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Just some thoughts:

Giving children a bit of responsibility in their time management can go a long way. One idea is to basically have a 1:1 minutes practice time with screen time. Or perhaps something like minutes spent in piano practice and something else (chore, reading, whatever), = number of screen time aloud.

This is an idea I give parents sometimes. It has to be the right circumstances and the right child, but I think it can be highly motivating, as it gives the children responsibility for how they want to spend their time.

Hi Don, I love this thread. I was feeling pretty down today, because too many students (I work in a music store) on the average, practice twice a week (probably one of those days falls on the day of their lesson!). These young ones have so much potential, but their parents are busy, work late, can't supervise their practice routine, or they have a million other activities they are involved in. IN a perfect teaching world, my students would practice at least 5 days a week, and complete all their assignments.

Despite the overly structured world this generation lives in, very few of them have established practice times. When I suggest that to parents, they are very receptive.

However, there are two incentives that I find really motivate students to practice in my studio: I have 3 recitals a year, one in the Spring, Fall and Holiday recital in December. We are always working on performance pieces, which I let them have some input in when selecting pieces. But most importantly, your son is 8 years old. The boys that age in my studio are not too motivated by method book music. They want to learn songs like Viva La Vida, All of Me, Demons, Radioactive. I am always amazed at the progress they make when they are working on music they know and love. They learn notes and rhythms that would take 2 or 3 levels via method books to learn. But more importantly, they are excited, their faces light up and their performances reflect their joy. I make sure to include something popular, whether it's current pop music, Disney music, Broadway, swing, movie themes. One of my young men (he's 10 now) has been taking lessons for 3 years. I've noticed more disinterest in method book songs, classical pieces and other pieces I introduce to him. He wanted to learn a piece from a pop group. He created his own dynamics, ending with an explosive chord and when he jumped up from the piano, his bow was that of a star! The audience went crazy. I've never seen a more exciting performance from my students, and his parents were ecstatic.

Thanks for the comments Colin and Chasing.

Practice sessions have been a bit bumpy over the last 2 weeks - we've dropped back to 3 days a week. This is because the schedule is different on the weekend, so we've only been practicing on weekday's, but not on the day when he goes the class (same time as practice schedule) and not on the day when I have to work late. I need to tighten up the weekend practice.

However, over the last month with more regular practice he is pulling things together a lot better and we've had a pleasantly surprised teacher the last 2 lessons.

I completely agree that the song makes a big difference. If he's into it, he'll do well. What I'm surprised at is some of the songs in the method book that I look at I think "ho hum, he's going to hate this one" and then he totally gets into it. While others I think "oh this is fun" and he doesn't.

So far we've only had 1 recital - our teacher says she will try to arrange them 3 times a year but will have to wait and see if she can pull that off.

Colin - I've suggested 1:1 screen - to - piano time but was mocked. If I could get 6:1 I'd be happy

Been there, done that, and very quickly we were arguing on the numbers:

"I played 30 minutes I am watching TV now"
"You didn't play 30 minutes!"
"I did, I came up here 6:30 now is 7:00"
"Half of the time you were on YouTube"
"It wasn't half of the time, I were there only 5 minutes to check out how other people play the piece"
"It was far more than 5 minutes"
"I needed to search it up"
I gave up counting the minutes.

Here is how we do at home and it seemed to work for us, so far:

1. No screen time of any sort from Sunday night to Thursday night. Electronics are very distracting. Weekends, go wild. (But there are so much fun things to do in the weekends, they don't usually end up watching a lot of TV or playing a lot video games, but that is their choice).

2. The teacher gives written, quantified assignments, like do this exercise each day 2 times before practice, play these section 20 times each day. At the bottom of the assignment sheet, there are check boxes for each day. When they complete the practice of the day, I put a check marks on it. I don't count how many times they play each piece, it is an honour system. I just trust them (or let them cheat). They did cheat when we started this, and I think they knew I knew they cheated, but I just showed them my full trust and quickly they stop cheating. There are times they don't complete the practice, we just put a smaller check mark, or don't put the check mark on it. There is no reward or penalty for it, it is just for record keeping, but the very act of putting down a record gets them going.

3. We try to make each piece they practices presentable. Often we record (video or audio) a piece on Tuesday (Wednesday is lesson day). We don't post the recording to the internet, but the recording itself motivates them. They love to watch or listen to they own playing, and laugh all the way though.

4.The teacher (school) has 2 recitals a year, in addition to that the teacher assigns some performance pieces and do in lesson video recording a few times a year. The teacher posts the recordings on YouTube. It gets like 30 views or so but kids seem to be proud of it.

5. For the older one, after every 3 pieces the teacher assigned him, he can request one piece. His list, includes, of course Star Wars, Mission Impossible.....

6 I let them set their own schedule, they have all the freedom to arrange the orders of activities as long as everything gets done.

I enforce the schedules they set themselves.

Our days go like this:
"What is you plan today?"
"After dinner, I will read 15 minutes, then I will play piano for 20 minutes, then I will take a shower, read 15 minutes, do my homework, drink milk, brush my teeth, and play 20 minutes and go to bed by 8:30"
"OK"
"Isn't it time to play piano?"
"Oho yeah, I am going up now"
"Isn't it time to do your homework?"
"Just 2 more minutes, I am finishing up this chapter.."
"Go brush you teeth, it is 8:40 already"
"It is?"
.........
I never get them to bed 8:30, just like I never get them hold the fermata long enough (the boys always rush). The day will probably never come, and I am OK with it.

Piano practice is not always fun. Whenever they "finish" a piece, I celebrate with them, however imperfect it is, that is fun. Piano learning, even life itself, has no destination, it is all about the journey.

The Monkeys.

Excellent post. Great ideas.

We calculate various strategies to infuse the student with a sense of engagement, or ownership if you will, in the endeavor of learning rather than have them feel they are spending their life taking orders for the sake of obedience alone. That feeling of forward motion and achievement varies from student to student, but one way or another it must be there. That is often more than 50% of our job.

Sometimes I trade places with the student and they are now the teacher. I play their piece and they follow the score as I play. They must be alert to any wrong notes that I play or incorrect rhythm (and I make sure they happen) and stop me and identify the exact note in the score. They must listen, and they must read carefully. This chance to exercise authority definitely engages them and I get them to pay attention to the music. Sometimes I just don't get it, you see, so I ask them to illustrate how the theme goes, or what is a steady rhythm as opposed to the mush I just made. They jump for the opportunity to show me how it really goes. Of course, they must give me a grade as well.

I may ask them if they ever heard of such-and-such a piece (knowing they do know it) and if so, could they play it to help me remember how it goes? - they invariably feel triumphant at being able to show off they do indeed know that piece and play it with gusto to prove the point. I earnestly thank them for reminding me how it goes, and then we work some creative changes into the tempo or dynamics for dramatic effect - 'just for the fun of it' - and they are not quite aware they just got the lesson I meant to give anyway.

Children like to prove they can do something on their own (adults are much the same but more fearful) so I like to make sure they hold forth. That is why small children sometimes brush away my hands when I show them a position - they don't want to be pushed around any more than necessary. Children generally are at the mercy of adults pushing them around day and night, so one way or another I give them their own territory to prove themselves, and make sure they are acknowledged.

For what it is worth, I never talk 'baby-talk' or anything remotely like that as I see some mothers doing. I may use fewer big words and speak at bit more clearly than usual, but no downward patronization. I always engage in real dialogue throughout the lesson, and the young students get to have their own voice, and I must listen when they talk just as they listen to me in turn. Perhaps this is useful in some cases, because just today a mother said to me of her six-year old son, "He really like coming here for his lessons. It's because of the way you talk to him. That's what he told me."

For me as a student a great deal of made me feel I had input into lessons was having some choice in what I played. I have a lot of things that I teach that are fully optional. For instance, I have "Take Me Out to the Ball Game", which I could personally not care less about. I don't like baseball. I ask my students, "Are you interested in this?" Some can't wait to play it, some are so-so, and some can't wait to SKIP it.

I let them make the choice.

Young people already have strong attractions to certain kinds of music and don't like others.

I have students who don't like "dark" things. They won't want to play the kind of moody, emotional music I was attracted to, but others will be the opposite.

Things don't always go well when I "demonstrate" something on the spot that I have not looked at or thought about for some time - or when I am sight-reading something with problems. This is a great opportunity to show students how and why things go wrong for us, and how we fix them on the spot, if they can fixed that fast, or how we would attack a bigger problem.

A student will usually not say: "Ouch, you really screwed THAT up. Having a bad day, are we?"

But if you say that about yourself, or I say it, we acknowledge that fact that we are all students, always, and that things go wrong.

And when things go wrong, I always make the point that they also go horribly wrong sometimes for the greatest players on the planet. Because of the recording industry students are under the mistaken impression that "professionals" don't make mistakes. All the mistakes are edited out in studios.

Parents tend to follow my lead in lesson. I teach the parents how to teach their kids at home, and some of my small ones are amazingly sharp. It's hard for a parent to use baby-talk when tiny tot is finding things almost as fast as the parent - and sometimes faster. I hated being talked down to as a child. I especially hate "we": "How are we doing today?"

My first response, which I always have to choke down, is: "Are you are nurse? Is someone sick?" ;D

Great thread you started Denzo. I am both a parent of two young piano students and a teacher. I don't teach my own kids - learned the hard way not to!
Just a question for chasing rainbows (and I'll post it in another thread not to mess this thread up too much) - where do you find good, well-written, level appropropriate pop music for your students - e.g. radioactive?
much appreciated

Ok, this is an old thread and I'm not trying to rekindle it, but just wanted to share what has been happening in our household with encouraging our now 9 y.o. boy to practice piano.

I'm sure the purists will hate this

Six weeks ago we got our son a 2nd hand Xbox for his birthday. But we put a stipulation on it. Basically, if he hasn't practiced piano for 20 minutes yet that day, no time on the Xbox. Its working out surprisingly well! I know there is the potential for this to be a terrible idea - wrong motivational source, not really generating interest in the piano, etc. I imagine it is not something one could make a blanket recommendation for.

But - at first my son had no problems with the deal, then for a while he was kind of chaffing at the requirement, now he has just settled in to "that is the way it is" and he is playing piano every day. And often on his own volition. I've found that he doesn't need me to sit with him and encourage him along. Now I can just comment from the kitchen - "good job" or "don't forget the piece <blah> that your teacher wants you to work on". To fill in his full practice time, he is being creative in going to pieces that are beyond his current assignments. Sometimes going to ones from a few months ago, sometimes not. Overall, in the last 6 months (since I started this thread) his musicality has greatly improved and his reading ability is also improving frighteningly fast. So, after 20 months of playing its like things are finally really starting to click, which is great.

But it is both sad and cool that the Xbox carrot has been very successful as a reward for routine. I think it is establishing him having a routine of going to the piano without being told to do so, and going through his practice material himself without needing me hovering over him. I hope those habits stick. But the other thing is the carrot doesn't seem to be affecting his concentration during the practice.

I hope it will continue! I feel like a bad parent to be using such an obvious bribery ploy... but I guess if I've learned anything about parenting, it's "if something works, go with it".

Don

100% in support of short-term reward systems over here, Don. It isn't bribery if it is a reward for something he has done.
Kids do not really understand motivation toward long-term goals until.... college?

(and... notice that praise from you is part of this new routine that is working well.)