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#2138450 - 08/24/13 06:53 PM Problem counting 120 BPM
D7K Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/25/12
Posts: 98
I do really well with playing and counting until I hit 120/140. Any suggestions on what to do with fast beats and counting?


Edited by D7K (08/24/13 06:53 PM)
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#2138452 - 08/24/13 07:01 PM Re: Problem counting 120 BPM [Re: D7K]
anrpiano Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 174
Loc: Chicago
Cut it half and use a slower pulse. You will probably find that you will be most comfortable between 60 and 120 BPM (also the normal range of BPM of the human heart). When you get to 120 or more the beats start coming so fast it can be more difficult to stay on time. However if you divide by 2 or 3 you will find yourself back in a comfortable range.
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#2138470 - 08/24/13 08:00 PM Re: Problem counting 120 BPM [Re: D7K]
D7K Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/25/12
Posts: 98
Andrew - so you basically make whole notes into half or quarter notes in the count?

BTW thanks for the reply.
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Jeff
Casio PX-5S Pro - my new adventure
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#2138871 - 08/25/13 04:26 PM Re: Problem counting 120 BPM [Re: D7K]
Derulux Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/05
Posts: 5446
Loc: Philadelphia
Quote:
so you basically make whole notes into half or quarter notes in the count?

Not sure this is quite right. You may be on the right track, but think of it more as counting every other beat. If you're in 3/4 time, sometimes you can count just beat 1, skipping beats 2 and 3. In 4/4, sometimes you can do the same, and skip the other three beats. Just depends on how fast it is, and what it is divisible by.

You wouldn't want to count every other beat, for example, in 3/4 time. You'd get lost, unless there was a specific reason (accent on certain notes).
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#2138891 - 08/25/13 05:04 PM Re: Problem counting 120 BPM [Re: D7K]
Brian Lucas Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/04/11
Posts: 1098
Loc: Nashville, TN
Not every beat is felt equally. In 4/4 time, the first beat is the strongest, followed by the third beat. The others are weaker.
So it would feel like: ONE two Three four ONE two Three four.

In 3/4 time, the first beat is again strong, followed by 2 weaker beats.
So you will need to feel: ONE two three ONE two three.

Feeling the different weight of the beats will help you master faster tempos.
_________________________
-Brian
BM in Performance, Berklee College of Music, 23+ year teacher and touring musician
My Downloadable Video Piano Lessons
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#2138984 - 08/25/13 10:02 PM Re: Problem counting 120 BPM [Re: D7K]
4evrBeginR Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/27/09
Posts: 1607
Loc: California
Is this with quarter note at 120 in 4/4 time? If so, it's really not that fast. If you are having trouble with counting it, try playing with only the left hand counting then playing with only the right hand counting. When hands alone is solid, then try doing it all together again.

I wouldn't slow down the metronome to 60 for 2/2 time. That's a very different rhythm. If it's in 4/4, then just start slower at 96 to 108 and progressively get up to 120. Patience help too!
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Art is never finished, only abandoned. - da Vinci

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#2139188 - 08/26/13 12:10 PM Re: Problem counting 120 BPM [Re: D7K]
D7K Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/25/12
Posts: 98
Thanks everyone this has been very helpful. Patience, err, what is that?:)
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Jeff
Casio PX-5S Pro - my new adventure
Yamaha p105 - gone but not forgotten

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#2140089 - 08/28/13 07:47 AM Re: Problem counting 120 BPM [Re: D7K]
anrpiano Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 174
Loc: Chicago
Basically yes. Whatever subdivision is convenient to the tempo. This also works in reverse for fast tempos. If the quarter is 184, 92 on the half is a whole lot easier to stay with and it will give you a much more musical rhythm.
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Andrew Remillard
http://www.ANRPiano.com
http://www.AndrewRemillard.com
Downers Grove, IL 60515

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#2140205 - 08/28/13 11:51 AM Re: Problem counting 120 BPM [Re: Brian Lucas]
Sweet06 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/22/13
Posts: 413
Originally Posted By: Brian Lucas
Not every beat is felt equally. In 4/4 time, the first beat is the strongest, followed by the third beat. The others are weaker.
So it would feel like: ONE two Three four ONE two Three four.

In 3/4 time, the first beat is again strong, followed by 2 weaker beats.
So you will need to feel: ONE two three ONE two three.

Feeling the different weight of the beats will help you master faster tempos.


do you just feel these beats strong or should you be emphasizing it in the music you play as well?
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"Doesn't practicing on the piano suck?!?!"
"The joy is in the practicing. It's like relationships. Yeah, orgasms are awesome, but you can't make love to someone who you have no relationship with!"

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#2140294 - 08/28/13 02:48 PM Re: Problem counting 120 BPM [Re: Sweet06]
Brian Lucas Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/04/11
Posts: 1098
Loc: Nashville, TN
Originally Posted By: Sweet06
Originally Posted By: Brian Lucas
Not every beat is felt equally. In 4/4 time, the first beat is the strongest, followed by the third beat. The others are weaker.
So it would feel like: ONE two Three four ONE two Three four.

In 3/4 time, the first beat is again strong, followed by 2 weaker beats.
So you will need to feel: ONE two three ONE two three.

Feeling the different weight of the beats will help you master faster tempos.


do you just feel these beats strong or should you be emphasizing it in the music you play as well?
It really depends on the music. If you want to get even more technical, every measure isn't always weighted equally. For example, a lot of 4/4 music has either a 4 or 8 measure phrase. In that case, the first beat of the next measure is usually very strong. If it's solo piano, often the tempo ritards at the end of these phrases to emphasize that strong beat. Learning to feel these beats in music can also help you remember where you are.

To start, I would focus more on feeling it rather than playing it, at least at the exercise level.
_________________________
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BM in Performance, Berklee College of Music, 23+ year teacher and touring musician
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