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#2243853 - 03/09/14 08:05 PM KAWAI MP7 THREAD
Marko in Boston Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/30/12
Posts: 902
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts


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#2243896 - 03/09/14 09:03 PM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Marko in Boston]
HisKidd Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/31/11
Posts: 198
Loc: AL/USA
James…

Will the kawaimp.com site be updated to include the new MP7, or does the 7 get its own website?

What an awesomely beautiful board. What's not to like? Think I'll go take a look at your manual!

Congratulations, James. Two stunning new additions to the Kawai stage piano line (MP7/MP11)!

Play On!
H.K.
_________________________
Keyboards are the best therapy I know of...
______________________________________________
Kawai MP6 stage piano
DCM CX-17 Monitors
Sennheiser HD 205, DJ series, headset

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#2243901 - 03/09/14 09:12 PM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Marko in Boston]
HisKidd Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/31/11
Posts: 198
Loc: AL/USA
_________________________
Keyboards are the best therapy I know of...
______________________________________________
Kawai MP6 stage piano
DCM CX-17 Monitors
Sennheiser HD 205, DJ series, headset

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#2243902 - 03/09/14 09:15 PM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Marko in Boston]
Joe Garfield Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/07/13
Posts: 156
Loc: Ohio, USA
What is the price point? I am interested in US.

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#2243925 - 03/09/14 09:50 PM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Marko in Boston]
Musical Dan Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/27/10
Posts: 64
Loc: Sydney, Australia
What's the weight? Also how long will it take to get to Australia?
_________________________
Kawai MP7

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#2243926 - 03/09/14 09:52 PM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Musical Dan]
pwl Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/31/13
Posts: 202
Loc: Bay Area CA
Weight is shown as 46 pounds.

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#2243953 - 03/09/14 10:54 PM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: HisKidd]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9333
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted By: HisKidd
Will the kawaimp.com site be updated to include the new MP7, or does the 7 get its own website?


Yes, the MP7 content will be added to www.kawaimp.com/mp7 (currently just a teaser page), then a model selection/overview will be added to the top page at www.kawaimp.com .

Originally Posted By: HisKidd
What an awesomely beautiful board.


Yes I totally agree! I was totally bowled over when I saw the first prototype - it's like a little brother version of the MP11. wink

Originally Posted By: HisKidd
Think I'll go take a look at your manual!


Thank you! Suffice it to say, I didn't re-use the old Unix-style MP6 manual format...actually it's very similar to the MP11 manual as both models share a lot of the same functionality.

As always, multi-language PDFs available from here:

http://www.kawai.co.jp/worldwide/support/manuals.html

I was informed of some typos recently, so will update the PDFs when the MP7 website content is online.

Cheers,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2243957 - 03/09/14 11:00 PM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Marko in Boston]
Musical Dan Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/27/10
Posts: 64
Loc: Sydney, Australia
From: http://www.kawai.co.uk/

The ultimate pianos for Concert, Pop, and Jazz
The MP7 captures the beautiful sound of Kawai’s highly acclaimed hand-built concert grand piano, with all 88 keys of this exceptional instrument meticulously recorded, analysed and faithfully reproduced using proprietary Harmonic Imaging™ XL technology. This unique process accurately recreates the broad dynamic range of the original grand piano, affording pianists an extraordinary level of expressiveness ranging from the softest pianissimo to the strongest, boldest fortissimo. With separate variations for Concert, Pop, and Jazz playing, the MP7 offers an excellent selection of high quality acoustic piano sounds suitable for various musical styles, including a separate sub-category devoted entirely to upright and mono pianos. Moreover, Kawai’s unique Virtual Technician feature allows various characteristics of the selected acoustic piano sound to be shaped at the touch of a button or the turn of a knob, with parameters to adjust voicing and regulation, string and damper resonances, and subtle hammer, damper, and key release noises.


Does this mean that there is only one sampled Piano, the the different Pianos types just undergo different later processing?


Edited by Musical Dan (03/09/14 11:01 PM)
_________________________
Kawai MP7

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#2243962 - 03/09/14 11:25 PM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Marko in Boston]
Joe Garfield Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/07/13
Posts: 156
Loc: Ohio, USA
I read in the description of "harmonic imaging" that they sample only one piano, but use different equipment to sample it for the different tones. For example, recording equipment associated with modern rock was used to sample the piano for the 'Rock' piano tone. So that leads me to believe the sound was not processed to change the tone. Of course there probably is some processing, but hard to say how much.


Edited by Joe Garfield (03/09/14 11:28 PM)

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#2243964 - 03/09/14 11:28 PM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Marko in Boston]
Joe Garfield Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/07/13
Posts: 156
Loc: Ohio, USA
http://www.kawaius.com/main_links/digital/Features/harmonic_imaging2010.html

Quote:
Many upper models also feature a “Pop Piano” sound. Like the others, this is also an EX Concert Piano, but the recording methods and equipment were those used on many famous pop and rock piano recordings done in Los Angeles area recording studios.

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#2243968 - 03/09/14 11:33 PM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Musical Dan]
HisKidd Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/31/11
Posts: 198
Loc: AL/USA
Musical Dan…

Just took a gander at the "sound list" in the manual. The piano section includes, by my count, 28 piano sounds (7 banks of 4 each). The first 12 are the same names as the present 12 on the MP6 (Concert Grand, Concert Grand2, Studio, Mellow, Jazz, Pop, Bright, etc.). In addition there are groups of pianos for mono, octave, upright, new age; 4 different "piano variations," and piano/EP combinations.

To my knowledge Kawai has always created its samples from its own Grand Pianos, that is to say, all the piano sounds are created using a Kawai instrument. I recall reading that different effects are created by the positioning of microphones, etc. So, yes- you are getting sample variations from a Kawai Grand Piano.

Kawai James can jump in here and correct any information I have wrong, and/or offer additional information.

Play On!
_________________________
Keyboards are the best therapy I know of...
______________________________________________
Kawai MP6 stage piano
DCM CX-17 Monitors
Sennheiser HD 205, DJ series, headset

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#2243973 - 03/10/14 12:05 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Musical Dan]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9333
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted By: Musical Dan
Does this mean that there is only one sampled Piano, the the different Pianos types just undergo different later processing?


No, as with the MP11, the MP7 features different piano samples (mic type/positioning and voicing) for each category.

Kind regards,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2243974 - 03/10/14 12:11 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Kawai James]
voxpops Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 3081
Loc: Oregon
Originally Posted By: Kawai James
Originally Posted By: Musical Dan
Does this mean that there is only one sampled Piano, the the different Pianos types just undergo different later processing?


No, as with the MP11, the MP7 features different piano samples (mic type/positioning and voicing) for each category.

Kind regards,
James
x

But presumably from the same source piano?
_________________________
Occasional author and inveterate ivory tickler:
http://www.amazon.com/author/richardspanswick

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#2243977 - 03/10/14 12:37 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: voxpops]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9333
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted By: voxpops
But presumably from the same source piano?


I believe there are also different instruments from different recording sessions too.

Cheers,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2243982 - 03/10/14 12:48 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Kawai James]
HisKidd Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/31/11
Posts: 198
Loc: AL/USA
James…

I have had my MP6 for three years, and I'm definitely looking to trade up for either the MP7 or the MP11.

I have a question for you about the processing of the sound samples. Perhaps the biggest complaint against the MP6 was that it did not contain the same quality sound samples as the MP10. I noted that with the MP7, it has the HI (Harmonic Imaging with 88 key sampling), and not the PHI ("Progressive Harmonic Imaging"). Does this mean that any sound improvements are going to come from the new processors on board, and not from a higher quality initial sample (PHI)?

I noted that the ES7 has the PHI feature as do the MP10/11. What can you tell us about the "quality" of the samples in the MP7 compared to the MP6/MP11? Noting that the first 12 piano samples are exactly the same as the MP6 menu, what can you tell us has been done to improve the piano samples of the MP7? My experience with the MP6 is that there are 3 or 4 good sample sounds, but the remaining piano sounds are marginal. That seems to be a common sentiment amount MP6 users. Listening to the samples online, they do not sound to be as bright as the MP11. Have you compared the MP7's piano samples yourself? What can you tell us about improvements in piano sounds, if any? There's always the MP10 or MP11, but I was hoping that with the arrival of the MP7, Kawai would step up the quality of the piano samples….

Thanks in advance…
H.K.
_________________________
Keyboards are the best therapy I know of...
______________________________________________
Kawai MP6 stage piano
DCM CX-17 Monitors
Sennheiser HD 205, DJ series, headset

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#2243984 - 03/10/14 12:57 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: HisKidd]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9333
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted By: HisKidd
I noted that with the MP7, it has the HI (Harmonic Imaging with 88 key sampling)...


May I ask where you saw this?

The specifications table in the MP7 owner's manual and on Kawai Europe's MP7 product page both state that the MP7 uses 'Harmonic Imaging XL' (HI-XL). This is the same sample quality as the MP11.

Previously the MP10 had superior sounds to the MP6 (UPHI vs PHI), but now both the MP11 and MP7 utilise the same HI-XL sample quality. It goes without saying that the MP7 is a considerable improvement over the MP6.

Kind regards,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2243990 - 03/10/14 01:10 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Marko in Boston]
lolatu Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/01/13
Posts: 480
Loc: UK
What are the major differences between this and the MP11 apart from the keyboard?
_________________________
Kawai CA95 / Pianoteq Stage / Sony MDR-7506 / Steinberg UR22
In the loft: Roland FP3 / Tannoy Reveal Active / K&M 18810

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#2243995 - 03/10/14 01:28 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: lolatu]
Marcos Daniel Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 06/07/13
Posts: 170
Loc: Punta Alta, Buenos Aires, Arge...
Even though I know that James is the person who knows about these pianos, for a pure piano player, I guess that the action is the major difference.
Number of sounds and effects may be?

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#2244007 - 03/10/14 01:50 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Kawai James]
HisKidd Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/31/11
Posts: 198
Loc: AL/USA
Here is the information on "harmonic imaging" from the Kawai website:
http://www.kawaius.com/main_links/digital/Features/harmonic_imaging2010.html

Thanks for asking for my source, because reading your explanation and this aritcle on how the sound sources are processed has helped me learn more. Yes, there are distinctions between "Harmonic imaging," "Progressive Harmonic Imaging," "Ultra-Progressive Harmonic Imaging," and "Harmonic Imaging, XL. All have 88 key sampling, but the quality of the samples seems to be graded according to which imaging process is used.

I am thrilled to hear your explanation for the piano sounds of the MP7, and that the processing is essentially the same as the MP11 sounds!

This being said the Kawai site gives the specifications as follows:
MP11- Harmonic Imaging, (HI-XL) with 88 key sampling
MP10- Ultra-Progressive Harmonic Imaging with 88 key sampling
MP7 - Harmonic Imaging (HI-XL) with 88 key sampling
MP6 - Progressive Harmonic Imaging (PHI) with 88 key sampling.
ES7- Progressive Harmonic Imaging (PHI) with 88 key sampling.

Harmonic Imaging XL:
"Hi-XL extends the length of the critical attack by up to 120%, articulating the characteristics of each note more clearly and organically."

Your answer, and this information are great confidence builders! Now, I can't wait to actually sit down and play the MP7. Have you had the opportunity to do so, James?

As always, thanks for your help!
H.K.






_________________________
Keyboards are the best therapy I know of...
______________________________________________
Kawai MP6 stage piano
DCM CX-17 Monitors
Sennheiser HD 205, DJ series, headset

Top
#2244009 - 03/10/14 01:57 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Kawai James]
Musical Dan Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/27/10
Posts: 64
Loc: Sydney, Australia
Originally Posted By: HisKidd
Musical Dan…

Just took a gander at the "sound list" in the manual. The piano section includes, by my count, 28 piano sounds (7 banks of 4 each). The first 12 are the same names as the present 12 on the MP6 (Concert Grand, Concert Grand2, Studio, Mellow, Jazz, Pop, Bright, etc.). In addition there are groups of pianos for mono, octave, upright, new age; 4 different "piano variations," and piano/EP combinations.

To my knowledge Kawai has always created its samples from its own Grand Pianos, that is to say, all the piano sounds are created using a Kawai instrument. I recall reading that different effects are created by the positioning of microphones, etc. So, yes- you are getting sample variations from a Kawai Grand Piano.

Kawai James can jump in here and correct any information I have wrong, and/or offer additional information.

Play On!

Originally Posted By: Joe Garfield
I read in the description of "harmonic imaging" that they sample only one piano, but use different equipment to sample it for the different tones. For example, recording equipment associated with modern rock was used to sample the piano for the 'Rock' piano tone. So that leads me to believe the sound was not processed to change the tone. Of course there probably is some processing, but hard to say how much.

Originally Posted By: Kawai James
Originally Posted By: Musical Dan
Does this mean that there is only one sampled Piano, the the different Pianos types just undergo different later processing?


No, as with the MP11, the MP7 features different piano samples (mic type/positioning and voicing) for each category.

Kind regards,
James
x


Thanks guys. This might be enough to hold off on purchasing the Yammy CP4 (assuming it doesn't take forever for the MP7 to get to Australia).
_________________________
Kawai MP7

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#2244010 - 03/10/14 02:01 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: lolatu]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9333
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted By: lolatu
What are the major differences between this and the MP11 apart from the keyboard?

  • MP7 retains the 'zones' approach of the MP6 and previous 'classic' MPs, while the MP11 retains the 'sections' approach of the MP10.
  • The MP7 features a much broader range of sounds, including tonewheel simulation. The MP11 does not include any organ sounds.
  • The MP7 features 16-track SMF direct playback. The MP11 only allows 2-track MIDI songs (keyboard + drum backing) to be loaded into recorder memory.
  • The MP7 does not feature XLR jacks, the MP11 does.
  • The MP7 includes the F-10H single pedal, but can use the F-20/F-30 (double/triple pedal units respectively) as accessories. The MP11 includes the F-30 as standard.

I expect there are a number of other differences, but these are points that spring to mind initially.

Cheers,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2244015 - 03/10/14 02:14 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: HisKidd]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9333
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted By: HisKidd
This being said the Kawai site gives the specifications as follows:
MP11- Progressive Harmonic Imaging, XL with 88 key sampling


May I please ask you to tell me which Kawai website you are referring to?
Any website that lists the MP11 as featuring 'Progressive Harmonic Imaging, XL' is incorrect and should be revised.

To clarify Kawai's different sample standards, in increasing order of expressiveness:

- Harmonic Imaging (HI), 88-key sampling
- Progressive Harmonic Imaging (PHI), 88-key sampling
- Ultra Progressive Harmonic Imaging (UPHI), 88-key sampling
- Harmonic Imaging XL (HI-XL), 88-key sampling

Once again, the MP11 and MP7 both utilise the same 'Harmonic Imaging XL' standard.

Originally Posted By: HisKidd
Have you had the opportunity to do so, James?


I have a prototype sitting to the right of my desk. I actually snapped a picture of it a few months ago, but nobody noticed. wink

Cheers,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

Top
#2244018 - 03/10/14 02:24 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Kawai James]
HisKidd Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/31/11
Posts: 198
Loc: AL/USA
James…

You are correct… and I've made the change in my earlier post. I took all my info from the Kawai Europe link:
http://www.kawai.de/mp11_en.htm
(for the information on the MP11)

The MP7 and the MP11 are one and the same for sound source:
Harmonic Imaging (HI-XL)- 88 key sampling.

Cheers..
H.K.
_________________________
Keyboards are the best therapy I know of...
______________________________________________
Kawai MP6 stage piano
DCM CX-17 Monitors
Sennheiser HD 205, DJ series, headset

Top
#2244055 - 03/10/14 05:27 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Marko in Boston]
doremi Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 1744
KJ or others, can the 4 drawbars be used to control, via MIDI, the sound volume of external sound sources in real time? Can't see that from the manual.
_________________________
I am 'doremi' because I play scales smile
Had I progressed to playing chords,
I would be 'domisol' shocked

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#2244064 - 03/10/14 05:59 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: doremi]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9333
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted By: doremi
KJ or others, can the 4 drawbars be used to control, via MIDI, the sound volume of external sound sources in real time? Can't see that from the manual.


Yes, the functionality of previous MPs is retained.

When a zone is set to INT the faders control the assigned internal sound volume. When set to EXT the faders control an assigned external MIDI channel. When set to BOTH the faders control both internal sounds and external MIDI channels.

This is mentioned in a few people places, but the first reference is on page 13, in the Introduction chapter.



Kind regards,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2244069 - 03/10/14 06:15 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Marko in Boston]
doremi Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 1744
Thanks, KJ, very nice feature of the MP7 that the MP11 does not seem to have.

Edit: Which other models have the same RH2 action? So as to get a first feel for the action by proxy.


Edited by doremi (03/10/14 06:21 AM)
_________________________
I am 'doremi' because I play scales smile
Had I progressed to playing chords,
I would be 'domisol' shocked

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#2244071 - 03/10/14 06:22 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: doremi]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9333
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted By: doremi
Thanks, KJ, very nice feature of the MP7 that the MP11 does not seem to have.


The MP11's faders are for controlling the internal sound section only.
However, the MP11's has a separate MIDI OUT section with four zones that can also be controlled in real time using the assignable knobs.

Originally Posted By: doremi
Edit: Which other models have the same RH2 action? So as to get a first feel for the action by proxy.


The ES7, CS4, CN34, and CN24 all utilise the same RHII action.

Cheers,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2244074 - 03/10/14 06:43 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Marko in Boston]
Phlox Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/14/10
Posts: 121
Loc: The Netherlands
@ Kawai James:

Is the sustain of the piano sounds in the MP11/MP7 as long as the piano sounds in the CA65/CA95/CS7/CS10 ??
_________________________
10.000 clowns on a rainy day

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#2244075 - 03/10/14 06:50 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Marko in Boston]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9333
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
For the most part yes, however there are some additional piano sounds on the MP11/MP7 that are not included on the CA/CS models.

Kind regards,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2244078 - 03/10/14 06:53 AM Re: KAWAI MP7 THREAD [Re: Kawai James]
PV1 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/03/13
Posts: 5
Hello,

I believe the MP7 is what I was looking for. I play piano but also composose with other virtual instruments. Do you think the action is suitable for playing other virtual instruments such as orchestral VST's and synths? What about DAW controlling?

Thank you

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