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Hello!
I recently bought a Sauter delta grand; wonderful tone and touch but when I play fast I notice that my arms get tired, and that the action is somewhat heavy. I measured
56g downweight (damper depressed)
28g upweight (damper depressed)

The manufacture says it should be around 50 grams from factory And that this might be due to humidity.

The grand is almost new. So I am a little puzzled what to do (40k $). Don't want to change it in the first run..

Some people said shaping the hammerfelt might help. Is there any hope?

I would be grateful for advice.

Regards,
Hermerik

That is not especially heavy. I think that you will get used to it very quickly. You may be playing more than you did before, and that can tire you out.

There is not enough weight in the hammer felt to make much of a difference.

Thanks -- yes I do play more now. Have 2 small kids so i used to play 5 min per day for a long time. Grew up on a very light bechstein from 1923. So it feels heavy.. clearly heavier At least.
but still, isn't there anything one can do ? I do have problems playing Beethoven moonlight 3rd mov. Left hand. And chopin etude 5 op. 10 (right hand). well yes it may be just that I have to practice more.. ;-) Today I played over 1 hour (!)

Do you think it will lighten up over time?

Grateful for any advice anyhow.

Hi Hermerik,

I think it's too early to think about changing anything. You have a new piano, so it's possible the action parts are a bit too tight - a good tech will start by checking friction problems, ease the keys a bit if needed, lube action parts, etc. Just this could be enough for you to feel the action lighter and more responsive.

If after that you still feel the action is too heavy, then you can start thinking about other things.

Take a look at the keys and see how much lead was required to reach the stated DW's

Have you asked your technician about polishing the centerpins?

BDB makes a good point. In the meantime you might also ask your tech about the possibility of reducing aftertouch. Some say anything beyond the minimum results in wasted effort. Adding punchings is easy and reversible.

I have one of these on my piano

http://pitchlock.com/touch-rail/

I would not own a piano without one. If your action geometry is correct, which it probably is, the touchrail can lower the downweight dramatically without adversely affecting repetition. You probably just prefer a lighter action as I do. This has done wonders for me. You should ask you tech about it.

Of course. Find a tech who is well versed in Stanwood TouchDesign protocols.

I would have suggested increasing the after touch. Almost any time someone complains of a "heavy touch" on a piano that was previously OK, it is because the capstan adjustment has been neglected. Duh! Set a hammer line first then see if that does not do it. How about the tightness of flange screws and every other screw that holds the action together? Do we all assume that NONE of that needs attention? Are we all thinking about adding lead weights to keys?

What about jack position to hammer knuckle insert? Has that perhaps drifted a bit far south? How about lubrication where it is warranted? How about cleaning all the dirt out first before you redesign the whole thing?

If you have been playing an upright, particularly an old one, or an upright, there is extra complexity to the touch which makes a grand feel stiffer.

There was a video referenced in one of the other areas which pointed out that once you play a note loud, you can release the extra tension and still hold the note. Learning little tricks like that will improve your stamina.

I second Jim Ialeggio's suggestion. If the action has four of five front keyleads plus whippen assist springs and has down-weight like you reported-the high inertia of the action is contributing to tiring you.

BDB's point about relaxing when holding a played key down is also spot on.

In your Pianostreet thread you mentioned that your tech proposed to look at friction and, presumably, regulation. I took it as read that you will do that first. I imagine that is what Bill Bremmer had in mind.

If I had spent $40,000 on a nearly new piano I too would think twice about spending an unbudgeted $X,000 more on modifying it immediately afterwards.

It was Andre van Oorebeek, the author of a well-received book on voicing, who suggested reducing aftertouch to the minimum necessary to allow for minor variations between the keys, about 0.4 mm as I recall. If the aftertouch on your Sauter is significantly more you could try reducing it. That would mean a little less work to play each note.

My impression is the last mm or so of key travel can be relatively demanding on fingers and wrists, so that less aftertouch feels like a reduction in weight. That may be why some prefer 9.5 mm key dip to 10.5 mm.

When it comes to physical fitness a runner would suggest building up speed, endurance and technique gradually over weeks and months.

Yes, many have reported that reducing keydip and
hammer blow distance can make a heavier action feel
lighter.

The tradeoff being less volume and power, of course.

That's right, a possible solution for the OP. However, to clarify, Andre van Oorebeek was writing about adjusting aftertouch on Yamaha Concert grands after everything else had been done.

I looked at led weights. Only at most one here and there. Hammers may be a bit heavy (?)
I guess I will use lubricant and try to get a tech loosen it up a little. But can only friction make 6g downweight? ? From 56g to 50?

Btw- What are the capstans?

Thanks for all advise. Stanwood I have never heard of. Will ask a tech about it!

Hemerik,

You have nailed it!

You may find Rob Mitchell's piece about friction interesting, but I was looking for something that says how much each part of the action typically contributes to 56g downweight.

See Igrec, Pianos Inside Out, Table 5, p143. The total difference between the lowest and highest acceptable values is over 15g, though for all to apply at once would be unlikely.

Just a reminder that if you modify your piano's action, you will likely void the warranty.