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Hi All!

So far this forum has been amazing at helping me find what I'm looking for in a piano.
I'm looking for a digital piano that plays like an acoustic piano, but that costs between $500 to $1500. I know, this is probably impossible.

I grew up on a Kawai acoustic upright, so I am used to the keys being fairly easy to play ( not too stiff), and the sound a little brighter than most, and not muffled or too dark. I also played a Steinway in college every chance I got. I haven't played for a few years (because I don't have a piano, and I can't seem to find one that I'm pleased with), but it is getting to the point where I absolutely have to have one. I am not a beginner piano player, and so am not looking for something that has good enough quality for beginners, but not for performers. I'm not anywhere near professional, but I know what sound and feel I want. I play a lot more classical than any other style.

The only digital pianos I have found that sound remotely close to my Kawai tend to be way too expensive for what I can afford.

So is there any hope for me? Is there a digital piano out there that would actually work for my expectations and price range? I know I don't like Rolands. They feel too stiff and muffled for me, as good as they may be.

I was looking at the Yamaha DPX 660 for $800, but it seems that isn't good for classical. I was also looking at the KawaiCP-150 for $800 Suggestions? I'm ok with paying up to $1500. I don't care about the bells and whistles. I just want my digital piano to sound like a great accoustic piano.

Thanks!

I would definitely look to buy a second-hand digital rather than a new one. The action on a digital piano lightens over time and use, so if you are looking for a lighter action then a second-hand piano is more likely to fit the bill.

The value of a digital piano falls off a cliff after purchase (like any electrical appliance) so you will get a much better deal.

I have a Roland digital piano that is nearly 30 years old, and it plays and sounds great (though the action is now too light for me).

In a digital piano, sound is a combination of the samples built into the piano and the speakers / headphones. Any digital piano from any of the major manufacturers from the last 10 years is going to have a great set of samples. And a good set of 'phones can do wonders for a digital piano sound.

Good luck!

Hello kristinh,

You might do well to ask a moderator to move your post over to the digital piano forum.

I recognize that some people do not prefer Roland's warmer tone, but their actions are on the lighter side of average, not stiff, so it makes me wonder if what you tried is not representative of typical.

But for a quick answer, in the sub-$1k market, Casio's Privia models tend to be the most competitive. Roland now has a very good entry level in that range too, the FP-30. A good all-around entry level digital from Yamaha is the P115.

Staying under $1500, I'd recommend the following consoles:
Casio Celviano AP-460
Roland F-140R (or RP-401R is $1599)
Yamaha YDP-163

Both Casio & Yamaha tend to have a brighter sound than Roland, but both also tend to be firmer.

Kawai makes good, competitive models as well, but I'm less familiar with them to recommend.

Thank you both for your help! I think I will focus on getting a 2nd hand digital piano to hopefully get the qualities I need.

How do I ask moderator to move my post over?

I used to have a Yamaha P120, and paired with good headphones (this is key, the onboard speakers were not great), I thought it was remarkably good for a digital piano. It had its physical limitations if I wanted to play with some force since it'd top out, but for mellower pieces it was pretty convincing. I bought it new for about $1k over ten years ago, so I'm sure you wouldn't have a problem finding a newer version in your budget, or maybe you can find a used P120 for cheap. I had read somewhere that it had the same technology as the Clavinovas, but was priced much less since it didn't look as nice.

>>>
The only digital pianos I have found that sound remotely close to my Kawai tend to be way too expensive for what I can afford.
<<<

Exactly right.

You're fighting on three fronts:

a) the mechanical construction of the keys -- making something that _feels_ like an acoustic-piano keyboard is expensive (and tends to be heavy).

b) the quality of the "sound generator" -- the circuitry that converts keystrokes to audio waveforms. Making something that duplicates the sound of an acoustic piano, with its resonances, mis-tunings of harmonics, long and complex decays, isn't easy.

c) the quality of the amplifiers and loudspeakers. An acoustic piano has a _big_ soundboard, and produces both more volume, and more low bass, than the loudspeakers in inexpensive (and moderate-price) DP's. Good speakers are expensive; some of us are happier with headphones (which cost less, for a given sound quality).

You will be making trade-offs, in all these areas, between "cost" and "quality". The best you can do is _understand_ the trade-offs; you can't avoid them.

The mechanical keyboard action is the only part of the DP that you can't change, in the future. You can buy "virtual pianos" (which run on a computer) to replace the sound generator, and outboard loudspeakers to get better-balanced (and louder) music.

Most important, go out and try lots of DP's. You'll probably find one that lets you say:

. . . "I can live with this, and I can afford it."

I don't know that I would go as far as to focus on 2nd hand. The price/quality/technology curve for digital pianos is skewed in favor of new or nearly new. If you find a clearance on an outgoing model, it's really hard for any of the used DP's to compete.

And to move the post, click on the "Notify" button at the bottom of any of your posts and simply request that a moderator move the post to the Digital Piano Forum.

Thanks for all the input. If I got a second hand piano, at what point would it be considered "too old" to be worthit? 5 years? 10 years?

I've also tried the Kurzweil and really liked the sound. Is this a high quality digital piano?

Digital pianos are like smartphones: new models come out every year with incremental upates and eventually after a couple of cycles or so, the new updates and features do make a tremendous difference. For comparison, you can still use a 1st-gen iPad for example, but the screen resolution doesn't hold a candle to the current flagship models, some apps don't work, it's a lot more sluggish, etc. If you had never held an iPad before your would be impressed, but if you have seen the latest models you might be disappointed.

With DPs newer models get closer to the touch and tone of an acoustic, first at the top-tier (expensive) models, with the technology eventually trickling down to the consumer level. My Casio Privia that I bought back in 2009 has an acceptable touch and tone, but compared to the entry level Kawai ES100 (which is much cheaper and not even a recent release), the ES100 stomps all over it in terms of touch and sensitivity.

Unless you are willing to shell out big bucks, I find Digital Piano shopping to be about figuring out what compromises you are willing to live with.

I agree that the technology changes quickly with the digital pianos...

I too have a Casio Privia PX310 that I paid $599 + tax at Guitar Center several years ago. The thing about the Casio, it does have a decent weighted key-touch, built-in speakers (which are nothing to brag about) and can be played through a PA system or Key-board amp with an excellent sound.

I play the Casio hard and have a lot of fun with it when I play it. In fact, I don't worry about breaking it because if I do, I'll buy another one.

If you do decide to purchase a used digital, I would not pay more than half, or less, of what it cost new.

Good luck!

Rick

You sure you don't want to buy a used acoustic upright instead? They won't sound like the concert sound samples in digitals but my impression from your story is that you're more used to an acoustic.

For $1500 you might be able to find a good Baldwin Hamilton or maybe a YC Pramberger studio. Plus they won't depreciate as precipitously (thanks spell check) as digital pianos do.

Thanks everyone for your help! I have been fiercely looking since June for something, and gnuboi I think you are right. I need an upright accoustic piano. I have tried many digital pianos and just haven't found the satisfaction out of them that I do from an accoustic.

I have the opportunity to buy a Kawai CX-5H made in 1994 for $1500. I have read some pretty poor reviews about this piano, but I enjoyed playing it for whatever that is worth. So, for the price, is that a good deal, or should I still not go for it?

Thank you all for your help!!!

The best possible option in digital world for around 1500 and most close to acoustic action and sound is Kawai VPC1 midi (action) + Pianoteq (sound). Forget others if you want close to acoustic for that budget. Most of them are toys compare to VPC action.

Although often mentioned, I think it's a mistake to worry about the fact that digital pianos have frequent upgrades. IMO the only important thing is how much you like a digital piano's sound and touch at the time you're considering purchasing it. If you like it, why would you care if there is an improvement in 2, 5, or 10 years(by which time you might be able to buy the latest version)?

I haven't heard many/any worry about upgrades when purchasing an acoustic. I'm not talking about upgrades to a given maker's piano, but the possibility of buying a larger or higher quality acoustic piano in the future. Almost no one recommends against buying a 25K grand because in the future they might want a 50K grand.

Best price for VPC 1 is $1850. Add $250 for Pianoteq. This is not in the OP's budget.

He can find it for max $1600 and 99e for Pianoteq stage (stage version is enough). Little above 1500 but miles from alternatives for piano playing.

Hi! Unfortunately I don't have any knowledge of the Kawai CX-5H, but I thought I'd quote as people seem to be missing this is what you're asking about now. You may need to make a new thread, though.

Could you tell me where it can be had for $1600 or less? I'm interested for myself.

If you enjoy it then that's all it matters. Have you searched this forum for posts about the CX-5H? What do the dealers say? They are the most qualified at comparing it with similar acoustic pianos.

I can tell you that it's probably leagues better than my previous acoustic piano (a console), and that one lasted many many years until I got a job to pay for a nicer piano.