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Intuitive technique does not imply efficiency. A person can be at once a fine pianist and ignorant of things that would make them an even better one.

Again you are arguing against a straw man by mixing up your objective and subjective lines. I'm not talking about subjective ideas, I'm talking about objective ideas.

I'm one of two pianists at our church. I prefer to sit fairly high on the bench - because I play infinitely better that way in all respects. The other guy was taught to sit VERY low - and doing so seems to work for him. During the course of a church service the Jansen artist bench gets a real workout.

I doubt it.

Anyways, he believes that improv is reserved for the gifted few, which speaks volumes about his critical thinking facilities.

The truth is the truth, after all.

The reason why you speak the way you do is because you are not a very good pianist, i.e. you have technical difficulties. If you didn't have these difficulties, you'd immediately understand my point because you'd realize that they are correct. Like being born in a cave, you don't realize that there is more to the world than just the cave. You just haven't ventured out to realize it. You may never venture out, but don't say that the rest of the world is a fantasy when all you know is your cave. Dunning-Kreuger: you're too ignorant to realize your own ignorance.

Indeed it does not -- at least not necessarily. But why the continued insistence on the all-or-nothing importance of "efficiency"?

Not all pianists are capable of the entire range of different movements that faulty_damper has been alluding to. And even when they *are* physically capable of performing the theoretically "perfect" movement, they may have found a different way of producing the same sound that suits their playing style better. The fact that it may also require a little more energy is, to my mind, not important, unless it demonstrably results in lower-quality playing which can *demonstrably* be remedied by more "efficient" technique *for that specific pianist*.



I'll say again: show me that Horowitz played better when he sat higher. You don't know that he did. He need not have been ignorant. He may have made his choice of bench height knowing full-well what the effects of sitting higher would be, in his case. They may not have been what *you* would expect. A piano performance is not an assembly line. Efficiency has little to do with it.



None of what I've said here is objective, except for the part where I said that if I were to go out and try to ascertain the average height at which a concert pianist chooses to sit, it would probably show me that Horowitz sat lower than most. Everything else is my opinion -- an informed one, I think.

*You* are the one who keeps insisting you're talking in objective truths. You are wrong about that.

No, I do not agree that Horowitz sounded good. I can't listen to most of his recordings. I can hear too many technical issues including wrong notes.

Exactly.

Your posts are objectively null and are really just "words, words, words" without any intellectual substance.

@faulty_Damper
+1 to Horowitz sounding not-very-good. I find him very sloppy, similar to many other "legendary" pianists.

ALL pianists are capable of the entire range of movements (with the exception of those without arms.) They probably use all of them on a daily basis unless they are comatose. Or arthritic.

Further, you advocate inefficiency. It only takes ~55 grams of weight to depress a key. But 1 pound works just as well. One of these wastes a lot of energy even if the sound is the same. There was a quantitative study on amateur vs. experienced pianists and the results objectively show that amateurs use excessive weight into the keys while experienced far less. The experienced pianists were more efficient.

Probably true, but I'm a lot more sure that I'm a better physicist and scientist.

1) It's probably not true.
2) You haven't the slightest clue about anything to do with physics or the sciences LOL! It's cute that you think you do though.


Also likely false. Your reading comprehension is probably the lowest I've seen on this forum

For even such a self-proclaimed 'expert' as yourself, you've said a lot of stuff which is pure nonsense on this thread already, but this really takes the biscuit.

That people use the entire range of movements on a daily basis? Even pianists?
Go ask a doctor, or an anatomist, or a physical therapist.

Nobody - not even a gymnast, or ballet dancer, or contortionist - uses the entire range of possible movements in any one joint on any one day.

The fact that they are subjective does not make them without substance. An opinion, unlike an objective fact, can be the subject of a fruitful discussion. If you keep insisting that you deal exclusively in "objective facts" (not so), while I deal in "substance-less' words", then *your* posts are the ones that are null and void for the purposes of this discussion. Not mine.

What was this thread about again?

Haha, this is obviously a false statement that is not supported by reason or evidence.

You keep mixing up your objective and subjective lines, and until you figure out how to separate the two, the conclusions you arrive at are logically unsound.

And the truth shall set you free.

Its OK if Mark plays better than you. After all he's been at it for almost 50 years.

And of course, "anyone" can learn basic improvisational skills - but being able to improvise at the highest creative level - well, that's a gift !!

Do you have evidence to support this claim, or are you making things up again?

In fact, the evidence available to us points to the contrary.

Hahaha. Nice try, faulty. You are free to live your delusion. Enjoy it if is that's what you wish.

You know nothing about me. You simply can't know if I'm a good pianist or not, anyway I'm not interested at all in your opinion. Would I be a better pianist in your imagination if I'd agree with you? Hahaha, this thread is getting funny.

I insist in my opinion, you are a piano noob. I'm really sick of dilettantes like you who spread their false information on Internet forums. Dunning-Kreuger may apply to you, not me. I'm not the one who is telling nonsensical things based on some personal opinions with no evidence at all.

BTW, only out of curiosity, what are your credentials, whom have you studied with and where? What's your background? I think I asked it before.

This is nothing but nonsense and poor reasoning in action. Notice the appeal to authority as well. Try again poor "Carlo".

I think it's about some Chopin etude I've personally never had the desire or patience to learn myself.

We're sure having fun here aren't we !!

Another (inadvertent) understatement!