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#2216835 - 01/18/14 06:47 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: D. S. F.]
Sammae Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/13/09
Posts: 47
Loc: Ottawa, ON
Originally Posted By: D. S. F.
Originally Posted By: Polyphonist
The Scenes from Childhood are definitely not a suite.


Funny, immediately after browsing this thread, I read this article posted in this thread. And I highlight this paragraph:

Quote:
The evening opened with the belated premiere of Marc Neikrug’s “Passions, Reflected” for solo piano, written in 2008. Structured in 12 sections, the piece was inspired, Mr. Neikrug told the audience, by Schumann’s imaginative suites for piano.


While researching, trying to figure out if it could be counted as a suite or not, I came across a few references to The Scenes from Childhood being a suite.

For now, I'm signed up for Woodland Sketches, but if the consensus swings in favour of Scenes from Childhood being counted a suite, I'd like to put dibs on that one instead!
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#2216993 - 01/19/14 04:58 AM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
Ganddalf Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/09
Posts: 607
Loc: Norway
Updated list:

J.S.Bach

French Suite no.2 - FarmGirl
French Suite No.4 – 1RC
Partita no.1 - Carey
Partita no.3 - Ganddalf
Partita no.6 - Kuanpiano

G.F. Händel

Keyboard suite no. 16 - Cinnamobear

E.Grieg

Peer Gynt Suite no.1 - Damon
Peer Gynt Suite no.2 - SlatterFan
From Holberg's time - jeffreyjones

MacDowell

Woodland Sketches - Sammae

Carl Nielsen

Suite for piano - D.S.F.

C.Debussy

Suite Bergamasque - woodog
Suite pour le Piano - neuralfirings

M.Ravel

Tombeau de Couperin - hreichgott + ScriabinAddict

B.Bartok

Suite Op.14 – Kreisler
Six Romanian Folk Dances - Carey

Deodat de Severac

En Languedoc: Suite pour piano - Tim Adrianson

Alberto Ginastera

Suite de Danzas Criollas - Orange Soda King

Feinberg

Suite 1 - albumblatter

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#2216995 - 01/19/14 05:04 AM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
Ganddalf Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/09
Posts: 607
Loc: Norway
This becomes just better and better. So much interesting music I never heard about.

There is one issue where I need the opinion of the other participants. Can we Count "Scenes from Childhood" as a suite? Sammae really wants it instead of MacDowell.

None of Bach's English suites are represented. Anyone?

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#2217026 - 01/19/14 08:23 AM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
Pathbreaker Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/18/04
Posts: 1030
Loc: Massachusetts
Originally Posted By: Ganddalf
This becomes just better and better. So much interesting music I never heard about.

There is one issue where I need the opinion of the other participants. Can we Count "Scenes from Childhood" as a suite? Sammae really wants it instead of MacDowell.

None of Bach's English suites are represented. Anyone?


I see no reason to exclude the Scenes from Childhood. It is a sequence of smaller pieces tied together by a common theme. If you look at Brahms Op. 118, it is a set of pieces with no unifying theme. Therefore you could say that such a set is not a suite. This is enough of a distinction in my opinion.


Edited by Pathbreaker (01/19/14 08:24 AM)

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#2217065 - 01/19/14 10:10 AM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Pathbreaker]
Kuanpiano Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/06/10
Posts: 2114
Loc: Canada
Originally Posted By: Pathbreaker
Originally Posted By: Ganddalf
This becomes just better and better. So much interesting music I never heard about.

There is one issue where I need the opinion of the other participants. Can we Count "Scenes from Childhood" as a suite? Sammae really wants it instead of MacDowell.

None of Bach's English suites are represented. Anyone?


I see no reason to exclude the Scenes from Childhood. It is a sequence of smaller pieces tied together by a common theme. If you look at Brahms Op. 118, it is a set of pieces with no unifying theme. Therefore you could say that such a set is not a suite. This is enough of a distinction in my opinion.

Oh but there are unifying devices and motifs in 118!!
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#2217072 - 01/19/14 10:50 AM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
Pathbreaker Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/18/04
Posts: 1030
Loc: Massachusetts
You could still include 118 by the broadest definition but I figured the line could be drawn based on whether or not a unifying theme is made explicit either in title or form.

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#2217092 - 01/19/14 12:11 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
BDB Online   content
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We need a pairs event as well! Rachmaninoff Suites! Arensky Suites! Dolly Suite! Mother Goose Suite! Children's Games Suite! Debussy's Petite Suite!
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#2217126 - 01/19/14 01:01 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
Ganddalf Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/09
Posts: 607
Loc: Norway
I have no objection if anyone want to perform a duet suite as part of this recital. Alternatively a separate duet e-cital could be arranged. Depends a bit on how many want to play duet suites.

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#2217173 - 01/19/14 02:33 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Pathbreaker]
carey Online   content
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/13/05
Posts: 6140
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona
Originally Posted By: Pathbreaker
You could still include 118 by the broadest definition but I figured the line could be drawn based on whether or not a unifying theme is made explicit either in title or form.


My understanding is that the "unifying theme" (along with the titles) for the 15 pieces in the Scenes from Childhood was arrived at by Schumann AFTER the pieces had been composed. He originally was simply going to call the set "Easy Pieces." grin

There certainly are plenty of references on the internet to the Scenes from Childhood as being a "suite" - whether the term is being used correctly or not.

My own feeling is that if someone wants to contribute a work that "kind of" looks like a "suite" to the recital - then we should allow them to do so. BUT - they should play ALL (or MOST) of the movements/sections/pieces or whatever within the set - otherwise it wouldn't really be a "suite" would it???



Edited by carey (01/19/14 03:18 PM)
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#2217183 - 01/19/14 02:53 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: carey]
Ganddalf Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/09
Posts: 607
Loc: Norway
Originally Posted By: carey


My own feeling is that someone wants to contribute a work that "kind of" looks like a "suite" to the recital - then we should allow them to do so. BUT - they should play ALL (or MOST) of the movements/sections/pieces or whatever within the set - otherwise it wouldn't really be a "suite" would it???



I second this. Makes sense to me.

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#2217185 - 01/19/14 02:54 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
BDB Online   content
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There are zillions of suites. There is no reason to stretch the definition given in the first post.

I probably will not participate, because I am not a very good pianist, but I have four different suites in mind, none of which is likely to be performed by anyone else, so a miracle could happen and I could get a decent recording of one of them by the deadline.
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#2217196 - 01/19/14 03:24 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: BDB]
carey Online   content
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/13/05
Posts: 6140
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona
Originally Posted By: BDB
There are zillions of suites. There is no reason to stretch the definition given in the first post.

I probably will not participate, because I am not a very good pianist, but I have four different suites in mind, none of which is likely to be performed by anyone else, so a miracle could happen and I could get a decent recording of one of them by the deadline.

Zillions of suites??? Seriously???? crazy

Other than the obvious "suites" from the Baroque era, I was hard pressed to find works that 1) weren't already spoken for, or 2) actually were titled "suite" by the composer. Is there any possibility that you might share the names of the four suites you've identified? grin
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#2217206 - 01/19/14 03:36 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
Pathbreaker Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/18/04
Posts: 1030
Loc: Massachusetts
Originally Posted By: Ganddalf
Originally Posted By: carey


My own feeling is that someone wants to contribute a work that "kind of" looks like a "suite" to the recital - then we should allow them to do so. BUT - they should play ALL (or MOST) of the movements/sections/pieces or whatever within the set - otherwise it wouldn't really be a "suite" would it???



I second this. Makes sense to me.


I like this too. And I wasn't even stretching the definition, there are many works that could be considered suites simply by being a collection of small pieces. It only matters how rigid the organizer wants to be about it. My music dictionary spent almost 3 pages on it. It starts like this:
Quote:
A series of disparate instrumental movements with some element of unity, most often to be performed as a single work.


Maybe that's a bit too broad but we don't have to stretch the definition. If you want I can quote the first paragraph. It's really quite good I think.

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#2217208 - 01/19/14 03:36 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: BDB]
FarmGirl Offline

Silver Supporter until Jan 02 2013


Registered: 09/14/10
Posts: 1884
Loc: Scottsdale, AZ
Originally Posted By: BDB
There are zillions of suites. There is no reason to stretch the definition given in the first post.

I probably will not participate, because I am not a very good pianist, but I have four different suites in mind, none of which is likely to be performed by anyone else, so a miracle could happen and I could get a decent recording of one of them by the deadline.


Hahaha if I wait until I get to be a good pianist, it will never happen. I will just do my best. I figure I gotta start somewhere. I hope you decide to join later.
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collaboration - Handel g minor Sonata for 2 violins and piano (Arioso), Devienne Sonata #5 in D minor for Oboe and Piano (Presto)


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#2217223 - 01/19/14 04:03 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
Morodiene Offline
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Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11344
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
I was looking into a couple of suites written by Poulenc. One I really liked but seemed easier, so it would be great for an intermediate pianist was the Suite Francais:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dutR2mWOklQ

For a later intermediate/early advanced there's the Suite in C. Really charming pieces:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRvDH9OTyXY

For something a bit more challenging there's the Napoli Suite by Poulenc:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mL4C5AMyRkQ

I'm not currently planning on doing any of these, but thought I'd share in case someone wanted to. I am looking for a Baroque suite to do, but I'm not sure where to look. I'd love to do some Couperin, especially since some are playing Ravel's Tombeau it might be cool to hear how Ravel tried to reflect Couperin in this suite. Any recommendations?



Edited by Morodiene (01/19/14 04:03 PM)
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#2217251 - 01/19/14 04:47 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
BDB Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 21178
Loc: Oakland
A quick perusal of my library shows the Suite Española by Albeniz, a couple by Poulenc, one by Saint-Saens, one by Schoenberg, some pieces in the Gradus ad Parnassum which form suites, Hindemith's 1922 Suite, Grainger's In a Nutshell, Suite Andalucia and others by Lecuona...

If you go to the Baroque, there are 19 suites by Buxtehude, a lot more by Handel, and plenty by French composers.

That list omits all of the ones I am considering.
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#2217255 - 01/19/14 04:52 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11344
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Also came across a Muczynski Suite for Piano Op. 13, Goyescas by Granados, Mozart Suite K399 which only has 3 movements plus a fragment of a Sarabande. I really like this last one, that may be a contender for me!
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#2217265 - 01/19/14 05:02 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: BDB]
Polyphonist Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/03/13
Posts: 7409
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: BDB
If you go to the Baroque, there are 19 suites by Buxtehude, a lot more by Handel, and plenty by French composers.

Not to mention the 16+ from Bach. So you have 60 suites from German Baroque composers alone.
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#2217278 - 01/19/14 05:26 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
BDB Online   content
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Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 21178
Loc: Oakland
I am sure there are other Bachs who wrote suites. There must be someone out there with a calliope who could play PDQ Bach's Toot Suite.

There is also Suite Lorraine, and Suite Georgia Brown!
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#2217286 - 01/19/14 05:34 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: BDB]
carey Online   content
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/13/05
Posts: 6140
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona
Originally Posted By: BDB
I am sure there are other Bach's who wrote suites. There must be someone out there with a calliope who could play PDQ Bach's Toot Suite.

There is also Suite Lorraine, and Suite Georgia Brown!


and don't forget the "Ain't She Suite" !!!!!!! grin

Great stuff folks - thanks for the titles.
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#2217293 - 01/19/14 05:43 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: carey]
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 6049
Loc: St. Louis area
Originally Posted By: carey
Originally Posted By: BDB
I am sure there are other Bach's who wrote suites. There must be someone out there with a calliope who could play PDQ Bach's Toot Suite.

There is also Suite Lorraine, and Suite Georgia Brown!


and don't forget the "Ain't She Suite" !!!!!!! grin



And "Suite: Judy Blue Eyes"
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#2217319 - 01/19/14 06:23 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: jeffreyjones]
pianoloverus Online   content
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Originally Posted By: jeffreyjones
Originally Posted By: hreichgott
Originally Posted By: Cinnamonbear
Originally Posted By: hreichgott
Originally Posted By: carey
only two of the six movements in the Tombeau are based on Baroque dance forms - and one is based on an Italian folk dance. The remaining movements (Prelude, Fugue, Toccata) harken back to the Baroque period - but aren't dance forms.

Menuets, Rigaudons and Forlanes routinely appear in French Baroque suites. You're right about the other movements.


Are not Menuets, Rigaudons and Forlanes dance forms? Are you saying, "If it's a dance form, even if it's Italian, it's o.k."? (I think that's what I heard you say...)

Yes! I also support the Sarabande as part of a baroque suite, even though it is from Latin America.


It was a court dance for a couple of centuries before the time of Bach, so there is a long precedent for it. Interesting how a dance that was seen as indecent and vulgar became adopted by the upper crust.
The Sarabande was the only dance for a solo dancer. Learned this in some terrific master classes by Magadalena Baczweska.

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#2217345 - 01/19/14 07:29 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Morodiene]
hreichgott Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/13
Posts: 860
Loc: western MA, USA
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
I am looking for a Baroque suite to do, but I'm not sure where to look. I'd love to do some Couperin, especially since some are playing Ravel's Tombeau it might be cool to hear how Ravel tried to reflect Couperin in this suite. Any recommendations?


Try these
http://imslp.org/wiki/Pi%C3%A8ces_de_Clavecin_(Couperin,_Fran%C3%A7ois)
It is a large work made up of 27 ordres. Each ordre is a set of dances arranged in a (longish) suite.
_________________________
Heather W. Reichgott, piano http://heatherwreichgott.blogspot.com
Sounding the depths of small pieces: Beethoven Op. 33
Daily attempts at 16th notes: Chopin Op. 10 no. 4, Pischna
Totally loving Fauré/Barcarolles and Ravel/Tombeau de Couperin
I love Mozart, Haydn, Beethoven and new music

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#2217361 - 01/19/14 08:15 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: hreichgott]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11344
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: hreichgott
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
I am looking for a Baroque suite to do, but I'm not sure where to look. I'd love to do some Couperin, especially since some are playing Ravel's Tombeau it might be cool to hear how Ravel tried to reflect Couperin in this suite. Any recommendations?


Try these
http://imslp.org/wiki/Pi%C3%A8ces_de_Clavecin_(Couperin,_Fran%C3%A7ois)
It is a large work made up of 27 ordres. Each ordre is a set of dances arranged in a (longish) suite.
I was wondering about that. I do know Les barricades mysterieuses which appears to be part of the Sixieme ordre, which doesn't look outrageously long. It would be interesting to do this, I think. Is that acceptable? If so, please officially sign me up, Gandalf.
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#2217366 - 01/19/14 08:23 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: carey]
wr Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/23/07
Posts: 7738
Originally Posted By: carey


Great stuff folks - thanks for the titles.


There are also a couple of "Modern Suites" by Edward MacDowell. IMSLP has them, listed under "First" and "Second".

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#2217462 - 01/20/14 02:42 AM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
Ganddalf Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/09
Posts: 607
Loc: Norway
There is one argument AGAINST being too sloppy with the definition of a suite when arranging this recital. Already now people have signed up for around 20 suites and if the average duration is 15 minutes we already have five hours music to listen to.

One way to handle this is to "release" the music in batches - perhaps some 1 - 2 hours of music each day. I even think it will make sense to make individual response threads for each batch. And maybe the batches could be composed in a way where different styles are represented in each of them.

Whatever we do I think we have to set an upper limit to the total amount of music for this recital. 10 hours perhaps... I even assume that when this recital is completed a new similar one will be running.

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#2217536 - 01/20/14 09:31 AM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
Ganddalf Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/09
Posts: 607
Loc: Norway
Updated list:

J.S.Bach

French Suite no.2 - FarmGirl
French Suite No.4 – 1RC
Partita no.1 - Carey
Partita no.3 - Ganddalf
Partita no.6 - Kuanpiano

G.F. Händel

Keyboard suite no. 13 - Cinnamonbear
Keyboard suite no. 15 - Cinnamonbear
Keyboard suite no. 16 - Cinnamonbear

E.Grieg

Peer Gynt Suite no.1 - Damon
Peer Gynt Suite no.2 - SlatterFan
From Holberg's time - jeffreyjones

MacDowell

Woodland Sketches - Sammae

Carl Nielsen

Suite for piano - D.S.F.

C.Debussy

Suite Bergamasque - woodog
Suite pour le Piano - neuralfirings

M.Ravel

Tombeau de Couperin - hreichgott + ScriabinAddict

B.Bartok

Suite Op.14 – Kreisler
Six Romanian Folk Dances - Carey

Deodat de Severac

En Languedoc: Suite pour piano - Tim Adrianson

Alberto Ginastera

Suite de Danzas Criollas - Orange Soda King

Feinberg

Suite 1 - albumblatter

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#2217545 - 01/20/14 09:57 AM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
hreichgott Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/13
Posts: 860
Loc: western MA, USA
Originally Posted By: Ganddalf
There is one argument AGAINST being too sloppy with the definition of a suite when arranging this recital. Already now people have signed up for around 20 suites and if the average duration is 15 minutes we already have five hours music to listen to.

One way to handle this is to "release" the music in batches - perhaps some 1 - 2 hours of music each day. I even think it will make sense to make individual response threads for each batch. And maybe the batches could be composed in a way where different styles are represented in each of them.

Whatever we do I think we have to set an upper limit to the total amount of music for this recital. 10 hours perhaps... I even assume that when this recital is completed a new similar one will be running.


Yes, I've been noticing this issue too, and I seem to remember that this concern was raised when the subject of a recital of longer pieces was first mentioned.

I notice that ScriabinAddict and I are the only ones sharing a suite. I would like to recommend this option to others. Not that I think anyone is not capable of playing their whole suite smile (ScriabinAddict and I are actually both learning all of Tombeau)

I remember that when we were close to the Mazurka recital many people felt stressed out about getting their selections learned and recorded in time. These pieces are much longer and many on the list are much more difficult. If more people shared suites, it would be less stressful for performers and also less of a marathon for the audience.
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Daily attempts at 16th notes: Chopin Op. 10 no. 4, Pischna
Totally loving Fauré/Barcarolles and Ravel/Tombeau de Couperin
I love Mozart, Haydn, Beethoven and new music

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#2217572 - 01/20/14 10:57 AM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
FarmGirl Offline

Silver Supporter until Jan 02 2013


Registered: 09/14/10
Posts: 1884
Loc: Scottsdale, AZ
I'm sharing my Suite with my friend Phil who is an excellent player. Just FYI this is not the Phil you know here. My friend needs to join the forum. We divided up the piece as follows:

Allemande - FarmGirl
Courante - Phil M
Sarabande - Phil M
Air - FarmGirl
Menuet - FarmGirl
Gigue - Phil M

As you can see basically I asked him to do difficult ones as Sarabande and especially Gigue. I played through the whole Suite and realized that I had trouble sight reading Gigue. Sarabande is short in this Suite but I know enough to know it will take time to play it well. So I reached out to Phil M. Courante was not difficult but decided to give it to him because it seems to flow better. We both take performance studio class together and plan to perform this in the fall. It makes it easier for me because I am working on other pieces too.
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collaboration - Handel g minor Sonata for 2 violins and piano (Arioso), Devienne Sonata #5 in D minor for Oboe and Piano (Presto)


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#2217727 - 01/20/14 03:40 PM Re: Themed recital: Suites [Re: Ganddalf]
Ganddalf Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/09
Posts: 607
Loc: Norway
Sharing is definitely a good idea.

Generally when these recitals are arranged, participants get frustrated when time comes for recording. Recording a 3 - 5 minutes piece is one thing. Then one can just imagine what recording of a suite lasting for 15 - 30 minutes will take.

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Interested in an Exam Program; Which One Best in Eastern US?
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07/10/14 10:40 AM
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07/10/14 08:05 AM
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