Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Piano Tuner-Technicians Forum The friction, blubbering, and lost motion are eradicated!

RXD--you are just the type of tuner who would be off my preferred list. Your attitude is exactly the type I would eschew.. Thankfully, you are not going to touch my piano now or in the future.

Now, Shirley, which part of this sounded like a job application to you??

Read it again, there's more if you need it. I'm only too happy that you took me seriously enough to respond.

EDIT. I must have really got to you, I must read the many consecutive posts.

I only add this. That the condition of your pianos is not the fault of any of the techs you mention. By your own admission, you call them for squeaking pedal or clicking note, complaining when a tech makes a needed repair to prevent further wear (the two key buttons). I took the trouble to look briefly at your blogs. Very selective manipulation.
What you claim Israel said when the piano was "rebuilt". What he said currently in your video is to the point. The piano was not completely rebuilt or the key buttons would have all been replaced. not the hodgepodge we saw.

A tuner is wise to leave alone a piano that you are happy with but when you have to play with the piano closed up, the game changes. Look again what Israel tried to tell you about that in your video. You weren't listening. You would be amazed at my background and I don't say all this merely as a piano tech

I am not here to save you from yourself but this is to protect the fine technicians that you use thos way and are not listening to.

Some pianos have different sized screws holding the action brackets to the keyboard at the end of the action. If the screws are not matched to the holes, they can come loose. I hope that was checked. Even if it happened in the past, it can still be a problem.

Israel said the last rebuilder put in larger screws and that is on the footage. Didn't seem to pose a problem. Just needed tightening.

Why would I have nearly 2000 subscribers if I am such a poor pianist?
And the piano is closed due to the very small room this piano sits in. Are you going to advise me about my personal aesthetic choices? Seems this back and forth is leading nowhere. Put your own videos up, and let us sample.

You are in good company. Not much point in directing further attention to this moronic nonsense.

After technicians around the country, including California, pass this thread around will any of them have a desire to assist in the future with a client that throws acid at the tech community like this.

Look at the absence of technicians responding to this thread.

Quite telling. Nobody wants to tolerate crap thrown around like this, tech or non-tech.

+1

Music32
I would appreciate a clarification from you regarding your use of the term "unauthorized" regarding past work done on your pianos. It is not at all clear what you mean.

Fascinating thread! This is one of the greatest things about this forum is when pianists and technicians have meaningful exchanges. I applaud both Shirley and Israel along with the other comments of technicians on this thread who have contributed to greater technical understanding of the instrument, especially Sally and Ed!

I had to chuckle when I recommended Shirley contact Israel Stein BEFORE looking at her blog - where she clearly identifies her tech as Israel! As I said in the other thread - it's a small world! I've enjoyed many interactions with Israel over the years. He a no-nonsense kind of guy, who tells it like it is: more concerned with clarity than diplomacy perhaps. I hadn't heard he was retiring and leaving the country! Certainly a big loss for PTG, but then again Israel has contributed more than 99.9% of PTG members (that is probably literally true!) So many members join, and pay their dues, and nothing more. Three Cheers for Israel!

I'm a bit baffled by the defensiveness and critical nature of some of the technicians posts here. It is never our place to tell clients what they or the piano needs. Israel and Shirley's exchange in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c0bGm2-bfVU is an awesome example of a constructive exchange between client and technician. To a technician, some of Shirley's questions and comments may seem naive and simplistic, but we are not the intended audience, which are non-technicians, who may know little or none about piano technology.

I loved Israel's comment about the keybuttons.
Shirley: "Now that keybutton thing...that can be fixed as an isolated event?"
Israel: "yeah..."
Shirley "and when you say all the keybuttons, do you recommend I replace 'em all now?"
Israel: "not if...if they're not giving you any trouble..."

Israel is not trying to talk her into extra work. He's not condemning her for the current state of her piano. He is simply giving her the facts as he sees them in a non-judgmental fashion, which to me is the definition of professionalism.

Shirley is proceeding cautiously due to past experience with technicians. This is smart, as we all know there are technicians out there who can create more problems than they solve. With some of the valuable information she has gained, she can make a more informed decision about the work she wants done.

When it comes to having a piano voiced, there is some very real risk involved. Not all changes will be perceived as "good" by the pianist - even if they are "technically correct". Take Horowitz's piano as an example. Talking to a couple of technicians who actually tuned the piano when it was in service, I learned that they personally hated it! And after Horowitz passed, and the piano was on a nationwide tour, it had to be modified extensively in order to make it more user friendly! So do you think Horowitz would have thought his piano improved by a standard regulation and voicing? Was he a moron for playing a "non standard" action?

We as technicians are in the business of helping clients express themselves musically. It can be a very tricky business sometimes. There is a lot of psychology at play. Sometimes the most challenging situations can also be the most rewarding. We have to be careful about making foregone conclusions about what the piano or the pianists "needs" are. As usual, communication is key.

Mr. Silverwood Pianos I have a magnificent tech doing quality work. That has been accomplished despite your insecurities.

I can count a handful I can put my trust in.. same for my colleagues, one of whom is agonizing over awful work done on his magnificent Steinway.

And he shipped his Steinway A cross country.

I'm no longer looking for Israel Stein's replacement (he is retiring as everyone knows) but I have an amazing tech who does proud to the profession. I would count the late Sheldon Smith among these. And one of my students had excellent action work recently done on her Yamaha by John Callahan.. whom I have recommended based on a terrific outcome. Touch weighting, voicing were outstanding. So yes, there are good techs and others who need to improve their skills. On a personal level, some of the good ones, have warned me about those to avoid.

Wonderful news. Now there is absolutely no requirement to continue this thread.

The instrument has been remedied for the previous immediate complaints and a new tech has been found.

Anything further from anyone is superfluous.

Thank you Mr. Silverwood and best wishes for your current and future undertakings.

Shirley, have you ever considered doing a little piano tech work yourself?

I've been only doing it for a bit over a year now, but it has greatly enlarged
my appreciation and love of the instrument, and I get to regulate it exactly how I
like it! Plus, it would be much harder for a more experienced tech to B.S.
me now.

I like your clean mordents and your trills with Chopin:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5MLPxKFl2c

Nicely played, with good emotion and feel!

Maybe I could take a Bach lesson from you when I swing by Berkeley?

How much are your lessons?

Yes, Shirley, but can they trust you? Yes, you, Shirley.

You create a self fulfilling prophesy.

According to your own account,(read your own account again) You turn on your long time technician savagely, self righteously and publicly after he patiently tolerated your constant badgering him at his visit. I'm sure that he couldn't wait to get out of there.

Nobody should be treated that way. Do you understand that?? You are not alone among a certain class of piano teacher. I have anecdotes galore that I, so far have kept mostly to myself. We all have, truth be told.

Having 2,000 blog followers these days means nothing. Particularly since you are making some kind of cheap self aggrandising "reality show" of your life.
What kind of people must many of your followers be?

Does your new tech know what you did to your last tech?. Does he realise he's merely next? Did you video him, too???
Unless you've learned something from your post, behaviours tend to repeat themselves.

Do you realise that videoing and badgering is great pressure on a normal person just trying to do a good job for you??? I'm not surprised he forgot something. It's inhuman treatment of a fine older gentleman.

The honest "reality" treatment and very strong feelings that you have engendered from many in this post and your petulant replies to them shows that something got through to you. A dose of your own reality, perhaps?

Nobody changes that much, though. As you will no doubt prove if you answer this.

I would struggle to hear myself think if I were working for you, Shirley! You chat non-stop - that could cause lapses in concentration for a tech and also being observed every second can put people off their game. It's something to consider for your new tech.

Actually, that's very true, as all you tuners and techs
know.

I don't mind explaining the concept of iH and the basics of
how Tunelab works, but it's quite another thing if they look
over my shoulder the whole time.

Then if they ask questions, and expect me to work at the same
time, that's even worse.

I've never had a customer start videotaping me during my work,
but I don't think I would like it very much.

Ask questions at the beginning or the end, but not during. Leave us alone to get the job done!

Hi Paul, Israel Stein, my current tech who's retiring, was saying at his last visit that all pianists (esp. conservatory grads) should be required to take Piano Technology.. and is he ever right. I started taking the course as an elective at Oberlin Conservatory when Louis Sombaty taught it, and no sooner than I filed a hammer, it ended up a shadow of itself. I quit the course after I purchased the tool box, tools. Should have hung in there. I do know, however that it takes YEARS and years to be a good tech... and I'd rather devote those to practicing. But we should know what our pianos are about so we don't wig out when cheek blocks or stacks are loose. At least for me, when something goes wrong panic sets in.
Sure if you're in Berkeley give me a jingle a few days in advance. For further details, email me at shirley_kirsten@yahoo.com What Bach are you studying. I have a student who travels in from Chico who does all Bach so right now we are working on BK 2 WTC F minor Prelude... Thanks for your kind words about my playing.. sk