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Progressive also within tolerance!

Kees

Well done.

I submit I did not tune that temperament focusing on the attack which was measured. I'm going to try that next.

Also the trichords may have contributed to beat speed variation. For sure Stopper and Gadzar had less variation.

Funny no one has mentioned the claim that this was done in one pass.

A lot of work was done here. Thanks to all for posting.

Mark,

In your recording you measured 6 beats for F3A3, 4 beats for F#3A#3, 5 beats for G3B3 and 7 beats for G#3C4.

Why?

Aren't you cheating?

The measurements made by Kees picking only three beats show your intervals are not progressive.

Besides, the time you use to tune has nothing to do with how you measure. For F3A3 three beats take less than half a second! For C#4F4 3 beats take only 0.3 seconds. You can not estimate the beat rate in so little time, your argument is ridiculous!

What Kees told you is true:



I am afraid you are not being honest!

I've posted here my video to show that it is possible for a good aural tuner to tune progressive intervals.

Which you are denying. When I told you that your intervals sounded non progressive you told me that my ears were fooling me and that after measuring I could confirm what numbers say. If that was true then it would be impossible to aurally tune progressive intervals unless you measure them and correct them based in ulterior measurements. But at the same time you claim you are able to aurally tune progressive intervals in a single pass. But these intervals prove to be non progressive when measured by others.

???????

IMO this is pure nonsense.

Relax Gadzar. You're going to have a coronary. For Pete's sake, call the tuning police.

I already told you. This thread has helped me develop rational criteria for beat measurement. Criteria I did not have when I measured my temperament. Criteria that I will use from now on.

Now, about the time it takes me to discern a beat speed. I have no trouble hearing it that quickly. You, maybe not. So please don't paint me with your brush.

Find someone else to lynch.

I've showed what I wanted in my video. I've told what I think of your recordings and measurements.

You've showed you are not able to tune good unisons, nor progressive intervals in one pass, but more important youve showed your lack of professionalism and ethics to present facts as they are and not as you want they to be. You cheat on your procedures to prove you are right and others are wrong.

That's all I am going to say. I'm done with this thread.

I will pre-empt the moderators and tell you that you are back on my ignore list. When will I ever learn?

Now that's you who are calling the police!

As I've told you in a PM where you threatened me to report me with the moderators, I have the right to express what I think.

I have not profered insults, nor breaked any rules of PW, as far as I understand.

If I am banned for telling what I believe, then be it. This Forum wasn't for me. If not, I will be gratefull for the existence of a Forum where I can express myself.

Thank you Kees, for measuring.


It's what I thought. My ears didn't fooled me. Though I was afraid there were some inconsistences at the break, fortunately there weren't.

I am reassured what I learned from Bill Bremmer is a very valuable knowledge.

PS: This tuning was recorded almost 6 years ago. At the time I was concerned to tune "perfect" ET, focusing only on beat rates. Now I tune with a different approach. I tune what sounds best while depressing the sustain pedal, looking for maximum consonance, as described by Isaac Oleg. It's amazing! There is a sweet spot where the note sounds just right. No testings, no beats, no partials, only hearing the whole piano resonating. Maybe checking octaves, double octaves, twelves, nineteenths...

ABout 3 strings unison ,

Are the 2 strings strongly coupled for sustain (lenghtening) , or do they deal with the thickness of tone, while the "ballast string regulates sustain ?

I feel that the 3d string (assuming a strong pure doublet is tuned first) regulate the timing of the attack, making it more or less crisp.

But I can be wrong on that.

PS Raphael, tuning with sustain pedal is quieter for the ears, but then we tune more in the iH than usually, so the stretch can easily be excessive in the treble I find.

it allows in anyncase to be conscious of the consonant spot(s?)

Could you tweak your test http://mrtuner.com/BeatSpeedDifference.html to have the option to listen to only a set number of beats? We can then measure how many beats you need to hear before performance degrades.

Kees

Yes. Also, I have thought of changing it to a triangle test. Have you heard of that before? Three beat speeds. One is faster/slower. Two are the same. Much harder for non-experts (apparently). May completely change my conclusions.

I also thought of throwing in "equal" as a choice. And actual piano notes. Really, the test is too easy.

Here is my crack at a progressive beat speeds in one pass. It's been awhile and the ear/arm coordination slips a bit. No doubt room for improvement, I'm sure. This is done on a NY 1917 O with original soundboard and treble strings, small amount of voicing. Comments and suggestions welcomed and encouraged.

Thirds, then sixths, then tenths.
https://app.box.com/s/bw0101djsad4an182dtb3ouhlnz9cfpt

Some random noodling after the tuning - about a minute's worth
https://app.box.com/s/pse1wy4rid3zgnlyjf9es8079d5wfqce

The a sample tuning/tune from that sequence - an Einaudi piece and an improv for the last three minutes
https://app.box.com/s/sk99l7ql8kvvidsrbs7atdr4phrhuorf



Glen