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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,756
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The FP-4 has the Roland PHA alpha II keyboard, I believe, so I think you can get a lot better than that either for gigging or practice. In fact, though I'm generally a Roland fan, I'd have to say that that keyboard - PHA alpha II - is one of the worst I've ever tried - much worse than Yamaha GHS, for example, which itself is not generally highly rated, to say the least. Roland replaced that with Ivory Feel-G which is slightly strange but much better than PHA alpla II.
On the other hand, PHAII and III are very nice responsive actions - their new PHA IV is slightly softer bottoming out and maybe heavier.
Kawai's new actions, especially GF are very good indeed, with wooden parts and long lever to pivot distances.
Roland HP 302 / Samson Graphite 49 / Akai EWI
Reaper / Native Instruments K9 ult / ESQL MOR2 Symph Orchestra & Choirs / Lucato & Parravicini , trumpets & saxes / Garritan CFX lite / Production Voices C7 & Steinway D compact
Focusrite Saffire 24 / W7, i7 4770, 16GB / MXL V67g / Yamaha HS7s / HD598
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,746
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I played a grand briefly (before the shop assistant yanked me off)... Must have been in one of those Australian adult piano shops I keep hearing about. Sounds like the main plot point of a new screenplay.
- Schimmel Upright
- Kawai VPC-1 with Pianoteq
Any issues or concerns are piped to /dev/null
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Joined: Nov 2007
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Talking touch or feel, not the sound,** for classical piano purposes only, there's much better out there than my old Roland FP-4???
**(I use vsts for sound.) I owned a FP4 and loved the action for gigging. I would not practice classical on it if you eventually want to play those pieces on an acoustic. They are quite different. So Kawai GF keyboards would be a plausible trade up, I guess? (I play acoustic, but need something portable when I'm not at home.)
Last edited by johnlewisgrant; 07/24/14 06:43 PM.
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Joined: Sep 2011
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Kawai GF would only be remotely what you'd call portable in a stage piano. Fortunately, they do put it in their top of the range stage piano, the MP11 (32 kilos, though!).
But it'd be worth trying Roland RD800 , Kawai MP7 and Yamaha CP4, (all around the 20 kilo mark). Also there's the the Kawai VPC1 if you are running VST rather than relying on the piano's own sound engine. This is much cheaper and has a good keyboard (but not GF, and not much lighter at almost 30 kilos)
Roland HP 302 / Samson Graphite 49 / Akai EWI
Reaper / Native Instruments K9 ult / ESQL MOR2 Symph Orchestra & Choirs / Lucato & Parravicini , trumpets & saxes / Garritan CFX lite / Production Voices C7 & Steinway D compact
Focusrite Saffire 24 / W7, i7 4770, 16GB / MXL V67g / Yamaha HS7s / HD598
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,231
1000 Post Club Member
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1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,231 |
Kawai GF would only be remotely what you'd call portable in a stage piano. Fortunately, they do put it in their top of the range stage piano, the MP11 (32 kilos, though!).
But it'd be worth trying Roland RD800 , Kawai MP7 and Yamaha CP4, (all around the 20 kilo mark). Also there's the the Kawai VPC1 if you are running VST rather than relying on the piano's own sound engine. This is much cheaper and has a good keyboard (but not GF, and not much lighter at almost 30 kilos) Thanks. That's very useful info. I wouldn't be moving the keyboard that often. 32 kilos is doable.
Last edited by johnlewisgrant; 07/24/14 10:17 PM.
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Joined: Jun 2014
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A salesman told me that 97% of concert halls in the US have steinway grands. That tells me that if you don't have a steinway in your house for practice you may as well hang it up and call it quits because there's no way you're playing a *real* piano if it's not a steinway. :-p
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Joined: Jun 2013
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Steinways are great; however, the competition is giving them a run for their money. Take the new Yamaha CFX for example, by all means a worthy contender to the Steinway D. Also, Steinway dominates the concert-hall market, but not so much the consumer market. Why haven't they built a silent piano yet? Sure you can retro-fit a silent system into any Steinway, but it's not the same as a factory designed/built system. with retro-fitted systems the touch/playability is affected when the silent system is engaged. Yamaha took care of that many years ago with a thing called QuickEscape. Steinway is no longer king of the hill. The whole hand-made-thingy is getting a little long in the tooth; they need to catch up with the times.
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Reading this IMO demonstrates that DP's don't prepare you for a real grand. I have an AG, and last time I played a beautiful grand in a store I was playing too much sustain pedal. I'm sure I did this cause AG pedal samples really gives the instrument a more real sound, but on the grand it's overkill. After about 10 minutes I had adjusted. If I had space, I love to own a grand. OTOH you could say how well they prepare you: you can adjust to a "real grand" in just 10 minutes! Whatever piano you play in practice, you're going to have to make adjustments on a new piano.
Kawai CA95 / Steinberg UR22 / Sony MDR-7506 / Pianoteq Stage + Grotrian, Bluethner / Galaxy Vintage D / CFX Lite In the loft: Roland FP3 / Tannoy Reveal Active / K&M 18810
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Joined: Dec 2013
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Steinways are great; however, the competition is giving them a run for their money. Take the new Yamaha CFX for example, by all means a worthy contender to the Steinway D. Also, Steinway dominates the concert-hall market, but not so much the consumer market. Why haven't they built a silent piano yet? Sure you can retro-fit a silent system into any Steinway, but it's not the same as a factory designed/built system. with retro-fitted systems the touch/playability is affected when the silent system is engaged. Yamaha took care of that many years ago with a thing called QuickEscape. Steinway is no longer king of the hill. The whole hand-made-thingy is getting a little long in the tooth; they need to catch up with the times. Prep is everything in the acoustic world. Some pianos are pretty great "out of the box". Let a competent tech loose on them and they become a truly amazing instrument. I played a Steinway Model B in Calgary a little while back that took over my place as the best piano I've ever played. There was a 7' Bechstein and a 7+ foot August Forster competing in my mind for the best before that. Luckily, the Roland digital are on sales floors next to some of the best grands out there, so I get to try MANY awesome pianos. Some fall flat because of the lack of prep, and some well prepped piano don't "Speak to me". Hand-made still has caché with consumers, but an educated and experienced player knows to look past specs and go with the instrument that speaks to them. I find that the transition from Digital to grand for a decent player with good technique is getting easier all the time as sound engines and actions improve. Jay
Industry Consultant
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That's true; prep is essential. In terms of 'hand made,' yes, it's more of a romantic rather than pragmatic approach. Automation works better for many aspects of the piano-building process. Of course, some crucial steps are better accomplished by hand. Yamaha has taken this combined approach, and the results have been fine. I believe Steinway does implement some automation; however, I don't think they're using state of the art machinery; they're probably still using the same equipment/machinery originally used by Mr. Steinway himself.
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Joined: Jun 2014
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CNC machines do wonders for manufacturing complex things like acoustic piano parts, etc.
For solid body electric instruments like electric guitars and basses the quality and consistency of low end instruments has dramatically improved. People are saying we're in a golden age for quality inexpensive musical instruments in general.
So what's missing with the cheap instruments? Quality of materials used and a lot of finishing touches and some quality control.
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Joined: Nov 2007
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We've become so acclimatized to the Steinway D sound, both German and American, recorded and in performance, that our ears may not always like hearing something different (whether it is better or worse, such things being in the end quite "subjective" or a matter of "taste".
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Piano
by Gino2 - 04/17/24 02:34 PM
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Piano
by Gino2 - 04/17/24 02:23 PM
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