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#2305491 - 07/22/14 03:53 PM Where is the new blood?
Markarian Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/06/12
Posts: 460
Loc: Seattle Area
Before I begin I want to preface this by saying that I intend this to be a civil and insightful discussion, and that I bring this up with only the utmost respect for those who have provided me help and guidance in my journey to find an instrument.

As some of you may know, I have been on a bit of a roller coaster ride in my process to secure a piano that will be my "forever" instrument, the piano that is still sitting around during my wake. I have talked to numerous dealers, sales reps, factory reps, rebuilders, technicians, enthusiasts and other piano people. I won't go into a lengthy narrative of my experiences here because that's not the point of my thread.

I'm a Millennial. I'm probably younger than the average Steinway buyer, especially one looking at B's and D's. I grew up on the Internet and was raised by Nickelodeon, Nintendo, and Netscape. I was not raised with a piano in the home, and had to make do on keyboards and digital pianos until now. At 31, I finally have a unique opportunity to pursue a career as an independent composer--a rare gift, to be sure.

During my experiences in the world of pianos, I have noticed that the entire community tends toward a much older crowd. The youngest person I met in my journey was a local sales rep who was well into his mid-40s. Countless times, I've been regaled with anecdotes of the glory days of a mythical beast called Sherman Clay in times when I was still in diapers and the world was not yet ready for Devo.

During all of this, I am left wondering where the younger techs, reps, and craftsmen are. I realize the economy has been particularly rough on my generation's efforts to launch their careers (see above) and that acoustic pianos aren't exactly the centerpiece of home entertainment anymore, but the fact remains that I have been left feeling uneasy for two reasons:

For starters, when you're relatively young and spending more money than you ever have in your life is intimidating enough. When you are constantly dealing with a parade of colorful characters--some whom strongly disagree with each other--that are old enough to be your father it can make the experience even more daunting. Now there is something to be said for wisdom and experience and I have received that in excess. For that I am very grateful.

But the second, and perhaps most pressing, issue is the quiet question of who will take up the mantle of maintaining this industry when those involved become so old they can no longer work. I am surrounded by great techs in this area, but who will service my Steinway when I myself am 50, even 60? Who is going to work on Lang Lang's D when he goes on tour in 2040?

Now it could be that I am simply seeing a narrow cross-section of the piano industry, based on my location and the type of piano I was looking for. Could these younger sales reps, technicians, and rebuilders be lurking in less expensive, less competitive metro areas?

My point is that I would love to both have more people closer to my age in this journey I could relate to, as well as feel secure in knowing that the network of support and knowledge will continue to be there for me for as long as I play. As for the former issue, I know of only one person on this forum who is the same age as I, and my hat's off to him for reaching out to me way back in November.

And to all you out there who have helped me, and who continue to help me, you have my sincerest gratitude and respect.


Edited by Markarian (07/22/14 03:55 PM)
_________________________
2012 NY Steinway Model B | Kawai MP11 | Korg Kross 61

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#2305505 - 07/22/14 04:19 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
michaelha Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/05/13
Posts: 959
The millennials are working at tech companies that Netscape founder Mark Andreesen funded or are working on Wall Street, not retailing or rebuilding pianos.
_________________________
Casio CDP-100
2012 Kawai RX-5 BLAK

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#2305515 - 07/22/14 04:33 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
Rickster Offline


Registered: 03/25/06
Posts: 8583
Loc: Georgia, USA
It's not just the piano industry where this is a problem (not enough younger people interested in the field/trade); it's also a problem in other industries and the trades. I suppose there are lots of reasons the younger generation is not interested in some of these fields/industries.

As for me, I fall into the older generation you speak of... I'm on the downhill side of life, but having a ball with my pianos! smile

Rick

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Piano enthusiast and amateur musician: "Treat others the way you would like to be treated". Yamaha C7. YouTube Channel

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#2305521 - 07/22/14 04:45 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
Mark Cerisano, RPT Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/24/10
Posts: 1421
Loc: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Pianos will never go out of style. But they are not as mainstream as they once were, that is true, and they probably won't be again.

Piano tuning and technology is not the bright career it once was, so let's face it, less people are attracted to it.

The ones that make a full-time career in this field are truly well rounded.

I wrote an article about the phenomenal rise and fall of the pianos. You can read it here:
http://howtotunepianos.com/2014/05/04/why-you-may-want-to-learn-how-to-tune-your-piano/
_________________________
Mark Cerisano, RPT
www.howtotunepianos.com

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#2305528 - 07/22/14 05:04 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
wimpiano Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/16/13
Posts: 1549
Loc: The Netherlands
My tuner is 35 and I am 31.
_________________________
Schimmel 116 S ...

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#2305529 - 07/22/14 05:05 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
Ben_NZ Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/16/14
Posts: 89
Loc: Auckland, New Zealand
I'm 34, and I've met some piano techs and salespeople around my age. I suspect my tech is probably younger than me - I haven't asked her. wink
I don't know anyone who owns a piano though. I would expect more young people in the industry if demand were increasing.

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#2305533 - 07/22/14 05:20 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
Carbonblob Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/26/13
Posts: 360
Loc: Los Angeles, Ca.
Good question........

Maybe there's another "Moog" inventor yet to come along and perhaps the technology will be so great by 2040 that instead of a 9 foot grand, there'll be some spacey looking carbon fiber electronic thing on stage. There's been recent posts showing us actual projects not far from that description.

Take the printing biz. I could name you dozens of print craftsman positions that simply don't exist now, hence, no apprentices either. Maybe the piano will never undergo a "technological revolution" and 100 years from now, pianos will look exactly the same (with some minor tweaks), I hope so. Still, you have to take your hat off to a product so complex, it has more parts than your car and we're discussing a design that goes back centuries. That's pretty cool and says something about the engineering. What's it all going matter if there's nobody left to sell or maintain them?

I would be pretty hard pressed to see why anyone, of the generations you're speaking too, would pursue this field. There'll always be someone, as Mark mentioned but I wonder what this market segment will look like decades from now? Yeah, good question..........blob
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KAWAI RX-3 BLAK
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#2305538 - 07/22/14 05:44 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
Grandman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/18/12
Posts: 218
Loc: Usa
This is a scary thought.

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#2305549 - 07/22/14 06:10 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
Minnesota Marty Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 7439
Loc: Rochester MN
_________________________
Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#2305555 - 07/22/14 06:32 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
Del Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/04/03
Posts: 5317
Loc: Olympia, Washington
For what it's worth --

Some 500+ of us attended the PTG Annual Convention in Atlanta last week. I gave two classes to an audience whose average age was probably forty something. Since there were several approaching my age in the group that means there were also several who were considerably younger.

I've been going to these things for better than forty years and, while I expect that the average age of the group is some higher now than it was when I started, I still see a good smattering of younger people as well. And that, by the way, includes a smattering of younger women as well as younger men. (And that is a welcome change from the early years.)

ddf
_________________________
Delwin D Fandrich
Piano Research, Design & Manufacturing Consultant
ddfandrich@gmail.com
(To contact me privately please use this e-mail address.)

Stupidity is a rare condition, ignorance is a common choice. --Anon

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#2305569 - 07/22/14 07:14 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Ben_NZ]
JohnSprung Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/02/11
Posts: 1570
Loc: Reseda, California
Originally Posted By: Ben_NZ
I'm 34, and I've met some piano techs and salespeople around my age. I suspect my tech is probably younger than me - I haven't asked her. wink


Are you married? Is she? Do you want to be sure you have the same tech for the rest of your life? ;-)
_________________________
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Knabe Grand # 10927
Yamaha CP33
Kawai FS690

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#2305573 - 07/22/14 07:25 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
Piano*Dad Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 10408
Loc: Williamsburg, VA
Markarian,

I can't cite the statistics of the piano industry then again no one else can either since they don't exist! Nonetheless, I think there are some general characteristics of an industry like this that are at work.

First off, as everyone knows the piano biz is in decline. This has been true for quite some time. But it once had a more solid employment base. I think this is an almost canonical example of a bottleneck of existing labor (everything from techs and wood workers to sales people and executives). Some of these people can move into other lines of work more easily than others, but in general the decline of the industry likely has created this blockage that has shifted the age distribution of the people we run into in this industry. It'll shake out over time, but there may be a period when the younger end is rather underrepresented, and that may very well be today. On top of that, entry into a retrenching industry isn't really most young people's cup of tea. I suspect we'll get an oscillating situation. At some point the retirement of the oldsters will create a dearth of qualified labor (beware the shysters of 2025 smile ), and that shortage may pull in some younger workers over time.

My tech is around my age, so I'm probably OK for a while. grin
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#2305575 - 07/22/14 07:28 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
doctor S Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/27/12
Posts: 147
Loc: Western PA
There is hope in "niche" markets. I am not an organist, but among very few acquaintances I know two pipe organ builders, one a few blocks away, and another within driving distance (he tuned my piano). The part-time piano tuner is in great demand; he's less than 30. Apparently both are working hard and being paid for it (the senior organ builder is the only person I know with a heated driveway: 1000 feet of concrete!)

Despite the utter demise of the home spinet organ, and the tendency of newer churches toward electronic organs (or no organ at all), there must be pipe organs somewhere and someone is (apparently) paying these guys to build and maintain them.

On the other hand, my Main Man piano tuner is probably in his mid-50's and he had to cancel my tuning date today 'cause he had to take a detour to the hospital. The Best Tuner in our area had to quit recently due to hand arthritis.

My mother in Phoenix speaks reverentially of the lost age of Sherman Clay. She just had her Steinway rebuilt (the rebuilder is in his 70's). If you want an heirloom for your children, I imagine the cheapest way would be to find a good "new" rebuilt Steinway or Mason & Hamlin. The tuners are out there: I can think of 3 that I would trust with my Petrof: two are under 40 (and one's a lady!)
_________________________
"I will hear in Heaven." Beethoven

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#2305589 - 07/22/14 07:49 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: JohnSprung]
Ben_NZ Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/16/14
Posts: 89
Loc: Auckland, New Zealand
Originally Posted By: JohnSprung
Are you married? Is she? Do you want to be sure you have the same tech for the rest of your life? ;-)

If she were single, let's just say I don't think she'd be interested!

This thread has caused a corny, faintly arrogant country song Jerry Lee Lewis did, "Who's Gonna Play This Old Piano", to get stuck in my head. Thanks a lot. :p

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#2305605 - 07/22/14 08:11 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
gsmonks Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/17/10
Posts: 638
Loc: Saskatchewan, Canada
The phenomenon you're referring to has been underway for a long time. What you're referring to is actually the tail-end of a process that has been ongoing since the end of WWII.

The first thing that happened is people stopped going out. People went out BIG time in the 1910's, 20's, 30's and 40's, but after the War, all those big bands that had been a staple since the 1920's suddenly found work harder and harder to come by. This process continued until the mid-1970's, when the last of the big bands finally packed it in.

However, even as big bands became extinct, the bar band scene was on the rise and became the live venue of choice. But they too experience a slow decline, until the bar-band scene finally petered out altogether, leaving almost nothing in terms of live music.

The classical music scene croaked at the same time as the avante garde jazz scene, in circa 1963. By the early 70's, all the big-name composers had died off, and as in the jazz world, there simply was no new generation to take over.

This isn't to say that no one is writing jazz and classical any longer- they are. But they're a generation of wannabees and wankers who aren't breaking any new ground, aren't doing anything original, and are more taxidermists and weekend-warriors than real musicians.

Miles Davis went to a big rock concert some time in the 60's, watched bands like Tower of Power, and realised that the music scene was in a bad way. The new generation of musicians, and their audience, didn't know anything about music. By that I mean you suddenly had people writing music who didn't know the first thing about how music works. They're just bashing and thrashing around, doing everything by rote. Same kind of thing you hear in a "Blues" club, where old bar-band musicians wank out on 12- and 16-bar, b.s.-ing the night away.

By the 90's, the younger audience-members were drifting away, big-time, because most of them hated live music. They hated it for two reasons- one, it was all an older generation playing the live music (just look at the Stones, Sabbath, ACDC, all the other geriatric bands out there), and because THEIR generation was listening to Karaoke-like rectal spew, sung to prerecorded synths 'n' sequencers, with one or more pretty people angsting and whining and pretending away on-stage.

Frank Zappa prophetically warned of the "pretty" trend many years ago. He wrote "I'm So Cute" as a result. That's all the country scene is now- pretty people lip-syncing soap-opera schlock.

Young people today are in the same situation guys like me were in around 1970. As a brass & piano musician, I thought my future lay in playing live music. The brass gigs suddenly vanished, I had to buy an electric keyboard and learn to play bass, FAST, in order to land jobs, and my last regular gig was around ten years ago. That's all she wrote. There simply are no regular live venues to keep musicians working full-time, or even part-time in many locations.

I know musicians all over the UK, Europe, Canada and the US. We're all in pretty much the same boat.

There is still some work out there. I'm in the process of buying a 23-passenger bus & trailer, the trailer to be converted into a portable stage. This, for playing the Folk, Fringe and Jazz Festivals from coast to coast. The money's poor, you only get to play part of the year, but it's that or play only a few gigs a year.

And that's pretty much what's out there.

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#2305618 - 07/22/14 08:58 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Piano*Dad]
Steve Cohen Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 10523
Loc: Maryland/DC/No. VA
Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
My tech is around my age, so I'm probably OK for a while. grin


I didn't think techs kept working beyond their 80s.
_________________________
Piano Industry Consultant- http://www.linkedin.com/pub/steve-cohen/6/b92/b80

Consultant & Contributing Editor - Acoustic & Digital Piano Buyer

Jasons Music
Maryland/DC/No. VA
Since 1937.

www.jasonsmusic.com
My postings, unless stated otherwise, are my personal opinions, not those of my clients.

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#2305643 - 07/22/14 09:39 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Steve Cohen]
Del Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/04/03
Posts: 5317
Loc: Olympia, Washington
Originally Posted By: Steve Cohen
Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
My tech is around my age, so I'm probably OK for a while. grin


I didn't think techs kept working beyond their 80s.

I'll let you know. Very few things frighten me as much as the thought that one day I might have to actually "retire."

ddf
_________________________
Delwin D Fandrich
Piano Research, Design & Manufacturing Consultant
ddfandrich@gmail.com
(To contact me privately please use this e-mail address.)

Stupidity is a rare condition, ignorance is a common choice. --Anon

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#2305669 - 07/22/14 10:49 PM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: gsmonks]
Markarian Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/06/12
Posts: 460
Loc: Seattle Area
Originally Posted By: gsmonks
The phenomenon you're referring to has been underway for a long time. What you're referring to is actually the tail-end of a process that has been ongoing since the end of WWII.

The first thing that happened is people stopped going out. People went out BIG time in the 1910's, 20's, 30's and 40's, but after the War, all those big bands that had been a staple since the 1920's suddenly found work harder and harder to come by. This process continued until the mid-1970's, when the last of the big bands finally packed it in.

However, even as big bands became extinct, the bar band scene was on the rise and became the live venue of choice. But they too experience a slow decline, until the bar-band scene finally petered out altogether, leaving almost nothing in terms of live music.

The classical music scene croaked at the same time as the avante garde jazz scene, in circa 1963. By the early 70's, all the big-name composers had died off, and as in the jazz world, there simply was no new generation to take over.

This isn't to say that no one is writing jazz and classical any longer- they are. But they're a generation of wannabees and wankers who aren't breaking any new ground, aren't doing anything original, and are more taxidermists and weekend-warriors than real musicians.

Miles Davis went to a big rock concert some time in the 60's, watched bands like Tower of Power, and realised that the music scene was in a bad way. The new generation of musicians, and their audience, didn't know anything about music. By that I mean you suddenly had people writing music who didn't know the first thing about how music works. They're just bashing and thrashing around, doing everything by rote. Same kind of thing you hear in a "Blues" club, where old bar-band musicians wank out on 12- and 16-bar, b.s.-ing the night away.

By the 90's, the younger audience-members were drifting away, big-time, because most of them hated live music. They hated it for two reasons- one, it was all an older generation playing the live music (just look at the Stones, Sabbath, ACDC, all the other geriatric bands out there), and because THEIR generation was listening to Karaoke-like rectal spew, sung to prerecorded synths 'n' sequencers, with one or more pretty people angsting and whining and pretending away on-stage.

Frank Zappa prophetically warned of the "pretty" trend many years ago. He wrote "I'm So Cute" as a result. That's all the country scene is now- pretty people lip-syncing soap-opera schlock.

Young people today are in the same situation guys like me were in around 1970. As a brass & piano musician, I thought my future lay in playing live music. The brass gigs suddenly vanished, I had to buy an electric keyboard and learn to play bass, FAST, in order to land jobs, and my last regular gig was around ten years ago. That's all she wrote. There simply are no regular live venues to keep musicians working full-time, or even part-time in many locations.

I know musicians all over the UK, Europe, Canada and the US. We're all in pretty much the same boat.

There is still some work out there. I'm in the process of buying a 23-passenger bus & trailer, the trailer to be converted into a portable stage. This, for playing the Folk, Fringe and Jazz Festivals from coast to coast. The money's poor, you only get to play part of the year, but it's that or play only a few gigs a year.

And that's pretty much what's out there.


Jesus, tell us how you REALLY feel! But I can definitely see the trend.

Myself, I am more influenced by film music and more adult contemporary stuff like Yanni, Jim Brickman, and David Lanz. My dream is to write for film and I've already scored a couple of indie shorts.

I notice in my generation a rebellion against the artificial and inauthentic and a draw back to the kind of folk and prog rock of the 1960s, but unfortunately without the musical foundation to back it up, as you mentioned. These hipsters, if you will, are exactly the kind of people who, disillusioned with the idea of sitting in a cube like their dads, might go into some quieter, artisinal field that is more rewarding and less stressful. I fervently hope to see some bearded 29 year old in a headsock showing you how to shape hammers on YouTube. These guys may be our only hope. Have you techs and rebuilders out there thought of taking on younger apprentices, maybe taking advantage of government subsidies for work study, etc?


Edited by Markarian (07/22/14 10:52 PM)
_________________________
2012 NY Steinway Model B | Kawai MP11 | Korg Kross 61

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#2305697 - 07/23/14 12:55 AM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: gsmonks]
phantomFive Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/11/14
Posts: 1659
Loc: California
Originally Posted By: gsmonks
There is still some work out there. I'm in the process of buying a 23-passenger bus & trailer, the trailer to be converted into a portable stage. This, for playing the Folk, Fringe and Jazz Festivals from coast to coast. The money's poor, you only get to play part of the year, but it's that or play only a few gigs a year.

I am reminded of John Candy in Home Alone

_________________________
Poetry is rhythm.

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#2305699 - 07/23/14 01:00 AM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
turandot Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/27/07
Posts: 7265
Loc: torrance, CA
Originally Posted By: Markarian

I would love to both have more people closer to my age in this journey


If you're a good enough musician to make a living from composition, I would advise you to have as few people as possible accompanying you on your journey. Zero is the ideal number.That would include the young and the old, the retailers and the industry types, the brand advocates and the bon vivants who frequent here,

I'm always leery of the notion that buying a piano is a jounrney, a quest, an adventure, etc. A lot of the people who come here for advice use those terms. But most of those people do not play at a level where they can trust themselves. When you are trying to match a piano to your needs and taste and you are already a player, you have all the tools you need to get the job done. Those tools are on the sides of your head and at the ends of your arms. That's even more the case when you have the ear of a composer or arranger.

The time to enlist the help of others is when you have decided what suits you best. Then you can ask opinions of your choice before you commit that large sum of money that intimidates you. The more specific the question, the more helpful the answer.You can ask the techs about build qulaity and any historical trouble spots. You can ask everyone about the offered price. You can sample people's opinions of whether the brand's long-term future is viable in the face of the indsutry consolidation that is inevitable in the next decade. You can pay for a technical inspection even if the piano is new. You can ask some musician buddies to play it and give their impressions. If it's almost dialed in in your estimation, but not quite, you can communicate what it is you find lacking and see if the shop technical staff can get it there.

In this post you're basically saying" This is so tough.Help me". The only thing you'll gain from that is more uncertainty and confusion.

When you're choosing a washing machine or a dishwasher, You can't take your soiled clothes or dirty dishes to the shop to audition the machine. You have to rely on others if you want to get beyond appearance and specs. That's not the case with a piano regardless of its price range.

Keep it simple. Trust yourself to know what you want more than you trust others to know what you want.

_________________________
Will Johnny Come Marching Home?
The fate of the modern wartime soldier

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#2305706 - 07/23/14 01:11 AM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
Paul678 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/13/13
Posts: 826
If Lang Lang fails to prop up the piano industry in the future, which
he apparently has at the moment, and not just in China, then you'll
see more musicians like me doing DIY work, especially the basics like tuning.

Agreed with Turandot: Trust your own ears!

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#2305746 - 07/23/14 03:44 AM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
michaelha Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/05/13
Posts: 959
Originally Posted By: Markarian


Myself, I am more influenced by film music and more adult contemporary stuff like Yanni, Jim Brickman, and David Lanz. My dream is to write for film and I've already scored a couple of indie shorts.


Well, that's the problem. Millennial's aren't listening to Yanni, David Lanz, or Kenny G. Maybe their [grand] parents.




Edited by michaelha (07/23/14 03:44 AM)
_________________________
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2012 Kawai RX-5 BLAK

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#2305749 - 07/23/14 03:58 AM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Paul678]
JohnSprung Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/02/11
Posts: 1570
Loc: Reseda, California
Originally Posted By: Paul678
... you'll see more musicians like me doing DIY work, especially the basics like tuning.

Agreed with Turandot: Trust your own ears!


I do some regulation and repair, but tuning is something I wouldn't risk trying to DIY. It's just too easy to get bored and get on the wrong pin and break string.
_________________________
-- J.S.

Knabe Grand # 10927
Yamaha CP33
Kawai FS690

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#2305754 - 07/23/14 05:02 AM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
wimpiano Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/16/13
Posts: 1549
Loc: The Netherlands
Come on guys.. this is so lame..
There has never been a big public for classical or at least serious (good) music. Ok, there where some hypes but no, the common man never went to conservatory. In reality a lot of music before NOW was crap, also in the 20's, 30's, 40's, 50's, 60's and 70's.

And yes, there's plenty of young people "Millenials" (who invents these words, seriously?) who know quite a bit of music and play it using real instruments.

Just a couple of weeks ago there was a little concert during lunch in our company restaurant by students part of the VU (university) Orchestra in Amsterdam. Those were not people actually studying music for a career, they play it because they like it. And yes there were hipsters including the beards among them.

It was fun, the average age of the public was around 35-40 meaning it also included quite some younger people. They played Schubert and so on.

Every generation thinks they're better than the generation after them.
Always the melancholy: Oh this is lost.. oh that is lost, oh this was better, oh that was better.. Give me a break..



Edited by wimpiano (07/23/14 06:29 AM)
_________________________
Schimmel 116 S ...

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#2305756 - 07/23/14 05:18 AM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: JohnSprung]
Paul678 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/13/13
Posts: 826
Originally Posted By: JohnSprung
[

I do some regulation and repair, but tuning is something I wouldn't risk trying to DIY. It's just too easy to get bored and get on the wrong pin and break string.



Get Tunelab Pro, and it's pretty easy to tune your own piano, once you get the hang of using the hammer and setting the pins, so your tuning is stable.

If you have a reasonably young piano, with young strings, you probably won't break a string if you are careful. It does happen, but then you should learn to replace strings anyways.....

thumb


Edited by Paul678 (07/23/14 05:30 AM)

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#2305784 - 07/23/14 07:44 AM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: wimpiano]
gsmonks Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/17/10
Posts: 638
Loc: Saskatchewan, Canada
Originally Posted By: wimpiano
Come on guys.. this is so lame..
There has never been a big public for classical or at least serious (good) music. Ok, there where some hypes but no, the common man never went to conservatory. In reality a lot of music before NOW was crap, also in the 20's, 30's, 40's, 50's, 60's and 70's.

And yes, there's plenty of young people "Millenials" (who invents these words, seriously?) who know quite a bit of music and play it using real instruments.

Just a couple of weeks ago there was a little concert during lunch in our company restaurant by students part of the VU (university) Orchestra in Amsterdam. Those were not people actually studying music for a career, they play it because they like it. And yes there were hipsters including the beards among them.

It was fun, the average age of the public was around 35-40 meaning it also included quite some younger people. They played Schubert and so on.

Every generation thinks they're better than the generation after them.
Always the melancholy: Oh this is lost.. oh that is lost, oh this was better, oh that was better.. Give me a break..


That's not the issue here. The issue is the lack of jobs for working musicians. Each city used to have dozens, in some instances hundreds of clubs featuring live music. Today they're all gone. I can easily name 50 cities where I used to play that today have not one regular live venue, for ANY kind of music.

I have friends in Vancouver, Victoria, New York City, Chicago, Detroit, San Francisco, London, Paris, Berlin, Rome, Amsterdam, Montreal, Saskatoon, Regina, Edmonton, Calgary, Winnipeg, Boston, Seattle, and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, NONE of whom are working as full-time professional musicians any more. The clubs are all closed, gone out of business, the whole entire scene is kaputsky.

It's usually cyclical, but this time it's different. In the 70's, brass musicians were running all over North America like chickens with their heads cut off, chasing rumours of work. When it finally dawned on them that there wasn't any, they settled where they were, hung out their shingle, and taught for a living. That's why in the late 60's, early 70's, I had trumpet teachers like Bobby Hilton, Bobby Herriot, Joe de Bruyker, Len Whitely, and so on. The only reason I had them as teachers was because there was no place for them to play any more.

At that time, the bar band thing took over and replaced the dance and club thing.

But this time, the bar band scene has come to an end with NOTHING to replace it. THAT's the difference. It's not that things have changed this time. It's that the scene itself is gone.

The kids coming along aren't playing live venues. They're making videos.

The computer/video/Interweb scene is sucking the life out of both live music and the television industry. Television itself is on the way out. There are times when our local television stations are putting on public-service commercials because there are no paid ads to fill those slots.

The Interweb is the last big venue, and it is anathema to live ANYthing.

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#2305787 - 07/23/14 07:54 AM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
wimpiano Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/16/13
Posts: 1549
Loc: The Netherlands
I agree in that respect that the working musician is replaced by a DJ.
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#2305835 - 07/23/14 09:52 AM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
Rickster Offline


Registered: 03/25/06
Posts: 8583
Loc: Georgia, USA
Originally Posted By: wimpiano
I agree in that respect that the working musician is replaced by a DJ.

This may be a little OT, but on occasion I will get invited to play the piano for an event at the small community college where I work; not that I'm all that good on the piano, but what little I can play is legible to an extent (people can recognize the song/tune).

I get a lot of comments from the audience that they enjoyed my playing and that I was good on the piano. Fact is, I'm not really all that good on the piano, but the audience is not used to hearing someone playing live music at an event, as a general rule. So, although my playing is mediocre at best, they still find it somewhat entertaining and enjoyable.

Where is the new blood? My 10 year old granddaughter is taking piano lessons (though not from me smile ) and there will always be an interest in the piano in particular and the arts in general.

Rick
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Piano enthusiast and amateur musician: "Treat others the way you would like to be treated". Yamaha C7. YouTube Channel

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#2305844 - 07/23/14 10:05 AM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Markarian]
Ed McMorrow, RPT Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/09/12
Posts: 2349
Loc: Seattle, WA USA
There are young people starting careers in piano service in the USA. Probably enough to meet demand for some time. But probably not if everybody with a serviceable grand piano gets it tuned twice a year.

We are seeing a reduction in piano service support at most universities and colleges. There are signs of price competition among service providers. That should tell you something about the demand/supply curve.
_________________________
In a seemingly infinite universe-infinite human creativity is-seemingly possible

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#2305846 - 07/23/14 10:10 AM Re: Where is the new blood? [Re: Steve Cohen]
Piano*Dad Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 10408
Loc: Williamsburg, VA
Originally Posted By: Steve Cohen
Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
My tech is around my age, so I'm probably OK for a while. grin


I didn't think techs kept working beyond their 80s.


Payback .. is .. coming.

.
.
.
.

grin
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Grotrian 192 #156455

https://www.youtube.com/user/dhfeld/videos

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