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#2197480 - 12/14/13 12:23 PM Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7''
Emily588 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/14/13
Posts: 3
Hi Everyone! My name is Emily and I live in Denver, CO. My family (5 piano players in total) and I can finally buy a grand piano in the new home we are moving into. I have had an upright piano for the past twenty years. I would like to buy a high quality piano that will last us a long time, but also hold its value. Does anyone have any recommendations for a piano that is between 5'1'' and 5'7''? We have a small room that will become the home to our new piano and cannot fit a bigger size. Also, we would like to stay in a price range under $30,000. Thank you so much for reading my post. Also, does adding a player piano system damage the piano? My kids would really like to have that added.


Edited by Emily588 (12/14/13 12:29 PM)

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#2197491 - 12/14/13 12:35 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
Jolly Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/20/01
Posts: 14048
Loc: Louisiana
Originally Posted By: Emily588
Hi Everyone! My name is Emily and I live in Denver, CO. My family (5 piano players in total) and I can finally buy a grand piano in the new home we are moving into. I have had an upright piano for the past twenty years. I would like to buy a high quality piano that will last us a long time, but also hold its value. Does anyone have any recommendations for a piano that is between 5'1'' and 5'7''? We have a small room that will become the home to our new piano and cannot fit a bigger size. Also, we would like to stay in a price range under $30,000. Thank you so much for reading my post. Also, does adding a player piano system damage the piano? My kids would really like to have that added.


I'd buy piano first and worry about player later, but that's just me.

Two new pianos that come to mind with a street price under $30K are:

1. Charles Walter W175
2. Estonia L168

Yes, I know the Walter is just a tad longer than 5'6", but it's a really, really good piano. The Estonia fits your length requirements and is also a very good piano.

Those would be my personal first choices.
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Over 1,000,000 posts where pianists discuss everything. And nothing.

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#2197496 - 12/14/13 12:42 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
dynamobt Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/07/13
Posts: 644
Loc: NH
It's all well to ask what we like. You need to get out there and play as many pianos you can find to determine what you like. Also, are you determined to buy new? Or are older or rebuilt pianos in consideration?

Have a look at the Piano Buyer Guide the link to which is on the right hand side of the page. Learn as much as you can about different makes and the quality of each. And informed buyer is in much better position to chose wisely.


Edited by dynamobt (12/14/13 12:42 PM)
_________________________
1918 Mason & Hamlin BB





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#2197502 - 12/14/13 12:55 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
maurus Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/21/11
Posts: 788
Hi,
In a situation not too different from yours I looked at many pianos and in the end opted for the one in my signature... But you really have to look around and play many pianos, new and perhaps also used, just to know what's out there and what your preferences are.
_________________________
Shigeru Kawai SK-2, etc.

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#2197504 - 12/14/13 12:58 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
Norbert Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/03/01
Posts: 14116
Loc: Surrey, B.C.
Thinking 2 of industry's possibly top choices had just been suggested. Beautiful, but different each.

Enjoy your shopping experience!

Norbert smile
_________________________
www.heritagepianos.com
Greater Vancouver B.C. piano dealers for : C.Sauter, Estonia, Brodmann, Ritmuller
604-951-8642

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#2197509 - 12/14/13 01:07 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
Minnesota Marty Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 7223
Loc: Rochester MN
Hi Emily - Welcome to Piano World!

You have a substantial budget and there are many instruments which would serve very well. I agree with the others that Walter and Estonia immediately pop into mind. The Walter might be too big, however. Another piano worth consideration would be the Kawai GX-1BLK.

Have fun with your shopping!
_________________________
Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#2197512 - 12/14/13 01:13 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
Emily588 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/14/13
Posts: 3
Thank you so much for your comments. I admit to being extremely uneducated when it comes to pianos. I haven't had the funds in the past to purchase a nicer piano, so this is a new experience for me. I would definitely look into used pianos too.

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#2197514 - 12/14/13 01:16 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
Ed McMorrow, RPT Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/09/12
Posts: 1868
Loc: Seattle, WA USA
Sometimes the new generation of solenoid activated digital controlled used player grands sit on the market quite a while before selling. You might find one that works for you well within your price range price. Many of the after market installed players have less than robust pedal systems. You would need a knowledgeable, independent piano technician to evaluate any prospects carefully for you.

The number one complaint of the new player systems is that they do not play softly enough. To evaluate this sit down in the room with someone while the player is operating and have a conversation at the same time. If you can't adjust the player volume low enough where you can talk in a moderate voice and hear both the music and the speech-you have a problem.

This problem can be addressed but it involves complete tone-regulation of the piano action and may even include replacing hammers.

The Yamaha disclaviers are excellent players but I am not so fond of the tone of Yamaha in general.

At $30K you may find a used Steinway grand with a post-factory player installation or a Mason & Hamlin with a factory done Pianodisc system.
_________________________
In a seemingly infinite universe-infinite human creativity is-seemingly possible

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#2197524 - 12/14/13 01:35 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
Retsacnal Online   content

Platinum Supporter until Feb 18  2015


Registered: 10/11/12
Posts: 453
Loc: Northern Virgina
I like the older Baldwin M (5'2"), but I'm biased. wink

On a serious note, just because you can spend 30k doesn't mean you need to.
I think a couple people above mentioned considering a rebuilt piano, and I'd second that thought, or even consider a well maintained older piano (which is the route I chose). I like older things, and like the idea of "recycling" something. One discussion I see on this site about new pianos is how long the various grades, makes and models will last. Years ago, things were made to last indefinitely (with proper care and maintenance, or course). I suspect that an older piano of good quality will last as long as most low- to mid-level pianos made today, if not longer.

You can buy a good quality piano, but when you buy a new one, at whatever the going price is, you don't have anything unique or necessarily interesting (imo)--you have a mass produced product that anyone else can buy too. That's not necessarily bad, but if you want something unique, interesting--focal point or talking point--in your home, you have to hunt for something different. And you don't find those "gems" new at the dealer for x percent off suggested price.

Sorry to over emphasize older pianos, but you say you want a "high quality piano that will last us a long time, but also hold its value." New pianos do not hold their value (many posts here about that), not even the brands that claim they do! The only way to satisfy your two constraints is to buy a quality piano that has already gone through the depreciation process (at someone else's expense), and has whose price is based only on its intrinsic value.
_________________________
1950 Baldwin M

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#2197526 - 12/14/13 01:45 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
Jolly Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/20/01
Posts: 14048
Loc: Louisiana
No, if you want to go the used route...

Again, just a couple of inches longer than your requirements, but a M&H A is a hard piano to beat. Many think it the very best sub-6 foot piano.

I saw a six-year old one go for $18K the other day, but I would think that an anomaly.

Good pianos are where you find them. A good used piano may be a bit harder to find, or may not.

Just remember, when spending the kind of money we're talking about here, always have a good tech check out a used piano.
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Over 1,000,000 posts where pianists discuss everything. And nothing.

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#2197538 - 12/14/13 02:15 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
dynamobt Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/07/13
Posts: 644
Loc: NH
I bought my rebuilt 7' Mason & Hamlin for just under 30K. So, it's possible to find a lot of piano for your piano budget.
_________________________
1918 Mason & Hamlin BB





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#2197542 - 12/14/13 02:23 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
jdw Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/04/11
Posts: 942
Loc: Philadelphia, PA
I think you can get a new M&H within your budget. The question is, which piano will please all 5 players? smile You'll have some wonderful choices under $30,000 at that size.
_________________________
1989 Baldwin R
Currently working on:
Grieg, Papillon
Mozart, K 330
Brahms, Op. 118 no. 2

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#2197574 - 12/14/13 03:11 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: jdw]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19225
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: jdw
I think you can get a new M&H within your budget. The question is, which piano will please all 5 players? smile You'll have some wonderful choices under $30,000 at that size.
MAYBE only the model B at 5'4". In most places the model A would be more expensive to the best of my knowledge.

Since the Walter 175 is narrower than most pianos of the same length it might look "smaller" than other pianos of the same length. Although some people have very specific limits on the maximum length piano they want, I think it's extremely rare that they can't fit a piano that's a few inches longer.

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#2197575 - 12/14/13 03:11 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
Grandpianoman Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/12/05
Posts: 2306
Loc: Portland, Oregon
Hello Emily,

If you can find an older, rebuilt Mason&Hamlin "A" grand, which I believe is 5ft 8, and you like the tone and touch etc, I would highly recommend to have the the LX solenoid player system installed. It is without a doubt, the best 'retro-fittalbe' High-definition player system on the market. www.live-performance.com

I have one in my rebuilt 1927 M&Hamlin 7ft BB. Here is my Youtube page which has quite a few vids and recordings of this wonderful piano with the LX system. Even if you find another brand of piano you like, the LX system would be an excellent choice. The LX does not affect the pedal system in any negative way either.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5f5Z5Pkj4VY&feature=c4-overview&list=UUabnplkSdNakIT6YdrzDacw


The reason I mention Mason & Hamlin as the piano, they are usually less money than some of the other high-end pianos, yet the tone and touch is commensurate with other high-end pianos. Buying a used one that has been rebuilt, the depreciation is already reflected in the price, as has been mentioned, will likely be a lot less than a new one of the same model, and you know that what you are hearing is what you are buying, just like a new piano. smile

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#2197612 - 12/14/13 04:13 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
PianoWorksATL Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/19/09
Posts: 2685
Loc: Atlanta, GA
Estonia L168 - The Piano Buyer, Staff Pick for "Musical Standout" & "Good Value". "Estonia grands are probably the best value among high-end pianos." - Larry Fine

What is neat is that only 3 grands under 6' were recognized as both Good Value & Musical standout, but only Estonia is high-end, hand-built. The other two are consumer level, production instruments.

While there are many fine instruments in your budget range, only Estonia offers premium quality & NEW. That's saying something.
_________________________
Sam Bennett
PianoWorks - Atlanta Piano Dealer
Bösendorfer, Estonia, Seiler, Grotrian, Weber & Hailun
Pre-Owned: Yamaha, Kawai, Steinway & other fine pianos
Full Restoration Shop
www.PianoWorks.com
www.youtube.com/PianoWorksAtlanta

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#2197615 - 12/14/13 04:32 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: PianoWorksATL]
terminaldegree Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/03/06
Posts: 2623
Loc: western Wisconsin
Originally Posted By: PianoWorksATL

What is neat is that only 3 grands under 6' were recognized as both Good Value & Musical standout, but only Estonia is high-end, hand-built.


You might be reading into that too much, Sam. To be fair, the "staff picks" section is not based on playing every model of every single manufacturer. It's what we've had a chance to play recently... and we try a lot of instruments... but certainly not everything out there. (I'm trying to see about getting to the Shanghai show, as a lot of mfgrs aren't at NAMM anymore.)
_________________________
Pianist, teacher, internet addict.
Piano Review Editor - Acoustic and Digital Piano Buyer
Casio px-200, Bechstein A190 #192939 @ home
Steinway A #585209, B #416809 @ work
Schimmel 130T #339100, on loan

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#2197638 - 12/14/13 06:06 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: terminaldegree]
PianoWorksATL Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/19/09
Posts: 2685
Loc: Atlanta, GA
Originally Posted By: terminaldegree
You might be reading into that too much, Sam. To be fair, the "staff picks" section is not based on playing every model of every single manufacturer.
I certainly follow, but what other high-end piano would be under 5'7" and in range for the OP's budget? The staff may add more picks in other categories by playing more pianos, but who else is even eligible in that category? There are relatively few high-end + good value in anything less than semi-concert to concert grands where high-end pianos consistently prove themselves.

What is true is that high-end pianos give good value/are valuable often in spite of their price, not because of it. Estonia is unique.
_________________________
Sam Bennett
PianoWorks - Atlanta Piano Dealer
Bösendorfer, Estonia, Seiler, Grotrian, Weber & Hailun
Pre-Owned: Yamaha, Kawai, Steinway & other fine pianos
Full Restoration Shop
www.PianoWorks.com
www.youtube.com/PianoWorksAtlanta

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#2197640 - 12/14/13 06:08 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: PianoWorksATL]
Jolly Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/20/01
Posts: 14048
Loc: Louisiana
Originally Posted By: PianoWorksATL
Estonia L168 - The Piano Buyer, Staff Pick for "Musical Standout" & "Good Value". "Estonia grands are probably the best value among high-end pianos." - Larry Fine

What is neat is that only 3 grands under 6' were recognized as both Good Value & Musical standout, but only Estonia is high-end, hand-built. The other two are consumer level, production instruments.

While there are many fine instruments in your budget range, only Estonia offers premium quality & NEW. That's saying something.


One thing we haven't addressed is a decent piano w/ player for $30K or less.

What would be your favorite(s)?
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Over 1,000,000 posts where pianists discuss everything. And nothing.

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#2197647 - 12/14/13 06:28 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
Grandpianoman Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/12/05
Posts: 2306
Loc: Portland, Oregon
Emily, one more thing, I am coming at this from a consumer and a professional musician's point of view. I am not a dealer of pianos, nor of the LX system. I am however, an avid fan of the M&Hamlin and the LX, having lived with both since 2007. smile My BB is not a new piano, it was built in 1927, rebuilt in 2007, with it's original plate and soundboard, a new action, hammers, strings, and a bridge modification using the original bridge, called "Wapin". www.wapin.com

Choosing a piano is a very subjective exercise...one persons favorite piano/system may not be the next person's favorite, for a variety of reasons. smile

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#2197694 - 12/14/13 08:23 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
patH Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/09/13
Posts: 548
Loc: Germany
No one mentioned the Kawai GE30 yet? Because that's the first piano in that size range I thought of.

Emily: Do you have neighbors in your home? Or when one person in your household plays the piano: Do the others like it, or do they prefer not hearing practising?
Because if either is true, you may want to consider a built-in silent system. The Kawai GE30 with silent system (they call it "Anytime") is below $30k, if I'm not mistaken. I don't know if Walter or Estonia come with built-in silent systems, and I haven't tried either of them.

Most important: Try the piano type; and have all those that are supposed to play the piano try it as well. After all, the best piano in the world does not serve its purpose as a music instrument if the persons that are supposed to play it don't like it.
_________________________
Everything is possible, and nothing is sure.
XXXI

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#2197740 - 12/14/13 10:01 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
Emily588 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/14/13
Posts: 3
I went out today and fell in LOVE with the Estonia piano. I couldn't believe how wonderful it felt to play and it was just as beautiful to look at. I also decided not to add the player piano system when I saw the large hole they had to cut in it to install the unit. Thank you so so so much for all of your advice. We are all going to enjoy this piano! I would never thought to look into this brand without your suggestions.

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#2197743 - 12/14/13 10:05 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
Minnesota Marty Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 7223
Loc: Rochester MN
Emily, you have chosen well.

Enjoy - Enjoy - Enjoy !!!

(And, we always love pictures.)
_________________________
Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#2197790 - 12/15/13 12:08 AM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
Grandpianoman Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/12/05
Posts: 2306
Loc: Portland, Oregon
Congrats!...it's a wonderful piano ...Heard one live a few years ago, enjoyed it very much.

Just to allay any fears about a hole in the piano for the LX player system. It does not damage the piano in any way, nor does it hurt it's resale value. smile

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#2197858 - 12/15/13 07:52 AM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
Jolly Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/20/01
Posts: 14048
Loc: Louisiana
Originally Posted By: Emily588
I went out today and fell in LOVE with the Estonia piano. I couldn't believe how wonderful it felt to play and it was just as beautiful to look at. I also decided not to add the player piano system when I saw the large hole they had to cut in it to install the unit. Thank you so so so much for all of your advice. We are all going to enjoy this piano! I would never thought to look into this brand without your suggestions.


They are very nice, aren't they?

May you, your children and your grand children, enjoy this one for many years to come!
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Over 1,000,000 posts where pianists discuss everything. And nothing.

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#2197865 - 12/15/13 08:09 AM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
jdw Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/04/11
Posts: 942
Loc: Philadelphia, PA
Congratulations, Emily! That's a great choice, I'm sure you'll all love it!
_________________________
1989 Baldwin R
Currently working on:
Grieg, Papillon
Mozart, K 330
Brahms, Op. 118 no. 2

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#2197904 - 12/15/13 10:25 AM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
dynamobt Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/07/13
Posts: 644
Loc: NH
Congratulations!!
_________________________
1918 Mason & Hamlin BB





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#2197906 - 12/15/13 10:26 AM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
PianoWorksATL Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/19/09
Posts: 2685
Loc: Atlanta, GA
smile Congrats!
_________________________
Sam Bennett
PianoWorks - Atlanta Piano Dealer
Bösendorfer, Estonia, Seiler, Grotrian, Weber & Hailun
Pre-Owned: Yamaha, Kawai, Steinway & other fine pianos
Full Restoration Shop
www.PianoWorks.com
www.youtube.com/PianoWorksAtlanta

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#2197941 - 12/15/13 12:50 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
Hakki Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 2405
Emily believe me, I was just going to post suggesting the Estonia, without reading the replies that I saw the congrats messages.

It is a very correct decision. I wish you many years of enjoyment with you piano!
_________________________
Put in one of IMO, I think, to me, for me... or similar to all sentences I post

http://www.youtube.com/user/hakkithepianist

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#2198125 - 12/15/13 05:57 PM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
malkin Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/18/09
Posts: 2410
Loc: *sigh* Salt Lake City
I'm so happy for you!

And for me too, because our L168 is settling in nicely!
Just had a Dampp Chaser installed last week--although in our desert, we chase around trying to get a little damp all year! We are still holding out for our first tuning.
_________________________
A good student is one who makes the teacher feel like a good teacher.

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#2198355 - 12/16/13 05:19 AM Re: Help Deciding on a Piano under 5'7'' [Re: Emily588]
wimpiano Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/16/13
Posts: 968
Loc: The Netherlands
Congratulations!
_________________________
Schimmel 116 S .

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