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#2303893 - 07/18/14 11:59 PM A basic timing question...
TX-Bluebonnet Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/15/14
Posts: 274
Loc: Central Texas
Which is the correct sequence to press/release the keys for this 3/4 measure?

(treble) 1/4 rest --- 1/4 note (x)--- 1/4 rest
(bass) 1/2 note (y) ----------------- 1/4 note (z)

Do I lift off of (y) and (x) at the same time, then press (z)?
Or do I lift off (y) and then simultaneously come down on (z) while lifting off of (x)?
_________________________
Linda

Started my piano journey June 2014 at age 54.
My digital piano: Casio Privia PX-850.
Working on "Alfred's Adult All-In-One Course" Book 1
XXXV

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#2303898 - 07/19/14 12:23 AM Re: A basic timing question... [Re: TX-Bluebonnet]
Charles Cohen Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/26/12
Posts: 1539
Loc: Richmond, BC, Canada
The obvious answer:

. . . lift off both X and Y, then strike Z.


But if you want a legato effect -- if, for example, the melody line goes from X to Z, and you want that line emphasized -- you might want to lift off Y _just a little earlier_ than you lift off X.

Something you'll find out, sooner or later:

. . . The written score is a guide to how the piece should sound.

It's not a complete definition of how the piece should sound.

. Charles

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#2303963 - 07/19/14 09:03 AM Re: A basic timing question... [Re: TX-Bluebonnet]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12215
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Can you provide a copy of the measure in question? Things like slurs and other articulations will give you the clues that Charles is referring to to help you decide if there should be a "lift" after beat 2 or not.

Usually, the default should be legato unless otherwise notated, but that also does depend upon the time period of the piece. Some Baroque pieces are traditionally played with some separation between notes unless otherwise indicated - so just the opposite.

The more information you have, the better-informed decision you can make.

Of course, you should always go with what you think sounds best, so if you don't have enough information, just try out a few different ways and choose what sounds the best to you.
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#2304088 - 07/19/14 04:06 PM Re: A basic timing question... [Re: TX-Bluebonnet]
TX-Bluebonnet Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/15/14
Posts: 274
Loc: Central Texas
Thanks for the replies. I guess I thought I should be able to read a piece and "decode" it to sound just like the composer intended. Then again, this is a simplified arrangement which obviously isn't going to sound like the original. Here's a pic of the first 2 lines. Is there enough info there to tell me how it "should/is intended" be played, or like you're both saying, just play it my way, whatever that may be?

_________________________
Linda

Started my piano journey June 2014 at age 54.
My digital piano: Casio Privia PX-850.
Working on "Alfred's Adult All-In-One Course" Book 1
XXXV

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#2304093 - 07/19/14 04:16 PM Re: A basic timing question... [Re: TX-Bluebonnet]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12215
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
You see, the LH has the melody here because it has the slurs. That means that you will not lift up or create space at all the in Lh in the first line of music. Just lift up the RH note from beat 2 when you play LH on beat 3.
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#2304096 - 07/19/14 04:30 PM Re: A basic timing question... [Re: Morodiene]
BrianDX Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/14/14
Posts: 934
Loc: Lewes DE
BUT......

After measure four, don't forget to lift off your left hand before measure five starts.

As my teacher loves to say to me all of the time in cases where I forget to do this, "Get off of it!".

I sometimes hear this in my sleep; I'm sure my teacher would be proud smile
_________________________
Groucho Marx: "Now we're getting somewhere"
2013 Yamaha C2X | 2001 Yamaha M500-F ..
Current: Diabelli - Song; Reinagle - Allegro; Faber - March Slav;

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#2304416 - 07/20/14 01:40 PM Re: A basic timing question... [Re: TX-Bluebonnet]
Derulux Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/05
Posts: 5377
Loc: Philadelphia
Originally Posted By: TX-Bluebonnet
Which is the correct sequence to press/release the keys for this 3/4 measure?

(treble) 1/4 rest --- 1/4 note (x)--- 1/4 rest
(bass) 1/2 note (y) ----------------- 1/4 note (z)

Do I lift off of (y) and (x) at the same time, then press (z)?
Or do I lift off (y) and then simultaneously come down on (z) while lifting off of (x)?



This is a far more difficult question than you may think at first, because there really are two answers. There is the answer that relates to movement, in which case your hands aren't technically moving together, or even at the same exact time. And then there is the answer that relates to sound, in which case you can line the notes up vertically on the staff, and notes that line up are played together, while notes that don't line up aren't played together.

That probably as simple as I can make the answer, and I hope it makes sense..?
_________________________
Every day we are afforded a new chance. The problem with life is not that you run out of chances. In the end, what you run out of are days.

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#2304556 - 07/20/14 09:26 PM Re: A basic timing question... [Re: TX-Bluebonnet]
TX-Bluebonnet Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/15/14
Posts: 274
Loc: Central Texas
Thanks, Morodiene. I think what you're describing is the 2nd example in my original post, or close enough.

Brian, I appreciate the tip, and I'm sure your teacher is very proud of you! laugh

Derulux, I really thought I was asking a simple question. Little did I know!

Here's one of my attempts at trying to play Alpine Melody. I know the chords sound terrible, it's something I need to work on. I'm just hoping that I'm at least headed in the right direction with this.
_________________________
Linda

Started my piano journey June 2014 at age 54.
My digital piano: Casio Privia PX-850.
Working on "Alfred's Adult All-In-One Course" Book 1
XXXV

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#2304579 - 07/20/14 10:36 PM Re: A basic timing question... [Re: TX-Bluebonnet]
Derulux Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/05
Posts: 5377
Loc: Philadelphia
Originally Posted By: TX-Bluebonnet
Thanks, Morodiene. I think what you're describing is the 2nd example in my original post, or close enough.

Brian, I appreciate the tip, and I'm sure your teacher is very proud of you! laugh

Derulux, I really thought I was asking a simple question. Little did I know!

Here's one of my attempts at trying to play Alpine Melody. I know the chords sound terrible, it's something I need to work on. I'm just hoping that I'm at least headed in the right direction with this.




Not bad! Some very quick constructive comments: wrists should be a little higher (there is a concave arc in them, which indicates they're probably too low), fingers should be a little less straight (will help with the wrist), move the hand/arm more to reach the keys (there are a few notes where you do move, but not quite far enough, so the finger has to reach a little to get there), and be a little more flexible in the wrist (when you watch, you'll see you play a chord and while the chord is depressed, all movement stops -- you should almost never stop moving, even while holding a note).

Hope this help! smile
_________________________
Every day we are afforded a new chance. The problem with life is not that you run out of chances. In the end, what you run out of are days.

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#2304590 - 07/20/14 11:21 PM Re: A basic timing question... [Re: TX-Bluebonnet]
jotur Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/16/06
Posts: 5659
Loc: Santa Fe, NM
Hm. Methinks TX-Bluebonnets just about has her recital pieces ready.

Cathy
_________________________

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#2304726 - 07/21/14 08:30 AM Re: A basic timing question... [Re: TX-Bluebonnet]
BrianDX Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/14/14
Posts: 934
Loc: Lewes DE
TX-Bluebonnet;

Hearing this piece brings back some good memories for me!

This sounds pretty good to me. I'm wondering if you need to bring out the melody a bit more in the left hand.

I would defer to Morodiene on this of course smile
_________________________
Groucho Marx: "Now we're getting somewhere"
2013 Yamaha C2X | 2001 Yamaha M500-F ..
Current: Diabelli - Song; Reinagle - Allegro; Faber - March Slav;

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#2304739 - 07/21/14 09:01 AM Re: A basic timing question... [Re: Derulux]
Ragdoll Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/03/12
Posts: 698
Loc: Illinois


Quote:
Not bad! Some very quick constructive comments: wrists should be a little higher (there is a concave arc in them, which indicates they're probably too low), fingers should be a little less straight (will help with the wrist), move the hand/arm more to reach the keys (there are a few notes where you do move, but not quite far enough, so the finger has to reach a little to get there), and be a little more flexible in the wrist (when you watch, you'll see you play a chord and while the chord is depressed, all movement stops -- you should almost never stop moving, even while holding a note).

Hope this help! smile

Very nice Linda, I agree with the above comments though I still have some of the same problems occasionally. I noticed that your playing at the "end" of the white keys. (looking at your thumbs) Moving your hands a bit forward would help with the wrist as well as the straight fingers. Try to bring out the volume of the melody a bit more than the chords also. You're doing well with your studies and progressing at a good pace. smile
_________________________
Ragdoll

Never get directions from someone who hasn't been there.


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#2305100 - 07/21/14 10:06 PM Re: A basic timing question... [Re: TX-Bluebonnet]
TX-Bluebonnet Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/15/14
Posts: 274
Loc: Central Texas
Hey all, thanks so much for the critiques! smile

I tried to incorporate all the suggestions in my practice tonight. Except I don't know how to be flexible in the wrist and still maintain some type of correct hand position. frown I'll see if I can find some videos demonstrating this. Anyway, if anbody feels like taking a look, here's tonight's take.

I think I've beat this song up enough for now. Time to give it a rest, so don't go looking for this in the recital. grin
_________________________
Linda

Started my piano journey June 2014 at age 54.
My digital piano: Casio Privia PX-850.
Working on "Alfred's Adult All-In-One Course" Book 1
XXXV

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