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Scep, the point is that restaurant gigs don't exist. Corporate/Organizational gigs have always been around and that's what where the pros make money, in addition to casuals, weddings, etc.

You think the 'paid' musicians don't know this? Remember that I've often replaced other musicians in the gigs I've gotten. So I didn't "create" a new market.

But this was no easy project. It's taken a year to get enough presence where they start becoming aware. Just realize that corporate/organizational/church events are planned WAY in advance. Often many months to a year in advance. So timing is part of this and knowing people who know people.

So if you want to have a shot, then I suggest avoiding the restaurants and bars unless you are so talented that you can bring your own audience.

Do you have a stack of business cards you hand out at every opportunity? Do you seek out other musicians in jam sessions to network?

I'm not a naturally outgoing person so you are mistaken if you think this is about personality. But it is about Marketing.

That's interesting to know. And I do realize it is about marketing. But I also know, because I've played a fairly large number of corporate gigs, weddings, private functions, etc, that at these places the music needs to serve a certain purpose, and oftentimes the purpose is to appeal to an audience that has little appreciation for jazz, but likes to think they do. So, I'd most rather play at a little dive for little or no money and be happy that I'm playing (not working) with people I want to play with, and music I chose to play because I like it. This is the main reason I never became a full time pro (well, that and besides the fact that I really couldn't see myself practicing for 6 hours a day). I have the opportunity of playing the type of music I want to play whenever I want, and if chance or fortune or whatever is with me I'll get to do it for an audience that is somewhat educated.
Marketing myself will make little difference unless I choose to do the monied gigs. Playing well and building a rep based on competence will allow me to play at more places that let me play what I want to play.

Scep, I'm happy to tell you that my initial perception of people's tastes are not correct. I admit I'm surprised but the 40-70 age group seems to enjoy jazz. Particularly since they are able to talk over the music.

What's the options for them? In this age group, they grew up with Rock and now they are older and their tastes have changed.

You think they can have a party with a Led Zep cover in the background?

I admit I may be breaking new ground here in discovering what people like. But I can't be succeeding here out of dumb luck. I just listen to what they ask for and I give it. Then I sneak in stuff that I like.

Last night, I played 'Windows'. Not exactly something expected in a casual, but I could afford to do it since I played 'Fly me to the Moon'. A little give and take and everyone's happy (including me).

In various forums, I always hear "Jazz is Dead". I can say B.S. I specifically asked some people today about our music and what they thought and the answer I got was so unexpected. They loved it, they said.

Marketing isn't just about hitting the pavement. It's about fashioning a product that matches the market, and then spreading the word.

Now I don't want to give the impression we're making big bucks. Absolutely not. If that's your goal, then, I don't know that formula yet...

I wouldn't say jazz is dead. It's just badly wounded.

As for audience, I too have had positive feedback about people wanting to hear jazz, but for the most part they are quite limited in what they really want to hear. And it's not as if I want to play free form Swedish poly tonal whale music, but I also don't want to get the only applause for the night by playing Linus and Lucy. I would seriously rather jam in my place and enjoy the time. I also don't want to play with a singer or horn player as a way to get gigs either. These days my focus is on playing trio, and I kind of like it that way. It seems that with most of the good horn players I've played with in the past I've been relegated to the rhythm section, and that is really quite boring for me. Singers and horns tend to want to play the head (of course) and if they solo they'll take the first one, then wait patiently, or not so much so, until you finish your solo to come back in.
So, it looks like my future in playing for huge amounts of cash may not pan out, but hey, I'm not too concerned.

As an aside, I'm actually interested in playing Led Zepplin, Rolling Stones, Beatles and other pop/rock tunes as jazz standards now. Not a new concept I know, but given that I like lots of these types of tunes I would also like to play them with a jazz groove. I think the trick is not to make them sound hokey, but with the right chord subs and arrangement its doable, and I think the audience (if they're like me) will love it. I'm already working on one by the BeeGees.
Anyone else playing 'the new standards' a la Herbie Hancock/Brad Meldhau/Joshua Redman etc?

Well, if you are inflexible, then of course you will have more limitations. I look at it as give and take. I'll play some familiar standards, and then sneak in something more obscure.

Even our obscure tunes in this thread like Nefertiti could be interesting if there's something the audience can latch onto like groove.

Actually, what's so different from the what's on your demo than what I usually play? It's all the same stuff. However, as you've heard, we may do some of it in Funk.

Look, I'm new to this. You guys have many more years of this and yet it's surprising my path is a bit different. Maybe because I don't know of any other way that I come up with a different approach.

Yes I do have a vocalist. But that's on half the tunes or less. The horn players switch with me on playing the head or the solo order. I've tried to make the group smaller but I know that I will lose the gigs if I do. Maybe too its because no one wants to change a formula that works.

For me, this is just a stage. I will likely branch off into something completely different later on. I've never been a jazz traditionalist. I just want to make sure I have a solid base of knowledge.

I don't see what's wrong with jazzed up versions of more modern tunes. Sounds exciting actually and may be something good for 'marketing'.

Check out this interesting CL post. Apparently originally from LA.

http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/doc/muc/2806579362.html

I think JW has a point here.

Well it would be insulting to me to take $75 for a band.

One of the reasons I can get 'some' money is that I make it clear that we are professionals and we take our music seriously. And non-restaurant/bar owners BELIEVE ME.

Those restaurant owners are familiar with the trick of $50 a band and bring your audience. This is the style for Rock bands in Hollywood. Then the recepients of the $50 spend at least $100 on drinks. What an F...ing game.

So for this reason, I've never approached a bar or restaurant.

I did chat with a restaurant owner once and this place has a coffee section. He said his fear was that all the seats would be taken by people buying coffee and for a $1.50, he has to pay a band. If he paid a band $200, he'd have to sell 60+ coffees and no profit. So I said I understood his problem. He'd have a problem even if we played for free because the seats would be taken instead of people paying for a full lunch or dinner.

Man, I used to think I'm a nothing because I just learned how to play jazz. Then I realized that has NOTHING to do with it. I believe I have value so I do. With what's happening with the live scene right now, chances are WE (we here in this thread) are better. Just don't act like a weekend warrior. Treat the job seriously and it all comes.

(and don't play in bars/restaurants...).

Great article/posting! I don't think though that this will change anything for me insofar as getting a restaurant gig here. If I go corporate/private function then the game changes, but I suppose I've already realized that the situation in many, many cities is that if you want to play live on a regular basis, and play the music you want this will severely limit the types of places that welcome you, or will even offer to pay you.

I don't suppose it would hurt to try to educate the local restaurant owners though, especially if they demand a following before hiring you.

I am curious JW, where do you play if not in bars and restaurants. Just at private parties/functions?

Getting paid to play the music you want is a rare rare thing in my experience. It always seems to me that the amount I get paid reflects the pain of the gig, ranging from playing with a few friends in the back room of a pub which results in almost zero pay and lots of enjoyment - or a full on posh wedding where one has to dress up in a funny wig and play disco, hanging around for hours but results in a fat pay check (relatively speaking). Restaurants are about in the middle, not that I do these any anymore. Some musical enjoyment is possible if not the norm and the money is bad but could be worse. But every gig is different.
I used to have one restaurant gig I really enjoyed - really good grand piano, good money, nice people, great food, once a week, minimal arty audience so I could play what I like. The only downer was that I had to start playing at 7 in the morning. Not exactly jazz time.

Yeah, for a rant, I thought it was pretty well written.

So we may not be very good at making money, but boy are we good at spending it!
Next week for me (all in 4 days time):
- KJ solo at Carnegie Hall
- Lesson with Dave
- Lesson with Pilc
- Mehldau solo.

And Herbie in March, but we gotta wait a little for that.

Wow lucky Knotty

I know... is it too close to bragging ?

Not as long as you give us the lowdown of what Pilc says ;-)

Exactly-- all will be forgiven then

Everyone's quiet so let's chat

Apparently KJ is doing his usual solo thing here again (the one I missed last year). I'm not planning on it this year but I am surprised at the regularity. In the past he wasn't doing annual gigs over here.

Another gig tonight (paid I might add...). I used my Nord Piano at last week's gig and I thought I played so badly that I don't want to post it. NP sounded good though. Just not me. Then a prior event, I forgot to turn on the recorder.

I've been so busy with gigs that I haven't worked much on anything new. February is not so heavy so maybe I'll catch up before the big gigs in March.

Tonight we'll be doing a vocals version of Blue in Green. We tried it a jam session. Worked well. Unusual because I don't know where the singer got the lyrics for Blue in Green. It wasn't Kurt Elling's lyrics.

So what's up with you guys?

gig at a jazz club last week
big band rehearsal yesterday
open day for postgraduate study at the university the day before
orchestra rehearsal tomorrow
drum cello and piano practice everyday
trying to keep busy, always

Interesting assignment from my teacher. The piece Freedom Jazz Dance by Eddie Harris consists of three phrases of rapid eight notes. I'll learn one phrase a week and do it in all keys. The point is no so much to learn a lick, but rather, these phrases use intervals that most piano players (at my level, at least), don't use in soloing. We have comfort zones in terms of the intervals we use, and the hope is that learning this head will get the feel of different intervals in your hands (and in your ear). Now, how about I actually practice instead of futzing on the internet. I'm home early from work because we've got a healthy winter storm here in Chicago.