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#2264656 - 04/20/14 05:43 PM Video clip for classical music?
Nikolas Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 5240
Loc: Europe
So,

I was drawn to this video by someone in Facebook: http://www.adweek.com/adfreak/k-pop-grou...ic-video-157093

I found that it's an interesting enough idea, and one that has crossed my mind many times: To do a "proper" video clip for classical music.

In this instance, I'm quite annoyed by the 5 girls dancing, like it's a strip club (or getting rather old) but I do find the whole premise, if anything, quite interesting.

Comments?
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#2264662 - 04/20/14 06:03 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
malkin Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/18/09
Posts: 2494
Loc: *sigh* Salt Lake City
I agree on both counts. The concept is interesting, but in this case the mundane 'come hither' choreography wasn't.
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A good student is one who makes the teacher feel like a good teacher.

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#2264672 - 04/20/14 06:35 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
FSO Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/03/12
Posts: 854
Loc: UK, Brighton
I think the video was spectacular for its intended purpose; to entirely distract the type of person who would consider classical music boring. They could have achieved much the same with video of, say, open heart surgery; um...certainly, pieces like Schubert's Ave Maria have entered the public consciousness through, I believe it is, the Hitman games/film. I'm not exactly sure this *is* the first classical music video but, hey, if they're going to insist it is then I won't argue (though it isn't laugh ). Um...the idea's fine though, of course, runs the risk of devaluing the work done by potential composers (just as truly great hip-hop music *is* possible {in theory wink }, but who can be bothered when good enough earns just as much? Very few "artists" *are* artists, bear in mind)...but aside from that it'll do no damage (except for, of course, potentially adding a *new* type of pressure to young and aspiring classical musicians; a genre of music typically flocked to by those disenchanted by vulgarity. That's not to say *all* videos would be so base in nature, um, *some* music videos nowadays *are* fine and family friendly, but there's no doubt that it's the nigh-on pornographic ones that gross the highest interest...Vanessa Mae! She did a music video of part of the Devil's Trill sonata...and she's not alone...anyway, where was I...were this form of classical music campaign to take off, more and more attention and, arguably, funding would head that way, of course. With the bent on vapid luridity I ascribed to earlier, um, it'd potentially become a case of "they play well, but..." and at that point...well, the integrity within Classical music which I'm still naive enough to believe in would be shattered frown Maybe that'd never happen though...um...it's certainly not happened in every other sector of entertainment after all) and could potentially draw new talents that wouldn't otherwise be ensnared. It's just a 21st century ballet; with the right directors I'm sure the effect of some pieces could even be improved upon. I mean, um, music is beautiful, but it's not the entirety of experience. I don't know...I approve over all, but videos such as that one would likely become the norm in a heavily distributed market...which disappoints me...*sigh*...I'm not sure Dvorak would have felt about this...
Xxx
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Sometimes, we all just need to be shown a little kindness <3

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#2264674 - 04/20/14 06:41 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
JoelW Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4763
Loc: USA
That was the stupidest thing I've ever seen.

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#2264690 - 04/20/14 07:37 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
TheFool Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/13/10
Posts: 155
Hate the video, and being honest the project which gave rise to it sounds condescending; like people are incapable of enjoying classical music if it isn't packaged in a bright and shiny way.

That said, there are some really cool video projects out there! I really like this Steve Reich one

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYca8EJlz0g

And while Fantasia isn't really a music video exactly, it's a similar kind of idea with some really genuinely fantastic moments. For me, the following Shostakovich being one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFanayBhyeA#t=66

And video operas are also in the same vein, no?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4SjjJ-hm1g
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#2264691 - 04/20/14 07:40 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: JoelW]
Polyphonist Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/03/13
Posts: 7573
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: JoelW
That was the stupidest thing I've ever seen.

I second this opinion.
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Polyphonist

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#2264705 - 04/20/14 08:01 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
Atrys Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/31/13
Posts: 984
That was hot.
_________________________
"A good intention but fixed and resolute - bent on high and holy ends, we shall find means to them on every side and at every moment; and even obstacles and opposition will but make us 'like the fabled specter-ships,' which sail the fastest in the very teeth of the wind."
R. W. Emerson

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#2264737 - 04/20/14 08:54 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 6103
Loc: St. Louis area
Originally Posted By: Nikolas

In this instance, I'm quite annoyed by the 5 girls dancing, like it's a strip club (or getting rather old) but I do find the whole premise, if anything, quite interesting.

Comments?


This didn't really seem to fit the Dvorak. It looked more like they were dancing to some pop music and later edited to a new soundtrack. The basic idea of a music video doesn't offend me, though. Classical music isn't very sexy.
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#2264779 - 04/20/14 10:49 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Polyphonist]
ChopinAddict Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/29/09
Posts: 6098
Loc: Land of the never-ending music
Originally Posted By: Polyphonist
Originally Posted By: JoelW
That was the stupidest thing I've ever seen.

I second this opinion.


I third it...

Click to reveal..
Tom and Jerry are better. laugh
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Music is my best friend.


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#2264785 - 04/20/14 11:06 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
Brad Hoehne Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/22/11
Posts: 366
Loc: Ohio
I have no problem with this concept at all- i.e. co-opting the style of music videos normally associated with pop and hip-hop- particularly if the dancing young women in question are this bunch. However the execution was somewhat flat and uninspired. They seem to do what is known as "mickey mousing" the music- i.e. simple emphasis of loud beats.

As far this sort of dancing to music goes, the ubiquitous "Gangam Style" K-pop video has this one beat by a mile in creativity. Heck, the dancing in the Dvorak video seems very derivative of that in the video that first introduced twerking-style dance to the broader universe- Sir Mix-A-Lot's "Baby Got Back" (from way back in 1990ish), and the former has far more all around delight and, importantly, humor.

Compare the dancing styles in the two videos: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHFNiDyYeUo

(Now, uh, that the "replay" button is that little arrow loop, right?)



Edited by Brad Hoehne (04/21/14 10:11 AM)
_________________________
1999 Petrof 125-111 (upright)
Casio Privia PX-330

Currently working on:
Rach. Prelude Op 32 #12
Mozart Piano Sonata #17, K570
Villa-Lobos, Bachianas Brasileiras #4
Playing by ear and "filling out" pop tunes

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#2264808 - 04/21/14 01:27 AM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
Svenno Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/25/14
Posts: 138
Loc: Estonia
I couldn't stand more than 20 seconds of it.

"B-Classic presents The Classical Comeback: a new music video format that gives classical music the same recognition as pop and rock music by combining the timeless emotion of classical music with the visual talent of a contemporary director."

Giving classical music the same recognition, by adding a video of 5 chicks twerking to the music?

This reminds me of Lang Lang - the famous chinese "virtuoso" pianist, who's purpose is to popularize classical music amongst young people.

He tries to do that, by looking like he's having a seizure behind the piano. He adds visual stimuli, to keep those people from getting bored while listening. And just listening to him butcher Rach's op. 23 no. 5 prelude was enough reason for me to never listen to him again.

But i think a classical music video is a good idea, if done properly. Here's a good example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGdFHJXciAQ


Edited by Svenno (04/21/14 01:28 AM)
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and life to everything.”

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#2264848 - 04/21/14 06:42 AM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
wr Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/23/07
Posts: 7784
Wasn't some company in Europe pushing their classical music videos more than a decade ago? Don't know when it was, exactly, but know the idea has been around for a long time - this is hardly "the very first", although it's the very first in which I've seen an attempt to juxtapose a current pop dance idiom to classical music. It is so insulting to my intelligence (not to mention libido) on so many levels that it's hard to know what to even say.

A music teacher once told me about a real porn flick he had seen that was done to classical music (Brahms, IIRC), way back in the 1960s. So this soft-core porn dance video (which is what it is, IMO) is way behind that cutting edge stuff from a half-century ago.

Someone else brought up "Fantasia". It wasn't a video, but it certainly had the basic idea down, a good while ago. And I think it was successful in its odd way, but much of that was due to a unique confluence things very much tied to the time and place in which it was made.

All of this seems to be about turning classical music that wasn't intended to be incidental music into incidental music. That's kind of pathetic, but hey, you know, like, whatever...if it sells, it must be good, right?

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#2264850 - 04/21/14 06:43 AM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
bennevis Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/14/10
Posts: 4964
The video is quite entertaining, and certainly a lot more so than the few clips of various pop videos I've had the misfortune of seeing on TV in recent years. The latter were mostly of gratuitously digitally-enhanced so-called 'artistes' and actors pouting suggestively at the camera, where all the skill was in the CGI effects and make-up. This video, at least, has real dancers who could actually dance.

Classical music has an image problem, and not just among the young. Many, many middle-aged and older people, if they've ever heard any of it, either think it's 'dead white men's music' or associate it with something they've seen in a movie or TV commercial. (Actually, the vast majority of the great unwashed wink only hear 'classical music' through John Williams, Hans Zimmer etc).

In the UK, for a while, Dvorák's 'New World' Symphony's slow movement (with its plaintive cor anglais tune) was well-known as.......background music for a sliced bread TV commercial. I doubt anyone who was looking for that music to buy from a record shop would have asked for it by name (the internet and downloads didn't exist then), and in any case, 'Dvorák' is unpronounceable - they'd have asked for 'the Hovis bread music' shocked . (Come to think about it, isn't that the precursor to music videos?)

I recently returned from a sailing holiday with a small group of people from all over the world (USA, Russia, NZ, Australia, Canada, Germany, UK) - all highly educated, all aged under 35. And everyone was playing the current pop hits from their MP3 players through the boat's music system.....until one evening, I asked if anybody liked classical music. They all looked at me as if I was odd grin - then I said I had videos of myself playing the piano on my iPod. At this they looked astonished, and wanted to see them. Bach, Beethoven, Chopin and Brahms didn't strike a chord with them, but the Russian girl asked to hear my Rachmaninov Op.23/5 and Schumann/Liszt Widmung. She told me later that she'd heard those pieces before, back in Russia.

Would they have wanted to listen to me playing 'boring' classical music on my iPod if there was no video? No, apart from the fact that I didn't look like their idea of a classical pianist wink (and it could be someone else playing)......and the fact that music videos and visuals are what attracts them to pop singers too.

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#2264855 - 04/21/14 07:17 AM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
Verbum mirabilis Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/15/11
Posts: 208
I found it amusing for the first minute or so. After that I couldn't watch more. I think the best video that a piece of classical music can have is one that has the sheet music in it.

The Allegro non troppo videos are also very good. For some reason they don't seem to be on Youtube anymore.
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Working on
Beethoven: sonata op. 14 no. 2
Chopin: op. 25 no. 2, op. 10 no. 3, op. 47
Bach: P&F in D minor, book 2

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#2264889 - 04/21/14 09:37 AM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
R0B Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 1439
Loc: Australia
The best visuals occur, when the eyes are shut.
smile


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Rob

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#2265028 - 04/21/14 05:37 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
TwoSnowflakes Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 1139
Wow, I am SO not the intended audience for that video. I don't need any help liking classical music, and even if I were in need of some special help there, that would not be the way to do it.

If you don't find anything inherently...interesting in the ladies', uh, caboosal characteristics, and the way they use it to "artistic" effect (I believe the technical term is "badonk-a-donk" but I don't often find much call to use that term) what you're left with is pretty much the same darn move, over and over and over again, in a repeating cycle of a few outfits and a few scenes. Again, and again, and again. Doing the same move in what looks like a parking garage. And then here on a field. Now in an aquarium. And now here in front of a building. Hey, back to the aquarium. Field. Building. Care to see it on a field? How about in an aquarium? No? Can I interest you in a parking garage?

Arrrgh. Instead of making three otherwise long minutes pass quickly, it managed to make three short minutes seem interminable. God, does this thing really take THAT long to resolve? We've had, like, twelve seizure-inducing scene changes and the music is still stuck in mid-cadence.
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Currently:
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With the pedal I love to meddle; When Paderewski comes this way... -Irving Berlin

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#2265061 - 04/21/14 07:25 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
joflah Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/09/09
Posts: 295
Loc: St. Louis, MO, USA
It might be interesting if someone could make a video where abstract visual shapes, colors and movements could represent elements in the music, like motives, themes and repetitions, or even rhythmic or sonic elements, or moods. That might be more like what a person perceives listening to music with their eyes closed. It might work for existing pieces, or maybe with new works composed and choreographed to suit.

You can see an abstract display like this with visualisations in audio players, but it's all just oscillographic and ultimately boring, with no real relation to the musical meaning.
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#2265062 - 04/21/14 07:27 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
JoelW Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4763
Loc: USA
Do they really think this is going to make people love classical music? You can't force love, or interest, or whatever it is. When I was 12, my school's music class played short selections of various composers. I think this went on for about a week, after which we tested on it. I was enthralled. This is where I discovered, for the very first time, a real interest in this music. I seriously doubt that my other classmates felt the same way. I don't think a single one of them walked away from that class with the new kind of perspective that I had.

This isn't something that can be forced down the throats of the public. Classical music is dense, artistic, passionate. Don't try to make it pop music. That's not its niche. You don't see jazzers doing this.

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#2265071 - 04/21/14 07:46 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: JoelW]
Atrys Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/31/13
Posts: 984
Originally Posted By: JoelW
Do they really think this is going to make people love classical music?

That was never the goal. You're misinterpreting the idea.

Originally Posted By: JoelW
Classical music is dense, artistic, passionate.

So is plenty of other music.

Originally Posted By: JoelW

Don't try to make it pop music.

It sounds like you're angry because your unjustified elitism is being threatened.
_________________________
"A good intention but fixed and resolute - bent on high and holy ends, we shall find means to them on every side and at every moment; and even obstacles and opposition will but make us 'like the fabled specter-ships,' which sail the fastest in the very teeth of the wind."
R. W. Emerson

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#2265076 - 04/21/14 07:59 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Atrys]
JoelW Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4763
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Atrys
Originally Posted By: JoelW
Do they really think this is going to make people love classical music?

That was never the goal. You're misinterpreting the idea.

Belgium's B-Classic music festival, whose mission is to "give classical music the same recognition as pop and rock music," (...)

Originally Posted By: Atrys
Originally Posted By: JoelW
Classical music is dense, artistic, passionate.

So is plenty of other music.

Obviously.

Originally Posted By: Atrys
Originally Posted By: JoelW

Don't try to make it pop music.

It sounds like you're angry because your unjustified elitism is being threatened.

I'm just going to acknowledge the irony here and move on.

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#2265077 - 04/21/14 08:01 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: JoelW]
Polyphonist Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/03/13
Posts: 7573
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: JoelW
Originally Posted By: Atrys
Originally Posted By: JoelW

Don't try to make it pop music.

It sounds like you're angry because your unjustified elitism is being threatened.

I'm just going to acknowledge the irony here and move on.

Atrys does seem to have more sophistication than most trolls, does he not? The irony in his posts is often rather amusing.
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Polyphonist

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#2265078 - 04/21/14 08:01 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: JoelW]
bennevis Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/14/10
Posts: 4964
Originally Posted By: JoelW
Do they really think this is going to make people love classical music? You can't force love, or interest, or whatever it is.

This isn't something that can be forced down the throats of the public. Classical music is dense, artistic, passionate. Don't try to make it pop music. That's not its niche. You don't see jazzers doing this.

Actually, jazzers frequently make use of pop tunes in their improv (as well as classical tunes, of course). And quite a bit of jazz comes perilously close to pop - though of course, some die-hard jazz fanatics will denounce it. They also denounce classical musicians who play jazz.....

Some of us are making the mistake of looking at the videos through the eyes of established classical musicians, rather than through those of pop fans, like the interviewees in the explanatory video. Did anyone actually watch that second video??

I'd had my fair share of introducing non-classical friends (and acquaintances and even total strangers) into the brave new world of classical, through (free) lecture-recitals, and sometimes even on my vacations, as I recounted above. They need all the help they can get: if necessary, through what they are familiar with from their own world of pop. Just playing choice bits of classical - even the tuneful bits - won't be sufficient, if it's totally alien to their world. Where are the visuals, the imagery, the constant drumbeats? We certainly won't convert everyone, but I'm always pleasantly surprised by how many people will begin to appreciate classical music, despite never ever hearing it in a context outside of movies, if we help them along with non-technical (but not condescending) guidance, or by utilising stuff from the pop world - like music videos. Notice, BTW, that the Dvorák music used in the video was in its original form (and performed by famous musicians), not in a dumbed-down 'pop' version with added drums and electric guitars.......

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#2265079 - 04/21/14 08:02 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: JoelW]
Atrys Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/31/13
Posts: 984
Originally Posted By: JoelW

Belgium's B-Classic music festival, whose mission is to "give classical music the same recognition as pop and rock music," (...)

You have poor reading comprehension if you're equating the two.

Originally Posted By: JoelW

I'm just going to acknowledge the irony of this statement and move on.

I can feel the pompous elitism running through your veins from all the way over here.

Protip: you're not as special as you think you are. Your classmates are in no way inferior to you just because they didn't take to classical music. Deal with it.
_________________________
"A good intention but fixed and resolute - bent on high and holy ends, we shall find means to them on every side and at every moment; and even obstacles and opposition will but make us 'like the fabled specter-ships,' which sail the fastest in the very teeth of the wind."
R. W. Emerson

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#2265080 - 04/21/14 08:03 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
JoelW Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4763
Loc: USA
grin

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#2265081 - 04/21/14 08:04 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: joflah]
wr Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/23/07
Posts: 7784
Originally Posted By: joflah
It might be interesting if someone could make a video where abstract visual shapes, colors and movements could represent elements in the music, like motives, themes and repetitions, or even rhythmic or sonic elements, or moods. That might be more like what a person perceives listening to music with their eyes closed. It might work for existing pieces, or maybe with new works composed and choreographed to suit.

You can see an abstract display like this with visualisations in audio players, but it's all just oscillographic and ultimately boring, with no real relation to the musical meaning.


I remember seeing a video on YouTube of a specially commissioned abstract video/movie that was projected on a screen behind the orchestra for the performance of some big piece - I think Messiaen's Turangalila Symphony. Can't find the link now. To me, it just distracted from the music and eventually became pretty annoying, but I guess for some people it might have worked.

Someone prolific uploader on YouTube does lots of videos of MIDI piano-roll views of the music being played, using color. They are fun to watch briefly, but unfortunately, the music itself is MIDI too, not live, and my appetite for MIDI realizations of classical music is limited.

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#2265082 - 04/21/14 08:04 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: JoelW]
Polyphonist Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/03/13
Posts: 7573
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: JoelW
Originally Posted By: Atrys
Originally Posted By: JoelW
Do they really think this is going to make people love classical music?

That was never the goal. You're misinterpreting the idea.

Belgium's B-Classic music festival, whose mission is to "give classical music the same recognition as pop and rock music," (...)

Classical music will never be as popular as pop and rock because most of the public is not sophisticated enough to appreciate it. That's a fact that's probably not going to change.
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Polyphonist

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#2265084 - 04/21/14 08:06 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: JoelW]
Polyphonist Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/03/13
Posts: 7573
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: JoelW
grin

I see you've also fallen prey to the Grin Syndrome. laugh
_________________________
Regards,

Polyphonist

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#2265085 - 04/21/14 08:08 PM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Atrys]
Polyphonist Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/03/13
Posts: 7573
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: Atrys
Protip: you're not as special as you think you are. Your classmates are in no way inferior to you just because they didn't take to classical music. Deal with it.

I would step in in Joel's defense here, were it not for the fact that I don't think he's insecure enough to need it. whome
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Regards,

Polyphonist

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#2265149 - 04/22/14 12:19 AM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Nikolas]
Brad Hoehne Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/22/11
Posts: 366
Loc: Ohio
It's not a "music video" per-se, but this video of a TED talk by conductor Benjamin Zander endeavors (and I think, perhaps, succeeds) in getting non-classical-loving folks to at least dip their toe into to its vast (and perhaps intimidating) ocean:

http://www.ted.com/talks/benjamin_zander...mp;utm_campaign
_________________________
1999 Petrof 125-111 (upright)
Casio Privia PX-330

Currently working on:
Rach. Prelude Op 32 #12
Mozart Piano Sonata #17, K570
Villa-Lobos, Bachianas Brasileiras #4
Playing by ear and "filling out" pop tunes

Top
#2265242 - 04/22/14 10:24 AM Re: Video clip for classical music? [Re: Polyphonist]
Old Man Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/04/12
Posts: 777
Loc: Michigan, USA
Originally Posted By: Polyphonist
Classical music will never be as popular as pop and rock because most of the public is not sophisticated enough to appreciate it.

More elitist propaganda! grin

"Sophistication" has nothing to do with it. Repeated exposure is the key. Unlike a simple song on pop radio, which lasts maybe 2-3 minutes, classical music pieces typically run much longer, and are far more dense. The melodies and harmonies are much more intricate, and cannot be easily absorbed quickly. One must devote a good deal of time to the effort, and also be willing to listen to the same pieces repeatedly.

I was surrounded by classical music from the time I was born, and I hated it. My friends would ask, "What's that weird music your parents are always playing?", and in my embarrassment I'd say, "Classical. Yuk!" But by the time I was 14, I had absorbed a good deal more of it than I had wished. Melodies got stuck in my head, and I couldn't rid myself of them: The intro to Brahms 4th symphony, the poco allegretto (3rd mvt) of his 3rd symphony, Mozart's No. 40, Rach's 2nd piano concerto, Bach's D Minor keyboard concerto, etc. Lots and lots of melodic and harmonic fragments, none of which I could identify.

Neither of my parents were educated beyond high school. My father took private piano lessons, and later organ, probably to escape a miserable home life. In the 1940s, my mother worked in a record store that catered to classical music, particularly opera. She'd had no prior exposure to classical music, but by simply showing up for work for 8 years, she developed a deep and abiding love for classical music, especially opera.

The notion that classical music can only be appreciated by a sophisticated audience is pure BS. The only requirements are: a love of music itself (any type of music), and two ears that can hear. Income, education, or social standing are irrelevant. The only missing ingredient is time - the time necessary to listen intently and repeatedly to a limited number of works (at least initially). There's no guarantee that a person who undertakes such a project will learn to love classical music. But the capacity to love it is within all of us, regardless of "sophistication". Take it from a simpleton! smile

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