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#2306161 - 07/23/14 08:24 PM Broken Butt Plate - Replacement part?
musicNow Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/22/13
Posts: 129
Loc: San Francisco, Bay Area
I have one broken, threaded, butt plate on a 1900 upright, Ivers Pond Piano, the broken plate is off to the side:



Would this part from Schaff Piano work? Reading Reblitz, it appears this was somewhat a standard part until the 1940s.



Thanks - Rick
_________________________
Learning to play the piano and tweaking my 1907 Ivers Pond upright.

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#2306212 - 07/23/14 10:54 PM Re: Broken Butt Plate - Replacement part? [Re: musicNow]
SMHaley Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/06/13
Posts: 757
Loc: Seattle
Probably, machining any alterations as needed.
_________________________
AA Music Arts 2001, BM 2005
Pipe Organ Builder
Practitioner of piano technology
Church Music Professional
Curator of instruments - Chancel Arts
Baldwin F 1960 (146256)
Zuckermann Flemish Single

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#2306322 - 07/24/14 08:01 AM Re: Broken Butt Plate - Replacement part? [Re: musicNow]
Eric Gloo Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/28/01
Posts: 1251
Loc: Richfield Springs, New York
I suggest ordering quite a few of the replacement butt plates, if not an entire set. The quality from one to the next is VERY inconsistent. They tend to be too thick, and the screw holes are often drilled off-center, which will throw off hammer alignment. The replacement screws can also be too long, and if not shortened, will be hit by the hammer butt upon installation. Sometimes, you can use the original screw in the replacement butt plate.

If one has broken, you should check to see if others are ready to break. One quick test is to push each hammer and shank toward the strings with your fingers. Let the shank fall back to the hammer rest rail. Listen for any that sound different from the others. You'll hear a rattle if the butt plate is starting to crack.
_________________________
Eric Gloo
Piano Technician
Certified Dampp-Chaser Installer
Richfield Springs, New York

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#2306405 - 07/24/14 10:33 AM Re: Broken Butt Plate - Replacement part? [Re: Eric Gloo]
BDB Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 21660
Loc: Oakland
Ones that are ready to crack will crack when the screws are tightened.
_________________________
Semipro Tech

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#2306589 - 07/24/14 04:29 PM Re: Broken Butt Plate - Replacement part? [Re: musicNow]
musicNow Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/22/13
Posts: 129
Loc: San Francisco, Bay Area
Thanks to all for comments and suggestions.

I found this particularly interesting:

If one has broken, you should check to see if others are ready to break. One quick test is to push each hammer and shank toward the strings with your fingers. Let the shank fall back to the hammer rest rail. Listen for any that sound different from the others. You'll hear a rattle if the butt plate is starting to crack.

Perhaps naively on my part, I have gone through them all and tightened the loose screws. I still have a small number of hammers that return with a small rattle. I will double check those. I'm guessing the rattle could be from other causes, but this is good clue, one that is not easy to see with the naked eye. The piano re-builder that has helped me suggested closing up the case and see if it still bothered me. It hurts my ears.

Thanks,

- Rick
_________________________
Learning to play the piano and tweaking my 1907 Ivers Pond upright.

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#2306952 - 07/25/14 11:57 AM Re: Broken Butt Plate - Replacement part? [Re: musicNow]
Craig Hair Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 06/03/11
Posts: 191
Loc: Holyoke, MA
MusicNow,

I have a good number of the original clips. If you want to PM me, I can send you what you need. This would justify the time I spent gathering them in the first place.

Be well,
Craig
_________________________
Craig Hair
Hampshire Piano
Holyoke, MA

hampshirepiano.co
soundboardrecrown.com

Either do something worth the writing,
or write something worth the reading.
S. Clemens

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#2307038 - 07/25/14 03:25 PM Re: Broken Butt Plate - Replacement part? [Re: Craig Hair]
musicNow Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/22/13
Posts: 129
Loc: San Francisco, Bay Area
PM sent.

- Thank you Craig.
_________________________
Learning to play the piano and tweaking my 1907 Ivers Pond upright.

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#2307568 - 07/26/14 10:56 PM Re: Broken Butt Plate - Replacement part? [Re: musicNow]
Chuck Behm Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/12/10
Posts: 700
Loc: Boone, Iowa, USA

Rick - I don't know if you need any general information about brass rail work, but if you haven't read it already, this article might be useful to you: Brass Rail Repair. Good luck with your project. Chuck Behm
_________________________
Tuner/Technician/Rebuilder/Technical Writer
www.pianopromoproductions.com
515-212-9220

"The act of destruction is infinitely easier than the act of creation" - Arthur C. Clarke

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#2307995 - 07/28/14 02:19 AM Re: Broken Butt Plate - Replacement part? [Re: musicNow]
musicNow Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/22/13
Posts: 129
Loc: San Francisco, Bay Area
Thanks Chuck. I always enjoy reading your articles. Lot's of photos in this one; easy to follow and understand.

- Rick
_________________________
Learning to play the piano and tweaking my 1907 Ivers Pond upright.

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#2308576 - 07/29/14 03:37 PM Re: Broken Butt Plate - Replacement part? [Re: musicNow]
Frank Pinn Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/21/10
Posts: 17
Loc: Lake Zurich, IL
Eric just to let you know, there was a problem in the past with the butt plate holes not being centered as you mentioned but the most recent shipments have addressed that problem.

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#2308857 - 07/30/14 08:14 AM Re: Broken Butt Plate - Replacement part? [Re: musicNow]
Craig Hair Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 06/03/11
Posts: 191
Loc: Holyoke, MA
MusicNow,

In the mail.

Craig
_________________________
Craig Hair
Hampshire Piano
Holyoke, MA

hampshirepiano.co
soundboardrecrown.com

Either do something worth the writing,
or write something worth the reading.
S. Clemens

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#2311149 - 08/04/14 07:16 PM Re: Broken Butt Plate - Replacement part? [Re: musicNow]
musicNow Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/22/13
Posts: 129
Loc: San Francisco, Bay Area
Craig,

Many thanks, Butt Plates received (letter sent to Festival of Arts)! As predicted another plate broke while tightening. Everything back in place. Half way done with a pitch raise - broke another bass string, but a nice bright sound overall...

- Rick
_________________________
Learning to play the piano and tweaking my 1907 Ivers Pond upright.

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#2313266 - 08/09/14 03:13 AM Re: Broken Butt Plate - Replacement part? [Re: musicNow]
Mark Cerisano, RPT Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/24/10
Posts: 1394
Loc: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
I have harvested a bunch of old butt plates from an old piano.

1. New ones are expensive.
2. You can't use the original screw with the new ones.
3. The new ones often need to be filed narrower.

Yes, some may be weakened from age, but they can be inspected with a magnifying glass for cracks, and can be stress tested to see if they break. If they don't, we're good to go.

BTW, they are so many parts on old pianos that are good for recycling. Anyone know of a site that resells these old parts?
_________________________
Mark Cerisano, RPT
www.howtotunepianos.com

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