I think it would also help if we changed our seating arrangement and put the softer instruments in the front. (Maybe I should try sitting in another room when we play. ) Also, the guitarist needs an amp (he plays on an acoustic Martin).

We could try sitting in a row, but that makes it hard for us to see and hear each other.

Assuming you can record your digital on computer, I'd do that first and then, wearing headphones, play the track back and record your vocal track into the zoom, load it on the PC and mix the vocal with the piano using software such as audacity or maybe the zoom has some mixing software?. This will give you the cleanest possible recording I think.

Very interesting suggestion. Two comments:

First to using the computer to record the digital piano, and H4 the vocal. Yes, a workable plan. You will get good experience using Cubase to do the final mixing. I'm guessing Audacity won't mix two different sources (?? I don't use Audacity). I'd also guess there might be timing problems; nevertheless a fun project. What you've described, however, can be done on the H4 without requiring direct recording to the computer.

Second to recording the piano first. I've never accompanied a singer who wanted the piano to lead [Obviously, I don't do karaoke]. Whenever I've done multi-track, non-simultaneous piano/vocals, the vocal came first and I filled in a piano accompaniment. As awkward as this sounds, I'd let the vocalist listen to a live piano in headphones and record the vocal, discarding/ignoring the piano. Then have a pianist add a piano track to the pre-recorded vocal.

Ain't we got fun?

I've experimented with group recording on the H4. It seems to be sensitive to instrument proximity.

Here's another thought: find the best seat in the house. Put the H4 on a tripod at the location of that person's head.

Amping a classical Martin? Yikes!

This thread is a great resource, but it's ... how to put this delicately ... too long. So I decided to make a How-to list for new Zoomers so that the information and advice here and elsewhere is readily available in one post at the top of the thread, that way people won't have to wade through 15 page-threads!

Here is the How-To:

Help me put together a How-to for the Zoom H4

I am a new Zoom user myself, so I would appreciate it if people could take a look at this list and post any additions or corrections that they think would be helpful. You don't even have to read all the other posts, just read the first post and reply. I will continue to add people's comments so that everything will appear in the top post of the thread.

However, one thing I'd like people to remember is that this list is for people who have just purchased a Zoom and are starting to use it for the first time. I'm not interested in debating the Zoom versus other devices, and I'm not going to try to answer a lot of specific questions about Audacity or Cubase, or using external mics etc. I want this to be as concise and simple as possible.

Thanks in advance!

Here is my contribution:
Arabesque by debussy on a Bluthner

I wonder if one can use both external mics and the built in mics at the same time.

Very nice, pianistical! I've never played a Bluthner; the sound was fuller than I expected after hearing some descriptions of its tone. The treble in particular was very clear.

Thanks Monica. You are correct, the treble is soo sweet and clear and it is this piano´s forte. I haven´t come around to voice the bass sufficiently yet but it would add some more depth to the bass, but as you probably already know, there is a limit to what one can do with a piano that is 180 cm. Listen to Luigi´s recording and you will hear a great Blüthner bass.

Do you by any chance know of any good recording of Mason & Hamlin? I am looking for recordings of different makes for our tea lounge.

I don't know about a commercial CD with M&H pianos, but here's a thread showing a video of a Shaun Terrell concert on a M&H CC . The Scarlatti piece in particular was stunning. I think mention was made of a DVD or CD soon being available from that performance.

The H4 has 4 tracks. You can record vocals right on it while monitoring the other tracks. Then transfer the tracks individually to the PC for efx, mixing and Mastering to CD.

Nice recording pianistical, nice play too of course, this one recall me a lot the sound of my Bluthner, a tipical wonderful (IMHO) old Bluthner sound.
Where did you place to Zoom H4 and what settings did you use ?

Beautiful, pianistical; beautiful. What more can I say?

Monica,
Thanks for the link. The Scarlatti was wonderful and I would be happy to play it in the tea lounge.
The recording doesn´t need to be commercial, it is really a full CD of soft music of a particular make and the quality of the recording I am primarily after.

LuigiV,
If I remember correctly, I put the Zoom 50-100 cm from the edge of the bend of the piano(position D). I pointed the zoom towards the strings. I haven´t done any manipulation of the file except converting it to mp3. The sensitivity was set to high but should have been set to somewhere in between medium and high. One can hear some distortions at louder passages. Do you have any experience of new Blüthners?

TX-Dennis,
Nothing more. What you wrote makes me happy.

In the zoom instructions it is written that one should adjust the sensitivity of the mics so the recorded tone almost reaches the threshold of being distorted. When one close mic, the attack of the tone is more pronounced. One thus has to adjust the mic to the attack and not the sustain of the tone, and this makes the recorded tone overall more feeble. This is especially a problem in louder passages.

I find that putting the zoom at some distance from the grand and increasing the mic level will result in an overall fuller, more natural and more airy sound. The downside is that one looses some of the crispness of the tone.

So, for soft pieces, closer micing may be preferable. For pieces with more contrast between loud and soft passages it may be better to move the zoom further away from the piano.

This observation comes from my very limited experience with the Zoom.

Everyone, am having an issue with my Zoom H4 and was wondering if anyone else is having the same problem...sometimes, more often than not, when I press the record button after getting the level, it shows it's recording fine, but then when I press the button again to stop the recording, the red light does not go off, then a few seconds later it goes off...and then when I try and play back the recording, it says "Card Error" and there is NO recording, plus the machine will not work, I have to turn it off, then back on again!? I just lost a great live concert selection, piano and viola...so this has to stop. I am thinking it's the memory card? What memory card is known to work with the Zoom? What memory cards do you all use with your Zoom's? Thanks,

Your card may be defective, try to replace the card.
It happens the same thing to me now after I replaced the SD card all is ok.
Luigi

I think I remember seeing a lsit of cards on their website that were known to be compatible with the H4. I did not consult it and bought a Kingston 2GB card on sale for under $20. It works just fine, but is a little slow in transfer speed to the computer.

Thanks! I went on the Samson Website and they had an "EFilm" card that was out of stock, so I found a vendor that has some and ordered one. Thanks again.

Zoom is releasing the H2 which is a stereo only version of the H4 for $199 MAP. IF you don't need 4 tracks it might be worth a look.

Kingfrog, were you able to figure out what kind of mic arrangement the H2 has? The photo doesn't show the same two little microphones that you see in the H4. Does it take external mics only or does it come with internal mics?

I'm marvelled with this recorder. I don't have one, and I go through hard times to record something. I did in the past, 2 years ago, with a karaoke awfully cheap mic. and a phillips CDR-W recorder with audio in. The result couldn't be good, and there were a lot of clipping and strange noises, apart the traffic noise coming from the window (it was my teacher apartment, in a very agitated area).
So that was the only thing I did. I had also a yamaha keyboard, those with 5 octaves, cheap also, that had a 5 or 6 track recording, and that was really cool. I spent many many hours, days, using this feature, as I could record things with one hand, then the other, to get together and see how that would look like.
I recently moved to France to study, and bought a MP8, as that was the best thing closer to a real piano, as I can't have one in my student's appartment. The problem is that I discovered that Dell's notebooks have some kind of driver that doens't allow the recognition of midi instruments.
So I can't record at all, and even using audio in, I have residual noise, and I tryed everything to correct it, but couldn't.

My questions are:
Can I connect the XLR line stereo to the H4? (In this case, phantom power wouldn't be necessary, as I think the signal is already in line level).

Can I record left hand, and then right hand, and then even something else, to add together without need of post-edition (on the fly) ? In this case, is it possible to hear the part already recorded while I record the second one?

thanks eveybody
ps: I could buy also a soundcard with better audio in, but I have a piano waiting me in my original home, and a Yamaha C5 available in the school.

I'm assuming by "XLR line stereo" you mean audio output from your digital piano. Yes, you can plug that output (XLR or 1/4" plugs) into the H4. Phantom power is needed by some microphones, and can be supplied by the H4, but won't be needed in a direct connection between your piano and the H4.

Yes, the H4 will allow you to record a left hand as a stereo recording. You can then listen to your left hand using headphones (with mini stereo plug) and record your right hand in stereo. You now have four channels of recording that you can mix together into a single stereo recording containing both right and left hand playing.

The H4 does not recognize and will not record a "midi" signal. There is no way to connect a midi DIN5 cable from an instrument to the H4.

Thanks everyone for the tips...it WAS a defective card that was not recording, the new "Efilm" card works perfecty.

What does everyone use for a Zoom case? Thanks.

For a case, I use a $ 2 transparent plastic pencil box. I found one that is almost the perfect size. I then wrap the zoom in a soft cloth, and place it in the box. It may not be elegant, but it works great.

I bought a carrier for a portable DVD player. It's padded and big enough that it has room for all the cables and manual and stuff.

I just got my Zoom H4 this week and finally between yesterday and today I am getting some recordings and using Audacity.

It has not been easy. Things I found that are not mentioned from what I can remember.

ZOOM Red button has to be pushed twice to record.

When it is in a blinking stage, it is not recording.

Even when in RECORD, somehow something did not complete record, or would not download to the computer.

THERE IS NO SPEAKER on the ZOOM. You HAVE TO HAVE EARPHONES or DOWNLOAD to your computer to hear what you did.

USB port doesn't seem to recognize my ZOOM
I CANNOT FIND under MENU, UBS computer recognition or whatever others are finding.

SO...to download, I had to take out the little card and insert that into the computer.

(Horrid to try to get THAT out of the ZOOM. Have a fingernail for that!!!)

Once into the computer I made a file to save the downloads. 3 out of 6 worked.

One can then DELETE what is on the card. I have 2 1GB cards ordered online for $12 each, free shipping, but as of now, needed to take out my 512 MB from my digital camera and use that.

Placement on the back of the music stand of MH AA

Another red button seems to be blinking as I record.

AUDACITY

Downloaded fine and tutorial was helpful for editing.

Give yourself time before you start to play and at the end.

You do not have to rerecord if there is a start place previous once you REALLY Mess Up. Again give yourself a pause before you take up the restarting place. This will help on editing out the mistake section and pasting in the retake. (first try was successful)

Save your Project.

Save you Wav file

THen you need LAME to do a transfer to MP3. This took me 2 hours to figure out. Thought I downloaded, couldn't find it even with searching.

LAME comes as a ZIP FILE, so you need a ZIP/UNZIP program to unzip it and save it someplace.

I made a file under my docs, LL recordings where I am keeping everything. I am keeping the STE 001 name with renaming the song afterwards in case i loose something and need to find it on the computer.

I saved the wav file and tried to email it out to a friend. My email program (comcast) one hour later said NOWAY Jose, too big. This was done while I was hunting for how to unzip the LAME which is now trying to save it as a MP3.

This has been the most frustrating thing I have done on the computer.

So, if you can help, or put any of this info, SHIROKIRO on your quick program, it might help others who are as frustrated as I.

I started at 6AM, it is now Noon!!!

Back to trying to record again! LL

Lilylady, sorry it has been so frustrating. The good news is that once you get those little quirks down, it really is an easy gadget to use.

The need to press the red button twice was in fact discussed here... but I realize this is a VERY long thread and it is easy to miss something in the 16 pages.

As for your computer not recognizing your USB connection, I wonder if perhaps you omitted the (all too crucial) step that needs to be done on the Zoom itself? (Instructions taken from ShiroKuro's Quick Start Guide):

"To connect the Zoom to the computer, use the USB. Verify that the recorder is stopped. Press the center of the menu key. Move the jog down up or down to USB then press to select. Next choose "connect to PC." When the message "now connecting to PC" appears, your computer recognizes the Zoom as an external harddrive and you can copy, delete or rename files this way."

If you don't have the Zoom itself set to connect to the PC, your computer won't recognize it even though attached with the USB cable.

It would be worth spending the time to trouble-shoot this, because I agree with you that removing the memory card is a royal pain in the butt.

I'm not sure why only 3 of your 6 downloads worked. The manual has some kind of warning about using cards that have been formatted for another function, and the need to reformat them for the Zoom. So maybe it has something to do with the fact that you are using your camera card. Once you get your new cards you (hopefully) should not have any trouble with it.

Good luck and hang in there! You're way past the steepest point of the learning curve.

lilylady, I had the same trouble with several recordings not working. I traced it to my SD memory card, as some good folks here pointed out. As soon as I bought a better card, SanDisk or Efilm, the problem has not surfaced again. The SD card I was using was in the bargain bin at Fry's....it must have been there for a reason!