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#2321154 - 08/28/14 02:18 PM Trying out Pianoteq and Have Sound Card Question
Ra Ed Offline

Silver Supporter until Jan 01 2013


Registered: 08/31/11
Posts: 17
I'm testing out Pianoteq and am currently using the internal original laptop soundcard. I downloaded ASIO4ALL and am able to get the system to work after I disable all but the "Independent Dual Headphones" and then reboot the PC. The problem is when I use the computer for any other application or Web browsing, the Pianoteq software makes no sound and I have to repeat the process of disabling other sound outputs and rebooting. I realize that the problem is most likely due to the fact that ASIO4ALL will only work with one program exclusively.
If I buy an external audio interface such as the R22 which has it's own ASIO drivers, will that allow me to somehow assign the onboard card to other applications and use the R22 for Pianoteq and eliminate the need to reboot when moving from say web browsing to Pianoteq and back?
Thanks in advance for sharing your knowledge

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#2321166 - 08/28/14 02:47 PM Re: Trying out Pianoteq and Have Sound Card Question [Re: Ra Ed]
Garf Online   content
Junior Member

Registered: 08/27/14
Posts: 7
IIRC that should work if you set the onboard card as the Windows default and then tell PianoTeq to to use the other one.

If you use DirectShow then you won't have this issue, but latency might be worse than with ASIO.


Edited by Garf (08/28/14 02:47 PM)

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#2321203 - 08/28/14 04:51 PM Re: Trying out Pianoteq and Have Sound Card Question [Re: Ra Ed]
lolatu Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/01/13
Posts: 440
Loc: UK
Originally Posted By: Ra Ed
If I buy an external audio interface such as the R22 which has it's own ASIO drivers, will that allow me to somehow assign the onboard card to other applications and use the R22 for Pianoteq and eliminate the need to reboot when moving from say web browsing to Pianoteq and back?

Yes exactly - you have two "audio busses", and applications let you choose which one to use. There are also programs like Soundswitch which let you easily (through a keyboard shortcut) switch the default one that Windows programs such as Media Player will use. And you can use both at once.

Also the UR22 comes with Cubase AI DAW software, which is actually pretty good. I've also tried Reaper briefly, but I had problems with the timing / latency. Cubase is much slicker, and I found it more user friendly.
_________________________
Kawai CA95 / Roland FP3 / Pianoteq Stage / Tannoy Reveal Active / Sony MDR-7506 / Steinberg UR22 / K&M 18810

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#2321213 - 08/28/14 05:15 PM Re: Trying out Pianoteq and Have Sound Card Question [Re: Ra Ed]
dmd Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/15/09
Posts: 1841
Loc: Pennsylvania
Originally Posted By: Ra Ed
If I buy an external audio interface such as the R22 which has it's own ASIO drivers, will that allow me to somehow assign the onboard card to other applications and use the R22 for Pianoteq and eliminate the need to reboot when moving from say web browsing to Pianoteq and back?


Absolutely.

That is exactly how it works.

I know nothing about R22 but I know it works for Focusrite Scarlett 2i4 (or 2i2) audio interfaces, which come with their own ASIO driver.
_________________________
Don

Current: ES7, Focusrite Scarlett 2i4 audio device, SennHeiser HD555 Phones, Focal CMS 40 Powered Monitors, Ravenscroft275, Ivory II American Concert D

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#2321226 - 08/28/14 05:55 PM Re: Trying out Pianoteq and Have Sound Card Question [Re: Ra Ed]
Charles Cohen Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/26/12
Posts: 1269
Loc: Richmond, BC, Canada
Originally Posted By: Ra Ed
. . . The problem is when I use the computer for any other application or Web browsing, the Pianoteq software makes no sound and I have to repeat the process of disabling other sound outputs and rebooting. I realize that the problem is most likely due to the fact that ASIO4ALL will only work with one program exclusively. . . .


Using Windows 8 on a laptop, I found that if I exit from (that is, stop) Pianoteq, the ASIO4ALL driver kills itself, and leaves the soundcard available to other applications.

When I re-start Pianoteq, it's in the same state it was when I stopped it.

So with one soundcard, I can be running Pianoteq, or listening to a Youtube video -- but not both at the same time.

. Charles

PS -- with a second soundcard, other applications seem to default to the second Soundcard when Pianoteq and ASIO4ALL are using the built-in soundcard.

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#2321267 - 08/28/14 08:08 PM Re: Trying out Pianoteq and Have Sound Card Question [Re: Ra Ed]
Ra Ed Offline

Silver Supporter until Jan 01 2013


Registered: 08/31/11
Posts: 17
I'm still using Window's vista SPC2 and am avoiding upgrading simple because I don't like or understand Windows 8. Whenever I have to help my mother in law with her Window's 8 pc, I have to google ever move on my phone just to get around.
In Vista, even when I let the PC go to sleep, it will loose it's ability to make sound

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#2321290 - 08/28/14 09:18 PM Re: Trying out Pianoteq and Have Sound Card Question [Re: Ra Ed]
Charles Cohen Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/26/12
Posts: 1269
Loc: Richmond, BC, Canada
Vista -- as I remember -- was an _awful_ O/S.

Windows 7, though, was stable (it didn't crash often) and seemed to run every program I threw at it. I was _very_ happy with it. I am running Windows 8 with a Windows 7 interface -- ClassicShell -- which shields me from lots of bad (=different) stuff in Windows 8.

I don't know if an upgrade from Vista to W7 is still possible, but it might help your problem.

. Charles

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#2323287 - Yesterday at 05:52 PM Re: Trying out Pianoteq and Have Sound Card Question [Re: Ra Ed]
Ra Ed Offline

Silver Supporter until Jan 01 2013


Registered: 08/31/11
Posts: 17
Oh well, this has turned out to be a tremendous waste of time. Got the Steinberg UR22, installed and sound constantly "dropped out". Installed, uninstalled, deactivated internal sound device, reboot, reboot, reboot. Adjust buffer size, sample rate, etc, etc., etc. Still dropping sound. Thought it might be my PC so I tried installing on wifes windows 7 computer and got no sound whatsoever! Guess I'll send it back and give up on Pianoteq.

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#2323308 - Yesterday at 06:59 PM Re: Trying out Pianoteq and Have Sound Card Question [Re: Ra Ed]
lolatu Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/01/13
Posts: 440
Loc: UK
By "dropping sound", do you mean you're getting audio glitches? Can you describe it some more? I had a problem where I was getting glitches exactly every minute, but it was a problem with my wireless card driver and went away after I updated that.

As for why it doesn't work with your wife's computer, I don't know. I take it you've consulted the Troubleshooting section of the manual. It's unlikely there's something wrong with the interface hardware, though possible. If you think that's the case, get a replacement unit, rather than giving up.
_________________________
Kawai CA95 / Roland FP3 / Pianoteq Stage / Tannoy Reveal Active / Sony MDR-7506 / Steinberg UR22 / K&M 18810

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#2323317 - Yesterday at 07:24 PM Re: Trying out Pianoteq and Have Sound Card Question [Re: Ra Ed]
Alexander Borro Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/18/14
Posts: 21
Loc: UK
There may be a firmware update you need to apply ? in any case check for updates for both firmware and driver. If you used the DVD shipped with it may well be out of date.

http://www.steinberg.net/index.php?id=downloads_ur22&L=1

Try another USB port, for example my tascam does not like USB 3 ports on my ASUS motherboard, often stalling, but a USB 2 port is fine.

Failing that try asio4all driver. I also tried the painoteq demo, it did not get on with the shipped tascam driver so well that came with my audio interface, but worked perfectly well asio4all.

Also if you are using an instrument with USB connectivity connected to the same USB BUS that may cause issues, or for that matter anything device that takes power over USB connected to the same BUS as the audio interface.

Another issue may be the config of your PC. speedstep and power saving are not desirable, at least to rule out the issue are you sure the laptop runs at a fixed frequency ?


Edited by Alexander Borro (Yesterday at 07:27 PM)

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#2323323 - Yesterday at 08:03 PM Re: Trying out Pianoteq and Have Sound Card Question [Re: Alexander Borro]
Charles Cohen Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/26/12
Posts: 1269
Loc: Richmond, BC, Canada
Let's see . . .

1. All "power-saving" should be turned off, and the "power management" setting needs to be "High performance".

2. You should be using an ASIO driver -- either supplied by the maker, or else ASIO4ALL.

3. The networking adapter(s) (wired and wireless) should be _disabled_. THat's different from "disconnecting" from your network.

4. Just for a laugh, go into the Control Panel and set "System Sounds" to "no sounds".

That should be a good start . . .

. Charles

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#2323337 - Yesterday at 08:46 PM Re: Trying out Pianoteq and Have Sound Card Question [Re: Ra Ed]
Ra Ed Offline

Silver Supporter until Jan 01 2013


Registered: 08/31/11
Posts: 17
Thanks for the responses. Let me try and answer some of the questions posted.
By sound "dropping" I mean that I can play a few notes that come thru just fine and then suddenly nothing for a couple of seconds, then sound will resume. These drops are not are frequent,as in every few seconds, but are not regularly timed such as every 5 seconds or such. Timing is erratic.
Tried troubleshooting ideas in the manual as best as possible with no improvement.
Tried various USB ports, with no improvement.
Asio4all driver did work on the original install using the internal sound card but conflicts with other programs were the reason for purchase of UR22. See original post for a better explanation.
I've tried connecting keyboard directly to UR22 via Midi and also connecting it via midi to usb cable directly to a different usb port on pc with no improvement.
PC has been set to high performance.
I'm not sure how to determine if "laptop runs at a fixed frequency".
I checked for an updated driver= no improvement.
" The networking adapter(s) (wired and wireless) should be _disabled_. THat's different from "disconnecting" from your network." I guess I can go to device manager and disable but will this require reboots to and fro using Pianoteq. If so, then even if this solves the UR22 problem, I'm no better off than I was before using ASIO4all and original internal card.
I'll certainly give "no sounds" a try.
Thanks in advance for you folks trying to help. Your input is appreciated.

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#2323350 - Yesterday at 09:23 PM Re: Trying out Pianoteq and Have Sound Cjard Question [Re: Ra Ed]
Ra Ed Offline

Silver Supporter until Jan 01 2013


Registered: 08/31/11
Posts: 17
Just tried disabling all network drivers and double checking the power settings to high performance and set "no sound" to windows sound. No improvement.
The ur22 control panel shows the processor activity on a moving graph and the graph STOPS MOVING periodically which corresponds with the drops in sound. I don't detect any other such "stop" when dealing with the pc.

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#2323372 - Yesterday at 09:48 PM Re: Trying out Pianoteq and Have Sound Cjard Question [Re: Ra Ed]
lolatu Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/01/13
Posts: 440
Loc: UK
Asio4all didn't work with UR22 for me - need to use the supplied or downloaded Yamaha drivers.

Quote:
" The networking adapter(s) (wired and wireless) should be _disabled_. THat's different from "disconnecting" from your network." I guess I can go to device manager and disable but will this require reboots to and fro using Pianoteq. If so, then even if this solves the UR22 problem, I'm no better off than I was before using ASIO4all and original internal card.

I think Charles meant just to do this as a troubleshooting measure, rather than every time you use the interface. In Windows 7 it's certainly possible to disable a network device without rebooting. Don't know about Vista.

Quote:
The ur22 control panel shows the processor activity on a moving graph and the graph STOPS MOVING periodically which corresponds with the drops in sound.

You mean the driver control panel, with title "Yamaha Steinberg USB Driver"? There's no graph in mine, nor in the pictures in the manual. Do you mean in Pianoteq Perf tab, or in the Windows Task Manager?

On the Amazon UK site, someone says "I use it on vista business and it's an absolute beast." However one reviewer says it doesn't work on Vista for him. Also on the Yamaha driver site it says "(*) Steinberg UR22 does not support Windows Vista SP2(32-bit/64-bit).". And on the Steinberg site it doesn't list Vista as supported. So it looks like the interface won't work with Vista. Seems like a good excuse to upgrade! Get yourself an SSD at the same time and install to that. They're cheap and it'll make a huge difference to your experience.
_________________________
Kawai CA95 / Roland FP3 / Pianoteq Stage / Tannoy Reveal Active / Sony MDR-7506 / Steinberg UR22 / K&M 18810

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#2323387 - Yesterday at 10:14 PM Re: Trying out Pianoteq and Have Sound Cjard Question [Re: lolatu]
Ra Ed Offline

Silver Supporter until Jan 01 2013


Registered: 08/31/11
Posts: 17
Quote:
The ur22 control panel shows the processor activity on a moving graph and the graph STOPS MOVING periodically which corresponds with the drops in sound.

You mean the driver control panel, with title "Yamaha Steinberg USB Driver"? There's no graph in mine, nor in the pictures in the manual. Do you mean in Pianoteq Perf tab, or in the Windows Task Manager?
My mistake, the graph is actually in Pianoteq Perf tab.

"Also on the Yamaha driver site it says "(*) Steinberg UR22 does not support Windows Vista SP2(32-bit/64-bit).". And on the Steinberg site it doesn't list Vista as supported."

That's confusing as I found the Steinberg USB driver 1.73 which is listed for Windows XP, Vista, 7, &8, on the Steinberg sight.

Has anyone had to uninstall ASIO4all driver to eliminate some sort of conflict?

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#2323477 - 25 minutes 2 seconds ago Re: Trying out Pianoteq and Have Sound Cjard Question [Re: Ra Ed]
dire tonic Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/17/11
Posts: 1248
Loc: uk south
There's no need to uninstall A4all, the hardware can only use one driver so any others are effectively invisible anyway.

I can understand not wanting to replace an OS you're familiar with but at any cost I would ditch Vista which, it seems to me, was an intermediate throw-away, a bit like Millenium was a dress rehearsal for XP. Could you get hold of win 7?

I'm using the UR22 myself and like it a lot but if you wanted to save some money and can get a refund on the UR22 I recommend the cheap Behringer uca222* which will circumvent the A4all 'unique' stream problem while narrowing down the culprit for your current drop-out problem; if you still have it with another interface it's more likely to be Vista that's playing up.

* the behringer has no midi-in if that matters to you - is it possible your missing notes problem is midi-related?

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