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Hello all, this is my first post here on Pianoworld and any insight/opinions would be appreciated.
I am currently in the market for a new digital, my old Casio Privia PX-400R just isn't cutting it anymore, and would like some outside input.

My budget is about $1700 but would be willing to go a bit over for something that i really like. As of right now, I have narrowed the selection down to three main choices. The Roland F130R, Kawai MP6, or Kawai CE220.

I have been able to try out the Roland F130R, some Yamahas, and a Kawai CN34 and ES7 fairly recently. The most important thing for me is the action. I ruled out the Yamahas simply because I don't like them. The GHS seems weak and flimsy and the GH seems too heavy at the top and relatively light towards the bottom, which is just weird. The RH2 action i tried from Kawai was probably my favorite but nothing with that action is within my price range. The Roland action I didn't like as much as the Kawai, I definitely understand people's complaints about it being too squishy, but I did like it fairly well, the Roland pianos seem to really respond well to the action even if by itself the action isn't my favorite. I've put some information and thoughts about my various options below.

Kawai MP6 - $1199 to $1699 - http://www.kraftmusic.com/kawai-mp6-professional-stage-piano-complete-studio-bundle.html
If I decide on the MP6 I will most likely be purchasing the bundle deal from Kraft that i posted above, however, I do have some questions about it. First, how similar is the older RH action to the newer RH2? I know that RH2 adds a third sensor but how likely am I to miss it? Second, how good are the accessories there? I really don't want a wobbly stand or junk speakers so any input as to the quality of these things would be most helpful. Lastly, how is the piano sound technology compared to my other options? Is there string/damper resonance, is the pedal continuous, what aspects of the piano sound can i change, etc.?

Roland F130R - $1300 - http://www.kraftmusic.com/roland-f-...-digital-piano-complete-home-bundle.html
Not too many questions here, I pretty much know what to expect from the Roland, but any insight or opinions are welcomed.

Kawai CE220 - $1699 to $1899 - http://www.kraftmusic.com/digital-pianos-and-keyboards/digital-pianos/kawai/ce220/
This is sort of my wildcard. The $1899 price tag is a bit more than I want to spend and I won't be able to try it myself but I trust Kawai enough to know that I would be getting a quality instrument and the "factory B-Stock" from Kraft (which to my knowledge is refurbished and has factory warranty) would be (I think) $1699 and definitely an option. So on to the questions: First, How is the action? I know, very subjective, but still worth asking. I REALLY like RH2 so how would it compare? Second, B-Stock have any concerns/risks that I am not aware of? Lastly, same as the MP6, how is the sound technology?

Any input is appreciated, thank you!

I've played a little on a CE220 and I thought it had a nice enough feel, but price/value-wise it gets blown out by the MP7, which you could get for $1530 (plus tax, likely) during one of Guitar Center or Musician's Friend (which is a subsidiary of the former) 15% sales. Compared to the CE220, the MP7 has Kawai's current-best onboard sound engine and a three sensor action--to me, it seems like a superior value in practically every way even if you do like the feel of the CE220's keys as much as those of the MP7 (and you may or may not; this is where personal preference comes in). Of course, depending on your usage, you may also need a stand, speakers, and a 2- or 3-pedal unit which would add to the price--but I'm not necessarily trying to sell you on the MP7 as much as I'm using the comparison to caution you against the CE220: I think it's too expensive for what it offers, even when compared against Kawai's own alternatives in the same price range.

Maybe worth noting, too--since you say you really like Kawai's RH2 action and are willing to go a bit over $1700 for something you really like--Kawai's CN24's street price is $1799, and you could probably get it for notably less than that from a brick-and-mortar dealer (maybe either with a showroom model, or perhaps you can haggle a better deal for an new, unused one, with the knowledge that Kawai Japan has already announced the updated CN25/35 models with the RH3 action).

Thanks for the input starboard, I think I'll probably cross off the CE220. I'm sure it's a fine instrument but it appears that there is better to be had for that price.
As you suggested, I contacted the nearby Kawai dealer and he's going to get back with me about a price on a CN24.
As far as the CN24, what exactly would I be giving up in comparison to the 34 and also, same as most of the others, how is the sound technology?(resonance, pedaling, etc.)

Also, if anyone has any suggestions for cheap but good quality stands or speakers for an mp6/7 it would be appreciated.

Thank you

If you can stretch to $1899 then the Roland DP90 is a good option. It has a full size action so should feel better than the F130R. I prefer this action to the CN34's.

In terms of CN24 vs CN34 - the brochure gives a side by side comparison of specs. Personally I would not buy any digital piano that has no display at all, and the CN34 has many other useful features, but it really depends on whether you'll make use of them.

When I tried the F130 at the store I had a chance to play pretty much all of Roland's newer actions and most of them seemed to be fairly similar. The DP90 is certainly nice but the keys are only minutely different from the F130, definitely not $600 different. The only Roland actions that seems any different at all from the PHA4 standard was the ivory feel, which felt pretty bad, and the pha4 concert on the 508. Most of the other actions were pretty similar.
As far as a screen goes it's not a big deal for me as I will pretty much just be using the piano sound. Would be nice to have, but I don't care enough about it to spend a couple hundred more just for that.

Edit: Looked up the DP-90, it actually has Ivory feel S, not one of Roland's full size actions. Perhaps you were thinking of the DP-90e. It has the new PHA4 Premium (which for the record is VERY similar to the standard on the F130) and retails for around $2500.

I echo Starboard's recommendation you consider the CN24. And you might look seriously at a CN34, too. It does have not only more features but should sound better with its larger speakers. And price may be VERY attractive because of those new model announcements. Another note on price: In the Prices Paid thread there's a post of mine back in March when I helped a friend buy a CN34 for $1933 plus tax from a SF Bay Area dealer. So - new models plus some negotiating with an aggressive dealer might net you a very nice price on a CN34, if you determined it was worth the premium over the CN24.

I understand your confusion. Roland choose confusing terminology, and it misleads people during important buying decisions like yours. We don't get a lot of sense from any of the marketing materials on what the differences are, and I get the impression that this is because the marketing guys don't really understand their own products. However it's not really that complicated - see my post here.

"Ivory Feel S" is the full size action, which you are confusing with "Ivory Feel G", the lightweight one. Exactly what "PHA 4 Standard" is, we don't know; it's likely it's a development of the lightweight line, although, according to a Taiwanese blog, it's possible that it may feature longer keys. The 6th row down in this chart says "Ivory Feel G" has keys that are 2 cm shorter:



I'm not sure how much credence to give to that, as it's not backed up by any other sources or official channels. I don't read Chinese either, but it's about as much we're getting out of Roland. Apparently the people buying the products don't deserve a technical explanation of what they're paying for.

I think you are wrong when you say that PHA4 Concert is significantly better, and PHA4 Premium is similar to Standard. Actually Concert and Premium are basically the same, with different trim - while other reports (1, 2) suggest Standard feels very similar to the lightweight "Ivory Feel G" action on the F120.

Some would say the Yamaha action on the CLP 585 is better than that on the 575. You can but try before you buy. . .

Not sure the Yamaha is relevant here but I get your point, and yes, I have tried the DP90 as well as most other popular digitals. In my opinion Kawai's RH2 or GF (wish me luck on that one) are the best followed by Roland's PHA 4. I really don't think the full size Roland actions are better enough than the PHA4 standard (which for the money is in my opinion Roland's best) for me to spend an extra $600 for it. If I'm going to spend that much I will get a Kawai.

You echo what I have said here before. The new PHA4 standard feels VERY good and very similar to the PHA4 Premium. Ivory Feel G and Ivory Feel S come from the last generation of actions. the Ivory Feel G is still used in a few instruments, and will be until the factory has the bandwidth to replace the instruments.

The F130R is an outstanding value. It sounds and feels great.

Jay

I have to agree with you on that Jay, while personally I do prefer the Kawai action, the F130 is incredible for the price range. In my opinion, the F130 is THE best digital for under $1500 and is pretty tempting. I do have a preference for RH2 but that would at least cost $550 more (the local dealer quoted me $1850 tax included on the CN24). I just made this post to get some more information about all my options before I make a decision.

Just wanted to update, with an offer of $1850 cash included as well as an offer to "trade-up" in the future (getting full price refund towards a newer model within two years), it looks like my decision will most likely be the CN 24. Decision isn't final yet so more info on other options is still welcome and thank you all for your input.