Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
the Forums & Piano World

This custom search works much better than the built in one and allows searching older posts.
(ad 125) Sweetwater - Digital Keyboards & Other Gear
Digital Pianos at Sweetwater
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad) Pianoteq
Latest Pianoteq add-on instrument: U4 upright piano
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
PianoSupplies.com (150)
Piano Accessories Music Related Gifts Piano Tuning Equipment Piano Moving Equipment
We now offer Gift Certificates in our online store!
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Piano
Quick Links to Useful Stuff
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers
*Organs

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano Accessories
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Contest
*Links
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
Topic Options
#2221851 - 01/28/14 11:39 AM About hitting the notes "almost" the same time
DanL Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/27/13
Posts: 57
Hi! Like the title says, I have a question about hitting multiple notes at the same time.

It seems like one can do it smoothly when playing loudly (eg f, fff,...). But when I play p,pp or something similar, something quiet, I see I don't actually hit all the notes at the same time. In other word, I think I make it sound like a "Half-arpeggio". For instance, instead of hitting C-E-G at the same time, sometimes I just hit the C note first, and then the two remaining notes come right after that. It doesn't happen all the time but I should work hard to correct the mistakes.

We all know how that sound, not good... Please give me some advice if you can:)

Thanks in advance!

Top
(ads P/S)

Sauter Pianos

#2221861 - 01/28/14 12:10 PM Re: About hitting the notes "almost" the same time [Re: DanL]
Andy Platt Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/28/10
Posts: 2375
Loc: Virginia, USA
There are several reasons why this can happen. The basic reason, of course, is that one finger goes down faster. When you are playing forte, the fingers move quickly and it's harder to hear the difference. At piano, the finger speed is slower so differences are more apparent.

First is, always start the motion from the key. In otherwords, have your fingers on the keys before you start pressing them down.

Second, make sure your fingers / knuckle bridge, is not collapsing as you press down. Although we talk about building up finger strength for this, it's more an awareness issue that it can happen and making sure that you naturally and consistently have a good strong arch (doesn't have to be very high, has to be good and solid.)

Playing ppp chords like this is excellent practice for good technique overall smile
_________________________
  • Liszt - Liebesträume No. 3, S541
  • Scarlatti - Sonata in D minor, K. 213

Kawai K3

Top
#2221918 - 01/28/14 02:32 PM Re: About hitting the notes "almost" the same time [Re: DanL]
Greener Offline

Platinum Supporter until July 22 2014


Registered: 05/29/12
Posts: 1168
Loc: Toronto
Originally Posted By: DanL

...
It seems like one can do it smoothly when playing loudly (eg f, fff,...). But when I play p,pp or something similar, something quiet, I see I don't actually hit all the notes at the same time.

Not sure if this will be of much help...
What you describe sounds similar, but not exact to issue I've been working on.

Play soft, play smooth = play half the notes ... bzzzt

In my case I've got a soft, smooth stride in the left hand accompanying a more dominant melody (RH.) The softer I make the left hand accompaniment, the more notes are being missed.

What seems to be improving the issue, is to give more control to my arms vs. fingers. That is, once I get my arm/hand/fingers into position, let my arm drop. And do this in every low and top iteration of the stride. Perhaps this sounds obvious, but made a difference for me vs. just focusing on hand and finger position, and not figuring in to the equation that I also need to actually hit the notes too.

Top
#2221925 - 01/28/14 02:49 PM Re: About hitting the notes "almost" the same time [Re: DanL]
Morodiene Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11448
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
How long have you been playing for? Playing softly is actually quite difficult to do for many beginner pianists, but it usually works itself out over time.

Having said that, if you've been doing this a while and it's still an issue, I'm guessing that you're not always following the key to the bottom of the keybed. In order to do this well, you have to have a bit of follow-through with the wrist. When you press a key, you should begin from the finger(s) resting on the key. Then as you press the key, you feel it touch the bottom of the key bed, then the wrist continues a downward motion to absorb the extra shock and then return to parallel position to the keys as you are holding the key. So each time you press a key, your wrist goes down below the keybed, and returns to parallel.

Work on this slowly one hand at a time, paying attention that you are still hearing it p.

Sometimes doing the opposite can help too. Try playing the passage in question a nice strong forte, then repeat getting a bit softer each time but still making sure you dig into the keybed (but don't add extra tension - only what's needed to keep good form in your hand).
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

Top
#2221938 - 01/28/14 03:18 PM Re: About hitting the notes "almost" the same time [Re: Morodiene]
Bamburg Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/07/13
Posts: 68
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
How long have you been playing for? Playing softly is actually quite difficult to do for many beginner pianists, but it usually works itself out over time.


I've seen similar postings to this a few times, what's a reasonable amount of time to develop this?

Top
#2222262 - 01/29/14 02:04 AM Re: About hitting the notes "almost" the same time [Re: DanL]
Derulux Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/05
Posts: 5286
Loc: Philadelphia
I usually blanket something like this under the big umbrella of "coordination issue". Once you understand that the sound you want to produce is a coordinated movement, and that the sound you are producing isn't the right coordination, you can begin to think in terms of movement into the keys in order to produce the correct sound. After you've got that in your head, the top two have already been said by Andy and Morodiene.

I'll just add that, sometimes you can play loud chords together because you're actively pressing down the keys, and when you play soft, you might have a tendency to relax the hand just a little too much, which can cause your fingers to press the keys at different times. (There are other motions, but these are some really basic ones you can check yourself.)
_________________________
Every day we are afforded a new chance. The problem with life is not that you run out of chances. In the end, what you run out of are days.

Top
#2222312 - 01/29/14 05:01 AM Re: About hitting the notes "almost" the same time [Re: DanL]
Mr Super-Hunky Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 4220
Loc: Arizona.
In addition TO what others have said regarding applying equal finger pressure to make the notes all hit together at the same time, I just wanted to add that I actually like hearing the slight inequities in the sound.

One of my favorite bands/groups is Mannheim Steamroller. They seem to do these slight irregularities with many instruments all the time. It gives their music a much more 'natural' or 'raw' feel to it.

I personally love it.

Top
#2222482 - 01/29/14 11:41 AM Re: About hitting the notes "almost" the same time [Re: DanL]
joyoussong Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/19/09
Posts: 732
Loc: Canada
My teacher pointed out this problem to me when he started me seriously learning scales & triads; I had been playing for about 3 years by then. He suggested when I practiced triads I should record them & play them back immediately - easily done on my digital. I devoted part of my practice for a few weeks to paying particular attention to triads, listening & repeating until all notes hit at once, & the problem seemed to work itself out. I'm not sure how, but once I could hear it, my hands seemed to figure out the remedy on their own, or at least without any conscious adjustment to hand position, etc. It may have been that during that process I slowed down a lot, too. It still creeps in occasionally, but rarely.
_________________________
Carol
(Started playing July 2008)



Top
#2222503 - 01/29/14 12:13 PM Re: About hitting the notes "almost" the same time [Re: DanL]
kapelli Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/26/12
Posts: 380
Loc: Poland
Put fingers on keys and from that point play a chord. Do it until you get perfect timing. When you get it, move your fingers up until they reach normal playing position. When I have bigger pauses from playing at all, my finger sometimes have the same problem.

With this easy excercise, you will get over this fast.

Very important - when playing, watch how fast your fingers and going down on the keys. Feel the depth of the keys. Do it SLOWLY and GENTLY. Banging on the piano is easy lol.

After few days, try to play some very easy patterns, like 2-3 note with one finger, and then some 2 or 3- finger chords. Slowly and in piano. If you couldn't play them in the same time, go back to the first excercies.

The key is to understand how your fingers are working,how they are pushing the keys. You need to know, that each finger - as you are untrained pianist - has very different power, so you need adjust a lot of things here.

Be patient and keep working, and have fun laugh

Top
#2222594 - 01/29/14 02:20 PM Re: About hitting the notes "almost" the same time [Re: DanL]
briansaddleback Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 01/27/14
Posts: 214
Loc: Irvine CA
I have this issue when I play chords all the time it is something you have to just play slower and nail down each and every time and then as time progresses you should be able to overcome it.
_________________________

Cloches a travers les feuilles
Minstrels

Top
#2222804 - 01/29/14 09:08 PM Re: About hitting the notes "almost" the same time [Re: Bamburg]
Whizbang Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/27/12
Posts: 740
Originally Posted By: Bamburg
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
How long have you been playing for? Playing softly is actually quite difficult to do for many beginner pianists, but it usually works itself out over time.


I've seen similar postings to this a few times, what's a reasonable amount of time to develop this?


30 years or so.
_________________________
Whizbang
amateur ragtime pianist

Top
#2222808 - 01/29/14 09:13 PM Re: About hitting the notes "almost" the same time [Re: Whizbang]
Happy Birthday earlofmar Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/21/13
Posts: 1408
Loc: Australia
Originally Posted By: Whizbang
Originally Posted By: Bamburg
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
How long have you been playing for? Playing softly is actually quite difficult to do for many beginner pianists, but it usually works itself out over time.


I've seen similar postings to this a few times, what's a reasonable amount of time to develop this?


30 years or so.


thumb
_________________________
I thought I understood endurance sport; then I took up piano
XXXIV-5-XXX

Top
#2222812 - 01/29/14 09:20 PM Re: About hitting the notes "almost" the same time [Re: DanL]
Sweet06 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/22/13
Posts: 405
Great thread!
_________________________
"Doesn't practicing on the piano suck?!?!"
"The joy is in the practicing. It's like relationships. Yeah, orgasms are awesome, but you can't make love to someone who you have no relationship with!"

Top
#2223238 - 01/30/14 04:13 PM Re: About hitting the notes "almost" the same time [Re: DanL]
JohnSprung Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/02/11
Posts: 1258
Loc: Reseda, California
Also, check to make sure that the problem is really you. Slowly play pairs of adjacent keys with one finger. If you find some that hit early or late, get your technician to regulate the action.
_________________________
-- J.S.

Knabe Grand # 10927
Yamaha CP33
Kawai FS690

Top
#2223311 - 01/30/14 08:08 PM Re: About hitting the notes "almost" the same time [Re: DanL]
DanL Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/27/13
Posts: 57
Thanks for all the reply! smile

I have recently study with my teacher and one my musical friend. They tell me the same thing, that I'm a little "shy" to press the key and I don't press the key with true "strengt". My teacher had me press the keys down until I can feel the key bed, slowly, but precisely, with clarity. I've been practicing this for a week and I find it very developing. Perhaps being confident while pressing the key helps me a lot, really. Whoa, playing quiet is absolutely very hard!

Thank you JohnSprung, My piano is in pretty good condition, I'll have it tuned in March, maybe smile

All the best wishes!

Top

Moderator:  BB Player, casinitaly 
What's Hot!!
Our latest Issue is available now...
Piano News - Interesting & Fun Piano Related Newsletter! (free)
-------------------
HOW TO POST PICTURES on the Piano Forums
-------------------
Sharing is Caring!
About the Buttons
-------------------
Forums Rules & Help
-------------------
ADVERTISE
on Piano World

The world's most popular piano web site.
(ad) HAILUN Pianos
Hailun Pianos - Click for More
Ad (Seiler/Knabe)
Knabe Pianos
Sheet Music
(PW is an affiliate)
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
Who's Online
144 registered (ajames, ando, AndresD, 42 invisible), 1841 Guests and 17 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
75599 Members
42 Forums
156310 Topics
2295677 Posts

Max Online: 15252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Another reason to love the MP11
by Markarian
43 minutes 53 seconds ago
Digital Piano for a Musical
by well23
Today at 03:39 PM
Carrying Bah for Rokit 6 G3 monitors?
by Mta88
Today at 03:39 PM
Supplemental instruction?
by TwoSnowflakes
Today at 03:15 PM
Mason & Hamlin BB with Live Performance
by eugene_bb
Today at 12:50 PM
(ads by Google)

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |


copyright 1997 - 2014 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission