Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Adult Beginners Forum Arrogance Help ft. Prodigy

Alright, a little bit of preface. I am 20 years old. So I got my first piano (digital) this January as a spontaneous Christmas gift. I've played the guitar for 7 or so years, although not very seriously. So the first thing I did when I got it was look up as many tutorial and lesson videos on youtube about technique and read the forums quite a bit. I played the Op 9 no.2 Chopin nocturne in my first 3 months(decently), spent a bit of time learning the op. 64 no.2 waltz(again, decently), got a teacher, focused purely on technique for a few months, learned op. 55 no.1 nocturne(fairly well), now I am playing Liszt's consolation No.3(well) and dabbling in Un Sospiro(which I know is out of my league but I love it too much and it has come naturally so far). So my point is this; My teacher says that I am a prodigy and that she is amazed by me. Everywhere I've mentioned my level people say that either I'm a prodigy as well or that I have a really bad ear or am lying. This has made me (combined with a little natural arrogance) extremely arrogant I feel. I just want to be able to accurately assess my abilities. I'm really curious to see what you guys think. Recording of un sospiro so far: https://soundcloud.com/d159/meh I started learning this piece 2 days ago, excuse the loud note I got carried away :p( a lot of mistakes ). Also, https://soundcloud.com/d159/mazurka this was also after a day or so of learning the notes. I know they aren't full pieces but it should give some insight into my dynamic control, phrasing, rubato, etc.

Listen to your teacher. Listen to other pianists you know. Go and play for other people or in a competition or take an exam. There's nothing to be gained by posting this stuff on the internet where it's completely unprovable. Even with good intentions you look like an attention seeker.

I don't know any other pianists unfortunately. It is a bit of an attention post but I'm honestly just looking for some discussion about it. Whether it's provable or not isn't the point.

1 word: youtube

no camera and not in a place to buy one at the moment unfortunately

Then no comment!

That's interesting... Same age, same amount of years of not seriously playing guitar. Unfortunately I'm not a prodigy, just a fast learner. To my ears (of a beginner, mind you) your performances sound quite good. That loud note in the Mazurka was, IMO, a bit too much forte though.

See a psychotherapist to work on your ego issues and to develop some social skills.

Unfortunately that is much too expensive of an option. Although, I don't think i have tremendous ego problems. I don't think that I'm a prodigy or whatnot. (maybe the sarcasm in the title was too ambiguous) I've just learned what I have in this time and everyone tells me it's impossible. Not that I have the burning desire to prove it to them, nor is it possible. As for social skills, I don't see how that is related in an anonymous forum.

Of course not. :-)

A couple of comments:

- I would rather hear perform an entire piece than just the beginning of something that you've only worked on for a couple of days. The beginnings are often the easiest parts, plus one cannot really assess playing from a few seconds of something. Also, I don't want to hear someone *almost* play something, nor do I want to hear someone play something that is supposed to demonstrate their abilities when they've only spent a couple of days on it. Anyone can cobble together 8 bars of something, but not everyone can master a piece and convey emotion throughout.

- I also agree that unless we can watch a video of you playing an entire piece, you're not really going to get any kind of assessment here with accuracy (assuming you want an accurate assessment). Use your phone, or ask your teacher if she can do a video, she may have equipment and can record during your lesson.

- What is your goal? Do you wish to become a concert pianist? If so, continue to listen to your teacher and follow her instruction. Come to listen to her other students' lessons who are playing similar levels as you if they allow it, so you can learn from them as well. Go to concerts - many are free, especially if you are near a university, many piano majors have to perform a lot and don't charge admission. You can also attend recitals of other teachers in the area, ask your teacher.

By listening to others, you will gain a better sense of where you "stand" as a player. Also, listen to lots of professional recordings on youtube. What most professionals feel is that they come to a point where they realize that the more they know, the more they realize they don't know. It's rare that a pro will feel as though they have "arrived" and no longer need to learn. Most often, they are very critical of their playing and know all the things that are wrong with it.

Another thing is that you should begin to realize that it doesn't matter "how good you are" in the sense of comparing to others. There will always be those that are far better than you, and those who are not and in the end, comparing to others really doesn't change a thing. Instead, you should develop a standard for yourself, and compare yourself to what you've done in the past, and that is a much better measuring stick.

- I also think that you need to play different styles of music if you are serious about classical music. Bach needs to be in your repertoire, as does Mozart, Beethoven, Haydn, Debussy, Ravel, Rachmaninoff at the very least. You need the experience of learning a lot of different kinds of pieces and different affects to complete your technical and musical expression.

- You should be working 3-4 pieces simultaneously, especially considering that you are a bit behind for your age. Other pianists your age are finishing up undergraduate programs as piano majors and have been exposed to tons of advanced music, in addition to collaborative piano, college theory, ear training, etc. Obviously, you can learn these things and would most likely need to attend college for piano, but even freshman piano majors have had this exposure. If you are interested in pursuing a career in classical piano, then you will have to spend a couple of years first getting in as much repertoire at a high level of playing as possible, in addition to learning as much theory and ear training as you can.

- Lastly, you will need to find a way to practice on an acoustic grand piano part of the week. Digitals are great, but for regular practice of classical music, you really need to be on a good acoustic grand. Perhaps there's one at a local school or church they will let you practice on. The sound that one can coax from an acoustic just cannot be matched by a digital - even the high-end ones.

Morodiene's bill is in the mail.

I agree with every point you make. I don't know if i seemed to imply that i thought i was done improving. I love improving and will continue to do so until i stop playing. I play on an acoustic grand piano a few hours a week. I listen to a great deal of proffessional recordings and am going to attend some competitions and meetings. I have started to hate the way that i play the op 55 nocturne but i will try to record it with phone video soon. Of course I'd like to be a concert pianist but realistically im very late to the party and it is even unlikely if i had started young. Also, I understand that it isnt important to compare my progress to others. I guess I'm just looking for some kind of verification in going into piano study in college. The only peer i have in piano is my teacher and she, of course, says that i should do it.

This is a quandary that many people face: am I good enough to make a career out of this? Unfortunately, the only way to know is to jump in and try.

You could set up a one-time lesson with a piano faculty member at a college you are considering to get their opinion on whether you should audition or not. I highly recommend that you set some goals for yourself, however.

They will want to see a well-rounded repertoire list containing things like Bach two-and three-part inventions, maybe even one prelude and fugue, a couple of Classical sonatas (mostly first movements, but one complete sonata would be great), you've got the Chopin pieces so that's covered, perhaps try one other Romantic composer like Brahms, Grieg, an easier Schumann, something like that (I wouldn't put Liszt on there unless you absolutely nailed all of it), a couple of Debussy preludes or the Arabesque, and a 20th c. piece like Bartok or Muczinski.

Each college is different, but most often if you have these things on your list you are good to go. Also, be sure to see what they require at an audition. They may have you sight read, play scales and arpeggios in any key, thing like that.

There's no reason why you wouldn't be able to have a career, except if you don't really want it. So set some short- mid- and long-term goals for yourself. You will be a bit older than others in your classes, but non-traditional students are quite common these days. In the end, your audience isn't going to refuse to listen to your playing due to your age.

If Sovrel's story is true, then there is nothing at all wrong with anything he presented, or how. If you suddenly find yourself thrown into a situation like this, in an unfamiliar world, and you're told that what you're doing is unusual, you won't know where on earth you are in any of this. Each person who studies a musical instrument on their own tends to be isolated. It's a kind of orientation. All you have is yourself, and whatever you do is your own norm.

Sovrel, if you have the unusual abilities that you seem to have, then be careful about your teacher(s) being blown away by what you can do. Make sure they go after your weak areas, and things that you may not know yet, but that they might assume you do, because of what you can do past that - holes, because of your rapid progress. Those are my thoughts.

pm me my friend

If people comment that you are a prodigy, then thank them. It is a nice polite comment on your talent. The danger is taking them or yourself too seriously.

When it comes to talent there is a large range. If you are very talented and you get really serious, it is still not too late to become a professional musician if you are willing to put in 6-8 hours or more a day into music with minimally a conservatory level instructor in piano, though you are very late in the game. Otherwise, it's all in the realm of a hobby, in which how well you play is only relevant to you.

The point is, there is no adult prodigies technically. Prodigies is a term applied only to very young children, typically starting at 2. By 20 years old, prodigies should be winning international competitions, not learning the instrument for the first time. So, it is very kind and nice when someone say you're a prodigy, but it's a off-handed remark without real meaning. They are just being polite.

You should know that people who play the piano well is basically dime a dozen. There are probably 30 million piano students in China, and that's just one country. Prodigies are far beyond. Even so, in the world of piano, there is no shortage of prodigies. Here's the 18-year-old Yundi Li winning the Chopin Competition.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yo82ipPkTRY. If you are a real prodigy, you should measure yourself to someone like that, otherwise, just thank your lucky stars that you won't have to stuggle as much as the average person having a meaningful and enriching hobby, but no more.

You also need to know every notable concert pianist almost without exception was a true prodigy, ie they perform a major concerto with a major city symphony orchestra by the time they were 12-14. You still could make it with a career in music, but to be a concert pianist, you are at a massive disadvantage when all your would be peers are all prodigies and could play rings around you when they were 10 years old.

basically the only sensible reply ^ thanks.

I think the best way to accurately assess your abilities is to find a teacher who does not call you a prodigy but instead will begin to show you how much you still need to develop to become really good. A teacher who is not blinded by the speed of you learning the notes of hard pieces but has plenty of critical advice to offer.

Here's another pianist exactly your age now, 8 years ago. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8alxBofd_eQ. There is literally no shortage of remarkable pianists like this in the world. I'm not trying to discourage but on the contrary just trying to show you the real world, so you know what you face in case you choose to go for it.

Of course one does not need to be Yuja to make a living with the piano...

But to be a successful performer the most important requirement really isn't how fast or how difficult pieces you play. The most important thing is that when you play people are captivated and want to hear more. And that your playing sounds pleasing to someone used to hearing competent playing. Judging from your soundcloud you don't quite have that yet...

The "prodigy" part of my comment in that other thread was actually a conscious exaggeration on my part. As has been said, technically the term prodigy doesn't apply to you. And "wonder boy (or girl)" pianists are indeed a dime a dozen, usually at an age much younger than twenty.

If everything you've written here is true (which I will assume it is, because what would be the point of lying about something like this?), then I think you probably do have some very remarkable abilities. But, as has been pointed out here by multiple people, you are really nothing special when compared to people your age whose natural abilities may well be somewhere in the same ballpark as yours, but who have been honing, exercising, and building upon them since they were very young.

Morodiene had some very wise words to offer, as usual. If you're serious about pursuing this talent of yours as a career, I think you'd do well to take her advice to heart.

No, but if you're a young person contemplating a future career, you should aim for the best rather than settle for the lounge pianist playing on a cruse ship to people who aren't paying attention. At least the room and board is free, I guess. There's plenty of opportunities for the OP to lower his expectations in life when he turns 30 or 40.

Ok, imagine that we are all agree you're a prodigy. If you had started at 4, you might have been the best in the world now. But reality is you cannot not get those years back. You can only move forward. We have confirmed that you're a prodigy. So what are you going to do now? The world moves on. At the end of the day, as long as you're happy with your progress and continue to play then it doesn't matter what we think.

But what if one has thick hairy legs?

Dunno, the cruise ship gig sounds pretty good to me. Far less stress, the perks could be excellent and the pay likely better. The big money is rarely found in performance accept for a very small percentile. Having a career in music is more about the love of what you do then the money aspect (usually) anyway. Starving Artist's come by the name honestly.

Although I agree with you that I will very very likely never be a concert pianist. That isn't really my goal. My goal is to teach, preferably at a high level and with high level students. If I do keep progressing at the current rate I am, however. I'd be confident that in 4 or 5 years I could play as well as many of them. I also understand that there are people much better than I am (extremely obvious) and much better than I will ever be. That can be said with anything and everything.

People have said I am a prodigy. Seriously. I have thanked them and have moved on from that because I know the real challenge is that everybody is a 'prodigy' at the bottom of the ladder.
There is mediocrity that exists there. 'prodigies' stating they are prodigies or better than others. or that is all they are chasing are complements to their 'gifts' or what they have at the moment.

those who excel start climbing up the ladder. leaving the 'prodigies' behind. The real stars are those who work. prodigy or gift or whatever is just that primer 1% hard work is the other 99% most dont know this.

Agreed. If you want to teach, then the playing field is completely different.

You still need to find the absolute best teacher possible to help you along with the explicit goal of entering a conservatory. Much of what others have said here are very wise. You should take them seriously. In music like anywhere else, there are a lot of hacks who get by making a living. They are not teaching at a high level or have any high level students. If that's what you want, you need to not waste anymore time, and do something about it immediately.

If you enter college not having done a single year of math or science your entire life and suddenly decides to major in astrophysics or quantum mechanics, no one would take you seriously. All physics majors have completed at minimum 12 years of math including calculus by the time they are 18. It is no different in music. My co-worker at the age of 40 decided to become a backyard astronomer. Now, that's a completely different situation.

This is true. I don't know if the % breakdown is exactly that, but even at 50/50, those who have massive talent and don't put in the massive work never goes anywhere. Even then, I was just talking with the Dean and Professor of one of the most prestigious music schools in NY whose graduates have all the talent and done all the work, and she said it's so hard to find steady work for someone graduating from these fine schools, the cost and debt after the fact is numbing as well, and inspiration alone cannot feed a person.

I don't know if the implication is that I didn't work hard to get where I'm at in regards to piano. But, I practiced 6-8 hours a day for the first few months, drilling out bad habits and attempting to self teach. Finding every available resource to help me on my way. Also I am not going to a prestigious university and will not be in debt by the time I graduate. At least not more than a few thousand. There is no such thing as talent without dedication. It simply doesn't exist. Not in any meaningful fashion, anyway.

..tried to post thumbs up smiley. guess it didnt work

... and there are people that are much better than they are.

As referred to earlier, as you progress you will become (with practice) better and better at what you can do. Also, you will become more and more aware of what you cannot do. So, as you advance, it is like there is always more and more. If you achieve being where you would like to be in 5 years, in 5 years you may feel you have only scratched the surface.

You are a prodigy student and your teacher had to tell you. I started learning 5 months ago, and if your teacher has been dealing with normal people like me, she must be so very happy with you.

I don't know about piano concertist, because that looks like gymnastics to me, but you can be whatever you want in life if you are very clear about it, being 20 as you are. Or just go on doing what you love and letting life lead you wherever... what you are learning can always be useful when you less expect it.

Keep bringing us songs!

I am not implying either way, just taking what you say on face value.

I've seen one really amazing child at my kids' studio. One girl began piano at 6, then went to RCM 5 within the first year then to RCM 9 the next years, then left the studio, assuming to the conservatory now 13. She didn't practice that much, according to her parents, perhaps an hour a day but less than 2. That is a prodigy. She is a very pleasant little girl until she sits on the piano, then the sound somehow does not fit the person, a maturity that is astonishing. My understanding of the difference between talent and prodigy became crystalized after I met that young lady. During a class when the teacher ask her to change something or to play a certain way, she instantly applies it. Unlike a normal person who needs to go home and practice, she instantly provided the results then and there on spot upon the teacher's explanation. Now think about what this person could do if one day she decides to practice a lot and work hard. Her parents are not musicians. It's like a complete freak accident.

Then there is the son of a family friend who at 16 stepped-in for Yo-Yo Ma at the last minute when Ma was ill, and astonished the audience. This boy is merely very talented though. His father, a cardiologist, was the first violinist in his college orchestra and a decent amateur musician, but the boy's mother is a pianist and teacher, graduated from Julliard, and teaches full time at home. He is the product of his family, a very different situation from the young lady. Most people say he's a prodigy, but he clearly is not, and his mother also agrees that he is not. He simply enjoys music and works hard, and has a musical family. He is now studying at Julliard and Columbia business school.

Actually, I am not saying you don't work hard at all. In fact to hear that you practice that much isn't such a good sign, either. It would have been better if you were able to play so well with little to no practice. If your playing is already the result of 6-8 hours of daily practice, then that's more or less average.

It's not actually that great to be a prodigy, really. It's like you have been predetermined from birth to excel in this one thing. What if it's not what you want to do? Do you throw away and waste this amazing talent that almost nobody else has? Or do you do this thing because you have no choice. It's better to be average, to work hard, and to make your own choice.

Prodigy definition:
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/prodigy

"a person with exceptional talents or power"
"a person, especially a child, of unusual or marvellous talents".

Obviously if a four year old child plays music that is usually difficult for a much older person, then this will be noticed right away. If a twenty year old plays the same music, it will not be noticed, because one will assume the twenty year old has years of experience.

The assumption can also be that of a level playing field, where everyone has a chance to start young. So if they shine, it will be right away. But in reality, some people don't get to start until they are adult.

Why "should" they be winning competitions. And what about a child who starts young, plays with such unusual abilities, but is not interested in competitions. Does he have lesser abilities because of a lack of trophies on the mantlepiece? I think you are mixing up two different things.

How can you possibly know what someone you have never met is thinking?

I wouldn't take any of that as advice.

Didn't listen. Didn't need to, because it doesn't matter.

Confidence is good. Arrogance is offputting (but probably good TV).

IMO, you probably get farther with people by being approachably confident than by being arrogant.

Not sure why you'd drop in ABF for a professional opinion; most of us here are just making music with whatever we can bring. If you want the unvarnished critique, you should be hanging out in Pianist Corner.

I realized my mistake shortly after posting lol I just considered myself a beginner and was hoping maybe someone else shared my experience

I'm really surprised as to why all of the lack of support here.

I know, we do often get those that come on and are arrogant and claim greatness - even to the point of faking it (thus why so many request a video).

But I think this person has come on here genuinely looking for affirmation and seems to be receptive to advice. I think it's best to err on the side of caution and let someone who is honestly just looking to claim to be the next Franz Liszt but not wanting to actually work at it show their true colors in time. No sense in assuming they are like that from the get-go.

Maybe there's a context from another thread I'm not aware of, so sorry if I'm way off base here.

To the OP: as far as careers go, to make a living doing music, you must often wear many hats. Don't rule out concertizing, but that's not a way to make a living. Teaching, if you have a talent for teaching, accompanying, and even performing weddings or playing at a department store. Pretty much anywhere you can to reach people with your gifts if what it's about. So don't rule yourself out, but try to explore as many different facets as you can. Explore further the things you enjoy and discard what you don't, and hopefully you'll be able to avoid those things you don't care for (or at least do them minimally).

Sovrel, it is obvious that you truly enjoy playing and I believe you are sincere in wanting to learn more. There are many great books on phrasing, technique, etc. A good book to start with is, "Schnabel's Interpretation of Piano Music" by Konrad Wolf. I have the second edition which has a new preface by Alfred Brendel. The first edition was originally published with the title, "The Teaching Of Artur Schnabel."

My only suggestion is to start looking at complete compositions. You seem to focus on the 'pretty' song parts and are missing the beauty and balance of these great compositions. Wolf's book on Schnabel's teachings will get you started on viewing the composition as a whole.

Enjoy

There is a thread in the teacher's forum where the same person asked about ways to attract enough students for him to make a living as a piano teacher. I don't really think that one indicates you are completely off base. But I think the OP invited some of these reactions when he claimed wanting to be "cured" of his arrogance.

There is nothing wrong with arrogance, IMHO, as long as you can back it up with actual chops, in which case it's just called confidence. But even then, it will still rub some people the wrong way. We tend to like our geniuses humble.

OP: you don't even really *need* to be a genius, or a prodigy, or whatever else you want to call it, to make a living with your music. I know at least a couple people who are professional musicians, and who were never seen as "prodigies", or even as particularly talented. It depends on what exactly you want. You don't need to be Yuja Wang, as outo said. Although if you *can* be Yuja Wang, I'm sure that helps.

I will look into getting that book. It does seem to me that when I finish a piece (I've finished 4 or 5 by now) it seems to fall apart. Instead of hearing the phrase that I once heard, I hear the notes. And what I should be hearing is the piece as a whole.

This is completely normal for someone with your very limited experience and practice habits that are probably far from optimal. The pieces are simply a bit too advanced for you to handle on a higher level. You may be able to get through the notes decently, but because of not having enough experience of playing different pieces and learning many of them from the scratch, your have not developed the tools to handle whole pieces and are lacking the practice methods to do this. It's all perfectly fine since you are so early in your piano journey. What you are going to do about this is what matters.

I think you should discuss a plan with your teacher to make sure you are not just jumping around but actually building a foundation of skills needed to pull off playing such pieces. If you do not get this from your present teacher you may need to consider looking for a new one.

Well, in that case, welcome to the beginner's forum, Sovrel. I hope you will hang around and learn with everyone here. As Morodiene says, this forum is very supportive. We have a ABF quarter recital as well. I would encourage you to join us and listen and play. It's a good experience. I truly look forward to hearing your pieces. Sounds like you worked hard, so it would be great fun and rewarding to share it with those who love music as much as you.

Keep your ambition in the backburner. Too soon to talk about victory on your first lap. In the mean time, enjoy the journey.

But then again, who needs another Yuja Wang, we already have one?

Could definitely use a few more Trifonov's though

Sovrel, you say you've learned 4-5 pieces so far. Can you tell us what pieces they are? Are they all Romantic or post Romantic? If you plan to study music and become a teacher you need to learn different styles of piano music, also Classical and Baroque repertoire. You need some different skills to play those. Also I think you need to be able to practice stuff you may not really love that much, but which is considered standard.

Another thing to consider:
You say you have finished 4-5 pieces in about 9 months. What else have you done? Any technical exercises? Because just to compare, I keep a diary and in the first 9 months of my piano study I had studied 28 different pieces. Much easier than what you play, but I learned a lot from all of them. I think variety in the beginning is probably more useful than spending enourmous time on just a few pieces.

I've completed 2 chopin nocturnes, waltz, and traumerei. Up until a few days ago I was just playing as a hobby so I've played the first few measures of like 50 some pieces just for fun. (Still conscious of improving, however) the pieces are op9no2 op55no1 op64no2. I'm a little more than halfway through Rach op32no12 and Liszt consolation no3. I will admit there was a two month or so period where i didnt play as well.

I'll say another thing hope this helps but a hobbyist can and will explore romantic nocturnes and other sort of atmospheric pieces from the beginning , where you can apply some sort of vanity lighting on and none of these hobbyists will consider if they are a virtuoso or anything
But a prodigy (usually comes along w the definition of being serious for the study of whatever he or she is 'prodigying ' in <lol sorry it is late> ) will usually set the groundwork on precision in note playing , precision in rhythm/tempo, precision in articulation..like in some brilliant classical work where there really is not a lot of room for error in any of the three above. .. These I would say are usually the true tests where if the student can really soar in with minimal instruction, there's reason to believe in a special case.

Analogy is an aspiring young artist will have recommendations and discussions murmured amongst the academic scholars and parents if he or she can soar in sketching painting realistic drawings (whatever) than what he can show as an abstract painting or trying to paint like a stereotypical "Picasso"

I hope you know what I mean

Now that explains a lot. 9 months at 6-8 hours a day is 1600-2100 hours, which is the equivalent of 5 or 6 years of study at a normal pace. It's not very exceptional to play a few advanced pieces after that much practice and playing the first few measures of anything means absolutely nothing. I'd say you're a very serious hobbyist but nothing more. How about going through the grade requirements and completing all the stuff you would normally expect at this level, like a complete classical sonata, a complete WTC P&F, some modern pieces, technical exercises, etc?

I just listened to your sospiro here are two comments first good and second bad or good how you look at it depends:

1 you play that first page and a half well. Well done. I'm impressed if that was the piece.
You do have a understanding of how the music is to be expressed and how the piano is to be sounded for that articulation of those first dozen measures or so. At least for after only couple days.
This is a piece I only hear one very experienced piano student play at school (and a professor , at least it is implied she can play it well bc she is instructing that student on this piece and she also plays it (better) in the parts she is correcting her on.

2 this is a piece I hear almost every other student (well, let say every one out three;still a lot) can whip out that first part of that Liszt beautifully. They don't study it but you know ..some kids like to fool around on the practice pianos while their friends are on their iPhones and chatting and ...they just whip that part out. They also can whip out the first few measures of moonlight 3rd movement and the repeating theme on étude 10 5 or some popular Rachmaninov piece. But only the first few measures. They don't claim to play it well they just learned it for fun you know . Go to any music dept there are always a handful of these kids , but In class they are working on s Bach prelude or Mozart something and not that that is bad I'm just describing what I see at school.
Tired to type now but I think everyone knows where I'm going w this.

Fun subject. Love to discuss this.

I only played 6-8 hours a day for the first month or so. The rest probably avgs to 1 or 2 a day.

It's tricky because I don't know whether a piece is too difficult and I'd be wasting my time learning it or if it is just above my level and it is the piece I need to advance. I'm really bad with any kind of runs involving thirds and I'm not sure if i can make it past the arpeggios in rh after the climax. I'm practicing them now and building tempo though so hopefully it works out.

Sovrel, make sure you and your teacher are not letting the glitter of advanced pieces masquarade the foundation you need in various styles, techniques, and theory. The fragments you've posted suggest potential. At nine months, you've made a very good start. Attending music school will (should) give you the broad knowledge you need and most importantly, time and experience at the piano.

My own bias would be for you to hold off teaching until you've had more experience *of* teachers and being taught. Observe how those teachers approach teaching, what they teach, and what works well for different types of students. Best of luck to you!

This is what a teacher is for: to introduce pieces to you in an order that makes sense, building upon what you already know plus adding one or two new challenges. I would not be giving you the Liszt to work on at this time.

Did your teacher assign this to you? Also, how much experience does this teacher have with advanced repertoire?

She isn't an advanced teacher, just a friend of the family so we get a discount. I don't think in my position any teacher could recommend the right piece for me though. If they could I definitely can't afford them lol

This is one thing a good teacher should be able to help you with ...

Have you checked around to know fur sure you couldn't afford a better teacher? If you are near a college that has a music department, there are sometimes graduate students who have to teach students as a part of their degree, and you can get lessons that are quite affordable this way, plus you are studying with a more accomplished pianist who has a mentoring teacher they can go to with specific questions about how to help you.

Also, I totally disagree with your assertion that any teacher wouldn't know what to assign you. I gave you a list of things that you should be studying, and I'm not unique. There are many teachers that I know of who teach privately and have quite advanced students and don't charge more than most other teachers.

You generally get what you pay for. Your teacher is clearly both giving you a discount and taking a major discount out of your education. It is all fine if you are just fooling around and want a hobby. It's another thing entirely if you're serious and have possible career ambitions with it. Clearly your teacher does not take you or your wishes seriously, certainly not as seriously as I do. I always take young people very seriously.

You need a real teacher. Real teachers are not cheap. You need to do some soul searching and know how serious you are when you say you want to teach or perform classical music at a high level. If you are thinking out loud, fine. We all do that sometimes. If you are really serious, you have to take this like any educational endeavor and take on the burden of paying for the cost of such an education, by work, by loans, by whatever means today's young people achieve their educational goals. It is not possible to achieve your stated goals without proper higher education. There is no precedent whatsoever in someone becoming a classical piano teacher at a high level without 16-20 years of quality training.

Since you're 20, I think it is possible for you to reach your dreams, but you have to be extremely committed to it. You need to live, breath, eat, and dream classical music, and practice 6-8 hours a day. If you were 30, I would simply say, don't quit your day job, and keep playing piano 1-2 hours a day. It's a great hobby.

YES. This, this, this!!! I started playing about 18 years ago as a brand new beginner and my teacher started me on Chopin preludes within the first year, and Solfeggietto by CPE Back at about a year and a half. With no theory even glanced at. NO WAY should I have been playing these pieces, they took me forever to learn and I had no concept of the actual music behind the glitz. After a little over 2 1/2 years I quit, mainly due to a new job working swing shifts, but also because I just wasn't really understanding music or loving it at all. It was mostly really stressful.

I came back to playing this past Feb. out of the blue, 15 years from the last time I sat down at a piano. The difference is now I'm actually learning music using a wonderful method, and....I'm happy, and I get what I'm playing. So please, do yourself a favor and really learn MUSIC, not just how to hit the keys to make something sound good. Solid knowledge of theory and technique makes all the difference!

Best of luck to you, enjoy the journey!

She does teach theory. I will discuss with her the situation. She isn't a bad teacher, nor does she overlook anything in my lessons. She doesn't praise me during any lessons or anything. She advises me on technique, wrist movement, phrasing, dynamics, etc. I've never played something for her to have her respond, "that's good" like there is no more work to be done. Honestly I can't compare it to anything else as I've never had another teacher. I will try to get her to set me up with some advanced teacher if she knows one for a guest lesson.

I haven't written anything else because my first post got no response. It was a bit along the line of what Stubbie wrote.

Sovrel, Interpreting and playing piano music is a wonderful hobby. No shame in enjoying yourself.

This series may be of interest:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7PZEJ9CsBfM

Hi Sovrel, sounds great after just a few months, glad you are enjoying piano so much.
Some of the comments you received can be explained by the fact that a remarkably large number of self-described "adult prodigies" come by here and post a little about themselves then disappear.

About your playing, the Liszt is actually better than the Chopin despite your comments. You have a nice serenity in the Liszt piece, good singing long line in the RH, and the LH is fast and fluid without becoming rattling or over-loud. The Chopin has serious rhythmic problems. I do not know this particular mazurka but I have played many and know the mazurka rhythm, and even knowing it, I can't hear it or really any rhythm at all. Rubato is appropriate in Chopin but never so much that you lose the rhythmic backbone. So maybe try it with more willingness to hear a rustic oom-ba-pah pah and see where you get. It should make you want to dance.

About your questions, right now you are really motivated to play a lot, and whatever avenue you eventually choose for piano playing, playing a lot right now and getting as good as you can is certainly the best thing to do. You are headed to university soon and it sounds like you know which university it will be, does it have a good piano faculty? That seems the logical place to start with a new and very knowledgeable teacher. If you have trouble explaining what you're doing to other people without feeling like you're coming off as an arrogant jerk, don't worry, it's temporary. When you get to university you will be around many more experienced piano students and it will be all you can do to keep up.

Enjoy the music!

Bit of an update, terrible iphone recording of a full piece. A lot of mistakes.. still not used to acoustic pianos.. need so much more time with them. Chopin, Nocturne op 55 no 1 https://soundcloud.com/d159/20151008-143927a-1

($80k steinway that you can't even hear because of the quality )

That's a link to the live Chopin competition.

yes it was, my bad. Missed the c key.

Are you still planning on providing a recording of you playing?

It is edited into the previous post. I just replaced the link.

Thanks for posting this.

From what I heard, I agree that you need more time with acoustic pianos (grands especially). I'm hearing a bit of harshness to your tone when you get to the loudest parts, and some other subtleties in dynamics that you are lacking. I'm pretty sure they're due to a technical issue, but it could be a musical/listening thing too. It seems mainly in your LH, but I do hear it in some of the louder section in your RH.

Perhaps a video of a portion of your playing...maybe a few measures from the softer A section and then something from the louder B section?

Yeah, I've spent a total of probably 30 hours on an acoustic piano. The harshness in this is just because I was playing it too loudly. Playing the LH that softly on an acoustic vs digital is a completely different feel. The inconsistencies stem from trying too hard to play it quietly. I'm pretty confident that as I play more on an acoustic, my LH will become more comfortable, allowing me much more focus on other things. Could you point out where these inconsistencies are, if you have time?


I may be able to record a video in a few weeks as I'm playing for a "chopin expert" and she has recording equipment.