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I am in the process of unloading my Petrof IV, trading it in for an Intermediate top-size upright and some $$$. These are the photos I will announce to the various dealers. I would appreciate any comments about shots that I should add, or anything that looks bad, etc. There are a couple of small defects on the cabinet (leg, side of front, side), but it seems that the guts look fabulous.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/137017779@N04/shares/8HvpSm

I have put the photos to Flickr. On a side note, Pinterest is GARBAGE! AVOID!

I'm not advocating covering up any blemishes or defects in the finish, but you'd be surprised what improvements you could make with a black magic marker/furniture marker.

I agree the insides look good, but you might be hard pressed to get cash back from a dealer on a trade for an upright; I think that (trading down) is probably rare... dealers don't usually pay out cash on trades, that I know of; they will take your piano on trade, and they want the cash too.

In my opinion, your best bet would be to try to sell the piano straight out and then buy an upright, if that is what you want.

And, yes, I know, pianos are hard to sell, even at lower than average prices.

Good luck!

Rick

Where did that crazing come from? That would make me concerned as a buyer, that the piano wasn't kept in a good environment.

Other than that, it would be nice if you could get a wider shot instead of a ton of close-ups. Also, the finish tends to look better if you don't use a flash and have better lighting, but the dealers can probably decide based on what you have whether they'd want to take in the piano. If those were advertisement photos I'd advise you to hire a photographer to best show off your piano.

Perhaps it doesn't phase a dealer, but my immediate impression from the photos makes me uneasy with how the piano is being stored. It's obviously in a storage room or garage based on the old instrument cases and milk crates stuffed underneath and the pinball machine literally sitting 2 inches away from it. I'd also be alarmed that the belly of the piano seems to be sitting directly in front of a window that has a piece of cardboard in place of the glass, and a wall of raw plywood directly beside the opened lid. I would definitely be concerned about temperature and humidity of the storage area. And the abundance of fingerprints, streaks, dust and crazing on the finish make me feel like it's been neglected. (ie: if the owner couldn't be bothered to even wipe it down before taking pictures to sell it how was it treated the rest of its life?)

Were I trying to get the most from the piano, I would remove all doubt from anyone's mind. Move the dusty cases from under the piano, move the pinball machine, wipe the whole thing down with a rag and some windex and the proposal would feel much better to me. Again, dealers may well be used to this. But if I were trading in my car, I'd at least drive through a car wash and vacuum the interior before pulling in to the dealer's lot. Just MHO as a layman.

All good advice...

But I don't think doing everything you mentioned would make one iota of difference with a dealer; a private buyer, most definitely.

Also, I don't think washing and vacuuming out the old car would make one iota of difference on trade-in value.

Just my .02.

Rick

It is in the room that most would consider as "the parlor" or "the den".

For one window, it is not cardboard; it is OSB. There is a proper, sealed window behind it; I just have not bothered taking the board down as the piano is there. (I put it up any time I go away during the hurricane season.) The window there does not get any sun. The other window is to an enclosed garage (which was broken when burglars came in through the garage and that window.) Yes, the space is cramped, which is part of the reason I am looking to sell. I suppose that if those other things are what a piano buyer is interested in (i.e., not the excellent condition of the hammers & strings, etc.), I could retake the photos that show those other things.

Yes, there is crazing on the sides of the front. I would think that for glossy ebony, this would not be a big deal as it could be fixed. The small gouges on the legs are obviously not crazing, and since the height of them does not seem match anything I have there, that may have been there since when I had bought it, or when it was shipped (I guess I didn't bother to look); perhaps there was something there when I was moving it around. Still, that wouldn't seem to be that big of a deal either (i.e., a few hundred $ to fix).

What I am much more interested in is whether I am missing some angles, or if somehow the photos show that the piano is in bad shape, not my house; I know the house could be in better shape.

Exactly. I want the dealer to be able to look at my piano and say "I could fix a few cosmetic things on the cabinet, give the seller $15K, and sell it for $22K, and sell the seller one of my uprights as well."

BTW, today I went to look at a Seiler ED-132 (i.e., the one made in Indonesia), and the when we talked about my Petrof IV, he was thinking of how much *I* would have to give *him* in addition to the trade-in to get his piano, LOL. (I was not all that impressed with that piano, BTW.)

I did furniture polish everywhere - perhaps I put TOO much on, and that what was causing the streaking. The fingerprints are there because it is such a tight fit that I had to touch the piano to get around it. I suppose I could rebuff the outside and take new photos.

Oh, and I can't take a photo from anywhere farther away as the room is too small to get far enough away.

My default choice for the upright all along has been the Perzina 129, which I think I can get new straight for cash for about $6500-7000. One dealer has already told me he'd give me $2500 in cash with that trade (and he sounds like he is flexible). But in that case, is my piano only worth $9K? I DON'T THINK SO! (channeling my inner prequel-era Obi-Wan Kenobi.) If I can't get a number closer to $14K (I was going to go for $15K, but with the newly discovered cabinet blemishes, I'll relent), I'll just continue to enjoy my grand until I can sell it in a private sale.

I was offered $7k cash or $8k consignment for my Petrof IV (a few years older than yours) from a dealer. If you're looking for money back, you're going to get a wholesale price offer.

Swampwiz, I'm thinking the dealer who offered you $2500 cash back for trading your Petrof IV in on a new upright was probably a generous deal, coming from a dealer. I think you would hard pressed to beat that, but it may be possible.

I think selling your piano out-right and paying cash for your upright is likely the best option, depending on whether or not you run out of patience trying to sell your Petrof privately.

Best of luck to you either way.

Rick

If you are looking to get out of the piano what you think it would sell for in a private sale, you may as well skip the trade in idea. Essentially you are wanting to buy a piano while asking the dealer to sell yours for you and give you the proceeds, they will want to make money on both transactions (think of trading in a car). The dealer is also going to have the cost of moving the piano, prep work, a cash outlay increasing the value of their inventory, it just won't be worth it to them (unless they are desperate to move the piano you are looking at buying).

Regarding your pictures, high polish finishes are really hard to take photos of. A certain angle can hide all sorts of swirls or scratches, a bad angle (or flash) and it looks like the piano is in horrible shape, they really can't be trusted. Have you thought of doing a video (might be helpful with the private sale too), it might show a better view of what the piano actually looks like (and sounds like). If there is any way you can store the other items in that room somewhere else, that would be a good marketing move. Just like you stage a house when trying to sell it, every detail helps. Good luck!

I think you're going to have to lower your expectations... I have a feeling that it's going to be tough to get much interest since Petrof doesn't have the name recognition.

Maybe also consider a trade plus cash with a private buyer who is looking to upgrade to a grand? That might be your best bet!

But take some better photos if you're going for a private sale (maybe pay to get that crazing fixed up), and good luck!

Ooooooh, video is a great idea! Seconded!

Especially since you have a tight space and can't get a wide shot!

TIP: I noticed you said you used furniture polish, which can cause terrible streaking on poly finishes. Use windex instead and it will remove some of the haze and streaks.

After testing out the Seiler ED-132 and being underwhelmed, and then playing my Petrof right after, I am starting to think about just blowing off my idea. I will still try out the Knabe WKV-132 and blow off even trying the Perzina as it would be a long drive that would not be necessary if I weren't strongly considering getting it. Also, it turns out that the salesman who told me I could get a Perzina upright for $X was not accurate, but actually $Y when the sales manager got involved, making it an even less desirable transaction. There is no way in h3ll that I am going to sacrifice my piano like that.

I think I will generate room by putting that pinball machine in the kitchen, LOL.

Unfortunately, in your position, wanting to trade down, you are at the dealer's mercy (and some are not too merciful when it comes to making a healthy profit ). So, deciding to keep the Petrof may be in your best interest.

Also, you can always put the piano up for sale and just enjoy it until you can get an acceptable price for it.

Wishing you the best of luck whatever you do.

Rick

Yes, I guess if word gets around that Petrof is a great unknown piano, and a friend of a friend ... knows about mine, I'd sell it for the right price. But even then, would I ever be satisfied by an upright that could be bought at half the price?

I seem to find myself attached to big purchases like a car, piano or home, as I typically buy what I really want, and know that I had made the correct decision. (My current home does not fit into this category, as it was more of "I need a home somewhere" and "I need to spend the government grant given to me for my flooded home".) And it pretty much takes a car wreck or home catastrophic loss (and the Charles Walter sitting inside it) to get another one. And I think part of the reason is that the transfer costs are so high that the replacement good would need to be really, really better - or my financial position be so much better that the transfer costs is affordable - for me to change. Of course, in a home catastrophic loss or (insured) car wreck, full replacement value is given by insurance, so there is no loss there.