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#2199486 - 12/18/13 01:29 AM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: carey]
AZNpiano Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/07/07
Posts: 5454
Loc: Orange County, CA
Originally Posted By: carey
Originally Posted By: hreichgott
Hey AZNpiano, just wanted to say I really like your style. Those LH figures are very fun in your interpretation.

Ditto !!

Thanks! smile
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#2199495 - 12/18/13 01:58 AM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Polyphonist]
dire tonic Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/17/11
Posts: 1243
Loc: uk south
What a perfect pre-Xmas treat this is, full of wonderful music from my familiar friends in ABF and some superlative playing from the pianists in PCF Iíve never heard before. A joy to listen and to be involved. Keep them coming, but not too quickly Ė itíll be over all too soon.

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#2199508 - 12/18/13 03:19 AM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Polyphonist]
FarmGirl Offline

Silver Supporter until Jan 02 2013


Registered: 09/14/10
Posts: 1952
Loc: Scottsdale, AZ
Jeffreyjones - my goodness you can play incredibly well.
Santa did a superb job as well. What a nice gift.
Valencia - I have never heard the piece before and now I love it. What a sweet piece. You played very well. Perfect gift for your mom. Hope she gets better soon.
_________________________
Solo - Liszt Hungarian Rhapsody No. 2, Schubert Sonata D960 Andante sostenute (9/7/14), Bach f minor Fugue WTC Bk1, Rachmaninoff Elegie Op 3 #1, Chopin Trois Nouvelles Etudes #1



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#2199529 - 12/18/13 05:10 AM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Polyphonist]
Ganddalf Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/09
Posts: 613
Loc: Norway
Listening to the first three Mazurka opuses was a real treat for me. Having focused mainly on later Mazurkas most of the early ones were completely new to me, and I regret that I havenít paid any attention to them before. All the Mazurkas seem to have their individual character. The folkloristic inspiration is obvious in most cases and some of the harmonics are pretty peculiar. Just browsing the scores of the mazurkas may give the impression that this is just triviality, but listening to the contributions made me understand how great music this actually is.

I have developed a habit of commenting to each individual performance of such e-citals, and Iíll try to do so in this case too. Some of the performances will get more extensive comments than the others. This doesnít mean that the contributions getting longer comments are better than the others, but in some cases it is just difficult to say so much.

Op.6/1 played by Sam S: The first I noticed when listening to your performance was your consciousness about the dynamics. Clearly this mazurka is technically difficult, but you managed well, and gave me a good listening experience.

Op.6/2 played by SwissMS: Beautiful dancing character. You manage to make your grand piano sing. It is interesting for me to notice some similarity between Chopin and Grieg in this piece. Maybe not a big surprise, since both were inspired by folk music, and there are some similarities between Polish and Norwegian folk tunes.

Op.6/3 played by AZNpiano: Excellent performance. This was professional level. And what a beautiful piece!

Op.6/4 played by Roland the beagle: The character of this mazurka greatly contrasts with the previous one. You bring out the special mood of the piece and I enjoyed listening to it.

Op.7/1 played by Rubinstein: No comments to the performance, but this is also a great composition with very interesting harmonies.

Op.7/2 played by Brad Hoehne: Fine ornaments! You beautifully bring out the changing moods of this piece. Very nicely done.

Op.7/3-4 played by Cinnamonbear: Obviously you are a very skilled pianist. I enjoyed the way you made out the folkloristic character of the first piece (7/3) and I was impressed by your lower voice figures. The second piece (7/4) was extremely interesting. I donít think I have heard anything similar anywhere. You played it very beautifully.

Op.7/5 played by peterws: Another small peculiar piece. Although the piece is very short it doesnít mean that it is simple. Nice playing of the ornaments and beautiful sound. Maybe you should have played it all over again some 8 Ė 10 times???

Op.17/1 played by jeffreyjones: You beautifully express the joyful character of the main part and the contrast with the middle theme. Fine playing.

Op.17/2 played by Dipsy: Excellent video! And very fine playing! I think that the Chopin Mazurkas require some liberty in the rhythm and tempo. You definitely have a deep understanding of this music.

Op.17/3 played by jefferyjones: This is a very complex piece with rapidly changing moods. The performance shows that you are a very skilled pianist. Listening to it was a real treat.

Op.17/4 played by Valencia: Indeed Iím very impressed by your performance. You manage to bring out the beautiful character of this mazurka. Especially I noticed the very relaxed performance of the complex ornaments in the melody. Very well done.

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#2199612 - 12/18/13 09:42 AM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Polyphonist]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11699
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Mazurka in F# minor, Opus 6 No 1, Performed by Sam S: You play with such energy - I really enjoyed listening to this quirky piece!

Mazurka in C# minor, Opus 6 No 2, Performed by SwissMS: You play this beautifully, I was entranced during the whole thing and will definitely remember this piece in the future.

Mazurka in E major, Opus 6 No 3, Performed by AZNpiano: How great to hear you play! This is a top-notch performance - Bravo!

Mazurka in Eb minor, Opus 6 No 4, Performed by Roland the Beagle (or should I call you "CowOnCrack"? LOL): This piece seems to be very circular in its form. You did a great job adding such a melancholy feel to this piece. Thanks for playing!

Mazurka in Bb major, Opus 7 No 1, Performed by sandalholme: I really loved the trills on this- they are so light and whimsical! A fine performance with good contrast between the sections.

Mazurka in A minor, Opus 7 No 2, Performed by Brad Hoehne: You play with a lot of clarity, and I love how this sounds on your Petrof, as if it's meant to be played on this instrument. Love the excitement you add toward the faster ending section!

Mazurka in F minor, Opus 7 No 3, Performed by Cinnamonbear: I love the mysterious beginning! You have a great feel for the style of this piece and a great choice of rubato - I wish I could play this nicely!

Mazurka in Ab major, Opus 7 No 4, Performed by Cinnamonbear: What a delightful piece! Another fine performance.

Mazurka in C major, Opus 7 No 5, Performed by peterws: I was really surprised by the ending. Great work in playing this fun, quirky piece! Is this the same set up that you used for the Grieg recital as well?
_________________________
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MTNA member
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Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#2199620 - 12/18/13 09:58 AM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Polyphonist]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11699
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Mazurka in Bb major, Opus 17 No 1, Performed by jeffreyjones: Wow, you play with such excitement it makes me want to get up and cheer (but of course, that would be silly and it would freak out hubby and the cats). wink

Mazurka in E minor, Opus 17 No 2, Performed by Dipsy: I love how you played this, and looking like Santa's little helper too! Merry Christmas to you!

Mazurka in Ab major, Opus 17 No 3, Performed by jeffreyjones: This mazurka has a sort of pastoral feel to it with the pedal tone and the melody I could totally hear that being played on the oboe. Thanks for playing this so wonderfully!

Mazurka in A minor, Opus 17 No 4, Performed by Valencia: A lovely piece to dedicate to your mother. I hope she is well soon. Have you played this for her? Great job on the fioritura!
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#2199627 - 12/18/13 10:21 AM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: carey]
Cinnamonbear Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 3861
Loc: Rockford, IL
Wow, people! I'm really warmed to the core by the kind words. I do not consider myself to be an "accomplished" pianist at all. As many of you know, I was one of those "lapsed pianists." Over the last three years, though, and especially since finding Piano World, I have been working hard to make up for lost time and to "get good." But there are many holes in my education and deficits in my pianism. These Mazurkas were such a hole. As to education and deficits, Pogerelich and Minnesota Marty are especially keen on them, and I am indebted to them for their unvarnished critiques and helps over time, such as can be done over the Internet by means of judicious typed words. So, since Poly would not permit me to write a "sufficient" (imho) introductory explanation for my submissions, I present them to you here grin :

When Poly blew onto the scene with this particular e-cital idea, and he said, "Have them on my desk in one month," I thought, "Oh, for cry eye! Are you kidding me? One month?!? It takes me *at least* a year to get anything to the point where I'm ready to share it." But I was up for the challenge. Then, wonder of wonders, he relented, giving me the precious gift of time.

So, what to do? "What is this thing called 'Mazurka'?" So, of course I went to two other of my closest PW friends, ChopinAddict and Carey, and said, "What should I play?" ChopinAddict, that dear librarian-hearted resource person, thought to ask the "second" question (reference librarians will know what I mean by that... wink ) "What do you want? Major or minor? Happy or sad? Fast or slow?" Gosh. "I think I want simple." LOL! Actually, I think I asked for happy, so she sent me off with a few ideas. Then, Carey, who always gently pushes and pulls me to challenge myself and NOT take foolish interpretive liberties, sent me some ideas.

I pulled a couple of sheets off of IMSLP and read through them and that's when the fireworks of epiphanation went off inside of me. When I was young, my dad and I would play together the Dvorak Slavic Dances, four hands, and we had such fun! I miss playing those. When I heard the sound of "Mazurka," it took me back to that time. It dawned on me that, for *me*, anyway, in the way I was hearing them in my mind's ear, these were like "solo Slavic dances." I love the sound of them. And so now, thanks to Polyphonist, I have a new mania. eek wink

So, I eventually landed on the four (two more to come later in the recital). And I worked really hard at them. My wife goes to work at 6:30 a.m., and by 6:35 I was on the piano bench. Except for a few times when I had other musical deadlines to meet, I played through all four every day, multiple times, sometimes multiple times a day. I'd take one and chew on it and practice hands separately, I'd practice very slowly and deliberately hands together, drill some sections, then try some expression practice and try them against the metronome at speed and crash and burn. grin Behind the scenes, I'd complain to Carey, saying there was NO WAY I could play 7-4 at speed, and besides "Presto, ma non troppo" means fast, but not too fast, so despite the m.m., I was taking Chopin at his direction. So, when Carey says:

Originally Posted By: carey
[...] Andy - These have come a LONG way since your first readings - [...]


...he means he heard practice recordings at about mid-point, and that I was playing a D nat. in the opening section of 7-3, instead of Db! blush And stuff like that! laugh And also, I want to thank Carey, because when I asked some deeper, more pointed questions about this thing called "Mazurka," he sent me a link to this paper:

http://www.chopin.org/articles/Polish%20Folk%20Music%20and%20Chopins%20Mazurkas_Gorbaty.pdf

...which *really* started illuminating things for me. So, anyway, over the course of the months, suffice it to say that I had many cognitive leaps of the kind that come when you focus on something really hard, and then put it aside to rest for a minute or a night or a week, then pick it back up and go at it again. I mean, about two weeks ago, as I was getting ready to think about recording, and, because I am a *reader* and not a *memorizer*, and because I was trying to keep track of pedaling and articulations and dynamics and such, the words that came out of my mouth were, "Honey? Don't we have different colored highlighters somewhere in the house?" (They were in a desk in the basement.)

Click to reveal..


So, I recorded and edited my submission on Sunday. "EDITED?!?," I hear you ask. Yes, edited. I have discussed my philosophy about this rather thoroughly at other times in other threads both on the main boards and in Member Recordings, and if anyone is interested, I'll dig up a link. In the past, between my first and second mid-life crises, I worked with a musician/producer for a while, editing tracks, and it is such a part of me that I almost can't not do it, now. But when I post "finished" recordings, I want them to be something that 1) sounds good, and 2) will bear repeated listenings. But, I always edit lightly, meaning that I use whole chunks of three or four takes in order to keep the musical line and flow of it sane and cogent, and I strive to leave in enough wobbles, fluffs, and burbles to keep it honest. After all, I am *not* an accomplished pianist, though I love to play piano very much and I play piano A LOT! grin When I edit my recordings, I work very deliberately to not over-edit, and to arrive at a track that would be something that would come from me in performance on a good day. And I *do* have good days where I play this stuff for real people in real performances. That is what also keeps me honest and grounded about my abilities and those areas that I need to work on.

You will really see what I mean about fluffs and wobbles when you hear Op. 67, No. 1, the playing of which is Hugely Big Fudge in many places because it was *Not Ready For Prime Time* and in which I missed and skipped whole trills until such time as I can get them to come out from under my fingers (I need more than three months for that one! And even then, I am not sure what the trick is to playing them at speed. But I am sure Carey will push and pull me to it. wink ).

So, that is my story, just so you know. And my wife, God love her, on Sunday morning before vacating the house so I could record, and after enduring an evening of frantic and pointed rehearsal Saturday night, said that she had Mazurkas going through her head all night long. My true love. Surely we are one.

I, too, have been enjoying these performances tremendously!!! I love the passion, humor, thought, feeling and care that have gone into these offerings! Like gandalff, I would like to comment on each one, and hope to do so. Very, very wonderful work, everyone! Thank you so much for sharing!!!

--Andy


Edited by Cinnamonbear (12/18/13 11:13 AM)
_________________________
I may not be fast,
but at least I'm slow.

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#2199639 - 12/18/13 10:37 AM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Cinnamonbear]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11699
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: Cinnamonbear
I have discussed my philosophy about this rather thoroughly at other times in other threads both on the main boards and in Member Recordings, and if anyone is interested, I'll dig up a link. In the past, between my first and second mid-life crises, I worked with a musician/producer for a while, editing tracks, and it is such a part of me that I almost can't not do it, now. But when I post "finished" recordings, I want them to be something that 1) sounds good, and 2) will bear repeated listenings. But, I always edit lightly, meaning that I use whole chunks of three or four takes in order to keep the musical line and flow sane and cogent, and I strive to leave in enough wobbles, fluffs, and burbles to keep it honest. After all, I am *not* an accomplished pianist, though I love to play piano very much and I play piano A LOT! grin When I edit my recordings, I work very deliberately to not over-edit, and to arrive at a track that would be something that would come from me in performance on a good day. And I *do* have good days where I play this stuff for real people in real performances. That is what also keeps me honest and grounded about my abilities and those areas that I need to work on.

I appreciate hearing this - makes me feel a bit better for having to do that this recital as well. If I had the kind of time I need to dedicate to piano to play the way I want to play and the way I know I can play, then it wouldn't be necessary to edit. But I'm just not able to be at that level, unfortunately.
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#2199651 - 12/18/13 11:07 AM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Morodiene]
Cinnamonbear Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 3861
Loc: Rockford, IL
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
Originally Posted By: Cinnamonbear
I have discussed my philosophy about this rather thoroughly at other times in other threads both on the main boards and in Member Recordings, and if anyone is interested, I'll dig up a link. In the past, between my first and second mid-life crises, I worked with a musician/producer for a while, editing tracks, and it is such a part of me that I almost can't not do it, now. But when I post "finished" recordings, I want them to be something that 1) sounds good, and 2) will bear repeated listenings. But, I always edit lightly, meaning that I use whole chunks of three or four takes in order to keep the musical line and flow sane and cogent, and I strive to leave in enough wobbles, fluffs, and burbles to keep it honest. After all, I am *not* an accomplished pianist, though I love to play piano very much and I play piano A LOT! grin When I edit my recordings, I work very deliberately to not over-edit, and to arrive at a track that would be something that would come from me in performance on a good day. And I *do* have good days where I play this stuff for real people in real performances. That is what also keeps me honest and grounded about my abilities and those areas that I need to work on.

I appreciate hearing this - makes me feel a bit better for having to do that this recital as well. If I had the kind of time I need to dedicate to piano to play the way I want to play and the way I know I can play, then it wouldn't be necessary to edit. But I'm just not able to be at that level, unfortunately.


Life is too short! What I have discovered is that in allowing myself to eventually edit my recorded tracks, I fear mistakes less, and have learned to play *through* them, so that when they *do* happen in live performances, I don't get rattled about it, anymore! laugh For me, giving myself that kind of permission (permission to avoid perfection in one take) turned out to be a kind of therapy that has actually caused me to calm down at the keyboard, and has improved my playing at those times when I *have* to play it once as best as possible. smile It's called, "Taking the long view." (That is *not* to say that, when I do each take, I *do not* strive for perfection, because I *do*, but I have tried to right-size my expectations about what really happens! grin ) I have also learned to develop a more nuanced definition of "perfection." wink


Edited by Cinnamonbear (12/18/13 11:09 AM)
Edit Reason: added a thought
_________________________
I may not be fast,
but at least I'm slow.

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#2199656 - 12/18/13 11:12 AM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Cinnamonbear]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11699
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: Cinnamonbear

Life is too short! What I have discovered is that in allowing myself to eventually edit my recorded tracks, I fear mistakes less, and have learned to play *through* them, so that when they *do* happen in live performances, I don't get rattled about it, anymore! laugh For me, giving myself that kind of permission (permission to avoid perfection in one take) turned out to be a kind of therapy that has actually caused me to calm down at the keyboard, and has improved my playing at those times when I *have* to play it once as best as possible. smile It's called, "Taking the long view." (That is *not* to say that, when I do each take, I *do not* strive for perfection, because I *do*, but I have tried to right-size my expectations about what really happens! grin ) I have also learned to develop a more nuanced definition of "perfection." wink
You know, that is very true about feeling better in recording. I wasn't having any issues this time around whereas for some of the Grieg pieces I really got flustered in the recording process and it kept getting worse because I was making more mistakes! But I knew I would have to do several takes and edit/splice them together, so I wasn't nervous at all.
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#2199659 - 12/18/13 11:22 AM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Morodiene]
Cinnamonbear Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 3861
Loc: Rockford, IL
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
Originally Posted By: Cinnamonbear

Life is too short! What I have discovered is that in allowing myself to eventually edit my recorded tracks, I fear mistakes less, and have learned to play *through* them, so that when they *do* happen in live performances, I don't get rattled about it, anymore! laugh For me, giving myself that kind of permission (permission to avoid perfection in one take) turned out to be a kind of therapy that has actually caused me to calm down at the keyboard, and has improved my playing at those times when I *have* to play it once as best as possible. smile It's called, "Taking the long view." (That is *not* to say that, when I do each take, I *do not* strive for perfection, because I *do*, but I have tried to right-size my expectations about what really happens! grin ) I have also learned to develop a more nuanced definition of "perfection." wink
You know, that is very true about feeling better in recording. I wasn't having any issues this time around whereas for some of the Grieg pieces I really got flustered in the recording process and it kept getting worse because I was making more mistakes! But I knew I would have to do several takes and edit/splice them together, so I wasn't nervous at all.


There ya go! thumb
_________________________
I may not be fast,
but at least I'm slow.

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#2199663 - 12/18/13 11:25 AM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Morodiene]
carey Online   content
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/13/05
Posts: 6282
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
Originally Posted By: Cinnamonbear
I have discussed my philosophy about this rather thoroughly at other times in other threads both on the main boards and in Member Recordings, and if anyone is interested, I'll dig up a link. In the past, between my first and second mid-life crises, I worked with a musician/producer for a while, editing tracks, and it is such a part of me that I almost can't not do it, now. But when I post "finished" recordings, I want them to be something that 1) sounds good, and 2) will bear repeated listenings. But, I always edit lightly, meaning that I use whole chunks of three or four takes in order to keep the musical line and flow sane and cogent, and I strive to leave in enough wobbles, fluffs, and burbles to keep it honest. After all, I am *not* an accomplished pianist, though I love to play piano very much and I play piano A LOT! grin When I edit my recordings, I work very deliberately to not over-edit, and to arrive at a track that would be something that would come from me in performance on a good day. And I *do* have good days where I play this stuff for real people in real performances. That is what also keeps me honest and grounded about my abilities and those areas that I need to work on.

I appreciate hearing this - makes me feel a bit better for having to do that this recital as well. If I had the kind of time I need to dedicate to piano to play the way I want to play and the way I know I can play, then it wouldn't be necessary to edit. But I'm just not able to be at that level, unfortunately.


I came SO CLOSE to wanting to ask (i.e., beg) Andy to edit a couple of my own recordings (I lack the skills to do so) - but chose not to ask because I knew he had too much on his plate. So instead, I simply recorded my pieces over and over and over again last week until I came up with a take that had no more than two obvious flubbed notes and an "interpretation" I could live with (strange things would happen each time I turned the recorder on). Fortunately, I was able to make the time to do this (although I'm paying for it this week!!). I respect those here who simply sat down and played as brilliantly as they did with only a few attempts - and especially those of you who recorded "live" in front of a camera !! Wow !!!

And Andy - that was an eloquent post regarding your Mazurka journey !! It shows what PW is all about !!

After hearing the recital performances presented thus far, I'm inspired to learn more of these tricky little musical gems !!
_________________________
YouTube channel - http://www.youtube.com/user/pianophilo

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#2199669 - 12/18/13 11:36 AM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Cinnamonbear]
hreichgott Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/13
Posts: 958
Loc: western MA, USA
Originally Posted By: Cinnamonbear
I do not consider myself to be an "accomplished" pianist at all.

Well, your F minor mazurka is most definitely accomplished playing. As in, I would have happily bought a ticket to hear playing like that.
Originally Posted By: Cinnamonbear
As many of you know, I was one of those "lapsed pianists." Over the last three years, though, and especially since finding Piano World, I have been working hard to make up for lost time and to "get good." But there are many holes in my education and deficits in my pianism.

This was a surprise to me. What I thought I was hearing was a professional or professional-level student, who perhaps didn't have time to fully think through every single phrase or bring out every dynamic etc. to the full extent possible, due to the short-term nature of the project and not being able to drop everything else in one's life to focus on this, but still it's that level of playing. The A flat I felt was not as strong as the F minor but it still didn't shake my assumption that I could have been hearing a slightly underprepared professional. Certainly I have colleagues (other dance accompanists and church musicians) who couldn't have played them as well as you with only a few weeks prep time and other pressing projects.

You might consider taking lessons again, if you have room in your life. It sounds like you are excited about digging into pieces, have sufficient practice time and value feedback from others. I recently restarted lessons after several years of working as a pianist, and it was the best decision I could have possibly made.

About editing -- my recordings are edited too, specifically, spliced together from a couple of takes. When recording I usually do 5-10 takes, choose the best 2 and then edit together the best sections of those. If page turns are necessary then I pause for the page turns and edit them out later. I don't usually do more than a couple of edits for a short piece. I agree with you that the finished product should resemble a live performance on a good day, and I would never record anything that I couldn't give a good live performance of.


Edited by hreichgott (12/18/13 11:42 AM)
_________________________
Heather W. Reichgott, piano http://heatherwreichgott.blogspot.com
Sounding the depths of small pieces: Beethoven Op. 33
Daily attempts at 16th notes: Chopin Op. 10 no. 4, Pischna
Totally loving Faurť/Barcarolles and Ravel/Tombeau de Couperin
I love Mozart, Haydn, Beethoven and new music

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#2199676 - 12/18/13 11:47 AM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Polyphonist]
Polyphonist Online   content
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/03/13
Posts: 7573
Loc: New York City
Fourth installment is here! smile

Mazurka in G minor, Opus 24 No 1
Performed by musica71


Mazurka in C major, Opus 24 No 2
Performed by peterws


Mazurka in Ab major, Opus 24 No 3
Performed by timmyab


Mazurka in Bb minor, Opus 24 No 4
Performed by Derulux
https://soundcloud.com/derulux/chopin-mazurka-op-24-no-4/s-SVT4s

Happy listening! smile
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Regards,

Polyphonist

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#2199682 - 12/18/13 12:03 PM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: carey]
peterws Online   content
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/21/12
Posts: 3524
Loc: Northern England.
Carey Chopin never ended it by tailing it off! So I thought I`d gi him a helping hand. Him being unavailable and all that . . .
_________________________
"I'm playing all the right notes ó but not necessarily in the right order." Eric Morecambe

""

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#2199686 - 12/18/13 12:05 PM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Cinnamonbear]
dire tonic Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/17/11
Posts: 1243
Loc: uk south
Originally Posted By: Cinnamonbear
I have discussed my philosophy about this rather thoroughly at other times in other threads both on the main boards and in Member Recordings, and if anyone is interested, I'll dig up a link. In the past, between my first and second mid-life crises, I worked with a musician/producer for a while, editing tracks, and it is such a part of me that I almost can't not do it, now. But when I post "finished" recordings, I want them to be something that 1) sounds good, and 2) will bear repeated listenings. But, I always edit lightly, meaning that I use whole chunks of three or four takes in order to keep the musical line and flow sane and cogent, and I strive to leave in enough wobbles, fluffs, and burbles to keep it honest. After all, I am *not* an accomplished pianist, though I love to play piano very much and I play piano A LOT! grin When I edit my recordings, I work very deliberately to not over-edit, and to arrive at a track that would be something that would come from me in performance on a good day. And I *do* have good days where I play this stuff for real people in real performances. That is what also keeps me honest and grounded about my abilities and those areas that I need to work on.


Yes, absolutely! I did an edit in one of my two pieces. The security of knowing that a bloomer neednít threaten the show allows much greater relaxation hence reduces the risk of error in the first place. Iíve got into the habit of doing a video so this introduces an extra complication in terms of knee position which sometimes varies so I might have to spend some time looking for Ďknee matchingí. My next workaround will focus on knee masking.
A thread focusing on editing would surely be useful other recital players?

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#2199688 - 12/18/13 12:07 PM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Polyphonist]
carey Online   content
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/13/05
Posts: 6282
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona
Opus 24 - All excellent performances of challenging works !!!!! This just keeps getting better and better !! thumb
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YouTube channel - http://www.youtube.com/user/pianophilo

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#2199689 - 12/18/13 12:08 PM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: peterws]
carey Online   content
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/13/05
Posts: 6282
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona
Originally Posted By: peterws
Carey Chopin never ended it by tailing it off! So I thought I`d gi him a helping hand. Him being unavailable and all that . . .


ha thumb
_________________________
YouTube channel - http://www.youtube.com/user/pianophilo

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#2199693 - 12/18/13 12:11 PM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: dire tonic]
carey Online   content
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/13/05
Posts: 6282
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona
Originally Posted By: dire tonic
Iíve got into the habit of doing a video so this introduces an extra complication in terms of knee position which sometimes varies so I might have to spend some time looking for Ďknee matchingí.


A new wrinkle in the recording process !!

Quote:
A thread focusing on editing would surely be useful other recital players?


Darn right it would !!
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YouTube channel - http://www.youtube.com/user/pianophilo

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#2199703 - 12/18/13 12:33 PM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: hreichgott]
Cinnamonbear Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 3861
Loc: Rockford, IL
Originally Posted By: hreichgott
[...] I agree with you that the finished product should resemble a live performance on a good day, and I would never record anything that I couldn't give a good live performance of.


Thank you so much for all of that, hreichgott! And ^^^ my sentiments EXACTLY!!!

And to keep the fun rolling in discussion, here is something about that nuanced definition of perfection I mentioned earlier, for those who are interested to head down the bunny trail with me. And so as to not spoil the flow of presentations, I'm putting it behind the curtain:

Click to reveal..

From a recent four hands practice session with a friend. He is the bass. I am the somewhat punchy tenor.

Perfection In Context: A Short Audio Documentary (1 min., 36 secs.)
_________________________
I may not be fast,
but at least I'm slow.

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#2199708 - 12/18/13 12:42 PM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: carey]
Cinnamonbear Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 3861
Loc: Rockford, IL
Originally Posted By: carey
[...] I came SO CLOSE to wanting to ask (i.e., beg) Andy to edit a couple of my own recordings (I lack the skills to do so) - but chose not to ask because I knew he had too much on his plate. So instead, I simply recorded my pieces over and over and over again last week until I came up with a take that had no more than two obvious flubbed notes and an "interpretation" I could live with [...]


And this is *one* of the things that I admire so much about you, Carey, that as many times as we have shared recordings behind the scenes, and as many times as I have come to you as "the devil incarnate" to suggest a splicing of best takes, you have chosen to pick the best whole take with no edits. And I *know* you have Carnegie Hall and the Moscow Conservatory in your head when you play, and your performances are always so excellent, well thought out, and executed. Just had to say that...

Originally Posted By: carey
[...] I respect those here who simply sat down and played as brilliantly as they did with only a few attempts - and especially those of you who recorded "live" in front of a camera !! Wow !!!
[...]
After hearing the recital performances presented thus far, I'm inspired to learn more of these tricky little musical gems !!


Ditto to all of that!!! laugh

--Andy
_________________________
I may not be fast,
but at least I'm slow.

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#2199714 - 12/18/13 12:57 PM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Polyphonist]
Cinnamonbear Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 3861
Loc: Rockford, IL
Opus 24: WOW!!! Excellence abounds!!! Such enjoyable music!!!
_________________________
I may not be fast,
but at least I'm slow.

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#2199717 - 12/18/13 01:03 PM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Polyphonist]
FarmGirl Offline

Silver Supporter until Jan 02 2013


Registered: 09/14/10
Posts: 1952
Loc: Scottsdale, AZ
Musica71 - you must've asked to do this at the last minute because I saw someone else's name on it if I'm not mistaken. Fine job. I loved the beautiful sound and musical quality. Hats off to you pulling this our with a very short notice. I played this in a recital 20 years ago and would have taken me hours to bring it back to my mediocre performance level which is below your sight reading (lol).

Peter, loved your fluent and light touch.

Timmy, an excellent job as usual. Nice to see my follow ABFers are playing so well.

Derulux, bravo! you are a fine player. I loved the way you play - for the lack of word (not a native speaker of English), I like the orchestrated sound that you bring out from the entire instrument. I heard all the notes in a chords while you emphasized the melody lines. But all the notes were there, ringing together in the harmony, sometimes like a distant echo or murmur, sometimes like a swelling under current in the ocean. Thank you for sharing.
_________________________
Solo - Liszt Hungarian Rhapsody No. 2, Schubert Sonata D960 Andante sostenute (9/7/14), Bach f minor Fugue WTC Bk1, Rachmaninoff Elegie Op 3 #1, Chopin Trois Nouvelles Etudes #1



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#2199725 - 12/18/13 01:22 PM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Cinnamonbear]
Derulux Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/05
Posts: 5294
Loc: Philadelphia
Originally Posted By: Cinnamonbear
Wow, people! I'm really warmed to the core by the kind words. I do not consider myself to be an "accomplished" pianist at all. As many of you know, I was one of those "lapsed pianists." Over the last three years, though, and especially since finding Piano World, I have been working hard to make up for lost time and to "get good." But there are many holes in my education and deficits in my pianism. These Mazurkas were such a hole. As to education and deficits, Pogerelich and Minnesota Marty are especially keen on them, and I am indebted to them for their unvarnished critiques and helps over time, such as can be done over the Internet by means of judicious typed words. So, since Poly would not permit me to write a "sufficient" (imho) introductory explanation for my submissions, I present them to you here grin :

When Poly blew onto the scene with this particular e-cital idea, and he said, "Have them on my desk in one month," I thought, "Oh, for cry eye! Are you kidding me? One month?!? It takes me *at least* a year to get anything to the point where I'm ready to share it." But I was up for the challenge. Then, wonder of wonders, he relented, giving me the precious gift of time.

So, what to do? "What is this thing called 'Mazurka'?" So, of course I went to two other of my closest PW friends, ChopinAddict and Carey, and said, "What should I play?" ChopinAddict, that dear librarian-hearted resource person, thought to ask the "second" question (reference librarians will know what I mean by that... wink ) "What do you want? Major or minor? Happy or sad? Fast or slow?" Gosh. "I think I want simple." LOL! Actually, I think I asked for happy, so she sent me off with a few ideas. Then, Carey, who always gently pushes and pulls me to challenge myself and NOT take foolish interpretive liberties, sent me some ideas.

I pulled a couple of sheets off of IMSLP and read through them and that's when the fireworks of epiphanation went off inside of me. When I was young, my dad and I would play together the Dvorak Slavic Dances, four hands, and we had such fun! I miss playing those. When I heard the sound of "Mazurka," it took me back to that time. It dawned on me that, for *me*, anyway, in the way I was hearing them in my mind's ear, these were like "solo Slavic dances." I love the sound of them. And so now, thanks to Polyphonist, I have a new mania. eek wink

So, I eventually landed on the four (two more to come later in the recital). And I worked really hard at them. My wife goes to work at 6:30 a.m., and by 6:35 I was on the piano bench. Except for a few times when I had other musical deadlines to meet, I played through all four every day, multiple times, sometimes multiple times a day. I'd take one and chew on it and practice hands separately, I'd practice very slowly and deliberately hands together, drill some sections, then try some expression practice and try them against the metronome at speed and crash and burn. grin Behind the scenes, I'd complain to Carey, saying there was NO WAY I could play 7-4 at speed, and besides "Presto, ma non troppo" means fast, but not too fast, so despite the m.m., I was taking Chopin at his direction. So, when Carey says:

Originally Posted By: carey
[...] Andy - These have come a LONG way since your first readings - [...]


...he means he heard practice recordings at about mid-point, and that I was playing a D nat. in the opening section of 7-3, instead of Db! blush And stuff like that! laugh And also, I want to thank Carey, because when I asked some deeper, more pointed questions about this thing called "Mazurka," he sent me a link to this paper:

http://www.chopin.org/articles/Polish%20Folk%20Music%20and%20Chopins%20Mazurkas_Gorbaty.pdf

...which *really* started illuminating things for me. So, anyway, over the course of the months, suffice it to say that I had many cognitive leaps of the kind that come when you focus on something really hard, and then put it aside to rest for a minute or a night or a week, then pick it back up and go at it again. I mean, about two weeks ago, as I was getting ready to think about recording, and, because I am a *reader* and not a *memorizer*, and because I was trying to keep track of pedaling and articulations and dynamics and such, the words that came out of my mouth were, "Honey? Don't we have different colored highlighters somewhere in the house?" (They were in a desk in the basement.)

Click to reveal..


So, I recorded and edited my submission on Sunday. "EDITED?!?," I hear you ask. Yes, edited. I have discussed my philosophy about this rather thoroughly at other times in other threads both on the main boards and in Member Recordings, and if anyone is interested, I'll dig up a link. In the past, between my first and second mid-life crises, I worked with a musician/producer for a while, editing tracks, and it is such a part of me that I almost can't not do it, now. But when I post "finished" recordings, I want them to be something that 1) sounds good, and 2) will bear repeated listenings. But, I always edit lightly, meaning that I use whole chunks of three or four takes in order to keep the musical line and flow of it sane and cogent, and I strive to leave in enough wobbles, fluffs, and burbles to keep it honest. After all, I am *not* an accomplished pianist, though I love to play piano very much and I play piano A LOT! grin When I edit my recordings, I work very deliberately to not over-edit, and to arrive at a track that would be something that would come from me in performance on a good day. And I *do* have good days where I play this stuff for real people in real performances. That is what also keeps me honest and grounded about my abilities and those areas that I need to work on.

You will really see what I mean about fluffs and wobbles when you hear Op. 67, No. 1, the playing of which is Hugely Big Fudge in many places because it was *Not Ready For Prime Time* and in which I missed and skipped whole trills until such time as I can get them to come out from under my fingers (I need more than three months for that one! And even then, I am not sure what the trick is to playing them at speed. But I am sure Carey will push and pull me to it. wink ).

So, that is my story, just so you know. And my wife, God love her, on Sunday morning before vacating the house so I could record, and after enduring an evening of frantic and pointed rehearsal Saturday night, said that she had Mazurkas going through her head all night long. My true love. Surely we are one.

I, too, have been enjoying these performances tremendously!!! I love the passion, humor, thought, feeling and care that have gone into these offerings! Like gandalff, I would like to comment on each one, and hope to do so. Very, very wonderful work, everyone! Thank you so much for sharing!!!

--Andy

Wow, you certainly worked your arse off, and it shows. I love the color-coordinated highlighter efforts.. an especially nice touch! It really goes to show that even someone who plays as well as you do must often take quite a bit of effort to get the piece up to that level of performance. Dedication apparent; results achieved. Bravo, sir. Very well done. smile

Originally Posted By: Farmgirl
Derulux, bravo! you are a fine player. I loved the way you play - for the lack of word (not a native speaker of English), I like the orchestrated sound that you bring out from the entire instrument. I heard all the notes in a chords while you emphasized the melody lines. But all the notes were there, ringing together in the harmony, sometimes like a distant echo or murmur, sometimes like a swelling under current in the ocean. Thank you for sharing.

Thank you very much for your kind words. I tend to be obsessively critical of the things I do, so this was very nice to hear. Thank you. smile


Edited by Derulux (12/18/13 01:31 PM)
_________________________
Every day we are afforded a new chance. The problem with life is not that you run out of chances. In the end, what you run out of are days.

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#2199760 - 12/18/13 02:30 PM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Polyphonist]
Valencia Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 248
Thank you everyone for your generous comments on my Op 17 No 4 submission, and for the good wishes to my mother. smile I'm visiting with her right now and so haven't yet had a proper chance to listen to everyone's submissions, but am looking forward to it!

My recording was done on a poor quality digital piano. I'd hoped to be able to rerecord it here on a better piano but did not get the chance. As for the piece itself, it was my first time working on a Chopin mazurka and also my first experience with working with rubato so extensively. Dire tonic helped me immensely in preparing my piece by listening to many practice recordings and giving me helpful feedback.

Are fioritura the groups of little notes? So difficult to get them sounding light and improvised. The other most difficult part of this piece was the part in the middle (Page 3...can't recall bar numbers atm) where there are a total of eight measures featuring a couple of grace notes and then repeated Ds in the RH. That was by far the most difficult part of the piece for me to be able to play, despite how simplistic it looks in the score.

Thanks Polyphonist and Derulux for your efforts in setting up the recital!

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#2199763 - 12/18/13 02:35 PM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Polyphonist]
dire tonic Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/17/11
Posts: 1243
Loc: uk south
Once again, superb playing from everyone. Derulux, I canít imagine how you deliver a performance like that on the eve of the recital. Itís a crime that we donít get to hear you on a fine grand piano. Even soÖ

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#2199780 - 12/18/13 03:48 PM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Morodiene]
sandalholme Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/31/09
Posts: 763
Loc: Dorset, UK
Thank you for those kind words on my Op7 No 1. Re whimsical: there is a "scherz." marking in, I think, bar 4, so hopefully the lightness is appropriate. LIke all Chopin the mazurkas reward continued study and experimentation. I have never thought of my ornamentation as being light - it usually feels heavy and clumpy, so your comment was very gratifying.

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#2199785 - 12/18/13 03:58 PM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Polyphonist]
Derulux Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/05
Posts: 5294
Loc: Philadelphia
Originally Posted By: Valencia
Are fioritura the groups of little notes?

I'm more familiar with this applying to voice, but I suppose that would be accurate. It looks like it means the same thing, based on context, but I'm not the most knowledgeable when it comes to application of foreign words..

I hope your mom's doing better. smile

Originally Posted By: dire tonic
Once again, superb playing from everyone. Derulux, I canít imagine how you deliver a performance like that on the eve of the recital. Itís a crime that we donít get to hear you on a fine grand piano. Even soÖ

Thank you! It almost completely fell apart in the "tarantella-like" con anima section when the G-sharp/A-flat (thread shout-out grin ) stuck on a repeated note (probably the most audible of my mistakes), but I'm glad it held together.

A decent grand would have been lovely. If I ever get the opportunity, I will re-record and/or perform something else to post up. Thank you again for the kind comments; I'm glad you enjoyed it. smile
_________________________
Every day we are afforded a new chance. The problem with life is not that you run out of chances. In the end, what you run out of are days.

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#2199794 - 12/18/13 04:16 PM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Polyphonist]
JoelW Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4763
Loc: USA
It's been over 4 hours since the last installment.

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#2199796 - 12/18/13 04:22 PM Re: Chopin Mazurkas - 2013 Recital! [Re: Polyphonist]
Kreisler Offline



Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 13773
Loc: Iowa City, IA
I think I delayed things a bit. Bad Kreisler. frown

It's in now, though. laugh
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