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Thanks JW. with the bass it walks sometimes but I find it gets boring if it walks too much. I didn't really put much thought into it, both bass and piano are first take improvisations, I just played what I felt at the time. It is always a bit weird playing with a recorded track because it doesn't respond, maybe that affects my playing. If I was playing bass with a live drummer and piano i would probably walk more. Next time I'll try that.

That's not you playing drums too, is it? If so, congratulations on the great stuff in such little time. Otherwise, nice job on the b and p as usual.

Hi guys,

I know I don't post often but I was wondering if you guys can give me some feedback about my dilemma.

I recorded myself practicing recently.. I feel like right now I want to focus on how to make music with what I know. I feel like too many people are just stuck trying to get better chops and learn complicated ideas without knowing how to use them musically, and I want to make a conscious effort to move away from that. I don't remember who said you spend 20 years learning what to play and another 20 learning what not to play, and that makes sense to me now.

In some ways playing fast on giant steps is easier than playing slow because you barely have time to think.. but on slower tunes where I feel like I am not sure what I am supposed to do. I feel like great players have this conviction in everything phrase they play, but I kind of get this empty feeling that whatever I play is not me, or it's not right, as I play them.

Here are the recordings.

http://soundcloud.com/jason-hayashi/giant-steps-practice
http://soundcloud.com/jason-hayashi/night-and-day
http://soundcloud.com/jason-hayashi/sugar

It's just not something we've ever discussed, walking vs. not walking. Old style jazz pretty much just walks. But only recently was I becoming aware that this is not always so. I just wanted to know if there's some guidelines on when it is good not to walk. I guess it may mean going from 4 to a 2 feel.

My bass player sometimes doesn't walk and I don't know if it sounds good or not like that. How does that affect swing feel?

I really noticed this in KJ's trio since they don't always walk or shift between the two.

You sound great Why are you hiding behind an EP sound all the time though?

Haha, no chance. I have just got a drum kit and am practicing but I can just about play Mustang sally!
On the recommendation of Dave Ferris on another forum I just got a cd of Paul Carman drum metronome. It is great for me as I can just put a bass for any tune on. And the drumming is great.

I don't think there are any guidelines, I just play what I think is right for the moment. Not-walking includes more than playing a 2 feel, it may be playing across the beat on playing dotted 1/4's or anything else that isn't just one 1/4 after another.

I think it's important that you still feel 2&4 as you play.. there are ways to play over-the-barline/not walking and still have strong sense of where 1 is is, and everyone has this common understanding of what is happening. On the other hand when bass players don't walk and they aren't confident about it, it just sounds confusing. It's hard to describe, but you are still playing a polyrhythm/over-the-barline stuff against the 1 of the original meter, and if you lose that reference internally it doesn't work well IMO.

jazzwee,

I don't like the acoustic piano sound on my keyboard (It's a casio PX-310), and I generally don't like piano sounds on keyboard anyways

Thanks, I guess I feel like there are still a lot of lapses in the playing.. where a musical ideas are as clearly intended/expressed as it should have been. It's amazing how great players can make everything they play great melodies. Sometimes I feel like I am playing fast because I have hard time playing good simple melodies/ideas.

Etcetra,
You play well and have the technique to play pretty much any idea you have. I think what you have done is learn to improvise fast. This is good as it is difficult to play fast. Playing slowly and simply and playing beautiful melody is also difficult but in a different way.
If you focus on that for a while I think you well get it pretty fast. Just try it for a week or 2 playing nothing but slow ballads, and try not to play any of the licks that you may normally play. If you find yourself going into double time without really thinking about it just stop yourself. Try to get the musical intensity in a different way than by playing fast notes. I can tell you will be able to do that because you have a good time feel. Post a ballad so we can hear how you are getting on.

Definitely gotta know where you are as much as possible, otherwise you are just lost.

Beeboss,

Thanks!! I was just thinking about practicing ballads as I was listening to the recording. I realized that while working on licks/ideas are good, it almost seems as if I became too dependent on them. I also think part of it is the fear of being really exposed rhythmically/melodically when I play simple..sometimes I get this though "gee I really don't know what to do." I'll do some work on ballads and get back to you guys on that.

I have the same melodic issues too so I recorded a slow version of All the Things You Are. Slower is harder for me. Aside from sensitivity to articulation, the melodic problems are more exposed. So please critique.

ATTYA
http://www.box.com/s/36cy4q8kx22ro9044oo3

jazzwee

I think I posted this before, but you can try playing around the melody more.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NehOx1JsuT4

Also, you might have to do this out of time, but a friend of mine told me to only play something you clearly hear in your head. I found this to be really difficult too.

I listen to the recording as much as possible and figure out what worked and what didn't, recall moments when it felt "right", like I was totally in the flow/moment, and try to get back to that feeling. It's hard to describe, but there are moments where I felt like I was on, and that seems to happen like for few seconds in practice session.

It's easy to be critical, but it's equally important to recognize what you did right too.. for me what you played in 2:10-2:15 the turned around to the next course was really melodic. So if I were you I'd focus on that as the 'model' so to speak.

One last thing.. It took me a long time to realize how important it is to have LH play in pocket, and how I wasn't as thoughtful about the placement of rhythm I should have been. It might help to just play quarter notes on RH and really make LH play in pocket until it feels really good with the rhythm. It's something I need to work on too.

JW,

I hear your 8th notes in 2s. Therefore, I don't hear a swinging flow.
Try one chorus with no drums, and no left hand. To help you harmonically, play the root note with LH as a whole note on 1.

Another from me

Estate...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GQ-i9hE8_gU&feature=youtu.be

Definitely. Hopefully by focussing on those moments they can become more common, ultimately ending up being permanently 'in the zone'.
I am still waiting for that though ;-)

I think everyone has these melodic issues more or less. It is hard to play melodically but it is very hard thing to define or talk about.
It seems to me that it is the rhythm is the biggest problem in your recording, I don't know if the drum loop helps but there is something not swinging about it. It is not that you are really out of time but the groove doesn't sit very happily. Maybe you need to sit a bit more behind the beat or something. Sorry I am not describing well what I mean. The rhythm is kind of there but it is not strong enough.
I think you should try with a better drum track, that may help you to develop more groove.

beeboss&jazzwee

I agree with beeboss on the rhythm not being strong on ATTYA recording. If it's anything like the problems I have, it has a lot to do with tension(physical/mental), technical problems and in general not really articulating your ideas with conviction. I find that LH can be a big culprit, especially if you don't have control over where you are placing them. If the RH is not articulated well/smoothly the lines will sound weak too.

I think we can all benefit from playing EXTREMELY simply, and just make it swing and sing at the same time, like some of Miles Davis' solos. Again it's about figuring out when it feels right, and making that standard for everything you do.

Whether it's playing melodically or playing with strong swing feel, it all comes down to really listening to yourself and holding yourself to higher standard than you did. Sometimes it depressing to deal with me and my playing, and just how much lacking it is, but I feel like it's the only way to grow. I think I've done like 200+ of transcriptions and learned like a 20 solos over the last 2-3 years.. and my conclusion is that it didn't get me where I wanted, and in some ways, those exercises became a goal in itself, an excuse to not really face/listen to myself.

Just keep at it man... you sound good! I think as long as we know there's something more to learn, we'll keep getting better. We just have to keep seeking out better ways to do things. It's all a part of the process and it never ends.

Yeah I just listened to it again and I was really off there. Not my favorite tempo so I practice very little in this range and it shows my weaknesses. I think I was thinking of other things and wasn't focused.

Thanks for the comments. This gives me something specific to work on.