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#2173056 - 10/28/13 07:13 AM Re: Some help with sight reading polyphonic music [Re: JosephAC]
JosephAC Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/23/12
Posts: 168
Loc: Melbourne Australia
Can anyone be kind and explain measure 14 of this gavotte. There is an unusual music symbol that I do not recognise. I do not know what to call it so that I google it . It looks like an incomplete vertical square bracket.

Moreover, I am not sure how to do the counting for the bottom staff of this bar. The counting of the bottom staff does not add up to the counting of the top staff.



Edited by JosephAC (10/28/13 07:16 AM)

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#2173068 - 10/28/13 08:05 AM Re: Some help with sight reading polyphonic music [Re: JosephAC]
Andy Platt Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/28/10
Posts: 2424
Loc: Virginia, USA
Originally Posted By: JosephAC
Can anyone be kind and explain measure 14 of this gavotte. There is an unusual music symbol that I do not recognise. I do not know what to call it so that I google it . It looks like an incomplete vertical square bracket.

Moreover, I am not sure how to do the counting for the bottom staff of this bar. The counting of the bottom staff does not add up to the counting of the top staff.



You might need to post a screen shot. Looking at the score on IMSLP, I think (assuming I'm counting the measures as you are) that you might have a strange 16th note rest symbol. It would explain the counting problem too.

In the bottom staff, are you looking at a strange symbol right before the final three 16th notes - E, F#, D ?
_________________________
  • Schumann - Ende vom Lied, Opus 12.8
  • Haydn - Sonata in Gm, Hob. XVI/44

Kawai K3

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#2173071 - 10/28/13 08:14 AM Re: Some help with sight reading polyphonic music [Re: JosephAC]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12227
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: JosephAC
Can anyone be kind and explain measure 14 of this gavotte. There is an unusual music symbol that I do not recognise. I do not know what to call it so that I google it . It looks like an incomplete vertical square bracket.

Moreover, I am not sure how to do the counting for the bottom staff of this bar. The counting of the bottom staff does not add up to the counting of the top staff.

I, too, would have to see the music, then I can tell you.

As for the counting for the "bottom staff" and adding up to the counting of the "top staff", I really don't understand what you mean. A staff is the 5 lines and 4 spaces upon which notes and rests are placed. In piano music, there are generally two staves, one for each hand. So you don't usually count the staves nor do they add up. The term "bar" is interchangeable with "measure". Do you mean the number of beats don't add up in the measure?
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#2173221 - 10/28/13 02:14 PM Re: Some help with sight reading polyphonic music [Re: JosephAC]
JosephAC Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/23/12
Posts: 168
Loc: Melbourne Australia
This is the link that was posted earlier.

http://www.sheetmusicdirect.com/se/ID_No/25987/Product.aspx


We are not looking at the same measure. I know the rest symbols.

The bottom F staff has 2 quarter notes only ( B and B octave below).

The unknown symbol is to the left of the F# of the top staff. When I googled for this piece, this measure was presented differently.... I will make copy of my paper copy later and post if this link does not help.

Looking at other versions of the piece, it seems to me that the notes of the top staff belong to the bottom staff. Is this possible?

In terms of the counting, what it does not make sense is that the subdivision ought to match both staves. In this case, it does not. Most likely, I am expressing myself incorrectly.



Edited by JosephAC (10/28/13 02:15 PM)

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#2173231 - 10/28/13 02:35 PM Re: Some help with sight reading polyphonic music [Re: JosephAC]
Andy Platt Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/28/10
Posts: 2424
Loc: Virginia, USA
OK, got it. Measure 12 by my count (don't count the first partial measure and the measure with the repeat in the middle of it is just one measure, not two.)

So, yes, that's basically saying that the left hand "melody" goes from the Bb in the bass to the Bb in the treble, then to the F and back. Of course the Bb in the treble is also part of the upper voice going Bb, C#, D and E. Or that's how it should sound. Sometimes I actually do this with both fingers, at least at the beginning before I get the feel.

One final thing to note: The division of left hand to the bottom staff and the right hand to the top is a useful rule but it's there to be broken as needed (as in this case.) You will find more and more pieces as you progress where the hands swap over each other or share work with in the middle, etc..
_________________________
  • Schumann - Ende vom Lied, Opus 12.8
  • Haydn - Sonata in Gm, Hob. XVI/44

Kawai K3

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#2173400 - 10/28/13 07:55 PM Re: Some help with sight reading polyphonic music [Re: JosephAC]
JosephAC Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/23/12
Posts: 168
Loc: Melbourne Australia
Thanks Andy. Now it makes sense. What do you call this symbol ? Rising and falling glissando ?

In my paper book, it shows a different symbol. It is vertical bracket with the bottom angle missing .i.e. it looks like a vertical representation of the volta bracket 2nd ending.

BTW, why is it Bb? I read it as natural B in nless we are looking at the piece with a different key signature.

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#2173421 - 10/28/13 09:02 PM Re: Some help with sight reading polyphonic music [Re: JosephAC]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12227
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: JosephAC
Thanks Andy. Now it makes sense. What do you call this symbol ? Rising and falling glissando ?

In my paper book, it shows a different symbol. It is vertical bracket with the bottom angle missing .i.e. it looks like a vertical representation of the volta bracket 2nd ending.

BTW, why is it Bb? I read it as natural B in nless we are looking at the piece with a different key signature.


OK, now that I can see it, I think it is simply to point to the fact that your LH will play the B in the Treble clef, and that note coincides with the RH melody. You can see this by the fact that the B has a stem up and down. The LH would then play the stem down F# that follows.
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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