I have a 5 years old son. We sent him to YAMAHA music school since he was 3. He likes it. From 4 years old, he and other 5 kids are in junior class playing keyboards. Recently, I got more and more frustrated with his bad hand posture and loud playing habits. BTW, I know nothing about piano. I knew his bad habits only after his teacher pointed it out. However, the teacher is busy with all 6 kids and cant sit down to correct him. All she told me to do is to use a pencil to point up to his wrist. Also with group lesson and play, my son cant hear his own keyboard sound very well and often try to lean toward the keyboard to listen.

I started looking for private lesson so that the teacher can correct his bad behaviors. When I talk to a teacher, she said that I should get my son out of the YAMAHA school right away. One of the reason is that they don't use CDEFG and use Do, Re me, a different system than American/european.

Any one here has experience with YAMAHA music school. Should I stay or change to private? We will interview a teacher who's fee is $25/half hr. I am planning to have my son to play in front of her and have her to tell me her plan to correct and improve him.

Thanks.

It sounds like your working him pretty hard. Keep in mind, the most important thing for him right now is that he enjoys it. If he has a bad experience with piano now, he may never like the piano.

I don't know a whole lot about the Yamaha music school, but I do know that a private teacher is essential. I recommend that you give him private lessons either way.

Yeah, private lessons are very good.

Just a warning, though - don't go "shopping" for teachers. That is, even if you don't see much improvement with the new teacher after a week or two, stick with him/her. (Also, don't worry if the teacher can't give you a sufficient "plan" right away. It takes time for the teacher to get to know the student, and to understand what needs to be done. Unlike a business plan, which can be followed to the letter, quite often "plans" for students evolve, especially when there is only one student in the class, because the students improve in certain ways giving rise to new difficulties or negating aspects of the original "plan"...) Give your child a month or two with the teacher, and then assess the progress. There is very little that most teachers can do with a student in one week, so be patient.

But do get him a teacher! Good luck.

I would ask the teacher if you could observe some of her other student's lessons. That way you can see how good her other students are and also how she works with/interacts with someone she is used to. And also ask about her experience, education and if she can play a little for you. (Asking to hear the teacher play may sound a little weird, but I did this when looking for a teacher in high school and I found someone really great.) If the teacher does not know how to play decently then she won't be able to demonstrate to your son how to play correctly. Demonstration in the beginning stages is very important, IMO.
If you are looking to pay $25 a 1/2 hour then you have every right to make sure you get the best you can for your son. And definately get him out of group lessons.

Thank you for your prompt reply and advice. This is really a wonderfull place. I do have high expectation of my son, though I know he is not necessary talented in music. However, I would like to give him the opportunity to enjoy music.

The good thing about my son is that he likes everything he is in to. He always likes to go to YAMAHA music school and practise at home. He cries when he has trouble to mast a piece. But he never gives up. Therefore, I think he deserves a private teacher and more investment from me.

I am in southern California, Irvine area. If you know a good teacher, please let me know. Many thinks all.

I would be very hesitant about moving him from the
school. The main thing is he likes it.
There is camaraderie with the other kids,
no one is singled out, it's fun and
enjoyable which translates to enthusiasm
for practicing at home, some people
are just naturally people-oriented and
learn better in groups.

The fact that they use do-re-mi is an
advantage not a disadvantage. This trains
the ear, like in singing. They'll get
around to regular notation at some point.
But of course if you ask a private teacher
she'll say to give him private lessons.

The thing about private lessons is that
they will no longer be fun. There will
be no other kids for company, there
is no camaraderie, and he could come to hate
it and consequently no longer practice at
home.

I would wait until he outgrows the Yamaha
school or asks for private lessons. Right
now he's having fun and is enthusiastic
about the piano, which is great.

My dear friend Gyro, I have been taking private lessons for the past six years. I have so much enjoyed them, that I have decided several years ago that I must make music my career and my life.

I am assuming LearnPiano's son will still have interactions with other children, at school and around town, and he will most likely become a far better pianist and musician with one-on-one teaching from a good teacher.

Of course, there may also be (hopefully) the comraderie between the student and the teacher. I have had (and continue to have) a most excellent relationship with my own teacher. For this, I cannot express enough my deepest gratitude and appreciation.

If being around other kids is very important to your son, I would see if anyone teaches the Pace Method or similiar method where "partner" lessons are involved. That is just 2 kids at a lesson once a week plus a group of 4 once a week, so he would get two lessons, plus more individual attention. The only reason I hesitate to aggree with Gyro is that you said he is picking up bad habits at this Yamaha school. If some day he wants to pursue a career in music he could be at a disadvantage if he has developed bad habits.

It all depends on the student, the teacher,
and other factors. You're the one who
started lessons at 12 and now play the
Grieg concerto? That's terrific progress,
but that's the exception rather than
the rule with most piano students.
Apparently you were lucky enough to
land with just the right teacher for you,
any other teacher and you might not
even be playing now.

This child is now showing the kind of
enthusiasm that you showed when you
were starting out. So I'd be very
cautious about changing his environment
at this point.

maybe, the kid can stay at that Yamaha school but get a private teacher for him anyway. let him do both for a couple of months to see what happens. if then he has learned more from the private teacher than the school, then quit the school and continue with the teacher. if the teacher didn't help that much, then find another teacher.

No, if you did that the private teacher would
come to dominate everything and make him
feel that the Yamaha school is bad for him. I'd
leave him where he is for now.

Gyro- I don't think it's fair to say that the teacher will dominate everything, you don't know the teacher. If LearnPiano finds an honest person and explains the situation I am sure they would do whatever is necessary to keep the student interested in music.

I think the teacher would want a certain amount of control over what the student is learning. There's a pride issue, too. The teacher wants to look at the progress of the student and say for sure, "I have molded and shaped this student, and this is the result." If there are two teachers, who can take full credit? Pride is important.

But I think it depends on the student - you are right about that Gyro. The key at this point is to decided why[/b] the boy is so eager about his lessons at the Yamaha School. Is it because he is simply eager to see his friends, or is he rather eager to learn and the friends are just a bonus? Or is it a combination of the two?

If it is a combination of the two, and I would hope/suspect that it is, then I don't imagine switching him to a private teacher would crush his love for the music. After all, he can still meet with friends at other times, and perhaps even his teacher could have him learn duets and trios with his siblings or friends. The difference, though, would be that all of the teacher's attention would be focused on him during his lessons, but that does not mean that he could not still play the piano with other children.

i don't think there is anything wrong with having 2 teachers or going to school and having another teacher. it's just like some undergrad students taking college math class, but also going to a math tutor (like me).

i understand in some fields, teachers are competing for business and they would not be happy when their students going to another teacher for advise or even lessons. but if the focus of learning is different, then teacher may not care about it, such as in the case that a student take lessons from 2 different teachers, one for violin and the other for cello. therefore, in the case of LearnPiano's son, if the private teacher has different teaching focus over that kid from that of Yamaha school, then i think if would be perfectly ok. because the school only does group lessons and focus on general learning, while a private teacher can focus on something that the school never has worked or focused on for that kid. so, there's little conflict here.

If he is developing bad habits, something needs to change fast. While there is no substitute at any age or ability level for private instruction, the Pace method may be a possible comproise. If your goal is for him to enjoy music, then give him that opportunity. With bad habits, playing the piano is very uncomfortable and can even lead to serious injury. For example, poor hand arch can lead to various repetitive movement disorders and playing hunched over the keys can lead to severe back pain. It also makes it very difficult to play well, creating great frustration. This is not how one enjoys anything, but rather how one develops bitterness at the very thought of piano playing.

I'm a product of the Yamaha school (about 30 years ago). I now make my living solely from music. I have positive memories of my experience with the Yamaha school. I do think the curriculum was strong -- mainly the strong emphasis on ear training. However, in the end it all comes down to the teacher. I had a great one! In my opinion, the real goal is learning to love music. Your son can get the greatest instruction around, but if he doesn't love music, he will ultimately quit playing.

Also, I know the Yamaha school you're talking about -- well, sort of. I lived in Irvine (Woodbridge) for 15+ years. So I know where it is, but I don't know much about it...

Hi,
If you can drive to Huntington Beach, I know the perfect teacher for your son. Her name is Barbara Alcott. She runs a great program for kids in Orange County and I know she has some summer openings. Email me for her info. My email address is info@planetmullins.com

Thank you all again for your honest and kind suggestions. I think I should tell you more about my son and his "bad habit". My son is a boy that has great concentration and is an eager learner. He can put together over 1000 lego pieces following the instruction at age of 4 and read chapter books at age of 5 (thanks to his montessori teacher). However, due to my fault since I know nothing about piano, I started him on keyboard at age of three in YAMAHA school and did not pay attention to the keyboard height. So his hands are flat when he is playing. Recently, I bought a 2nd hand YAMAHA U3 for him to practise at home (his school is still using keyboard) and adjusted the bench so that his arm is parallel to the keys. However, I am still wondering what his hand posture should be. His teacher never have time to sit down to correct him.

Since I have aready paid YAMAHA school till the end of July, I will keep him there till then. Meanwhile he will go to summer school where has piano teachers with many years of experience. We will interview one of them this weekend and see whether she is a good teacher for his future private lesson. However, I do think that going to two lessons will be confusing to him, since they may be at different paces and using different method. On top of that, it will be more cost for me which I would rather spent on his other trainings. It sounds like I am a pushy mother to give my son a lot of burdon. But he enjoys every activity.

Rob, thank you for your recommendation. I will contact you later.

LearnPiano, try this:

Stand up, and walk around the room for a moment. Just relax, and then look down and see what your hands look like.

This is how your son's hands should look on the keys: slightly curved (but not too curved) and relaxed.

Well, mmmmmm...... Yamaha JMC is a Junior Music Course, it is not really a piano lesson course yet. Well, guys! nothing wrong on Yamaha Music School to have their own sllybus, teaching techniques, and so on.....
Mr Learnpiano, I think you have enrol your kid in a wrong course. But, anyway your kids did enjoy the lessons and his new buddies, right?
If you want him to learn piano, well just enrol him for the individual piano lessons.
In Norm, 5 years old kid should only have a 30 minutes lesson, but don't expect him that he will be in the right mood for the whole 30 minutes. You should be happy if he can sit still on the piano bench for 15 minutes!!!

Yes, that's very true! 15 minutes of good practice is far better than an hour of boredom and slopping around.

Where did you find this bunch of idiots ?

Do Re Me is the European "method". It does not matter anyway.

OMG !

Oh... everything, believe me !

Just the same as with my kids going to one teacher and then having me at home criticizing the method of the teacher (I don't do that anymore - I was a bad guy !)

You paid for the lessons (and teacher) , yet she/he does not have time to sit down to correct him.

Don't you feel they cheated on you ! Would you keep taking your car to the same service knowing that they do not take care of it and just charge you for ... nothing ?

Don't you feel angry with that teacher ? Do you resist the urge to hit her/him hard ?

Well, I suppose the issue is something like this:

The teacher teaches the class as a math teacher, for example, would teach a class at school. There is a curriculum to follow, and if a majority of the students show that they can move on to the next topic, the whole class moves on.

The problem is that if a student doesn't "get" a particular technique, the class may move on regardless. Eventually, the student may catch up, but it may be very difficult. When the student finally does catch up, he may not catch up quite completely, leaving holes in his technique.

This is probably fine - most Americans go through this in all of our school classes, anyhow, and most of us turn out just fine!

But a private teacher can sit down with the student and really work with him. A private teacher will help the student with techniques that especially trouble him, and the teacher also won't have to spend so much time on a technique that the student picks up really quickly.

I think all of you have a point.

I probably should not blame the YAMAHA school too much. The problem is that I, myself, has zero knowledge of music and piano. The YAMAHA school did give both my son and me an opportunity to get closer to music. If I know how to play and how to help my son when he practises, the YAMAHA school may be a good place.

Perhaps you could watch and listen to some of his lessons? That might give you a better sense of what your son is learning and the methods that are being used. You might learn a thing or two yourself, too, and that could help.

Well, sometimes a bunch of students are not easy to handle. They are not like adults; these people makes a lot of funny, funny, funny things like noises, voices, funny faces, merely just to get teachers attention. As all we should know, JMC is only a program for kids in music appreciation, not really learning yet! As the teacher is paying attention and did notice that your kid's fingering is in a wrongful position; he/she is actually giving out more than he/she should be.
Please take note again: JMC motive is about music appreciation for kids, from JMC most of them is guided to move on to electone or organ, and yet minority actually move into Piano lesson.

I think Yamaha School is good for children who are under 7, after that, they need proper instuctions on reading, rhythm, and technic.

Yamaha teaching method focuses too much on ear training, which is part of music training, but not all, in addition, they also use imitation from teacher to student, since they don't teach too much on reading, a student can be pretty lost on explore repertoires independently. Yamaha method is good for violins, but not particularly on piano, that what the method is originally intended for.

Having 2 teachers is a bad idea, different teachers have different approaching on teaching and learning, your son will be confused to listen to two different suggestions, in addition, simply too many tasks within one week.

Group piano lessons are ok, but private lessons can be better, he will have more attention from the teacher, and it certainly will help him to grow musically.

Interview teachers who have 3-4 years of teaching experience, who has a BM degree of MM degree, who is professional and have a well-organized studio, in order to see a result, either good a bad, you may want to give a teacher like 6 month or so time to see if there are any changes in your son's playing habbit, and musical development.