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My instinct tells me that I should just let them go but have another back up teacher ready for them (male), so I am currently contacting male teachers in the area to see if any of them have availability. Would it be okay to say, "starting on this date (maybe three weeks from now or something), I won't be able to come to your house anymore, but I've found another teacher who is available"? Don't schedule a new teacher for them. That's not your obligation. Giving a list of names is already going above and beyond. You should just stop teaching this student. No explanation is needed. Be kind to the student as much as you can. By the way, male teachers are not expempt from unwanted sexual advances. It feels icky for us too (whether the sexual advances are from men or women)
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Like casinitaly said, your radar is up for a reason. If you're contemplating taking pepper spray to the lesson, don't go back.
Maybe the guy is just a totally unaware goofball who thinks he's being polite, but that doesn't matter. What matters is you don't like it.
I'm a totally unaware goofball myself, but I've made it a point to never make any comment that might even have the slightest chance of being misinterpreted by my teacher.
Well, once I made fun of Ludvig Schytte's name, but that's it!
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My instinct tells me that I should just let them go but have another back up teacher ready for them (male), so I am currently contacting male teachers in the area to see if any of them have availability. Would it be okay to say, "starting on this date (maybe three weeks from now or something), I won't be able to come to your house anymore, but I've found another teacher who is available"?
There are many things that strike me as misguided about your well-meaning idea, prettychords. First of all, are you explaining to the prospective male teachers about your current sexual discomfort? If so, why would one of them suddenly be interested in dealing with this jerk of a father in the guy's own home? Maybe he will come onto the new male replacement teacher just as he is doing to you. And viewing this from the family's point of view, why should they suddenly want to switch to another teacher that you are imposing on them? They probably think you are great, and that everything is fine. You have given them no reason to think otherwise. Clearly Dad looks forward to seeing you at lessons, and we hope his child does also. There is also the matter of billing. How does this family pay you? It's best to part ways when they are paid up - especially if it is going to end badly like this. Of course, if they pay you at each lesson, then it's easy: you can just end a lesson and say, "By the way, this will be our last lesson" and head out the door. To me that's unprofessional, but I think many of my colleagues on this board would say that this man's behavior is so out of line that it doesn't matter how you behave. I disagree, but I'm probably much older than you and don't view your situation in as uncomfortable a light as you do. However, you also have your own reputation in the community to consider. Could this family make your studio teaching future less successful, if they start telling friends and neighbors that you suddenly divorced them without explanation? You could sound like a total flake of a teacher in their explanation. And you haven't told us anything about your relationship to your young student. What is this child to think if you suddenly walk away from your teaching? Can you change the lesson day/time to one where Pop is not at home? Or where Mom is always home? Can you combine two students at your home so that little Sheila or Oscar shares a lesson with another child? I think there must be another workable solution. I am a female, but I completely agree with every single word Peter says here. If the student is making progress and enjoys learning from you, you can pretty much arrive on the dot and leave on the dot, and communicate with the parents (copying both parents) via email. It could be completely unprofessional for you to drop the student with no explanation, and could be potentially damaging to your career if word gets around. Nobody will know about the shoulder touching, only that you flaked. Is it fair? No, it is not, but that is the world we live in. If I quit my job every time I got an "icky" feeling from a male colleague (and I work in a male-dominated field), I wouldn't have a career. Stand up tall and act professional with a touch of cold towards the Dad. He will eventually get it and stop. It is very unlikely you are actually in any "danger" from this person, especially when his kid is there, but I could be wrong of course.
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It could be completely unprofessional for you to drop the student with no explanation, and could be potentially damaging to your career if word gets around. No. I don't think it could be - unless you are under contract that specifies a term. Look, we get emotionally involved in our work and we want to persevere for our students. That is good. But this is a business, and we are under no obligation to render services. As far as reputation, we can consider real examples. We have one teacher in our region who has dropped students like a hot potato. People knew there were reasons, and it didn't damage the teacher's reputation. If anything it damaged the student's reputation. As far as the teacher's reputation, maybe it communicated to some people there are things this teacher won't put up with. That's not a bad thing. I accepted one of the transfer students, btw. Neither that student nor the parent badmouthed the previous teacher.
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It could be completely unprofessional for you to drop the student with no explanation, and could be potentially damaging to your career if word gets around. No. I don't think it could be - unless you are under contract that specifies a term. Look, we get emotionally involved in our work and we want to persevere for our students. That is good. But this is a business, and we are under no obligation to render services. As far as reputation, we can consider real examples. We have one teacher in our region who has dropped students like a hot potato. People knew there were reasons, and it didn't damage the teacher's reputation. If anything it damaged the student's reputation. As far as the teacher's reputation, maybe it communicated to some people there are things this teacher won't put up with. That's not a bad thing. I accepted one of the transfer students, btw. Neither that student nor the parent badmouthed the previous teacher. I agree. As a profession, we are not obligated to put up with unpleasant, difficult, unethical, or dangerous situations just because we sometimes teach in the client's home. It's not unprofessional to drop a student if you do it like a grown-up. None of the the teachers I know or have taught have a problem with this, personally or in their business dealings. Attrition is a part of this business, and some of it comes from the teachers themselves. There is no good reason to keep students or their parents in your class if you don't want to work with them. As a matter of fact, there's every good reason to get rid of them if the business or personal relationship is not working out. Other professionals e.g. doctors, lawyers, accountants, even hairdressers, refer clients out all the time when they can't or don't want to work with them. It doesn't hurt their businesses at all, and a lot more is at stake for both the provider and the client in those disciplines. And just like passion said, having standards of behavior in your studio makes it clear to others that there are thing they can't do in front of you. Which is a very good and useful thing.
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If I quit my job every time I got an "icky" feeling from a male colleague (and I work in a male-dominated field), I wouldn't have a career. Stand up tall and act professional with a touch of cold towards the Dad. In the job that you have, first of all, are you self-employed, or is there the hierarchy that goes with employment where there are supervisors and people to turn to? Does your work entail regularly going into private homes where nobody but yourself and the people in that home know where you are and what is happening there? When you are in someone else's home, if the unthinkable happens, all the adult has to do is block your way out even when you "arrive punctually" and plan to leave on the dot. That one rare time something happens is one time too much. In my own freelance work, some customers come to the door to pick up the work. I have an arrangement with a nearby small restaurant, that if for any reason I am uncomfortable, I meet the customer there rather than at my home. There is nothing unprofessional about choosing who your clients will be, or feeling safe in your work.
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It is very unlikely you are actually in any "danger" from this person, especially when his kid is there, but I could be wrong of course. All the dad has to do is arrange things so the kid is not there at lesson time...the teacher finds that out after she walks in and the door is shut and locked behind her.
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People of this lovely forum. You are seriously freaking me out!
We have a father, who is possibly trying to hit to the piano teacher. From this, to labeling him a probably rapist, there's a loooooong way and it's really scary!
Unless you really live in a country where a dad of your student will make sure the kid is away, will lock the door in order to do whatever he has in mind. I mean how often does this happen in your area?
This doesn't mean that the piano teacher has to like this, or should NOT be careful. Safety first. And, of course, if she's freaking out herself by certain moves of the father she should seriously stay out of there. But between that and all of us ganging up against this parent, who none of us knows... ? hmmm...
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Nikolas, there is a very different view on security and safety in US compared to Europe. According to me they exaggerate many risks. I think it's bad if you can only trust your own family or people in your own group, there should be trust in a society. I also dislike the attitude towards guns in US. If there are guns available, people will get shot at some point. However, I am not expecting the whole world to agree with my views. There is simply a different outcome when discussing these issues in different parts of the world.
What would I do in the teaching situation? I would consider saying "stop doing that, it's not acceptable" to the dad. I would do so at an early stage and would not accept any excuses or discussion. I would also consider telling the wife why I am leaving, since she needs to know. It depends on the situation if I would feel the outcome could be successful. In maybe 20 percent of the cases I might feel safe enough to try the option and in 80 percent of the cases I would simply end lessons.
I have never as a student had a lesson in a techer's home or heard of of any teacher at all who come to the student's home. If I was a teacher I would not consider going to student's homes, since it only invites odd situations to happen. It is better and more professional to find a way to have a real studio.
Nothing is accomplished without enthusiasm. - Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Nikolas, nobody is "ganging up" on the father, and nobody is labeling him as a probably rapist or as anything. This is pretty standard for the lives of women. If there are warning signs, you don't take chances if you don't have to. Things do happen, and it is impossible to tell when they will, so it is best to take precautions.
I bit my tongue when Peter's post came up. The teacher was reminded of how the child might suffer by the teacher leaving (guilt), how stopping lessons could affect the teacher's reputation (fear), and then that he had the advantage of age (makes you doubt yourself). This bothered me. How often do people stay in uncomfortable situations, often to their own harm, because of feelings of guilt and fear of repercussions. Hesitation, giving the other the benefit of doubt, self-doubt, lack of strong moves, these are things that are often engrained in our upbringing.
I am heartened to see the support by some people like Laguna Greg, but quite disheartened especially by the some of the male population making light of this.
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You mean that this comment (below) is not set up against someone who is not here to explain himself, or what not? All the dad has to do is arrange things so the kid is not there at lesson time...the teacher finds that out after she walks in and the door is shut and locked behind her. Is this NOT an assumption that the dad is up to no good? Is this NOT sexist against all male population on the earth? As you can see the post above yours by Basia is quite clear that the mentality is different between the US and Europe. Which is what I'm talking about here. I'm not a female, so obviously I don't know the dangers around such things, but at the same time I am a male and I know perfectly well how to act, react and be around females, without wanting to harm anyone. Just a notice (once more): Under no circumstances I'm insinuating one bit for the teacher to stay in that house if she feels uncomfortable. And that's all it matters. But for the rest... :-/
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Nikolas, in life we must take precautions to stay safe. When you lock your doors at night, you are not accusing your neighbours of being thieves - but the reality exists that people do enter houses, steal things, and even hurt or kill the occupants. When children are taught not accept rides from strangers, chances are that a stranger seeing a child walking home in cold weather merely intends to be kind, but one cannot know. It is not a painting of all strangers as bad, but again a reality that exists.
One of the teachers here videos all his lessons, and gives the video to his students so they can study what they did in the lesson. But he also has the camera in there as a protection, because male teachers in particular can be accused of molestation. This is not prejudice against parents, expecting them to do such a thing. But one exercises caution.
Some people were making light of the situation, trivializing the unease of this teacher. They were stating that all she had to do was show up on time and leave on time, then nothing could ever happen. That is not the reality, so one or two people finally had to be blunt and give the worse case scenario.
This has nothing to do with painting men as bad. It does have to do with making wise decisions if uncomfortable because things can and do happen.
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Yes, that video part of the lessons, in case there's a legal issue against the teacher also strikes me as bizarre unfortunately (I remember the discussion).
I just don't want to come to terms that we need to over react to everything. Wearing your sit belt while driving is not an over reaction. Carrying a gun around is. There's a massive difference between these two poorly chosen examples.
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Most Americans do not carry guns. Americans do not live in fear... Yes, we have areas of the towns where we would not walk alone at night, but that is true globally. No assumptions should be made about a country and the people that live there including that opinions on a post are indicative of 'country thinking' or 'country practice'. Enough said.
the Dad in this case may never do anything but make these unwanted overtures,
BUT there is no reason to be uncomfortable as a teacher.
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Most Americans do not carry guns. Americans do not live in fear... Yes, we have areas of the towns where we would not walk alone at night, but that is true globally. No assumptions should be made about a country and the people that live there including that opinions on a post are indicative of 'country thinking' or 'country practice'. Enough said. Yes, but nowhere in my posts I claim that Americans carry guns, etc. This was your assumption to the subject, rather than mine and I was very careful when posting to NOT single out a country! Read my post again! BTW, I'm constantly a victim of biased assumptions on my country, on based on where I was born, as you may understand, so it's not something I tend to take lightly. So, again, we should always protect ourselves, yet we should not over react to absolutely everything that happens. As I've said a number of times, the teacher feeling uncomfortable is enough for her to get out and never come back. The rest is little chat about everything else... :P
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Most Americans do not carry guns. Americans do not live in fear... Yes, we have areas of the towns where we would not walk alone at night, but that is true globally. No assumptions should be made about a country and the people that live there including that opinions on a post are indicative of 'country thinking' or 'country practice'. Enough said. Yes, but nowhere in my posts I claim that Americans carry guns, etc. This was your assumption to the subject, rather than mine and I was very careful when posting to NOT single out a country! Read my post again! BTW, I'm constantly a victim of biased assumptions on my country, on based on where I was born, as you may understand, so it's not something I tend to take lightly. So, again, we should always protect ourselves, yet we should not over react to absolutely everything that happens. As I've said a number of times, the teacher feeling uncomfortable is enough for her to get out and never come back. The rest is little chat about everything else... :P Hi Nick Go back and read posts from members other than yourself regarding assumptions about Americans, guns and mistrust.
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Fair enough. I just logged back on to say that indeed... that's enough bickering... :-/ And this thread should probably die. The OP is nowhere to be found, and we've kinda beat this thread as much as possible... Let's go back fighting about which piano method is best!
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Sorry Dogperson! Of course there are different opinions on the matter in the US. When I stated my personal opinion, I did not mean to imply it's the only valid opinion nor that all Americans would be the same.
The thing is, in this post there seemed to be so much "not understanding" between those who believe the OP:s situation was dangerous and those who believe that the risks are overestimated. I was just offering one perspective on why there are two diverse views. It's only one perspective and not the complete picture. Other posters pointed at differences between male and female assessment of the situation. I don't think people necessarily mean to generalize when using groups to illustrate a point.
Nothing is accomplished without enthusiasm. - Ralph Waldo Emerson
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You mean that this comment (below) is not set up against someone who is not here to explain himself, or what not? All the dad has to do is arrange things so the kid is not there at lesson time...the teacher finds that out after she walks in and the door is shut and locked behind her. Is this NOT an assumption that the dad is up to no good? Is this NOT sexist against all male population on the earth? As you can see the post above yours by Basia is quite clear that the mentality is different between the US and Europe. Which is what I'm talking about here. I'm not a female, so obviously I don't know the dangers around such things, but at the same time I am a male and I know perfectly well how to act, react and be around females, without wanting to harm anyone. Just a notice (once more): Under no circumstances I'm insinuating one bit for the teacher to stay in that house if she feels uncomfortable. And that's all it matters. But for the rest... :-/ Hi Nick, I'm a man, and I did not find that observation sexist at all. Rather, I found it to be a some-time accurate assessment of what happens to women, and very occasionally to men. Sexual assault has been at high levels in Western countries and elsewhere as long they have been keeping numbers about it. I recently had to give a talk about gender identity and sexual violence here in the US to a charitable group I work with, and I was shocked to discover that as many as 19% of women and 6% of men experience sexual assault, up to and including penetration, at least once in their lives. National police services and the FBI both consider these numbers under-reported by as much as 50% and possibly more. The numbers are similar in other 1st world countries, and considerably worse elsewhere. So rape and sexual assault are a very wide-spread and serious problem fore everyone. The numbers have gone down only a little bit since I was a teenager, despite a much more open dialogue and legally responsive environment. The majority of rapes are perpetrated by people the victim knows, like family friends, dates, and even clients. So since this is such a big problem, it certainly pays to take a few minimal precautions. Also, let's not all pretend that sexual violence isn't a problem, because it is, and not just for women even if most sexual assaults are made against them. So no, it's not an overreaction to think the dad might be up to no good. As a matter of fact, just by coming on to the piano teacher even slightly, he has already shown that his intentions are not above-board. At the very least, he's trying to pull a fast one on his wife. I wouldn't trust a guy like that, and I don't do business with anyone who behaves like that. Would you? I certainly wouldn't want my sister to have to work with him or his family. Would you?
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And this thread should probably die. The OP is nowhere to be found, and we've kinda beat this thread as much as possible...
Let's go back fighting about which piano method is best! This thread definitely should not die. Piano method books are relatively unimportant. Years ago these things were not talked about, so things happened, and kept on happening. People in bad situations didn't know what to do about them. This has changed. This thread needs to be read and I'm glad it is here.
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