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I don't see Kawai James trying to do anything but back what has been already been stated well by PianoBear and Morodiene.

Last edited by petes1; 08/27/14 10:03 AM.

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Originally Posted by Digital Piano
Thank you, James, for this piece of advice. I am already enjoying my new piano.

The point of this post was simply to share my experience with Kawai DP and the USA technical team (not to fix my problem).

BTW, I understand what you are trying to do, but just saying "there is another side to the story" is not much of an explanation.
Why do you assume that since he works for Kawai in Japan that he knows the details of conversations that happened elsewhere in the world?


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Originally Posted by Digital Piano
Thank you, James, for this piece of advice. I am already enjoying my new piano.


That's good. I am glad we have a positive conclusion to this thread.

Kind regards,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
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Simply because he wrote that he "raised this matter with a colleague at Kawai America."

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BTW, I understand what you are trying to do, but just saying "there is another side to the story" is not much of an explanation.


Originally Posted by Digital Piano
Simply because he wrote that he "raised this matter with a colleague at Kawai America."


I don't think he was trying to explain anything to you or anyone. To his credit, he had no obligation to research this and did on your behalf anyways. All that we can tell for sure is that you are dissatisfied, and Kawai feels they've done the best they could in this circumstance. James has decided not to drag this out by "trying to explain" what perhaps has already been attempted many times by Kawai america. He's simply stating there is another side to this, whether or not you acknowledge it.

You came to this forum and your first post is to complain about their instrument and about customer service - not in attempts to find a solution or contribute anything to this forum, but simply to complain and make it public for whatever purpose. You've accomplished what you set out to do, so what good would an explanation do at this point?

FWIW, I have gone to my piano several times throughout reading this thread and listened to that note on headphones, and for the life of me I cannot hear any problems.


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Originally Posted by Morodiene
FWIW, I have gone to my piano several times throughout reading this thread and listened to that note on headphones, and for the life of me I cannot hear any problems.


My initial post is about defective piano notes in Kawai CL26 and CS4 units, not MP11.

Last edited by Digital Piano; 08/27/14 10:41 AM.
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I don't find anything wrong with 'digitalpiano' s posts. Complaining about a company's perceived customer service on social media is fine these days. A company usually can defend itself or respond appropriately. The edgy but mild indirect criticisms of digitalpiano in a couple of responses are unwarranted IMHO.

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Morodiene, the point of my post was simply to share with the online community my personal experience with two specific kawai digital pianos (CL 26 and CS4) as well as with USA customer service. I do not see, as spanishbuddha states, anything wrong with simply sharing information (and facts) in a forum. Apparently, sharing negative facts about Kawai does not please everybody.

By suggesting that I have a hidden purpose, and calling me a 'complainer,' you are simply trying to place doubt on the truthfulness of my claims. This is clearly an attempt to hijack my initial post and hide my criticism against Kawai under a pile of personal attacks.

Similarly, Kawai James's posts, by claiming (without giving any facts) that there is another side to the story, portrays Kawai as a company without reproach. This is clearly another hollow attempt to hijack my initial post and negate my negative experience with Kawai.

Last edited by Digital Piano; 08/27/14 05:13 PM.
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Originally Posted by spanishbuddha
I don't find anything wrong with 'digitalpiano' s posts. Complaining about a company's perceived customer service on social media is fine these days. A company usually can defend itself or respond appropriately. The edgy but mild indirect criticisms of digitalpiano in a couple of responses are unwarranted IMHO.


I don't find anything wrong with Digital Piano's posts, either, but I regret to say I don't find them very interesting. He or she is a brand-new member whose introduction to the forums has been an after-the-fact description of a 10-month-long dispute with Kawai USA customer service.

Here's my problem: I don't really have any basis on which to form an opinion about the defects Digital Piano perceives in the sound of F6 on that particular instrument, or about Kawai's responses.

What are we supposed to learn from this thread? That there are two sides to every story is so true it's a cliche. But I personally am just not that interested in hearing the gory details of a single customer's 10-month customer service odyssey with any manufacturer (from either party to the process!).

I'm cool with forum members asking for advice, or for troubleshooting assistance, or even complaining about customer service issues while they are in progress. I think discussions like these can be interesting, not least because they offer the possibility that forum members can actually be helpful in their resolution.

In this particular case, though, the OP's initial posts strike me as having been made for the main purpose of venting his/her displeasure with Kawai. That's OK with me as far as it goes. But may I say that I also hope the OP will stick around the forum and become involved in some more useful and/or interesting discussions?

I'm going to shut up and go practice now.

Kind regards,
Ben

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Originally Posted by slowtraveler
Originally Posted by spanishbuddha
I don't find anything wrong with 'digitalpiano' s posts. Complaining about a company's perceived customer service on social media is fine these days. A company usually can defend itself or respond appropriately. The edgy but mild indirect criticisms of digitalpiano in a couple of responses are unwarranted IMHO.


I don't find anything wrong with Digital Piano's posts, either, but I regret to say I don't find them very interesting. He or she is a brand-new member whose introduction to the forums has been an after-the-fact description of a 10-month-long dispute with Kawai USA customer service.

Here's my problem: I don't really have any basis on which to form an opinion about the defects Digital Piano perceives in the sound of F6 on that particular instrument, or about Kawai's responses.

What are we supposed to learn from this thread? That there are two sides to every story is so true it's a cliche. But I personally am just not that interested in hearing the gory details of a single customer's 10-month customer service odyssey with any manufacturer (from either party to the process!).

I'm cool with forum members asking for advice, or for troubleshooting assistance, or even complaining about customer service issues while they are in progress. I think discussions like these can be interesting, not least because they offer the possibility that forum members can actually be helpful in their resolution.

In this particular case, though, the OP's initial posts strike me as having been made for the main purpose of venting his/her displeasure with Kawai. That's OK with me as far as it goes. But may I say that I also hope the OP will stick around the forum and become involved in some more useful and/or interesting discussions?

I'm going to shut up and go practice now.

Kind regards,
Ben
Thank you, Ben. I agree. This is not a review site, and while I'm fine with people talking about their issues, I would hope it would be for some benefit to those who read this forum. It would be nice if Digital Piano participated on this forum in the future. Forums are made not by those affected by PADS (post-and-disappear syndrome), but by people who invest their time, knowledge, questions, and hopefully answers to assist other members.


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I found the post useful, as it is an indication that other brands/models have warts too. It reaffirms the correctness of my decision to keep my FP-50 even tho I find the hard knock annoying every so often. But I certainly understand how something that is unnoticeable to others can be irritating to a person if that person just happen to be sensitive to that sound. This is not a case of being too picky, it is just the variation between peoples native sensitivities. I really can't sense much in the differences in piano sounds, with a few exceptions, and I am not very sensitive to variations in keyboard touch. But the hard knock that grates on me every so often just triggers some kind of pain in my brain, sort of like finger nails on a chalk board.

For me, when the hard knock gets to be too annoying, it will spur me to finally get the Surface 3 and pianoteq. I trust that the modeled pianos will NOT have any of the numerous possible odd piano flaws, things that a discriminating piano owner would have had their piano technician fix.


Cynthia

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Originally Posted by Tuneless
I found the post useful, as it is an indication that other brands/models have warts too. It reaffirms the correctness of my decision to keep my FP-50 even tho I find the hard knock annoying every so often. But I certainly understand how something that is unnoticeable to others can be irritating to a person if that person just happen to be sensitive to that sound.

I see your point. No less than acoustic pianos, DPs have quirks, too (whether originating in the sample set, the tone generator, the analog electronics, or wherever), as a couple of other posters in this thread have rightly said. People have to decide for themselves whether these things are tolerable or not. No point in making yourself miserable over something that bugs you every time you sit down at the keyboard.

The claim that a given peculiarity constitutes a material defect requiring a remedy under warranty is a somewhat different thing, though. To have merit, such claims must meet a higher standard than annoyance.

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Originally Posted by Tuneless

. . .
For me, when the hard knock gets to be too annoying, it will spur me to finally get the Surface 3 and pianoteq. I trust that the modeled pianos will NOT have any of the numerous possible odd piano flaws, things that a discriminating piano owner would have had their piano technician fix.


Ah -- we have a comedian! <g>

. Charles

PS -- you should follow the discussion on the Pianoteq user forum, in which Rachael Jimenez has been note-by-note editing one of the "stock" pianos, to get better sound.


. Charles
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Yep, have been, but changes are possible. My FP-50 doesn't have much change possible. None that are useful anyway.


Cynthia

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Morodiene (and Ben), this may not be a 'review' site, but I see plenty of people voicing their opinions on specific pianos and making recommendations. I do not see anything wrong with that.

When I was shopping for a digital piano (looking at various websites, including this very forum site), I wish I had come across a post like the original post of this thread. IF you are looking for one, THIS is the reason why I decided to publish my experience with Kawai digital pianos.

Last edited by Digital Piano; 08/28/14 01:15 PM.
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Originally Posted by Tuneless
I found the post useful, as it is an indication that other brands/models have warts too.


That's make me a happy man smile

Last edited by Digital Piano; 08/28/14 12:32 PM.
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Digital Piano
What piano did you end up with?


All these years playing and I still consider myself a novice.
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(grey market) Yamaha U1 grin

I love it! Yet I find the keys a bit heavy (compared to the digital kawai). I see my U1 as a beast I must learn to tame, while the Kawai CL26 was already... domesticated. If that makes any sense...

Last edited by Digital Piano; 08/28/14 03:52 PM.
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Originally Posted by Digital Piano
(grey market) Yamaha U1 grin

I love it! Yet I find the keys a bit heavy (compared to the digital kawai). I see my U1 as a beast I must learn to tame, while the Kawai CL26 was already... domesticated. If that makes any sense...

Yup, I find most uprights to be like that. Practising on a digital, just does not prepare you for that.

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And I find the bass quite loud on the U1. The bass on the digital kawai (and most digital I think) was soft and would never overwhelm the melody (I did not use a subwoofer). With the U1, the bass drowns the melody easily.

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