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#2263383 - 04/18/14 07:07 AM Re: Mozart K310 fingering [Re: Derulux]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12535
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: Derulux
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
Originally Posted By: hreichgott
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
at m. 40, the RH is playing a Quarter note on treble C and the LH then comes in a 16th note later and plays the same C and then moves down the scale. I'm having difficulty playing the C with the RH, then have the LH come in then move off while still holding down the C for the full quarter note value. I was thinking of cheating and just playing the C twice with the RH (16th-dotted 8th) and not at all with the LH.

Any other ideas?

You will be going so fast that it will not matter in the least, especially if you tap the pedal.

Good, then I won't worry about it. Thanks smile

It also isn't a quarter note in the version I'm looking at. grin

But if you want to play it that way, I would play it first with the RH, then restrike with the LH. Hold the value with the LH, and go down to 4 on the G, and finger the 2nd beat 4131, then you can use 2131 2132 4 and repeat.

I think if another edition doesn't even have that quarter note (is it a 16th?) then there's no need to be fussy about it, IMO. Great suggestion though, thanks!
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#2263407 - 04/18/14 08:38 AM Re: Mozart K310 fingering [Re: Mark_C]
prout Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/14/13
Posts: 1065
Loc: Southwestern Ontario
Originally Posted By: Mark_C
Originally Posted By: prout
Originally Posted By: Mark_C
Originally Posted By: beet31425
....My teacher has opened up my eyes to "ridiculous", but really wonderful fingerings, e.g. a "33" in a fast RH passage of Chopin's first scherzo....

Wherever that is (and I can't even guess!), I think it's a sure bet that this was along the lines of what I said in an earlier post: It was because this fingering better enabled a particular musical goal, in line with a particular interpretation -- not simply because it was technically preferable.

33 is a slide from a black to a white note. Can be done with any finger. Very useful.

Well, I know that. grin
What I didn't know was where.

Obviously, I don't sight read words very well. I thought you said 'whatever'. mea culpa

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#2263709 - 04/18/14 06:23 PM Re: Mozart K310 fingering [Re: Morodiene]
hreichgott Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/13
Posts: 1529
Loc: western MA, USA
Yep, the score I downloaded from IMSLP (Breitkopf & Hartel?) has a 16th, while my Peters Urtext has a quarter note.
_________________________
Heather W. Reichgott, piano http://heatherwreichgott.blogspot.com
Working on:
Beethoven Op. 2 no. 2
I love Haydn, Mozart, Beethoven and new music

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#2263811 - 04/18/14 09:06 PM Re: Mozart K310 fingering [Re: Morodiene]
TwoSnowflakes Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 1554
I have three copies of this sonata. Presser, Weiner, and Henle.

All three have the C as a quarter note.

What I was doing was hitting the C with the right hand, and then clearing off, LH comes in and holds the second C with 1 while 2, 3 play B, A sixteenth notes. Thumb up at the same time 3 releases A, 4 plays G, LH thumb now ready to come back into action on next note A.

I'm not sure I'm making sense, but that's what I was doing.
_________________________
Currently:
Scales. Scales and arpeggios. Scales, arpeggios and chords.
Chopin, Fantaisie-Impromptu Op. post. 66
Tchaikovsky, Avril: Perce-neige Op. 37a No. 4
Scriabin, Three Pieces, Op. 2

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#2263858 - 04/18/14 10:11 PM Re: Mozart K310 fingering [Re: TwoSnowflakes]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12535
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: TwoSnowflakes
I have three copies of this sonata. Presser, Weiner, and Henle.

All three have the C as a quarter note.

What I was doing was hitting the C with the right hand, and then clearing off, LH comes in and holds the second C with 1 while 2, 3 play B, A sixteenth notes. Thumb up at the same time 3 releases A, 4 plays G, LH thumb now ready to come back into action on next note A.

I'm not sure I'm making sense, but that's what I was doing.

Makes sense, and it is what was previously suggested. OK, majority rules, so I'll assume it should be a quarter and try this method out. Thanks smile
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#2263973 - 04/19/14 08:44 AM Re: Mozart K310 fingering [Re: Morodiene]
TwoSnowflakes Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 1554
So, when I bought the Weiner version, I got the "facsimile" along with it because they didn't have any more left of the version without it.

It fell on the floor when I was looking for the measure in the printed score.

So this morning I picked it up to put it back and looked inside, and for whatever it's worth, it's a quarter note in Mozart's own hand, too, with two more quarter rests, then the eighth notes in the RH for the fourth beat. LH has sixteenth rest, then the sixteenth notes for the rest of the measure, phrasing over the sixteenth notes, under the rests:



I guess I finally found a purpose for the extra 5€ I spent on one sonata (the version without the high quality copy of the autograph was 10€ and this one was 15€). Though, given the fact that a) it probably doesn't much matter, and b) we've already come to a general consensus it's a quarter note anyway, I can't quiiiiite declare it 5€ well spent. Considering where I was when I spent it and the likelihood I'll ever need to refer to it for my own purposes, 5€ would have been more fun/tasty spent elsewhere. The café next door does a darn good espresso and breakfast pastry.
_________________________
Currently:
Scales. Scales and arpeggios. Scales, arpeggios and chords.
Chopin, Fantaisie-Impromptu Op. post. 66
Tchaikovsky, Avril: Perce-neige Op. 37a No. 4
Scriabin, Three Pieces, Op. 2

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#2263984 - 04/19/14 09:10 AM Re: Mozart K310 fingering [Re: Morodiene]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12535
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Still, it's nice to have that confirmation from the source. I think 5 euro isn't all that much in the grand scheme of things, and you have something that lasts longer than a coffee and pastry. wink
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher FT



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#2263990 - 04/19/14 09:23 AM Re: Mozart K310 fingering [Re: Morodiene]
TwoSnowflakes Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 1554
Well, enjoy! I, for my part, am going to go need to get myself some breakfast. I'll make it a Viennese coffee in Mozart's honor. And eat a croissant with it since the sonata was composed in Paris.

smile
_________________________
Currently:
Scales. Scales and arpeggios. Scales, arpeggios and chords.
Chopin, Fantaisie-Impromptu Op. post. 66
Tchaikovsky, Avril: Perce-neige Op. 37a No. 4
Scriabin, Three Pieces, Op. 2

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