Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
the Forums & Piano World

This custom search works much better than the built in one and allows searching older posts.
(ad 125) Sweetwater - Digital Keyboards & Other Gear
Digital Pianos at Sweetwater
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad) Pianoteq
Latest Pianoteq add-on instrument: U4 upright piano
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
PianoSupplies.com (150)
Piano Accessories Music Related Gifts Piano Tuning Equipment Piano Moving Equipment
We now offer Gift Certificates in our online store!
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Piano
Quick Links to Useful Stuff
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers
*Organs

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano Accessories
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Contest
*Links
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
Topic Options
#2229588 - 02/11/14 12:28 PM 12/8 time
ShannonG Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/05/14
Posts: 135
Loc: Canada
Can I just say "Aaaarrrrrrgggghhh!" It's just basic math but do I ever struggle! Any tips or tricks out there for playing a piece with 12/8 time?
_________________________
How did I end up with 3 pianos? Starting to think I may need a 12 step program...

Top
(ads P/S)

Petrof Pianos

#2229617 - 02/11/14 01:02 PM Re: 12/8 time [Re: ShannonG]
Pathbreaker Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/18/04
Posts: 1082
Loc: Massachusetts
I like answering these not because I know very much but because I usually learn something by thinking about it.

Normally you will have 4 beats to a measure where one beat is a quarter note. Normal is why it is also referred to as C or "common" time a.k.a. 4/4(hope I'm not making that up). Four quarter notes per measure. I like to look at it as the bottom note in the time signature is the denominator in a fraction. 4/4 = 4 1/4 notes or 4 * 1/4 = 4/4. For 12/8 you have 12 1/8 notes or 12 * 1/8 = 12/8. You literally have 12 8th notes per measure. You can always simplify to 6/4 or 3/2 (3 half notes). But it's always easiest to count your beats in either quarters or 8ths (it is for me anyways).

For actually playing that 12/8 time signature you will want to remember that the rhythm can be felt in threes (3/4, 6/4, 9/8, 12/8). In other words you can break up the measure into groups of three rather than 2 or 4. Seeing it as 6/4 makes this easier because it's two groups of 3 quarter notes per measure. It is the double of 3/4 time. To simplify just see it as a twice as long measure in 3/4 time.

Does this make any sense? Try wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_signature

According to wiki, 12/8 should be considered a compound time signature:
Quote:
In compound meter, subdivisions of the main beat (the upper number) split into three, not two, equal parts, so that a dotted note (half again longer than a regular note) becomes the beat unit. Compound time signatures are named as if they were simple time signatures, in which the one-third part of the beat unit is the beat, so the top number is commonly 6, 9 or 12 (multiples of 3). The lower number is most commonly an 8 (an eighth-note): as in 9/8 or 12/8.


By dotted note they mean that you could see 12/8 as 4 dotted quarter notes (each dotted quarter being equal to 3 8th notes, 4*3=12). But who wants to count like that, seems like a lot of work. I would just look at it as [1,2,3, 1,2,3] or [1 and 2 and 3 and, 1 and 2 and 3 and] if doing 8th notes or however you count.

Not sure of my accuracy here but this is how I would approach it.

Top
#2229659 - 02/11/14 02:04 PM Re: 12/8 time [Re: ShannonG]
Rerun Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/28/07
Posts: 604
Loc: Louisiana
Originally Posted By: ShannonG
Can I just say "Aaaarrrrrrgggghhh!" It's just basic math but do I ever struggle! Any tips or tricks out there for playing a piece with 12/8 time?



Go to 0.52 seconds on the clock:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wi0cLdJCgTA
_________________________
Rerun

"Seat of the pants piano player" DMD







Top
#2229675 - 02/11/14 02:27 PM Re: 12/8 time [Re: ShannonG]
TheodorN Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 1192
Loc: Helsingborg, Sweden
Ah, the Blueberry Hill rhythm. A triple eight feel.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NG5ot_KOGQY
_________________________
My YouTube channel:

http://www.youtube.com/user/thenorbass1

Top
#2229682 - 02/11/14 02:34 PM Re: 12/8 time [Re: ShannonG]
keystring Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11674
Loc: Canada
12/8 often means 4 beats in 3 triplets. 3 + 3 + 3 + 3. Three Eighths = 1 beat (triplets)

Top
#2229695 - 02/11/14 03:03 PM Re: 12/8 time [Re: keystring]
Pathbreaker Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/18/04
Posts: 1082
Loc: Massachusetts
Originally Posted By: keystring
12/8 often means 4 beats in 3 triplets. 3 + 3 + 3 + 3. Three Eighths = 1 beat (triplets)


That makes much more sense. And with the video to hear it I think that's very helpful.

Top
#2229827 - 02/11/14 05:59 PM Re: 12/8 time [Re: ShannonG]
peterws Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/21/12
Posts: 3599
Loc: Northern England.
12-8 is always triplets to my knowledge. Otherwise it would be written in a different time. Like 6-4 or 3-2.
It gives an indication for the feel of the music.
_________________________
"I'm playing all the right notes but not necessarily in the right order." Eric Morecambe

""

Top
#2229837 - 02/11/14 06:11 PM Re: 12/8 time [Re: ShannonG]
ShannonG Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/05/14
Posts: 135
Loc: Canada
Thank you everyone for your help. I also listened to the studio recording of the song (Turn Me On by Norah Jones)and the drum has a distinctive 1-2-3 beat that I found helpful.
_________________________
How did I end up with 3 pianos? Starting to think I may need a 12 step program...

Top
#2230709 - 02/12/14 10:50 PM Re: 12/8 time [Re: ShannonG]
Leon Harrell Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/11/12
Posts: 7
Loc: Urbana
Hi ShannonG

The problem you are experiencing is the misunderstanding of compound meter vs simple meter.

12/8 is a compound meter. This means that the beat unit (dotted Quarter note) should be counted as one beat and the subdivision level (the eight note) should be counted like 1-La-Li, 2-La-Li, 3-La-Li, 4-La-Li.

This counting system is called the Eastman Counting System.
1]

Let me know if you need more help.

Understanding compound meter will clarify how all these common compound meters work: 6/4, 6/8, 9/4, 9/8, 9/16, 12/8


Good luck on your musical journey,

-Leon


Edited by casinitaly (02/22/14 06:44 AM)
Edit Reason: removed personal advertising
_________________________
In all my years as a piano teacher I've never seen a better piano learning software than this! Click here to get a free 30-day trial and read my full review.

Top

Moderator:  BB Player, casinitaly 
What's Hot!!
HOW TO POST PICTURES on the Piano Forums
-------------------
Sharing is Caring!
About the Buttons
-------------------
Forums Rules & Help
-------------------
ADVERTISE
on Piano World

The world's most popular piano web site.
-------------------
PIANO BOOKS
Interesting books about the piano, pianists, piano history, biographies, memoirs and more!
(ad) HAILUN Pianos
Hailun Pianos - Click for More
ad (Casio)
Celviano by Casio Rebate
Ad (Seiler/Knabe)
Knabe Pianos
Sheet Music
(PW is an affiliate)
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Baroque Pitch - The Well-Tempered Clavier
by Badinage
09/16/14 02:25 AM
Need Leutke Leipzig info
by Gardenergirl
09/16/14 12:26 AM
Best digital approximation
by TEHunter1
09/15/14 11:49 PM
Wow, check out this baby!
by Paul678
09/15/14 09:31 PM
Baby Grand new Hammer Knuckles.
by OscarL
09/15/14 08:30 PM
Who's Online
62 registered (36251, Badinage, AliAlkhiro, andwi, AEMontoya, beeboss, 14 invisible), 923 Guests and 20 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
76209 Members
42 Forums
157554 Topics
2314215 Posts

Max Online: 15252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM
(ads by Google)

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
|
Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |


copyright 1997 - 2014 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission