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#2144151 - 09/04/13 05:09 PM change of lesson time
adultpianist Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/01/12
Posts: 540
I turn up at the usual time for my lesson 7.30pm and was informed that as from next week, my lessons will be at 7pm because my teacher has a new student who cannot make 7pm so they have put me at 7pm and the new student at 7.30.

I can accommodate the new time but the point is they should have asked me rather than tell me. That is not professional.

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#2144160 - 09/04/13 05:24 PM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
earlofmar Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/21/13
Posts: 1500
Loc: Australia
definitely agree this is not very considerate
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#2144171 - 09/04/13 05:50 PM Re: change of lesson time [Re: earlofmar]
adultpianist Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/01/12
Posts: 540
I also did not have a good lesson because I had worked very hard on one of my exam pieces over summer on my own and got all the notes right. When I played it back to my teacher she said anyone can play the right notes and it will sound good but I need to pay more attention to the phrasing and I am lifting my hands off the keys too soon, instead of holdig the hands down and moving fingers. I did not know that was what I had to do. I am not experienced enough in reading music to know. She said playing the piece as I played it sounded nice to anyone who does not know music or is not following the score whilst I play but this is an exam piece and should be played to exam standard which I was not doing. She then demonstrated playing the piece how it should be played and it sounded nicer. I then had a theory book which I borrowed from the library because if I pass this exam, the next exam will require theory exam and my teacher said I really ought to get the Grade 5 theory book, not any old theory book from the library. She said since I am doing ABRSM and will be taught theory Grade 5 for ABRSM then I should be looking at the right book for the exam.

In my mind, theory is theory and it should not matter what book I look at.

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#2144213 - 09/04/13 07:36 PM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
Bobpickle Offline

Gold Supporter until July 10  2014


Registered: 05/24/12
Posts: 1383
Loc: Cameron Park, California
Was it your teacher who moved your schedule around or a music school at which she works? If the former, then that's very unprofessional and it may just be your description of her, but she sounds insincere and not like the kind of person I would pay to bother studying music under. Regardless of whether it was her or her employer (i.e. a music school), she should be very apologetic about the re-scheduling.

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#2144259 - 09/04/13 08:45 PM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
dmd Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/15/09
Posts: 1822
Loc: Pennsylvania
Originally Posted By: adultpianist
In my mind, theory is theory and it should not matter what book I look at.


You are right, theoretically speaking.
_________________________
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Current: ES7, Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 audio device, SennHeiser HD555 Phones, Racvenscroft275, Ivory II American Concert D

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#2144264 - 09/04/13 09:01 PM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
Allan W. Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/03/12
Posts: 371
Loc: Michigan
Originally Posted By: adultpianist
I also did not have a good lesson because I had worked very hard on one of my exam pieces over summer on my own and got all the notes right. When I played it back to my teacher she said anyone can play the right notes and it will sound good but I need to pay more attention to the phrasing and I am lifting my hands off the keys too soon, instead of holdig the hands down and moving fingers. I did not know that was what I had to do. I am not experienced enough in reading music to know. She said playing the piece as I played it sounded nice to anyone who does not know music or is not following the score whilst I play but this is an exam piece and should be played to exam standard which I was not doing. She then demonstrated playing the piece how it should be played and it sounded nicer.


It's good that your teacher pointed it out to you right? It's good to learn a piece on your own and come to the lesson prepared. Then the teacher just needs to concentrate on helping you play it more musically instead of working on fingering, muscle memorying, etc, which you can usually work out yourself.
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#2144269 - 09/04/13 09:15 PM Re: change of lesson time [Re: dmd]
Sand Tiger Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/25/12
Posts: 1009
Loc: Southern California
You can take or leave any of my comments.

The change of time is annoying. It may be in part based on some old paper work where you stated your preference as to times. Sometimes teachers are put into difficult situations. Hopefully, she at least apologized.

As for the book, the way I see it, she is trying to save you time (which is a good thing). Music theory is a huge topic, and another book may be more advanced or more basic than the exam requires. The appropriate level of book is a better tool to use.

The lesson actually sounds pretty good. The teacher is there to teach, the student there to learn. I wish I could justify the cost of piano lessons, but I can not. At grade 4 on up, the correct notes are almost taken for granted. The dynamics, phrasing, voicing, become more of the emphasis. It is in large part what separates a beginner from a more intermediate pianist. A beginner might be able to learn the correct notes of a higher level piece by brute force methods. However, it is a rare beginner that can also pick up the the subtle phrasing, and dynamics that come with experience and good teaching.

I can tell a story: a relative did youth piano competitions. The kid was pretty good, though he did not have the passion for practice. At the early competitions, it was rather obvious, who the better pianists were, they got the notes correct. After a couple of years, the bar was higher. Every kid pianist got the notes correct. The judging was on phrasing, dynamics, musicianship.

After one such outing, the teacher suggested the family invest in a grand piano if the child wanted to continue in competitions. The family balked at that idea, because they did not have the room for a big piano even if they wanted to spend the money, and that was the end of the road for competitions.


Edited by Sand Tiger (09/04/13 09:42 PM)
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#2144280 - 09/04/13 09:38 PM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
malkin Online   content
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/18/09
Posts: 2498
Loc: *sigh* Salt Lake City
I think it sounds like a good lesson too.
You gained a bunch of new stuff from your teacher.
_________________________
A good student is one who makes the teacher feel like a good teacher.

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#2144281 - 09/04/13 09:38 PM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
Derulux Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/05
Posts: 5295
Loc: Philadelphia
Regarding the first question: it is highly rude (and unprofessional) to switch your time without asking you.

Regarding your second question: on this one, the teacher is right. If the book is different, you might be learning different theory than what is required for the exam. Take, for example, math. If you went out and bought an algebra book, but needed a calculus book, you won't be prepared for the exam. Similar idea here.
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#2144457 - 09/05/13 04:45 AM Re: change of lesson time [Re: Derulux]
adultpianist Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/01/12
Posts: 540
Originally Posted By: Derulux
Regarding the first question: it is highly rude (and unprofessional) to switch your time without asking you.

Regarding your second question: on this one, the teacher is right. If the book is different, you might be learning different theory than what is required for the exam. Take, for example, math. If you went out and bought an algebra book, but needed a calculus book, you won't be prepared for the exam. Similar idea here.


Yes it was rude but my job is flexible and they did say at the school that the advantage to me is that I start my lesson earlier and I get home earlier afterwards. I told them I will simply have to start work earlier to finish earlier and they said is that ok? I said I dont really have a lot of choice about it. If I had a job with fixed hours say, 9 - 5 then it would be impossible, but they did not know what my working hours are like. They did not bother to check first before telling me I would be doing a 7pm slot from now on frown

As for my piano playing. I agree that I was not playing up to exam standard and if I had sat the exam playing as I was playing it would not have got me very far. Yes I was hitting all the correct notes but to pass an exam its a little more than simply hitting right notes.

There is more to this piano playing malarkey than meets the eye.


Edited by adultpianist (09/05/13 04:49 AM)

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#2144474 - 09/05/13 06:41 AM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
peekay Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 184
Yeah, I had a similar experience with "correctly playing all the notes".

In my case, it was one of the first baroque pieces I learned (Bach Allemande in G minor). After self-study I thought I played it very well, but my teacher at the time told me that I performed the piece as if Mozart had written it -- instead of Bach -- that is, in completely the wrong style!

My teacher then started to annotate the music, adding where pauses should be inserted; which notes should be played connected vs. disconnected; various (unwritten) dynamics to be observed; how to interpret certain phrases, etc., etc., etc. None of these were present on the original score!

By the time we were done, it seemed like I was playing a completely different piece, even though all the notes were the same!

There was no way I could've known how to correctly play the piece on my own. There is a "common practice" for each style/period of music that's unwritten; they are "assumed" to be known by musicians performing them.

Some teachers do not know or do not care to teach students about all this. So seems like you have a good teacher!
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#2144488 - 09/05/13 07:50 AM Re: change of lesson time [Re: peekay]
adultpianist Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/01/12
Posts: 540
Originally Posted By: peekay
Yeah, I had a similar experience with "correctly playing all the notes".

In my case, it was one of the first baroque pieces I learned (Bach Allemande in G minor). After self-study I thought I played it very well, but my teacher at the time told me that I performed the piece as if Mozart had written it -- instead of Bach -- that is, in completely the wrong style!

My teacher then started to annotate the music, adding where pauses should be inserted; which notes should be played connected vs. disconnected; various (unwritten) dynamics to be observed; how to interpret certain phrases, etc., etc., etc. None of these were present on the original score!

By the time we were done, it seemed like I was playing a completely different piece, even though all the notes were the same!

There was no way I could've known how to correctly play the piece on my own. There is a "common practice" for each style/period of music that's unwritten; they are "assumed" to be known by musicians performing them.

Some teachers do not know or do not care to teach students about all this. So seems like you have a good teacher!


yes and the only reason I played it wrong was because I had nobody to guide me as we were on a summer break. At least I got all the notes right if nothing else, but I desperately want to get to the stage where I do not need to be guided and can see and play how the piece should be played and hold down my hands for as long as they need to be held down. My teacher was a beginner once upon a time and if she can look at a score and recognise this then why can't I? She only started learning to play the piano when she was 19 and she is younger than me and I am 50 so it goes to show that some people learn faster than others.


Edited by adultpianist (09/05/13 07:53 AM)

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#2144493 - 09/05/13 08:25 AM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
peekay Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 184
Well, to an extent, none of us will ever get to a stage where we can't be further guided -- and I say that as a good thing!

You might enjoy watching these two excepts on YouTube, with Daniel Barenboim giving a Beethoven masterclass to international pianists Lang Lang, David Kadouch, and Jonathan Biss.

In Part 1, we see Lang Lang playing the first movement to Appassionata "on his own":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yslruo1WgEY

In Part 2, we see although Lang Lang got "all the notes" right, Barenboim took apart his playing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=42BItJ-vpSA

(Part 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GM_rW7SSV8g)

Keep in mind, at that time Lang Lang was already considered one of the top pianists in the world, having won numerous competitions and was playing sold out concerts with major orchestras world-wide.

Yet he's still learning exactly like you and I. So, there's no end, and that means there's no hurry. The important part is to keep on learning and to enjoy the journey.


Edited by peekay (09/05/13 08:39 AM)
Edit Reason: added another link for reference
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#2144495 - 09/05/13 08:29 AM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11704
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: adultpianist
Originally Posted By: Derulux
Regarding the first question: it is highly rude (and unprofessional) to switch your time without asking you.

Regarding your second question: on this one, the teacher is right. If the book is different, you might be learning different theory than what is required for the exam. Take, for example, math. If you went out and bought an algebra book, but needed a calculus book, you won't be prepared for the exam. Similar idea here.


Yes it was rude but my job is flexible and they did say at the school that the advantage to me is that I start my lesson earlier and I get home earlier afterwards. I told them I will simply have to start work earlier to finish earlier and they said is that ok? I said I dont really have a lot of choice about it. If I had a job with fixed hours say, 9 - 5 then it would be impossible, but they did not know what my working hours are like. They did not bother to check first before telling me I would be doing a 7pm slot from now on frown


I agree, this was rude for them to do. There are times when I have to reschedule a student's lesson due to rehearsals, sometimes permanently. If this happens, my students first of all know I'm a performing teacher and it comes with the territory. But even in those instances, I ask the student what other days or times would work, not tell them. I would let your teacher know you were unhappy with how that was handled.

As for the lesson, it sounds as though you don't feel you were congratulated on the work you put in thus far. Perhaps you didn't realize there was more to it, but when a student of mine makes such an effort, I do try to let them know I'm very pleased with their progress. Then I tell them we are able to work on more intricate details now and then proceed with the lesson. Perhaps she glossed over your work and was just eager to get into the details? It sounds like what she was saying is worthwhile, but she may not be someone who doles out a lot of compliments.
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#2144497 - 09/05/13 08:37 AM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11704
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: adultpianist
Originally Posted By: peekay
Yeah, I had a similar experience with "correctly playing all the notes".

In my case, it was one of the first baroque pieces I learned (Bach Allemande in G minor). After self-study I thought I played it very well, but my teacher at the time told me that I performed the piece as if Mozart had written it -- instead of Bach -- that is, in completely the wrong style!

My teacher then started to annotate the music, adding where pauses should be inserted; which notes should be played connected vs. disconnected; various (unwritten) dynamics to be observed; how to interpret certain phrases, etc., etc., etc. None of these were present on the original score!

By the time we were done, it seemed like I was playing a completely different piece, even though all the notes were the same!

There was no way I could've known how to correctly play the piece on my own. There is a "common practice" for each style/period of music that's unwritten; they are "assumed" to be known by musicians performing them.

Some teachers do not know or do not care to teach students about all this. So seems like you have a good teacher!


yes and the only reason I played it wrong was because I had nobody to guide me as we were on a summer break. At least I got all the notes right if nothing else, but I desperately want to get to the stage where I do not need to be guided and can see and play how the piece should be played and hold down my hands for as long as they need to be held down. My teacher was a beginner once upon a time and if she can look at a score and recognise this then why can't I? She only started learning to play the piano when she was 19 and she is younger than me and I am 50 so it goes to show that some people learn faster than others.

How long have you been studying? Starting piano as an adult is very different from starting younger, even at 19. But let me point this out: you will never catch up with your teacher. She's continuing to play and gain more experience from teaching others and encountering their issues and solving them. So I do hope you're not trying to say you should be just as good as her, it won't happen, and that's OK. You are on your own path as a unique individual with your unique life experiences to shape how you interpret your music. It does take a long time to be at the point where you don't need a teacher, but one could argue you can always use a teacher's/another pianist's perspective on things. Even though I'm a teacher and I've been playing for 35 years, I still recognized I needed help with the Grieg pieces and sought it out from a colleague. It was extremely helpful and I don't think I could have figured it out on my own. But now I know, and I can share that knowledge with my students.

Give yourself the freedom of time to learn all you can. Don't pressure yourself to be as good as someone else or to have unrealistic expectations. Enjoy the journey, you are obviously making good progress! smile
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#2144524 - 09/05/13 09:44 AM Re: change of lesson time [Re: Morodiene]
adultpianist Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/01/12
Posts: 540
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
Originally Posted By: adultpianist
Originally Posted By: peekay
Yeah, I had a similar experience with "correctly playing all the notes".

In my case, it was one of the first baroque pieces I learned (Bach Allemande in G minor). After self-study I thought I played it very well, but my teacher at the time told me that I performed the piece as if Mozart had written it -- instead of Bach -- that is, in completely the wrong style!

My teacher then started to annotate the music, adding where pauses should be inserted; which notes should be played connected vs. disconnected; various (unwritten) dynamics to be observed; how to interpret certain phrases, etc., etc., etc. None of these were present on the original score!

By the time we were done, it seemed like I was playing a completely different piece, even though all the notes were the same!

There was no way I could've known how to correctly play the piece on my own. There is a "common practice" for each style/period of music that's unwritten; they are "assumed" to be known by musicians performing them.

Some teachers do not know or do not care to teach students about all this. So seems like you have a good teacher!


yes and the only reason I played it wrong was because I had nobody to guide me as we were on a summer break. At least I got all the notes right if nothing else, but I desperately want to get to the stage where I do not need to be guided and can see and play how the piece should be played and hold down my hands for as long as they need to be held down. My teacher was a beginner once upon a time and if she can look at a score and recognise this then why can't I? She only started learning to play the piano when she was 19 and she is younger than me and I am 50 so it goes to show that some people learn faster than others.

How long have you been studying? Starting piano as an adult is very different from starting younger, even at 19. But let me point this out: you will never catch up with your teacher. She's continuing to play and gain more experience from teaching others and encountering their issues and solving them. So I do hope you're not trying to say you should be just as good as her, it won't happen, and that's OK. You are on your own path as a unique individual with your unique life experiences to shape how you interpret your music. It does take a long time to be at the point where you don't need a teacher, but one could argue you can always use a teacher's/another pianist's perspective on things. Even though I'm a teacher and I've been playing for 35 years, I still recognized I needed help with the Grieg pieces and sought it out from a colleague. It was extremely helpful and I don't think I could have figured it out on my own. But now I know, and I can share that knowledge with my students.

Give yourself the freedom of time to learn all you can. Don't pressure yourself to be as good as someone else or to have unrealistic expectations. Enjoy the journey, you are obviously making good progress! smile


Thank you. But I do want to be as good as someone else. I love going to concerts and watching how the professionals play and think I wonder if I could do this or that like them and then get on my piano and try to learn and practice and get frustrated. But I am not a quiter and I love the piano too much to stop now. I WILL make it as a good pianist even if it takes me another 10 years

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#2144566 - 09/05/13 11:22 AM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
dmd Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/15/09
Posts: 1822
Loc: Pennsylvania
Originally Posted By: adultpianist
I love going to concerts and watching how the professionals play and think I wonder if I could do this or that like them and then get on my piano and try to learn and practice and get frustrated.


That FRUSTRATED part is what you need to avoid. High expectations combined with a lack of patience will defeat you.
This may take a very long time.

You are going to find (if you haven't already) that learning to play piano cannot be hurried. It takes as long is it takes regardless of what you WANT. You mention 10 years as though that is a long time out. It isn't. If you practice regularly with purpose for 10 years you will be much better than you are today but probably will not be at a level of those concert pianists you mention.

You can practice more often and that will help move things along some but do not expect to learn twice as fast by practicing twice as long. It does not seem to work that way.

As has been said many times on this forum ...

You need to enjoy the journey because that is really all there is. You will never reach your destination because there is no destination. Regardless of how skilled you become, you will continue to "wish" for more and strive to get better.

Enjoy your playing TODAY and regardless of where you are 10 years from now, you will have benefited greatly from the experience.
_________________________
Don

Current: ES7, Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 audio device, SennHeiser HD555 Phones, Racvenscroft275, Ivory II American Concert D

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#2144568 - 09/05/13 11:24 AM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
D7K Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/25/12
Posts: 58
If I was spending money and expected the firm or person to know it was my wants and desires that counted, such a thing as changing my lesson time would result in a sit down that talked to this person about my expectations. Depending on the reply I'd probably change teachers. I currently charge $200 an hour for my consulting and I ALWAYS communicate to my clients changes and unless its an emergency (which I do call to explain), always seek their "permission" to changes times. That is the professional way to handle client relationships.
_________________________
Jeff
Yamaha p105

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#2144579 - 09/05/13 11:41 AM Re: change of lesson time [Re: dmd]
adultpianist Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/01/12
Posts: 540
Originally Posted By: dmd
Originally Posted By: adultpianist
I love going to concerts and watching how the professionals play and think I wonder if I could do this or that like them and then get on my piano and try to learn and practice and get frustrated.


That FRUSTRATED part is what you need to avoid. High expectations combined with a lack of patience will defeat you.
This may take a very long time.

You are going to find (if you haven't already) that learning to play piano cannot be hurried. It takes as long is it takes regardless of what you WANT.


It can take a long time for some or a short time for others. If you are a prodgidy then it will take you no time at all 3hearts

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#2145315 - 09/06/13 02:37 PM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
Kymber Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/25/08
Posts: 1348
Loc: MA
Originally Posted By: adultpianist
I turn up at the usual time for my lesson 7.30pm and was informed that as from next week, my lessons will be at 7pm because my teacher has a new student who cannot make 7pm so they have put me at 7pm and the new student at 7.30.

I can accommodate the new time but the point is they should have asked me rather than tell me. That is not professional.

I agree. This happened to me when I was taking lessons. My time kept getting pushed back later and later.
I really liked my teacher and understood that that is her income (this was through a school by the way). She would kinda ask/tell me. But after I while I would get a little annoyed because I felt like they should say "that time slot is booked". Yes, my time was flexible but it meant a lot of time putzing around after work and then getting home late. I would be raelly tired by the time I got to my lesson. I suppose I could have been firm and tell then I couldn't do any other time but I just didnt.

Oh and also my teacher was always late on top of it. She admitted she was not good with time. But, I would end up getting an hour lesson because of it instead of the half hour I paid for so that was ok.
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#2145324 - 09/06/13 02:48 PM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
Kymber Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/25/08
Posts: 1348
Loc: MA
Originally Posted By: adultpianist
I also did not have a good lesson because I had worked very hard on one of my exam pieces over summer on my own and got all the notes right. When I played it back to my teacher she said anyone can play the right notes and it will sound good but I need to pay more attention to the phrasing and I am lifting my hands off the keys too soon, instead of holdig the hands down and moving fingers. I did not know that was what I had to do. I am not experienced enough in reading music to know. She said playing the piece as I played it sounded nice to anyone who does not know music or is not following the score whilst I play but this is an exam piece and should be played to exam standard which I was not doing. She then demonstrated playing the piece how it should be played and it sounded nicer. I then had a theory book which I borrowed from the library because if I pass this exam, the next exam will require theory exam and my teacher said I really ought to get the Grade 5 theory book, not any old theory book from the library. She said since I am doing ABRSM and will be taught theory Grade 5 for ABRSM then I should be looking at the right book for the exam.

In my mind, theory is theory and it should not matter what book I look at.



well I wouldn't say that wasn't a good lesson. We take lessons to learn. She pointed some things out that you weren't aware of. Now, that you are aware your playing will improve. My teacher would ask if I wanted to learn a song and then play it and I would be like YEAH that sounds awesome! Then I'd start learning it and it DID NOT sound like that. LOL. Of course our teachers playing will sound nicer than ours. It better because that is why they are teaching us.

I agree theory is theory. But I also understand where your teacher is coming from. Since you are taking the exams I would get the Grade 5 theory book just to make sure you are study everything you need to study specifically for the exam. there's just so much to learn about theory it would be a shame to miss something that was on the test.

Anyway, it sounds like you are making great progress.
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#2145362 - 09/06/13 04:00 PM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
RonDrotos Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 66
Loc: New York City
I've just read your post and also the various responses to it, and I think you're justified in feeling a little 'put out' by the situation. It seems like at the very least, the time change might have been presented to you in a softer way, and you should have been given some options if possible.

Learning theory, to me, is like learning a language. Sure, any French book will eventually teach you French, but using the specific book in preparation for the test will ensure that you're reviewing the exact material that will appear on the test, so your chances of doing well will increase. A different book, after all, might start with scales, when the test is going to focus more on chords, or vice versa. Yes, eventually you'll learn both, but along the way you want to do well on each test.

Good luck!


Edited by RonDrotos (09/06/13 04:01 PM)
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#2145393 - 09/06/13 05:11 PM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
Monica K. Online   blank

Platinum Supporter until Dec 31 2012


Registered: 08/10/05
Posts: 17771
Loc: Lexington, Kentucky
Welcome to the forum, RonDrotos! smile
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#2145513 - 09/06/13 11:17 PM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
Michael_99 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/12
Posts: 935
Loc: Canada Alberta
adultpianist, I have read your post, here:

Subject: Re: change of lesson time


I turn up at the usual time for my lesson 7.30pm and was informed that as from next week, my lessons will be at 7pm because my teacher has a new student who cannot make 7pm so they have put me at 7pm and the new student at 7.30.

I can accommodate the new time but the point is they should have asked me rather than tell me. That is not professional.

____________________________________________________________________________________________

as I understand your post, adultpianist, you think that a piano teacher should give you an option of making a decision about any change in the time of your piano lesson.

as a beginner piano player, I should caution you that I don't see things the way the rest of the people on the planet earth sees them.

Specifically, you have 2 choices, either you agree with the terms of the time change or you don't.

--> The rule in life is that you only go for one term when you are negotiating anything or you will lose everytime.

So with that in mind, you have to decides what the one term is that you want - and stick with that term and don't change it.

Dealing with the situation, the most important thing in life is that I have the best teacher possible - so for me - I would have my lesson at anytime the best piano teacher on the planet is available. That is the only term that matters to me and that is the only term that I will ever accept.

So I win getting the term I want.

You see, only go for the most important thing/things that YOU want - in life - and let the other person - or the rest of the world have all the small stuff - that you don't EVEN want.

I hope you understand what I am saying. The expression I use is only go for favourable terms and let the other person or people have every thing else - or the stuff you don't want.

AND THE REASON IS - VERY IMPORTANT - if you go for anything other than the one term - the other side or person - WILL or MIGHT - pick one of the terms you want and you will immediately and for ever lose -

So that is why!

And here is the logic. There may be many or hundreds of terms that you want - in reality - but by sticking with the most important thing for you - you immediately win - and then all the 999 terms you can relax and take or give away those terms because you really don't care about them

and specically if the teacher was extremely average then I would say a specific time and day and
and let the teacher say no and you would have the option of leaving immediately because the teacher didn't give you an option so it is all good for you. But if the teacher was extemely average, the teacher may not have millions of students banging on their door and would immediately back way, way, way off and listen to what you have to say about a time and date of your lesson.

See how awesome life is.- how can you not love living each and every day of life.

cheers,

3S06LTA

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#2145606 - 09/07/13 05:16 AM Re: change of lesson time [Re: Michael_99]
adultpianist Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/01/12
Posts: 540
True

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#2145609 - 09/07/13 05:24 AM Re: change of lesson time [Re: earlofmar]
Toastie Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/10/12
Posts: 210
Loc: UK
I can see why you would be a bit annoyed, having gone to the library and gotten the book already, only to be told it's not right. And that you thought you had done the piece well, again to be told it wasn't right. I'd feel the same if I had made the effort you seem to go to. I think perhaps your teacher has not recognised that idea of praising someone for what they HAVE done, before presenting them with feedback on what they haven't. Fortunately my teacher is very good at recognising where I have worked hard and done well. If anything, she's better at giving praise than telling me where I could be better, and I wish she would criticise more sometimes. That balance is hard to find. Sounds like your teacher may just have forgotten to congratulate you on your effort.

But changing your lesson time suddenly, on behalf of someone else, without consulting you, is just poor practice.
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The Easy Piano Collection Classical Gold
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#2145625 - 09/07/13 07:30 AM Re: change of lesson time [Re: Toastie]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11704
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: Toastie
I think perhaps your teacher has not recognised that idea of praising someone for what they HAVE done, before presenting them with feedback on what they haven't.
It is also possible that the teacher did praise him, but not in a way that the OP wished, or not sufficiently according to what the OP wished. It could be that perhaps the OP thought the teacher would be overjoyed at his progress and his book purchase and not have any corrections to make.

I'm not saying that is, but we weren't there and only hearing one side of it. These might be things for the OP to consider though.
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#2145693 - 09/07/13 11:04 AM Re: change of lesson time [Re: Morodiene]
Toastie Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/10/12
Posts: 210
Loc: UK
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
Originally Posted By: Toastie
I think perhaps your teacher has not recognised that idea of praising someone for what they HAVE done, before presenting them with feedback on what they haven't.


It is also possible that the teacher did praise him, but not in a way that the OP wished, or not sufficiently according to what the OP wished. It could be that perhaps the OP thought the teacher would be overjoyed at his progress and his book purchase and not have any corrections to make.

I'm not saying that is, but we weren't there and only hearing one side of it. These might be things for the OP to consider though.


I guess. Though generally I would think a teacher would adapt to what motivates a particular student. Constructive criticism is great, but not when the student goes away offended by it. You're right, we can't really say whose fault that is; the teacher's for however he/she presented the feedback, or adultpianist's for his/her reaction to it.
_________________________
Complete Beginner August 2012
'Play Piano' Book 1 - finished
'Play Piano' Book 2 - finished
Grade 1 Sight Reading - finished
Grade 1 Exam Pieces
Grade 1 Scales
The Easy Piano Collection Classical Gold
Yamaha U3

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#2145742 - 09/07/13 12:24 PM Re: change of lesson time [Re: adultpianist]
dmd Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/15/09
Posts: 1822
Loc: Pennsylvania
You know ...

Each of the criticisms in this thread of that teacher should be prefaced with ... IF THAT IS EXACTLY AS IT WENT ....

It just feels a little unseemly to be piling on that teacher based on one side of the picture.

We have no idea of how the interaction between the OP and the teacher ACTUALLY went.

That is not to say the OP is lying, either. People sometimes have different perspectives on how things transpire. Maybe a conversation had taken place prior to that lesson in which the OP had indicated a willingness to move his lesson to an earlier time. Perhaps not. Maybe the Teacher was apologetic and offered to leave things as they were if there was a problem.

Maybe, Maybe, Maybe ... We don't know. At least, I don't.

As for the other things ... criticism of how the OP is playing the piece ... again we know nothing about how that was delivered. Or, the part about getting a different Theory book ... we know only one side of it.

And, you know what ... the truth be told ...

Coming to the Piano World forum to complain about "My teacher changed my lesson time without asking me" gives me an uneasy feel about it right out of the gate.

That's just me, I guess.
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Current: ES7, Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 audio device, SennHeiser HD555 Phones, Racvenscroft275, Ivory II American Concert D

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#2145783 - 09/07/13 01:30 PM Re: change of lesson time [Re: Toastie]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11704
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: Toastie
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
Originally Posted By: Toastie
I think perhaps your teacher has not recognised that idea of praising someone for what they HAVE done, before presenting them with feedback on what they haven't.


It is also possible that the teacher did praise him, but not in a way that the OP wished, or not sufficiently according to what the OP wished. It could be that perhaps the OP thought the teacher would be overjoyed at his progress and his book purchase and not have any corrections to make.

I'm not saying that is, but we weren't there and only hearing one side of it. These might be things for the OP to consider though.


I guess. Though generally I would think a teacher would adapt to what motivates a particular student. Constructive criticism is great, but not when the student goes away offended by it. You're right, we can't really say whose fault that is; the teacher's for however he/she presented the feedback, or adultpianist's for his/her reaction to it.
I say this because I have encountered this in several adult students. They are insecure in what they're trying to do, they feel they've started late and so they put unrealistic expectations on themselves to excel far faster than they are, etc. As a result, they actually hamper the learning process and don't want to hear the criticism, only praise because that means they're getting there faster.

Or in another form, the student is so insecure in how they're doing that any praise the teacher gives, even if frequent, positive, and enthusiastic, the student projects onto the teacher their own feelings of inadequacy. No amount of positive reinforcement or no amount of constructive criticism done respectfully and with a positive spin can change the student from seeing things negatively.

As I said in my previous post, I'm not saying this *is* the case, just saying it could be. That is for the OP to hopefully reflect upon and see. I say no matter what the OP feels about the lesson itself, the changing of schedules was handled poorly and should let the teacher/school administrator know.


Edited by Morodiene (09/07/13 01:32 PM)
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