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#261585 - 02/08/08 12:02 AM Beginner in Search of A New Piano
pandora21 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 12
Loc: New York, USA
Hello! I'm a beginning level player. I have a (please don't laugh) Jacob Doll & Sons baby grand, 5'1". It is horrible...the sound is loud and shrill, the action is very sluggish and my hands and forearms hurt after I practice. BTW, one day I'll tell you how I was duped into rebuilding this piano...I am still so angry about this.

After numerous tunings and voicings, I have decided that this is it for that piano and will replace it ASAP. I just wanted your advice on what piano to buy. I like the sound of the Schimmel very much and I can fit a 7' easily into my living room. Also, I don't think I can afford a brand new Schimmel, perhaps you can suggest a piano similar to it?

I was thinking of renting, so I was offered a Ronisch 6'4 for $300. a month. What do you think? Is this a good piano? Anybody familiar with the touch and sound?

I spoke to Carl yesterday at Beethoven's and I plan to go over there this weekend to look at other pianos.

One more question, since I'm really a rank beginner, how does one test the piano? Scales? Exercises? What did you play when you were a beginner? I honestly feel kind of shy walking into the showroom and seeing all these advanced players testing the pianos...help!

Looking forward to receiving sage advice.

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(ads 568) Hailun Pianos

 

#261586 - 02/08/08 08:14 AM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
Monica K. Offline

Platinum Supporter until Dec 31 2012


Registered: 08/10/05
Posts: 17815
Loc: Lexington, Kentucky
Welcome to the forum, pandora21. My best advice would be to (a) be patient, (b) try as many pianos as you can, both at and above your budget (many of us revise our budgets upward after getting over the sticker shock), and (c) buy and read the Piano Book by Larry Fine and his latest annual supplement.

"Be patient" is probably the most important advice. You have already had one unpleasant experience with a piano; you want to make sure that this next piano is the right one for you. Fortunately you live in a state where there are lots of shops and choices.

I personally wouldn't recommend renting a grand unless you are not sure you are going to stick with piano. $300 a month will add up quickly.

As for being a beginner, don't let that concern you one bit. Trust me, the salespeople have heard it all. Just don't play "Heart & Soul" or "Fur Elise," and you'll be okay. \:D I had only been playing a year when I was shopping for my grand, and I also felt intimidated. One strategy I used was to go shopping at times few other people would be around (Tuesday morning, say). Usually I had the place to myself. I would encourage you to play pieces that you know fairly well, even if they are simple, in addition to scales. You'll want to hear how the piano sounds when you're playing chords and pedaling. (Does it have lots of harmonics?) Another strategy I used was just to play short snippets of pieces. That way when I (inevitably) made a mistake or had a memory lapse I could just stop and pretend it was just another snippet. \:D

Good luck, and keep us posted.
_________________________
Mason & Hamlin A -- 91997
My YouTube channel: http://www.youtube.com/pianomonica

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#261587 - 02/08/08 10:12 AM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
mikhailoh Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 4288
Loc: Cincinnati
My piano teacher just got a new Kawai RX1 to replace the Yamaha C2 he had. The bass is very, very impressive for a 5'1" piano. Could be a tad brighter in the tenor, but it will settle in.

My point being you are starting at a pretty pricey piano - a 7' Schimmel, You can go up from there, but there are good options going down as well.

Play as many pianos as you can. Fall in love - don't settle.
_________________________
Michael

====

He is so solemn, detached and uninvolved he makes Mr. Spock look like Hunter S. Thompson at closing time.'

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#261588 - 02/08/08 02:22 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
FogVilleLad Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 4680
Loc: San Francisco
In general it's tone, touch, appearance, then price.

Multi-line dealers are good places to audition pianos, so Manhattan's Piano Row is a premier location.

The more pianos that you audition, the more helpful it will be to have written down your impressions of each one. Just what you noticed, liked, or didn't like. Paired auditioning offers an easy entree. When you visit a shop, just tell them that your auditioning pianos and that you'd like to try two that have different tones. Then make notes about each one.

The playing can be finessed. Ask the reps to play for you. Play songs that you're able to play. Listen carefully. It's OK to play slower than usual, because you're auditioning tones. Concentrate on the registers that you'll be using most often, but do also play chromatically and at different strike levels. Write down your impressions. Do you know anyone who plays?

Impatience is your enemy - particularly since you're angry at the current situation. Try to think of your auditioning as an adventure in which you're searching for a piano whose tonal palette is congenial. (Touch can be adjusted, tho not radically changed. Something's just wrong with the current one.)

Choosing a piano is ultimately an emotional decision and we often react differently on different days. Even if you fall in love with a piano, it'd be a good idea to wait a few days, then go back and audition it again.

If you want to learn about pianos, Larry Fine's "The Piano Book" is a good source. Fine's "The Annual Supplement To The Piano Book" contains brand ratings and the prices which most folks on PW consider to be the basis for beginning negotiations.

Patience and persistence.

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#261589 - 02/08/08 04:01 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
Bear 1 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/06
Posts: 1348
Loc: Hillsboro Beach South Florida
 Quote:
Originally posted by mikhailoh:
My piano teacher just got a new Kawai RX1 to replace the Yamaha C2 he had. The bass is very, very impressive for a 5'1" piano. Could be a tad brighter in the tenor, but it will settle in.

My point being you are starting at a pretty pricey piano - a 7' Schimmel, You can go up from there, but there are good options going down as well.

Play as many pianos as you can. Fall in love - don't settle.
[/b]
Hi mikhailoh.

For your info, RX-1 is 5'5"

Cordially, \:\)

Bear
_________________________
Barry J "Bear" Arnaut ♫
46 Years in the Piano Industry
Retired Kawai/Shigeru Kawai Regional Manager
(My posts and threads are my opinions only)

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#261590 - 02/08/08 05:21 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
pandora21 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 12
Loc: New York, USA
Hello everyone! Thank you for the advice you gave. I've printed them out and will start my shopping tour tonight. Will let you know what happens when I return home later...this should be fun wooohoooo.....

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#261591 - 02/08/08 05:51 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
Zormpas Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/06/05
Posts: 616
Loc: Monterey, Ca
 Quote:
Originally posted by Monica K.:
Just don't play "Heart & Soul" or "Fur Elise," and you'll be okay. \:D [/b]
HEY! Fur Elise is my best piece right now...
_________________________
-Zorba
"The Veiled Male"
http://www.doubleveil.net
1918 Hobart M. Cable "H"
"No-one would knowingly provide Franz Liszt with a mediocre piano." -E. M. Good

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#261592 - 02/08/08 08:51 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
mikhailoh Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 4288
Loc: Cincinnati
 Quote:
Originally posted by Bear 1:
 Quote:
Originally posted by mikhailoh:
My piano teacher just got a new Kawai RX1 to replace the Yamaha C2 he had. The bass is very, very impressive for a 5'1" piano. Could be a tad brighter in the tenor, but it will settle in.

My point being you are starting at a pretty pricey piano - a 7' Schimmel, You can go up from there, but there are good options going down as well.

Play as many pianos as you can. Fall in love - don't settle.
[/b]
Hi mikhailoh.

For your info, RX-1 is 5'5"

Cordially, \:\)

Bear [/b]
It was damn impressive for 5'5" too.
_________________________
Michael

====

He is so solemn, detached and uninvolved he makes Mr. Spock look like Hunter S. Thompson at closing time.'

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#261593 - 02/09/08 02:59 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
pandora21 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 12
Loc: New York, USA
Hello! I'm back and want to share my experience last night at Beethoven's Pianos. Carl was very nice and patient, he showed me many pianos. I played a Grotrian, Yamaha, Kawai, Mason& Hamlin and a Steinway. Oh, and he showed me a 6'3" Ronisch, which he said I could rent for $300 a month. Does anyone have any experience with a Ronisch? Anyway, my husband and I were pretty impressed with the sound and the action. I must say that it has a better sound than the Grotrians I played. I think though, that the price is pretty steep $300 to rent.

So, I will take the advice of continuing to audition pianos, until I find the one that I love and can afford.

Are the AF's very expensive? I heard that these pianos are very nice as well.

Thanks so much!

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#261594 - 02/09/08 03:26 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
FogVilleLad Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 4680
Loc: San Francisco
Congrats on the auditioning.

The more pianos that you audition, the more helpful it will be to have made notes about each one. Comparing the Ronisch to the Grotrians would be a good exercise. Perhaps see if you can write down your impressions of them. Doesn't have to be scientific, just what you heard and felt.

Most people on PW recommend using the List Prices in Larry Fine's, "The Annual Supplement To The Piano Book" as the basis for beginning negotiations. You can get a downloadable PDF copy by clicking on this link.

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#261595 - 02/09/08 05:18 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
Gav Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/09/08
Posts: 1
Loc: midwest
The AF's are wonderful, my favorite piano (I have one too!). They have dynamic range, wonderful action, are resonate, beautiful bass, and tonal range as well (much more so than Schimmel in my opinion, but Schimmel has amazing action), oh, and the sustain.... Do try them just for the sake of hearing them. I'll bet that it will blow you away!!! Have fun on your piano shopping journey!!!

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#261596 - 02/10/08 10:08 AM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
pandora21 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 12
Loc: New York, USA
Hi Gav. What size AF do you have? I am going today to Piano Clearing House in Peekskill. They carry AF's, Bluthner, Steinway, M&H, Broadman, Yamaha, Kawai, and will be getting Schimmel's in. I will make sure I pay particular attention to the AF's..."sounds" like my kind of piano!

I can hardly wait to go and test the pianos. I spoke to the owner yesterday and he will be showing me the pianos.


And Fogvillelad, I just got the copy of LF's Annual Supplement and will review it. Thanks for the download though...what kind of piano do you have?

Okay, well better get ready! Stay "tuned" (get it??hahaha) for my next post.

Ciao.....

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#261597 - 02/10/08 10:12 AM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
pandora21 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 12
Loc: New York, USA
Michael, what piano down from Schimmel do you suggest is a good one to work with? I am serious about my piano, I really want to progress in my playing.

Oh Monica, I forgot to pedal! Will remember to do that today.

Cheers.

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#261598 - 02/13/08 10:37 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
pandora21 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 12
Loc: New York, USA
Just wanted to let you know that on Sunday, I went to Piano Clearing House, and found a very nice Kawai KG 2D. It was practically brand new, owned by a singer and maintained beautifully. I like the tone very much, it has a great sounding bass and very clear and nicely rounded treble. So, I traded in my old piano and bought this one. Oh, the casing is also perfect...not a single scratch. I bought the piano for $9000. It arrived today and it sounds wonderful in my living room. I am confident that this piano will serve me well for the next few years! Thank you to all for your great advice. Best regards!

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#261599 - 02/13/08 10:42 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
Monica K. Offline

Platinum Supporter until Dec 31 2012


Registered: 08/10/05
Posts: 17815
Loc: Lexington, Kentucky
Congratulations, pandora21! Please do come join us on the Adult Beginners forum. \:\)
_________________________
Mason & Hamlin A -- 91997
My YouTube channel: http://www.youtube.com/pianomonica

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#261600 - 02/13/08 11:30 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
hotkeys Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/12/07
Posts: 788
Loc: Massapequa, NY
Congratulations on your Kawai Pandora21! I started auditioning pianos at the piano crawl January 12th when pique (Perri Knize) was promoting her book "Grand Obsession". I did not find the "one" piano that spoke to my soul that day, but I thought all the instruments I played were outstanding. Kawai is next on my list to try out!

Best wishes. I am sure everyone will want to see a photo or two of your new piano!

- Mark
_________________________
...The ultimate joy in music is the joy of playing the piano...

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#261601 - 02/14/08 12:25 AM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
Ori Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/20/04
Posts: 1703
Loc: Stamford CT, New York City .
 Quote:
Originally posted by pandora21:
Hi Gav. What size AF do you have? I am going today to Piano Clearing House in Peekskill. They carry AF's, Bluthner, Steinway, M&H, Broadman, Yamaha, Kawai, and will be getting Schimmel's in. I will make sure I pay particular attention to the AF's..."sounds" like my kind of piano!
[/b]
Pandora,
First, congratulations on the purchase of your KG2D. I hope you will enjoy it very much.

However, the remark you made above is incorrect.
While I'm not really familiar with the "piano clearing house" I can assure you that they do not represent almost all of the lines you mentioned.

In fact, we at Allegro Pianos exclusively represent some of the brands you mentioned as being “carried” by the said outfit within that geographical area.

I can tell you that the "piano clearing house" does NOT carry new Bluthner, Forster, Mason & Hamlin, Steinway, Yamaha or Brodmann pianos.
I do not know what pianos they "will" be getting in the future, but more likely than not, none of the above will be available for them to carry anytime soon...

Perhaps they had/have some used/old pianos by some of these makes, but then it is not accurate to say that they "carry" these brands.

I doubt that whomever runs this outfit intended to mislead you intentionally, but if you were under the impression prior to your visit that they were carrying these brands, then perhaps you would like to communicate with the salesperson that somehow you were led to this false impression.
_________________________
Ori Bukai - Owner/Founder of Allegro Pianos - New York City and Stamford CT showrooms.

Authorized dealer representing:

Bluthner, Bosendorfer, Steingraeber, Estonia, August Forster, Haessler, Kawai.

Restored Steinway pianos.

www.allegropianos.com

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#261602 - 02/14/08 11:40 AM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
turandot Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/27/07
Posts: 7302
Loc: torrance, CA
Ori,

Is this really about the word 'carry' or is the distinction really between new and pre-owned?

For example, I would say that you 'carry' Steinway in that you make it your business to have a selection of Steinways in stock for customers at all times. Certainly your description of the size and scope of your rebuilding operation would tend to support that assumption. Also the home page of your website gives equal billing at the page top to Steinway along with the brands you represent. Obviously, it's clear from your Steinway page that your Steinway pianos are pre-owned and by and large rebuilt.

Are you saying that Piano Clearing House does not 'carry' the brands mentioned because they have no new inventory? In that sense, do you 'carry' Steinway?
_________________________
Will Johnny Come Marching Home?
The fate of the modern wartime soldier

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#261603 - 02/14/08 11:55 AM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
Beacon Chris Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/06/06
Posts: 465
Loc: Idaho
Ori,

I own the Piano Clearing House of Westchester.

My communications with my customers are straightforward and honest as is my representation of what is new and used in my inventory. Pandora21 was fully aware of what she was coming to see and she had a wonderful afternoon exploring my inventory with one of the top technicians in the area.

If you feel that it is to your benefit to give lectures on Piano World to other dealer's customers concerning the semantics of their posts then so be it.

To be clear Piano Clearing House carries a broad range of used and rebuilt pianos as well as new Grotrian, Shigeru Kawai, Kawai, Charles Walter, Kemble, and Ritmuller pianos.

I hope this clears up any misunderstanding.

BC
_________________________
Musician, Singer, Teacher, Humorist, Dad...

I don't want to achieve immortality through my work; I want to achieve immortality through not dying. I don't want to live on in the hearts of my countrymen; I want to live on in my apartment. - Woody Allen

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#261604 - 02/14/08 12:32 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
pianobroker Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 4309
Loc: North Hollywood CA.
The semantics as for dealer marketing is an interesting issue. I would say 90% of dealers whom represent Steinway or Mason & Hamlin in their store signature do not sell "new" ones and only have an occasional consigned rebuilt or used one. Yamaha or Kawai is always a common insertion in every dealer's signature. Let's face it, it's all apart of ways to entice the prospective piano buyer to your place only.A one stop shop. It may be stretching the truth but all dealers do it. Now for newer piano manufactures like Broadman,Hailun etc.it is a bit misleading in that if you're not an authorized dealer,who's gonna have preowned ones.
I'll have to side with Ori (believe it or not)on the Steinway /Mason and Hamlin legitimate claim in his signature in that they do inhouse restoration and most always wiil have a steady availability of inventory. As for Bluthner, I know no dealer that would input it in their signature unless they were an authorized dealer selling new ones.
_________________________
www.pastperfectpiano.com
Largest selection in the USA
100+Steinway and M&H grands
Warehouse showroom Onsite Restoration
Preowned & Restored
Hailun dlr.818-255-3145
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_z8RvhXGKzY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Voo0zumHGgE

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#261605 - 02/14/08 01:19 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
NE_Geek_Girl Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/30/08
Posts: 118
Loc: Boston Suburbs
So, what would be the difference between 'just' selling such used Steinways as come your way and being an 'authorized' Steinway dealer? I would imagine, for example, that just about every piano dealer in the US that carries used pianos has or has had or will have some Yamahas come through, but do all/most/some list that in their signature?
As a buyer, I would hope that if a dealer mentions a brand, that would mean there would always be some models in the showroom, but I would not expect them all to be new. Is that close to the mark?

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#261606 - 02/14/08 02:17 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
Ori Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/20/04
Posts: 1703
Loc: Stamford CT, New York City .
Chris,

I'm glad to learn that you believe that it was clear to Pandora, prior to her visit to your place, that indeed you don't carry the vast majority of the brands she said you did.

Regardless of what your belief is though, the impression that may have been left from her post to other readers, was that you DO carry these brands, and this is of course, NOT true.

I think that it is both in the interest of consumers and dealers alike to be clear about the brands they represent.
For this reason, I'm saddened to learn that although you are apparently monitoring and posting on this board, and most likely were aware of the post Pandora made, you did not find the time to reply here that you do NOT represent all of the brands that she mentioned, with the exception of Kawai.

I would consider such communication, had it occurred, to be straightforward and forthcoming.

The example that turandot gave in this regard is a good one.
When a dealer regularly have used/older/restored pianos by a certain brand, and therefore advertises that he has them in his inventory, he should make, in my opinion, the effort to clarify that indeed these pianos are not new, and that he does not "carry the brand".

For this reason, I have a clear separation in my tag line between the brands that Allegro Pianos DO represent, and the mention that we do sell restored Steinways.
Although we always have in our inventory many Steinways from almost all vintages, including some that are only a few years/months old, and others that are well over 100 years of age, we do NOT carry new Steinway pianos, and are NOT an authorized new Steinway dealer.

Should a contributor on this forum mention that we do "carry”, for example, Fazioli, and he is planning to visit here to try these out, I will be the first to set the record straight and make it clear that we do not represent the brand...for the sake of this poster, as well as other readers.


When it is said that a dealer "carry" a brand, it is about much more than semantics, but about developing awareness for the brand name and investing in inventory, presentation, technical expertise, and ties to the manufacturer...benefiting customers choosing to purchase the brand in many ways.

I think that this is especially important when we are talking about limited production/hard to find manufacturers, producing only a few hundreds of pianos a year (or less), where brand building and developing the market is not done on a national level through placement in concert stages, TV and film studios, and expensive marketing programs.
For such makes, the personal connection of dealer - manufacturer can be of great benefit and support.

I understand, Chris, that until now you may have not found it necessary to correct any such misconceptions about brands that you do NOT carry.
I would only hope that in the future, should such misunderstandings reoccur, for whatever reason, you would be the first to correct these misconceptions, making it unnecessary for others to do so.
_________________________
Ori Bukai - Owner/Founder of Allegro Pianos - New York City and Stamford CT showrooms.

Authorized dealer representing:

Bluthner, Bosendorfer, Steingraeber, Estonia, August Forster, Haessler, Kawai.

Restored Steinway pianos.

www.allegropianos.com

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#261607 - 02/14/08 02:21 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
pianobroker Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 4309
Loc: North Hollywood CA.
In the perfect non misleading piano world you would think the dealer should have representative inventory as for the piano manufactures in their signature whether new,used or restored. What you expect and what they realistically have on a consistent basis are not always of the same. The piano industry thrives and survives predominantly on the sale of new pianos though dealers actually make a higher mark on preowned. Having one unrestored explayer Steinway for $9995 doesn't justify to me as legitimate in a dealer signature claiming to carry Steinway. Do you know what a "lost leader" or a "nail down" is ?
_________________________
www.pastperfectpiano.com
Largest selection in the USA
100+Steinway and M&H grands
Warehouse showroom Onsite Restoration
Preowned & Restored
Hailun dlr.818-255-3145
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_z8RvhXGKzY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Voo0zumHGgE

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#261608 - 02/14/08 03:56 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
Beacon Chris Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/06/06
Posts: 465
Loc: Idaho
Ori,

I don't talk about brands on this board.

I don't correct people on this board. Not you, Ori, and not my customers.

I'm free to follow threads on these boards as I please - even when I'm out of town such as this past weekend performing with a symphony. Sometimes posting on PianoWorld just has to take a back-seat on such weekends.

Ori, You think I should have corrected my customer's semantics - you are free to think that.

I think otherwise.

Please drop it.
_________________________
Musician, Singer, Teacher, Humorist, Dad...

I don't want to achieve immortality through my work; I want to achieve immortality through not dying. I don't want to live on in the hearts of my countrymen; I want to live on in my apartment. - Woody Allen

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#261609 - 02/14/08 04:00 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
Beacon Chris Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/06/06
Posts: 465
Loc: Idaho
Ori,

I don't talk about brands on this board.

I don't correct people on this board. Not you, Ori, and not my customers.

I'm free to follow threads on these boards as I please - even when I'm out of town such as this past weekend performing with a symphony. Sometimes posting on PianoWorld just has to take a back-seat on such weekends.

Ori, You think I should have corrected my customer's semantics - you are free to think that.

I think otherwise.

Please drop it.
_________________________
Musician, Singer, Teacher, Humorist, Dad...

I don't want to achieve immortality through my work; I want to achieve immortality through not dying. I don't want to live on in the hearts of my countrymen; I want to live on in my apartment. - Woody Allen

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#261610 - 02/14/08 04:43 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
Rich Galassini Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/28/01
Posts: 9398
Loc: Philadelphia/South Jersey
I have known Beacon Chris for years, first as a professional performer and now as a piano store owner.

I just thought that I should state that I am sure that Chris did not intend to mislead his customer or anyone in this situation. His shop is run with honesty and integrity.

I am looking forward to teaching him a thing or two when he is in town next month appearing as a soloist with the Philadelphia Orchestra. ;\)
_________________________
Rich Galassini
Cunningham Piano Co.
Phila, Pa.
Dir. Line (215) 991-0834
rich@cunninghampiano.com
www.cunninghampiano.com

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#261611 - 02/14/08 05:11 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
Ori Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/20/04
Posts: 1703
Loc: Stamford CT, New York City .
Chris,

I would think that setting the record straight about a false impression, no matter how it was created, is nothing for you to be upset about...unless of course your agenda is that others will be under the same false impression.

Regardless of the excuses you bring for not correcting the customer, you should be pleased that now the record is straight, and readers clearly understand that you are NOT a dealer for ANY of the brands mentioned by her, with the exception of Kawai.

If indeed you didn't have the time to correct this false impression before, then you should thank me for taking the time to do so, and stop wasting anymore of it.

Now, I'll be glad to "drop it", as you ask, as long as you don't come with more excuses as to why you think that the readers of this forum should be under the false impression that you represent brands that you do not.
_________________________
Ori Bukai - Owner/Founder of Allegro Pianos - New York City and Stamford CT showrooms.

Authorized dealer representing:

Bluthner, Bosendorfer, Steingraeber, Estonia, August Forster, Haessler, Kawai.

Restored Steinway pianos.

www.allegropianos.com

Top
#261612 - 02/14/08 07:30 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
master88er Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/15/07
Posts: 886
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
Ori:

I vehemently object to your using PianoWorld as a venue to unfairly chastise any dealer, but certainly it is aggregious that you chose to cast aspersion on a competitive dealer. Once a customer has bought a piano there is NO reason whatsoever to cast doubt on the integrity of his sale.

To put it in language you may better understand; in Jewish circles we have a Sanhedrin, which is a court of Jewish judges that adjuciate disputes between Jews. This system has two benefits: It allows for the dispute to be heard by people of common backgrounds and understanding, and it keeps the dispute from being misunderstood by a public audience who may not have the understanding of the culture to make a fair analysis.

You could have easily voiced your concern to Chris in a private email or simple phone call if you sincerely had a virtuous goal. I know Chris, and I know he would have listened to your private concerns and taken them into consideration had you approached him in a gentlemanly manner. Voicing your vitriol in this manner is the type of petty sniping that has permeated our industry amongst competitive dealers and has caused the piano buying public to be wary of our trade.

In the "those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw rocks" vein, here is the Google Adwords posting that your company has: "Allegro Pianos is your Connecticut, New York and New Jersey specialists for Steinway pianos, and proudly represents Bösendorfer, Blüthner, August Förster". Now, I think that Steinway may not agree with your statement and I would certainly say that this is misleading. I can't understand why someone who represents such prestigious pianos as Blüthner, Bosendorfer and Forster gives top billing to Steinway! That seems counter-productive and certainly is overstating your Steinway prowess.

My whole point being that, in my humble opinion, we dealers should be doing all we can to encourage piano buyers in this forum, not denegrating other dealers. If you have a sincere greivance, take it up with the dealer directly. You might be surprised that most fly's are attracted more to honey than to vinegar.
_________________________
Russell I. Kassman
R.KASSMAN, Purveyor of Fine Pianos
Berkeley, CA

FORMER US Rep.for C.Bechstein

SF Area Dealer: SteingraeberGrotrianSauterEstoniaKayserburgBaldwinBrodmannRitmller
www.rkassman.com
russell@rkassman.com
510.558.0765

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#261613 - 02/14/08 07:43 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
piano_deb Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/26/05
Posts: 787
Loc: Memphis, TN
Getting back to the topic ... pandora21, I hope you love and play your Kawai for many happy years. It certainly must be a relief to have done with the old instrument.

I'm sure I'm not the only one who hopes to see some pictures. Of course, you'll have to tear yourself away from the keyboard long enough to take photos and post them! \:\)
_________________________
Deborah
Charles Walter 1500
Happiness is a shiny red piano.

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#261614 - 02/14/08 08:20 PM Re: Beginner in Search of A New Piano
Bear 1 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/06
Posts: 1348
Loc: Hillsboro Beach South Florida
pandora21,

Congratulations ...

Kawai KG-2, one of my favorite pianos and purchased through a very reputable dealer too..

In my opinion, you can't go wrong with this win win combination.

Wish you many years of enjoyment playing your Kawai. \:\)

Sincerely,

Bear
_________________________
Barry J "Bear" Arnaut ♫
46 Years in the Piano Industry
Retired Kawai/Shigeru Kawai Regional Manager
(My posts and threads are my opinions only)

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