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#2145805 - 09/07/13 02:04 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Rhodie73]
JFP Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/19/10
Posts: 1336
Loc: The Netherlands
So the current CLP line (like 470 , 480) uses the CFIII and the CP4 will presumably have a better piano on board with the CFX sampleset , right ?

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#2145812 - 09/07/13 02:09 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: JFP]
gvfarns Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3484
Loc: Pennsylvania
Originally Posted By: JFP
So the current CLP line (like 470 , 480) uses the CFIII and the CP4 will presumably have a better piano on board with the CFX sampleset , right ?


A sample from a newer (and in most people's opinion, better) piano, yes. Whether the implementation is better than those in the clavinovas in question or not is something we will have to see. Based on what I have heard, the difference between CFIII and CFX sampling isn't huge. For example, people playing the NU1 and N1 side by side haven't particularly noticed a big difference in the sonic characteristics (through headphones).


Edited by gvfarns (09/07/13 02:27 PM)

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#2145820 - 09/07/13 02:38 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Rhodie73]
anotherscott Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 3442
Yamaha owns Bosendorfer now, so maybe we'll see some of those samples in one of their DPs at some point.

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#2145827 - 09/07/13 02:49 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: gvfarns]
JFP Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/19/10
Posts: 1336
Loc: The Netherlands
Originally Posted By: gvfarns
Whether the implementation is better than those in the clavinovas in question or not is something we will have to see. Based on what I have heard, the difference between CFIII and CFX sampling isn't huge.


But if Yamaha throws SCM into the game , the sustain and audible looping will be history is my understanding. SCM is not part of the current yamaha DP line as far as I know, so the new CP could benefit from that in places where there are weaknesses now. Correct ? I hope...

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#2145830 - 09/07/13 02:54 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: anotherscott]
Rhodie73 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/11/08
Posts: 143
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: anotherscott
Info posted by a Yamaha rep in another forum...

On September 9th at 1 PM PST Yamaha's website and dealer websites will be opened with complete information, movies and interviews with artists.

The CP4 will start appearing in stores in the US around October 1st. The MAP price of the CP4 in the US is $2199.99.

It does feature Spectral Component Modeling . It is a Graded Wooden Hammer action (the CP5 was balanced so the weight did not change over the keyboard).

The CP4 Stage is the first pro stage piano to feature a CFX,Yamaha' flagship 9' Concert Grand. . It also has a CFIII and S6 pianos so the entire Yamaha Premium Piano Collection is represented. By the way, the S6 piano is very similar in design and part of the same family as the S700. It was specifically designed to have a warmer, more intimate sound than the CFX and CFIII.

At the same time we are releasing the CP40 , a baby brother to the CP4 which has fewer sounds (no CFX and one tine EP model). This will be a MAP price of $1699.99 in the US and replaces the CP50.

One of the biggest improvements on the new CP series is the user interface. It's very easy to understand and quick to get around on. We think people will really like it. There is also direct audio recording and playback to USB memory devices.


Thanks so much for putting this info out there! I can't wait to get the full details with pics on Monday. I sold my Fantom X8 and my RD64 because of other reasons, but I would be more than happy to pick up a CP4 next month.
_________________________
Rhodes Stage 73 (MKII), Yamaha CP4, Yamaha P-255B, Roland RD-64, Roland RD800

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#2145832 - 09/07/13 02:56 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Rhodie73]
voxpops Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 3101
Loc: Oregon
Originally Posted By: Rhodie73
I sold my Fantom X8 and my RD64 because of other reasons, but I would be more than happy to pick up a CP4 next month.

Rhodie, why no more RD-64? I recently picked up my second one having sold the first because of the limitations of a short keybed. I decided that, in the end, it was a tool worth having, despite the length.
_________________________
Occasional author and inveterate ivory tickler:
http://www.amazon.com/author/richardspanswick

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#2145839 - 09/07/13 03:08 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: voxpops]
Dave Ferris Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/12/07
Posts: 1733
Loc: Glendale, Ca.
Hey guys. Since Athan posted on KC, I'm assuming it's cool to go ahead here as well.. I'll just copy & paste my very un-technical first impressions of the CP4.
-------------------------------------------------------------------

I had a sneak preview down at S.I.R. in Hollywood almost a month ago. I spent 20, maybe 25 minutes tops on it. It was running direct into a pair of Yamaha DXR10s. The sound was excellent.

The new CFX Grand sample is quite good and imo an improvement over the CF Grand in the CP5/1. It definitely has more presence and I think will be more versatile for all styles of music then the CP5. One thing that stood out for me was the sustain of the CFX....nice ! I'd have to have it next to the newest offerings from Nord ; Fazioli, Bright Grand & Bosendorfer, but I feel the detail was right there with anything on my Nord Piano 2. The S6 sounded much better then the CP5 as well.

Also in typical Yamaha fashion, you had a very even and responsive sound to action connection in all registers up and down the keyboard.

The action was heavier then the CP5 but again very responsive. It just felt *right*. This along with the even sound is something I've greatly missed the past year and a half.. wink

As much as I sang the praises of the CF Grand on the CP5, in louder rock situations, unless you used the Rock Bright Grand, I felt CF piano could take on an almost Roland-sque character. For me that's where things become too transparent and can be a little too *floaty* or vague in the mix (with the bass & drums), at louder volumes. This is my personal take on it so fwiw of course. I thought the CP5 was best at low volume, intimate Jazz quartet, trio, duo (acoustic bass/piano backing vocalist) contexts. Which was cool because that's basically what I do or try to do most often. cool Again I think the new CFX sample will be great for that in addition to louder rock scenarios.

Excellent build quality, no wall wart and holes on the front for the CP music rest. And the little bit I heard, when one speaker was disconnected for the infamous *mono mode*, didn't make me cringe. Again for comparison--at least as good as the Nord in mono.

Again, I only had a short time on it but first impressions were--what's not to like ? I'm pretty sure I'll be getting one when they become available.
_________________________
http://soundcloud.com/dave-ferris

2005 NY Steinway D

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#2145850 - 09/07/13 03:21 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Rhodie73]
voxpops Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 3101
Loc: Oregon
Thanks for posting, Dave. Nice to be free at last, I suspect! wink
From reading the back and forth with Athan, it seems like Yamaha have really tried to address all the major concerns that most stage piano users have. If it sounds as good as it sounds(!) it will be a real winner.
_________________________
Occasional author and inveterate ivory tickler:
http://www.amazon.com/author/richardspanswick

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#2145852 - 09/07/13 03:22 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Rhodie73]
JFP Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/19/10
Posts: 1336
Loc: The Netherlands
Well , a bit heavier keys is better IMHO. I found the CP1/5 keys a bit on the light side of the spectrum.

Your first impression sounds good: if it lives up to the expectations it mustered so far, it'll sell like hotcakes I guess. Suppose the competition is not waiting on the sidelines and already has their new competing products ready for launch. Question is when. If Yamaha can deliver from early October they have a nice headstart !



Edited by JFP (09/07/13 03:23 PM)

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#2145853 - 09/07/13 03:23 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: voxpops]
Rhodie73 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/11/08
Posts: 143
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: voxpops
Originally Posted By: Rhodie73
I sold my Fantom X8 and my RD64 because of other reasons, but I would be more than happy to pick up a CP4 next month.

Rhodie, why no more RD-64? I recently picked up my second one having sold the first because of the limitations of a short keybed. I decided that, in the end, it was a tool worth having, despite the length.


Yeh I still think its a great tool for certain situations but I was getting rid of my Fantom and decided to clean house and get some extra cash for an all in one "gigging" keyboard with very few limitations in terms of the sounds and features that I need. I came very close to purchasing a Nord Piano 2, but glad I waited!
_________________________
Rhodes Stage 73 (MKII), Yamaha CP4, Yamaha P-255B, Roland RD-64, Roland RD800

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#2145854 - 09/07/13 03:25 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: gvfarns]
david_ka Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/07/13
Posts: 93
Loc: Sweden
Maybe I´m wrong but I think the S70/90XS use the S6. I havn´t tried it so I don´t know how it sound.
_________________________
www.poetstation.com

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#2145855 - 09/07/13 03:27 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Rhodie73]
voxpops Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 3101
Loc: Oregon
Originally Posted By: Rhodie73
Yeh I still think its a great tool for certain situations but I was getting rid of my Fantom and decided to clean house and get some extra cash for an all in one "gigging" keyboard with very few limitations in terms of the sounds and features that I need. I came very close to purchasing a Nord Piano 2, but glad I waited!

Yes, I'm tempted to do some "house cleaning" as well!
_________________________
Occasional author and inveterate ivory tickler:
http://www.amazon.com/author/richardspanswick

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#2146051 - 09/07/13 10:33 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Rhodie73]
Athan Billias Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/07/13
Posts: 10
Hi,

Sorry we haven't replied yet as we just got off a red eye from Japan.

Here are some answers to questions that have been raised.

We did ask to have some information held back on the forums, but only until we could get information out to our dealers so they wouldn't be caught by surprise. The ad appeared a few weeks before we thought it would. So we are happy to provide information here now that dealers have been provided with the information they needed.

On September 9th at 1 PM PST Yamaha's website and dealer websites will be opened with complete information, movies and interviews with artists.

The CP4 will start appearing in stores in the US around October 1st. The MAP price of the CP4 in the US is $2199.99.

It does feature Spectral Component Modeling . It is a Graded Wooden Hammer action (the CP5 was balanced so the weight did not change over the keyboard).

The CP4 Stage is the first pro stage piano to feature a CFX,Yamaha' flagship 9' Concert Grand. . It also has a CFIII and S6 pianos so the entire Yamaha Premium Piano Collection is represented. By the way, the S6 piano is very similar in design and part of the same family as the S700. It was specifically designed to have a warmer, more intimate sound than the CFX and CFIII.

At the same time we are releasing the CP40 , a baby brother to the CP4 which has fewer sounds (no CFX and one tine EP model). This will be a MAP price of $1699.99 in the US and replaces the CP50.

One of the biggest improvements on the new CP series is the user interface. It's very easy to understand and quick to get around on. We think people will really like it. There is also direct audio recording and playback to USB memory devices.

If you have specific questions, we are happy to try and provide that information.
_________________________
Director of Marketing
Pro Audio and Combo Division
Yamaha Corporation of America

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#2146054 - 09/07/13 10:40 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Rhodie73]
voxpops Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 3101
Loc: Oregon
Athan, good to hear from you here. The additional info you posted on Keyboard Corner filled in quite a large part of the picture with regard to the CP4 - and it seems that a lot of people are very interested in this board (particularly performing players, of course).

I'm sure that many of us here would welcome a long term Yamaha presence on this forum, similar to the involvement of reps from both Kawai and Casio. We hope you'll stick around!
_________________________
Occasional author and inveterate ivory tickler:
http://www.amazon.com/author/richardspanswick

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#2146056 - 09/07/13 10:45 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Rhodie73]
gvfarns Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3484
Loc: Pennsylvania
Ask an ye shall receive.

So, I still haven't heard in either place whether either of the new stage pianos will have a triple sensor action. Are you allowed to say?

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#2146100 - 09/08/13 12:16 AM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: gvfarns]
Athan Billias Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/07/13
Posts: 10
We'll check with the engineers in Japan and let you know about the three sensors.
Not exactly sure and don't want to provide any inaccurate information.

It's Sunday in Japan so it might take a day or so.
_________________________
Director of Marketing
Pro Audio and Combo Division
Yamaha Corporation of America

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#2146106 - 09/08/13 12:34 AM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Rhodie73]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9679
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Thank you Athan!

By the way, is it true that you used to play with Jerry Martini, former sax player with Sly & the Family Stone?

Cheers,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2146189 - 09/08/13 05:47 AM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Athan Billias]
Dr Popper Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/30/09
Posts: 1720
Loc: Hancock Park LA (not again)
Originally Posted By: Athan Billias



If you have specific questions, we are happy to try and provide that information.


Athan posts on the INTERNET ..... wonders never cease wink

Seriously good to see you about slugger ...
_________________________
"I'm still an idiot and I'm still in love" - Blue Sofa - The Plugz 1981 (Tito Larriva)
Disclosure : I am professionally supported by but not beholden to various musical instrument manufactures including Yamaha

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#2146190 - 09/08/13 05:48 AM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Dave Ferris]
Dr Popper Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/30/09
Posts: 1720
Loc: Hancock Park LA (not again)
Originally Posted By: Dave Ferris


The new CFX Grand sample is quite good and imo an improvement over the CF Grand in the CP5/1. It definitely has more presence and I think will be more versatile for all styles of music then the CP5. One thing that stood out for me was the sustain of the CFX....nice !



so you liked it ? ..... phew wink
_________________________
"I'm still an idiot and I'm still in love" - Blue Sofa - The Plugz 1981 (Tito Larriva)
Disclosure : I am professionally supported by but not beholden to various musical instrument manufactures including Yamaha

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#2146235 - 09/08/13 09:24 AM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Rhodie73]
JFP Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/19/10
Posts: 1336
Loc: The Netherlands
Having seen the pictures again, the only thing that is odd to me and where I think yamaha may have missed a design opportunity is the placement of the pitch/ bend wheels. It's perfectly OK to have them above the keys, to be more in reach and reduce the length of the board. But they placed them above the rest of the control panel lane ?! So all controls are nicely put right above the keys in a very small row , so you can have the keyboard of a second instrument right on top. But then you cover the wheels andthe wheel are also in the way in case you want to place this second board as low as possible above the Yammie. Seems they didn't think this one through ? The wheels could have been placed more towards the keybed next to the rest of the controls and the display. Am I the only one thinkin that wold make more sense ? The whole top surface would then be empty for other gear and the wheels are even closer within reach.

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#2146239 - 09/08/13 09:36 AM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Rhodie73]
CyberGene Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/04/07
Posts: 723
Loc: Sofia, Bulgaria
Only Roland from the big guys without a representative here on the forums :P
_________________________
http://www.myspace.com/evgenykumanov
Current DP: Kawai ES7
Previous DP-s: Kawai MP6, Kawai CA63, Roland RD-700SX, Roland FP-5, Yamaha P90, Korg SP-200, Casio CDP-100

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#2146244 - 09/08/13 09:55 AM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: JFP]
anotherscott Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 3442
Originally Posted By: JFP
Having seen the pictures again, the only thing that is odd to me and where I think yamaha may have missed a design opportunity is the placement of the pitch/ bend wheels. It's perfectly OK to have them above the keys, to be more in reach and reduce the length of the board. But they placed them above the rest of the control panel lane ?!

Wheels often cannot be placed "right behind" the keys, because wheels need clearance beneath the panel (i.e. when you rotate the wheel, the part that "disappears" beneath the panel doesn't transport to another dimension, it needs space beneath the panel for its travel). So the wheel has to clear the back part of the keys that lies beneath the panel. (And at least on some designs, I think the keys pivot such that the part of the key behind the panel actually needs to go higher than the part that you see.)

As for their placement interfering with sitting the front of another board on top of the CP4 itself, I think the wheels are far enough to the left that the typical 61 should fit with no problem (and even 7x key keyboards, though not as nicely lined up).

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#2146272 - 09/08/13 11:08 AM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Dr Popper]
Dave Ferris Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/12/07
Posts: 1733
Loc: Glendale, Ca.
Originally Posted By: Dr Popper
Originally Posted By: Dave Ferris


The new CFX Grand sample is quite good and imo an improvement over the CF Grand in the CP5/1. It definitely has more presence and I think will be more versatile for all styles of music then the CP5. One thing that stood out for me was the sustain of the CFX....nice !



so you liked it ? ..... phew wink


Well don't get me wrong, it's still an electronic keyboard, so.... wink

But yes I did like it, probably enough to replace the Nord at some point.
_________________________
http://soundcloud.com/dave-ferris

2005 NY Steinway D

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#2146390 - 09/08/13 02:26 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Rhodie73]
JFP Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/19/10
Posts: 1336
Loc: The Netherlands
Quick mockup of what I mean. Makes more sense to me. If wonder if there is really less space above the keys in the front than further back. I thought the Yamaha mechanism was always facing downward. Pity if they could have done it in this way, but simply didn't cause they simply didn't think about it.... If it's technically not possible, I understand.


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#2146475 - 09/08/13 04:50 PM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Rhodie73]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9679
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
JFP, I'm disappointed that you didn't take the opportunity to also Photoshop your head into the Chuck Leavell shot. wink

James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2146713 - 09/09/13 01:48 AM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: Rhodie73]
JFP Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/19/10
Posts: 1336
Loc: The Netherlands
I didn't want to scare the forum members here.

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#2146758 - 09/09/13 05:50 AM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: CyberGene]
pv88 Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/31/10
Posts: 2722
Originally Posted By: CyberGene
Only Roland from the big guys without a representative here on the forums :P


Correct - as we have:

1) Casio - Mike
2) Kawai - James
3) Yamaha - Athan

So, who will it be for:

4) Roland - ?

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#2146797 - 09/09/13 08:03 AM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: pv88]
anotherscott Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 3442
Originally Posted By: pv88
Originally Posted By: CyberGene
Only Roland from the big guys without a representative here on the forums :P


Correct - as we have:

1) Casio - Mike
2) Kawai - James
3) Yamaha - Athan

So, who will it be for:

4) Roland - ?

Korg?
Nord?
Kurzweil? (used to be Dave, he's not with them anymore)

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#2146807 - 09/09/13 08:26 AM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: anotherscott]
36251 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/12/10
Posts: 765
Originally Posted By: anotherscott
Originally Posted By: pv88
Originally Posted By: CyberGene
Only Roland from the big guys without a representative here on the forums :P


Correct - as we have:

1) Casio - Mike
2) Kawai - James
3) Yamaha - Athan

So, who will it be for:

4) Roland - ?

Korg?
Nord?
Kurzweil? (used to be Dave, he's not with them anymore)
Williamson? smirk
_________________________
AG N2, CP4, GK MK & MP

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#2146856 - 09/09/13 10:27 AM Re: Possible Yamaha CP4 in the future? [Re: pv88]
Scott Hamlin Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/11/12
Posts: 593
Originally Posted By: pv88


4) Roland - ?


Roland has a guy who works the Roland blogs.. he made a *brief* appearance in the KC forums.. somethingVallee?

Having "brand ambassadors" that talk one-on-one with customers or potential customers is something EVERY company (not just music mfg.) should be doing. Yes there are risks, but the benefits are immeasurable. I can't count the number of people who said they purchased a PX-5S due in large part to Mike's online presence.
_________________________
Personal Site: http://DulceLabs.com
Casio PX-5S Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/Casio.Px5s/

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