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We spent almost whole day today to let my son tried many pianos. Now we have three choose. Could anyone give us some suggestion? Thanks a lot!

1, Steinway Model M, 1993, $38000
2, Estonia Model 168, new, $28000
3, Shigeru Kawai Model SK-2L, new, $39000

You can't go wrong with any of those choices. Choose the one that excites you the most. If you choose the used one make sure to have it inspected by a technician before buying. Good luck.

What he said.

But I would add that if you can afford the Steinway and Shigeru you might consider the larger Estonia at around 6'4".

Those are all excellent pianos and any choice among those would be fine. It does come down to personal preference.

Price...
Of course price on a used piano is all about condition, but if the Steinway is a run of the mill, average use, 20 year old piano the price sounds a little high. If it has brand new strings, hammers, etc. that's different. However you're in Steinway model A territory at that price, and I much prefer the A. So carefully consider the condition on the Steinway.

The Steinway and the Shigeru have tonal characteristics that are widely loved. The Estonia is greatly appreciated by those who fall in love with that sound, but not everyone does. Just to be clear about my own bias, Estonia is not the piano for me. Just make sure that you love the sound before you commit to that direction.

From those three I would probably buy the Shigeru. But it's not me shopping, so pick the one that speaks to you the most and your son wants to keep playing. Keep us posted.

Each of the pianos has a distinctive voice, but with the Steinway, as it is a 21 year old used piano, you must also carefully consider its condition and have it assessed by an independent technician.

It is a fine assortment of pianos of exceptional quality. Play them to find which one you consider the best.

Lucky son!

Regards,

Robert.

Thanks a lot to everyone! My son likes larger Estonia too but it is too big. We don't have large living room so I think under 6' will be better. We will go again and let him choose which one he wants.

I am just wondering, will that be ok if I ask for more discount? How much discount do they usually give out? The sale price for Estonia is $32,000, for Shigeru is $43,700. The price above is after trade in $1500 & discount.

My advice would be: don't rush... Last year I came all the way from Brazil to USA and visited 4 different dealers before I did find my dream piano (in my case, a Mason & Hamlin BB), with a very good discount.

So, take your time, search over the internet, and pick up at least 3 or 4 shops to visit. I bet it'll be worth the effort.

Best wishes, and good luck!!

And... be sure and look at the used market because in some cases buying a "seasoned" piano is a much better buy. Your new piano will change and change and change until it too becomes "seasoned". What you buy/hear at the store will more than likely not be what you end up getting, maybe better, but maybe worse. I have a cousin (on a modest income), excellent pianist who purchased a brand new Estonia 168 5 years ago and shortly after started experiencing horrible overtones. The dealer sent over several different technicians, had the piano revoiced, 2 new set of hammers, and the piano is still too harsh to play. She told me she thought of many reasons why she wouldn't be able to play the piano, but NEVER thought the "piano" would be one. She can't play it, it can't be fixed, it's not the same piano she heard in the store and it seasoned into an unbearable sounding instrument.

I agree with Piano Brazil.... take your time and good luck!

We visited 4 dealer already. The sales from Steinway just call and said they have other one. 2002, model M, $43,000. It is quite expensive and only have one year warrenty. Others has ten year warrenty.

Also, are there any benefit to become Steinway artist? The sales said we need to buy their piano first.

Thanks a lot!

Nxwang,

Whether or not Steinway is the king of the pianos is a contentious story. Of course they make great pianos. Of course they're the most well-known brand. Of course they sell and market with an extremely aggressive approach that might be described as "we are the best of the best." But when all is said and done and actually way before there are other top-tier brands that easily equal Steinway in quality. Which is to say being a Steinway artist in the sense of buying a piano from them is a name. My own opinion is when I see a school or an institution that says "all Steinway school or institution" I always feel like " there's more variety out there in the world than just one brand alone and why not help students to see and understand what the differences are and how those differences can influence music making and performance."

In my own piano search in which I was looking for a top-tier instrument I ended up with a piano other than a Steinway (a Steingraeber). And there was a point where I was contemplating a trip to the Estonia factory in Tallinn to pick out a piano there. I live in the UK so Estonia really isn't all that far away. Actually if you book in advance it's cheaper to go there than it is to take a train to London! But that's a different story.

Here's a guide (The Larry Fine piano book) anyone buying a piano should know of.

http://www.pianobuyer.com/fall14/42.html

The Fine book doe not contain ultimate truth but it's well-considered and well-thought-of opinion. Here's an interesting article in which Shigeru Kawai and (Hamburg) Steinway are mentioned and described as top-tier pianos. It's from someone who used to tune for Oscar Peterson so he would be an informed source.

http://www.georgekolasis.com/best-pianos.html

Of course the advice you've been given to take your time is absolutely the best advice. Because the truth is as you (and your very fortunate son!) play on more and more excellent instruments you'll begin to know what you're looking for and what sounds and plays great. Of course that's a process that can go on and on forever so a decision has to be made "sometime somewhere." You may be at that point already, as you've already indicated.

Lastly, about piano warranties ... they're probably only as good as the person/firm that offers them. I wouldn't buy a piano (or not buy a piano) based on a a 1 year vs 10 year warranty. My opinion is a 10-year warranty is in large part a marketing ploy. But maybe others on the forum would advise differently from first-hand experience.

Take your time and don't let anyone, much less a sales person, rush you into anything. Great deals come up quickly. They go! And then they come up again! At least in my experience.

Hope all above is helpful ...

Unless your son is a professional pianist, I would say no.

Regards,

Robert.

Sorry, double post!

Robert.

Nope: that is all marketing and hype.

Anybody can make anybody a "brand artist"

It's normally called "invoice for piano"

Norbert

Well no. It's not all marketing and hype. If you are an endorsed artist with Steinway or Yamaha (or in my case Shigeru) there are potentially various benefits. I've done several recordings/concerts for example where a piano was provided for free or minimal charge.

Except, that has not been the case with the Steinway artists...unless something has changed.

I'm a bit of a Steinway fanboy. That being said, I love many different piano brands and really love sampling them. If I was extremely wealthy, I would have a hall of pianos, a collection so I could play my Steinway, my Estonia, my Bose, my Shigeru, and even my Hailun all day long. In the end it really just comes down to personal preference. They are all great. Don't get hung up in Steinway's exclusivity and marketing. The pianos are not hype--they really are that good. The benefits to owning one, well that's purely personal. Are they the best? Again, purely personal. If you're going for prestige, which I know is an important factor to some making this kind of purchase, you can't go wrong among musicians with any of these options.

I would encourage you not to spend the extra money just because of a name on a fallboard. If you love the piano that much more, and it's simply worth that much to you (and it is for many people... I'm not bashing Steinway here... I love them) then that's fine.

But I wonder if you would be asking the question if that were the case.

I persoanlly have never had problems with that.

However it's problematic if someone calls himself "best", "incomparable" and so on. A bit of a stretch IMHO..

The best piano to "compare" a Steinway any day has always been Mason Hamlin.

Guarantee that if people would play the pianos side by side, few if any could identify which is which.

Not going to "which" piano may be even preferred in such case.

It's been attempted here on the board by someone before.

Enough...

Norbert

Everyone knows that if you buy a steinway you will grow richer, play better, get better looking, never age and more nice things will happen to you, but you must be super intelligent to understand all this. Kids see through this, that why kids don't buy them.


Estonia.... never heard of them. Who plays them in concert competition? Any resale value?