Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Digital Pianos - Electronic Pianos - Synths & Keyboards Give me your opinions on pianos in the 4000-5000 euro range

What is the best digital piano in this price range in your own opinion?

What models should I look into and what to avoid?

What about the Yamaha B1 with factory silent system?

I won't be playing much without headphones.

And obviously I'm going to go and test them at some point.

The main difference between digital pianos of say 3000 Euros and 5000 Euros is the speaker system. IMO, the experience of playing a 3000 Euro digital---e.g., the Roland LX7---is less satisfying than playing the V-piano stage version (a much older instrument) with good monitors. However, the LX17 from Roland does sound better than the V-piano stage. The main differences between the LX7 and 17 are the speakers/amps.

Similarly, I was much more impressed with the sound of the CS11 from Kawai compared to the CA97, CA67 or CS8. The layout of the speakers and their power (also the existence of a sound-board) can make quite a difference in one's playing satisfaction, even though the sound chip/sampling or modelling technology might be the same in the 3000 Euro bracket.

What I'm focusing on is the feel of the action.

Right now I'm practicing with Yamaha's YDP-163 which action is way too heavy compared to the grand pianos or uprights I have played.

Bought a Korg Kronos last October with very good headphones, after testing models from many brands. The piano sounds are excellent and I really like the RH3 action.

I have seen Yamaha P114 with Silent System for under 5000EUR, used of course, but who would care if it is four, five years old only? Also used B2 and of course B1. The B series have a lesser silent system than the P series.

From Kawai you may be able to get a used K2 or even K3 with Silent System (called ATX). You will probably not yet find K200 or K300 models with ATX-2, the new models, at least not used, because they are relatively new.

Do not forget that all the moving parts in a acoustic piano action make quite some noise even if silent mode.

But if you almost always play with headphones, you probably want the best digital sound system. Roland is ahead of the crowd in terms of resonance modeling, which has an impact on the overall sound and realistic pedaling. The action/keyboard and sound engine is the same in all new models (HP603, 605, LX-7, LX-17), so you could actually buy the cheapest you like if you mostly play with headphones.

Next would be Kawai CA or CS series. For headphone-mostly use, CA67 has all the sound engine features and it has the very good Kawai action, which I personally prefer over the Roland. At default, I also like the Kawai sound character better than Roland, but you can tweak both massively.

Then there is the Yamaha CLP range. If you like the Yamaha sound character you need to look at them. The higher end models also have Boesendorfer sound, which is very nice.

Then Casio now has the GP300 and GP500, with an action from Bechstein. They have three distinct different grand piano sounds and a ton of acoustic effects. Definitely worth a look.

I tried the B1 silent in my local shop a week ago now. It played well, although I reckon the B2 would be mcuh better and dearer. i couldn't tell it was a silent until the guy told me how to use the centre pedal. Digital is nice enough with reverb on.

Hendrik42 said most things already. If you play mostly with headphones, the speaker system is not that important.

You can therefore look at the Roland HP603, FP-90, and DP-603; all the same piano, in different (small) cabinets. The LX-17, which is much more expensive, costs that much because of the cabinet and the speakers.

With Kawai, you can look at the CA67, for well under €3K; it will sound exactly the same through headphones, compared to the more expensive CA97, CS8, and CS11.

If you don't need any speakers *at all*, you could take a look at the Kawai MP11.

Agree with Falsch - if your intent is to always play with headphones, you're better off with a Kawai MP11 or some such stage piano with the relative manufacturer's top of the line action and a silent PC loaded with some nice piano suites like Pianoteq or Garritan or somesuch.

If something with a little less clunky appearance is required for the livingroom - the same action can be found in several of Kawai's console style pianos.

Falsch's LX17 is very lovely - under 5000 the choice is pretty wide, and it would buy you a very good sound system in the piano and handsome style; likewise with the Kawai CS11 and the Casio GP500 ( has an interesting action - fastest in digital pianos apparently )

On a note on acoustic pianos with factory fitted silent systems - apparently these still offer a handicap both in acoustic and silent mode influencing the mechanics of the action according to some who have owned them or who work on them on this forum..

Personally if you have 5000 to spend even though perhaps now you say you would mainly use with headphones, I would go for one of the models I mentioned earlier regardless of wether or not you use headphones more often than not. There is always a time where playing loudly is possible, and the sound systems on these pianos offer a great piano experience which if one would want to approximate with separate loudspeakers would be a real quest to try and match, also in regards to aesthetics ^^

Apparently none of the stores available to me stock Kawai pianos so my only options are Roland or Yamaha.
I've heard Casio's digital pianos are quite inferior.

Does anybody own the NU1? I just read that it had a bug where notes would play very loud even with a soft touch. Is this error still occuring on new factory models?

I've heard Casio's digital pianos are quite inferior.

I played the two hybrids that Casio came out with and they sounded great. I wasn't thrilled with the action but you might like it.

When you spend the kind of money you're planning on spending, you really have to play the pianos in question.

Remember also, you're not marrying the piano for life. A few years from now you might find another piano that tickles your fancy and might make a move.

See here but it doesn't answer your specific question.

Hello Monnet,



May I ask where you are based?

Kind regards,
James
x

I am not familiar with the price of quality speakers and what makes some that more expensive and better sounding than others.......
In my opinion all digitals incl. the Yamaha N3 still do not sound completely convincing.
During two occasions at the Frankfurther Messe i was extremely impressed with digital piano + speaker set up !!
More than a decade ago Kawai presented their DP-1 with multiple speakers , it was such a joy, because of very good speakers and a large authentic sampleset streamed from disc.
It never got materialised, but even the rare video's out there show how much better it sounded thanwhat was available at the time.

Last year Kawai had a joined venture with Onkyo resulting in the same pleasant surprise of a speakersound that actually sounds as good as our headphones.

I would never buy a LX-17, N3 ( to expensive for my wallet) or CA-97 because the two Kawai examples have shown what can be achieved soundwise.
I believe there is much room for improvement in the cabinet styled digital piano's, but till date i personally cannot warm for the speaker solutions used.

Maybe the A brands should hire the expertise from top of the line hifi brands.
In my country church organ music was (is?) quite popular. The numbers of Johannus, Content, Domus, Viscount, Eminent and Allen organs were bafling during the seventies and eighties.
To regenerate some church acoustics they develloped something called 'acoustic/aucoustimus' or something like it...... it was based on extra speakers responsable for the reverb tails.
Result a very good representation of a churchhall in your livingroom.
That was more than 25 years ago !!!!!

I can and will not believe that the current speaker solutions in digital piano's is at it's peak.

You are completely right there pianistje - but within the constraints of the budget and off the shelf solutions available, those are the options.
Not bad sounding, not the best..

But for perspective - the deep dark rabbit hole of hifi lol - People can end up spending tens of thousands of euros and still chase the great white elephant..

One could build something oneself that sounds better than what is on offer as a package from the A brand digital piano manufacturers, but not without extensive and expensive experimenting, and the aesthetics will require further money and time spent.

In our livingroom stand a pair of Kef Reference Model Three~Two loudspeakers, and a Van Medevoort class A hotplate lol - when it was new it cost more than the Avant Grand N3 - and still it won't please those chasing that white elefant.. Everything has its shortcomings and strengths.

But ask me today what I would get instead - it would be a pair of much smaller loudspeakers, a tidy sub, an amplifier with some more flexible uses like streaming options and friendlier interface - less physical presence and more ease of use for all members of the family. Less good sound, but good enough..

Thanks Goss, i think you made some valid points concerning 'hifi'. It seems you have quite some quality set up at home !


I think the problem in most digitals is the cabinet itself. No matter how you locate the speakers, the sound is 'boxed' so to speak.
A real soundboard works like an omni speaker that vibrates the air all around.
Placing more speakers in the background forfilling other tasks (like the extra 2 speakers in the original and ideal V piano set up ) could mean a more realistc audio experience.
If Kawai can show it off two times then it is possible to create a better sound than what comes with the current highend cabinets.
Like i sad about home organs and extra reverb speakers, or something that creates a more spacial effect.

I know to little about amps , speakers and hifi to make a serious suggestion. It is the underwhelming experience when playing any digital with internal speakers.
The top of the line home pipe organs have done a much better job in recreating the illusion of a pipe organ.
The digital piano is still off by quite some margin , unless of course you add specific quality speakers like Kawai did with Onkyo.

The static weight is higher, but when playing it dynamically the GH3 has the same "weight" of most acoustic pianos I played, including my upright. I consider the PHA50 a little too light dynamically, so my next piano would be a top Kawai or a CLP 575/585.

True paxel - the static touchweight of the PHA-50 action is high, but once it gets going it is lighter. Folded actions tend to have that property. The Kawai GFII and Casio GP Bechstein actions are more traditional and simpler and more direct, but also larger and more susceptible to environment being 90% wood and, denser wood than their acoustic brethren - more susceptible to humidity induced swelling. ( though my own issues w uneven touch weight of the PHA-50 shows plastics and metal isn't all that either..)

Yes pianistje - the issue for the all in one digital piano designers is dealing with cone shaped loudspeaker drivers instead of strings if you put some of the drivers in the exterior, you end up with the issue of the cone shaped sound projection of these drivers: the player of the piano would experience wildly varying frequency responses when playing and moving as the drop off just 20° off centre can be as much as 12db which is more than halving of volume - and this changes with the frequencies projected. So they put them inside, raise the relative EQ of some frequencies and let them out via a reflections from inside of the box way to solve the directional issue, but this does give that boxed in sound.. To be fair, an upright's tone producers are pretty much boxed in as well, but some of those drivers (strings) are a metre tall and spread throughout the piano, and have the soundboard to add resonances and as long as the piano is not up against a wall..

Its been 30 years since I had my first and last piano lessons - for now content with my learning tool the HP605, and I made the calculation that if my love affair continues as is, in a few years time I will upgrade to the successor of the first DP we truly liked, the Roland LX17 which had a nice full sound, very low extension and the brightness with the opened lid drivers, or go for adventure and build something myself with a low latency DSP crossover filter, a coned woofer or two and electrostatic drivers for mids and highs ^^