Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
the Forums & Piano World

This custom search works much better than the built in one and allows searching older posts.
(ad) Pianoteq
Latest Pianoteq add-on instrument: U4 upright piano
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
PianoSupplies.com (150)
Piano Accessories Music Related Gifts Piano Tuning Equipment Piano Moving Equipment
We now offer Gift Certificates in our online store!
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Piano
Quick Links to Useful Stuff
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers
*Organs

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano Accessories
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Contest
*Links
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
Topic Options
#2135560 - 08/19/13 05:29 PM datuner reading
trex101 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 07/15/13
Posts: 14
Loc: Melbourne
Hi,

I just bought a baby grand(Hailun 151) for my wife 3 week ago and out of curiosity i downloaded an Android apps "Datuner" and test it on all the note.



Most of the lower notes are pretty ok, hit within +-5c
From middle to high octave onwards, most notes hit +10c

The question is, are these reading any useful? I know that acoustic piano notes are not suppose to be as exact as electronic notes.

_________________________
Hailun 151

Top
(ad 568) Win a Year Journal Subscription
Win a year subscription to the PTG Journal
#2135582 - 08/19/13 06:12 PM Re: datuner reading [Re: trex101]
Silverwood Pianos Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 4182
Loc: Vancouver B. C. Canada


The piano is out of tune which is to be expected following delivery.
_________________________
Dan Silverwood
www.silverwoodpianos.com
http://silverwoodpianos.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/SilverwoodPianosDotCom
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur."

Top
#2135587 - 08/19/13 06:21 PM Re: datuner reading [Re: trex101]
trex101 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 07/15/13
Posts: 14
Loc: Melbourne
Should the middle and high note be within the datuner "green band"? Or just +-5c like the lower note to be in tune?
_________________________
Hailun 151

Top
#2135610 - 08/19/13 07:24 PM Re: datuner reading [Re: trex101]
kpembrook Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/10
Posts: 1252
Loc: Michigan
Originally Posted By: trex101
Should the middle and high note be within the datuner "green band"? Or just +-5c like the lower note to be in tune?


The green line is a generic inharmonicity curve that is typical of pianos. The piano can be successfully tuned with a different curve and in real life the notes will not fall exactly on anybody's curve.

I encourage listening to using a device to determine out-of-tuneness.
_________________________
Keith Akins, RPT
USA Distributor for Isaac Cadenza hammers and Profundo Bass Strings
Supporting Piano Owners D-I-Y piano tuning and repair

Top
#2135616 - 08/19/13 07:42 PM Re: datuner reading [Re: trex101]
trex101 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 07/15/13
Posts: 14
Loc: Melbourne
Oic,

I'm just wondering is it due to my room humidity(range from 55-80%) that seem to stretch all my note from middle to high octave : pitch up +10c
_________________________
Hailun 151

Top
#2135688 - 08/19/13 10:59 PM Re: datuner reading [Re: trex101]
David Jenson Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/22/06
Posts: 1947
Loc: Maine
New pianos are inherently unstable. Get it tuned. Get a base-line from that tuning on the telephone app., then go from there. The advice to learn to hear if the piano is out of tune is the best course. I've never heard of that app., and there's no possible way to know if it's accurate at all. (My guess is that it isn't.)
_________________________
David L. Jenson
Tuning - Repairs - Refurbishing
Jenson's Piano Service
-----

Top
#2135694 - 08/19/13 11:21 PM Re: datuner reading [Re: trex101]
trex101 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 07/15/13
Posts: 14
Loc: Melbourne
Thank you for the advice, will record down all the frequency once the tuner came for the 1st tune next mth. That would form a baseline for me.
_________________________
Hailun 151

Top
#2135700 - 08/19/13 11:33 PM Re: datuner reading [Re: trex101]
phacke Offline

Gold Supporter until November 11 2014


Registered: 10/18/12
Posts: 385
Loc: CO, USA
Originally Posted By: trex101
Oic,

I'm just wondering is it due to my room humidity(range from 55-80%) that seem to stretch all my note from middle to high octave : pitch up +10c


That is indeed way out of the generally recommended range for relative humidity. If you got a user booklet with the piano, or if you can otherwise get one, please check the recommended range for that instrument.

Best wishes-
_________________________
phacke

Steinway YM (1933)
...Working on:
J. S. Bach, Sonata No. 1 in B minor (BWV 1014) duet with violin

Top
#2135713 - 08/20/13 12:31 AM Re: datuner reading [Re: trex101]
kpembrook Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/10
Posts: 1252
Loc: Michigan
Originally Posted By: trex101
Oic,

I'm just wondering is it due to my room humidity(range from 55-80%) that seem to stretch all my note from middle to high octave : pitch up +10c


And how do you know that your room humidity is that level -- from a device as accurate as your phone tuner? Unless you are measuring humidity with a real hygrometer such as is used by HVAC folk, you don't really know . . .
_________________________
Keith Akins, RPT
USA Distributor for Isaac Cadenza hammers and Profundo Bass Strings
Supporting Piano Owners D-I-Y piano tuning and repair

Top
#2135715 - 08/20/13 12:42 AM Re: datuner reading [Re: kpembrook]
trex101 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 07/15/13
Posts: 14
Loc: Melbourne
Originally Posted By: kpembrook
Originally Posted By: trex101
Oic,

I'm just wondering is it due to my room humidity(range from 55-80%) that seem to stretch all my note from middle to high octave : pitch up +10c


And how do you know that your room humidity is that level -- from a device as accurate as your phone tuner? Unless you are measuring humidity with a real hygrometer such as is used by HVAC folk, you don't really know . . .


I got a hygrometer and record the reading from time to time, seem pretty accurate compare to Australia Bureau of Meteorology reading. It's winter over here now and humidity are pretty high compare to the rest of the year.
_________________________
Hailun 151

Top
#2135727 - 08/20/13 01:18 AM Re: datuner reading [Re: trex101]
kpembrook Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/10
Posts: 1252
Loc: Michigan
Originally Posted By: trex101

I got a hygrometer and record the reading from time to time, seem pretty accurate compare to Australia Bureau of Meteorology reading. It's winter over here now and humidity are pretty high compare to the rest of the year.


Meaning that you have put it outside and checked the Met. Bureau report?

Have you done this over the span of a year?

I'm not saying yours isn't accurate -- just being extremely skeptical from having seen identical hygrometers giving radically different readings in the same room and others that simply don't respond at all to changes. Every now and then a cheap hygrometer actually is dead-on, so I'm not saying it can't happen. Some don't even read below 20% -- they just go blank. You might check with a psychrometer setup. Either get a sling psychrometer or make a stationary one with two thermometers. You can get the differential charts online to interpret R.H.
_________________________
Keith Akins, RPT
USA Distributor for Isaac Cadenza hammers and Profundo Bass Strings
Supporting Piano Owners D-I-Y piano tuning and repair

Top
#2135739 - 08/20/13 01:55 AM Re: datuner reading [Re: trex101]
trex101 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 07/15/13
Posts: 14
Loc: Melbourne
My hygrometer are place just beside my piano. Reading from inside and outside should be similar i suppose, not saying my hygrometer are 100% accurate but should be around the ballpark figure.
_________________________
Hailun 151

Top
#2135783 - 08/20/13 05:53 AM Re: datuner reading [Re: trex101]
Mark R. Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/31/09
Posts: 1865
Loc: Pretoria, South Africa
Originally Posted By: trex101
Reading from inside and outside should be similar i suppose


Not at all. That's one of the critical points. In winter, the inside of a home is typically much warmer than the outside, which results in a significantly lower relative humidity inside, i.e. higher RH outside. For example, the same moisture content that gives 70% RH at 10°C only gives 40% RH at 20°C.

@ Keith:
Why would a homeowner want to read RH below 20%? If it's that low, its critically low for a piano anyway.
_________________________
Autodidact interested in piano technology.

1922 49" Zimmermann, project piano.
1970 44" Ibach, daily music maker.

Top
#2135887 - 08/20/13 10:30 AM Re: datuner reading [Re: Mark R.]
kpembrook Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/10
Posts: 1252
Loc: Michigan
Originally Posted By: Mark R.
@ Keith:
Why would a homeowner want to read RH below 20%? If it's that low, its critically low for a piano anyway.


It's just a matter of putting a number on how horribly dry it gets here in the Upper Midwest during winter. We have one of the worst environments in the world for pianos. In the summer, it's possible for ambient indoor humidity to reach 80% and in the winter I have measured 12%. It's the cold outdoor temps which might be at a somewhat reasonable 36% but when you raise that zero-degree-F 36% RH air to 70 deg. F indoors, the R.H. plummets. So, we can have a R.H. swing of 60-70% every 6 months.

Wanna come look at our soundboards? shocked (Never mind sticky key service calls, etc.)

It's easy to understand why most of us techs here are Dampp Chaser converts. The difference between protected and unprotected pianos can be dramatic.
_________________________
Keith Akins, RPT
USA Distributor for Isaac Cadenza hammers and Profundo Bass Strings
Supporting Piano Owners D-I-Y piano tuning and repair

Top
#2135927 - 08/20/13 11:20 AM Re: datuner reading [Re: kpembrook]
Mark R. Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/31/09
Posts: 1865
Loc: Pretoria, South Africa
Originally Posted By: kpembrook
So, we can have a R.H. swing of 60-70% every 6 months.


Good grief! (That being said, the OP is in Melbourne, Australia, which has a "temperate" climate, but is also known for its changeable weather.)

Originally Posted By: kpembrook
Wanna come look at our soundboards?


Umm, I think not. Methinks I'll cry. I've seen what swings from 70% to 30% can do already.
_________________________
Autodidact interested in piano technology.

1922 49" Zimmermann, project piano.
1970 44" Ibach, daily music maker.

Top

Moderator:  Piano World 
What's Hot!!
HOW TO POST PICTURES on the Piano Forums
-------------------
Sharing is Caring!
About the Buttons
-------------------
Forums Rules & Help
-------------------
ADVERTISE
on Piano World

The world's most popular piano web site.
-------------------
PIANO BOOKS
Interesting books about the piano, pianists, piano history, biographies, memoirs and more!
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
Sheet Music
(PW is an affiliate)
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
Download & Print Sheet Music Instantly
sheet music search
sheet music search

sheet music search
(ad) HAILUN Pianos
Hailun Pianos - Click for More
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
Who's Online
158 registered (accordeur, Akshay, 36251, acappello, 51 invisible), 1763 Guests and 27 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
74217 Members
42 Forums
153529 Topics
2249935 Posts

Max Online: 15252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Why 88 keys?
by gsmonks
Today at 03:01 PM
Casio AP range advice please
by thamajor7
Today at 01:38 PM
Installing plain wire: no twists involved
by A443
Today at 01:12 PM
Disney - Mulan - Reflection (arr. by K. Landry)
by Gi Dy
Today at 12:32 PM
A good introduction to history of French classical music?
by BWV 846
Today at 10:50 AM
(ads by Google)

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |


copyright 1997 - 2014 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission