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#429199 - 12/12/04 10:27 AM Question about Bach Fugues
SinspawnAmmes Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/16/04
Posts: 147
Loc: Houston, TX
I'm currently trying to learn Fugue 2 of the Well-Tempered Clavier, Book 1.

I've played a few of his inventions before, so I know how it works: 1 hand plays one voice, while the other plays the countersubject. Then they alternate, usually with an "astonishing" finish where both voices to tons of crazy stuff (Invention 14 comes to mind).

How do fugues work then? If there are three voices, does one hand play two of them? Do both hands work to play the third voice? And more importantly, how can u play two voices with one hand without it sounding like a bunch of chords???

Oh, and I'm finally getting piano lessons for my Christmas gift! Two months in, damn my cheap parents. I'm still glad though.
_________________________
Demi me, please!

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Piano & Music Acc. / Sheet Music


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#429200 - 12/12/04 10:34 AM Re: Question about Bach Fugues
F. Chopin Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/26/03
Posts: 386
Loc: England
There are no strict rules about which hands play which voices. Also, fugues are not limited to 3 voices.

Regarding your second question, the answer is that they are just difficult.

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#429201 - 12/12/04 09:45 PM Re: Question about Bach Fugues
signa Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8452
Loc: Ohio, USA
i am thinking to learn this fugue too some time later, while i am learning its prelude now. when i looked the score, i have almost the same question. at the bar 1-6, for example, all notes are on treble clef, i wonder if it means they have to be played with RH alone or with both hands? the 1st 2 bars can be played by one hand, does it matter which one? once the 2nd voice comes in on bar 3, do i need to switch to 2 hands immediately or have to use one hand (RH) to play, or divide a few notes to another hand?

i never played any fugue, and hope someone can offer some suggestions or basic principle on fugue playing.

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#429202 - 12/13/04 01:02 AM Re: Question about Bach Fugues
Matthew Collett Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/15/04
Posts: 536
Loc: Auckland, New Zealand
 Quote:
Originally posted by signa:
at the bar 1-6, for example, all notes are on treble clef, i wonder if it means they have to be played with RH alone or with both hands?
[/b]
Just use one hand for each part. You only have to think about distribution of parts between hands after the 3rd voice enters in bar 7.

 Quote:
the 1st 2 bars can be played by one hand, does it matter which one? [/b]
It makes sense to use the LH, since that is the hand that will continue playing that part (actually the middle one of the three) in bars 3-6. At the end of bar 6 you will want to transfer the middle part to the RH to let the LH play the newly-entering bass.

Generally the assignment of parts to hands is fairly straightforward in this fugue, but if it's giving you trouble try looking at another edition that does it for you. The only tricky bit is the entry of the middle voice in bar 15, which really needs to start in the LH and (imperceptibly!) transfer part way through to the RH (when the bass comes back in).

Best wishes,
Matthew Collett
_________________________
"Passions, violent or not, may never be expressed to the point of revulsion; even in the most frightening situation music must never offend the ear but must even then offer enjoyment, i.e. must always remain music." -- W.A.Mozart

212cm Fazioli: some photos and recordings .
Auckland Catholic Music Schola .

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#429203 - 12/13/04 10:34 AM Re: Question about Bach Fugues
signa Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8452
Loc: Ohio, USA
thank you so much, Matthew! it's great help, and i am sure i'd have more questions about this later when i do learn this piece. couldn't wait...

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#429204 - 12/13/04 02:11 PM Re: Question about Bach Fugues
Quidam Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/08/04
Posts: 866
Loc: USA
another thing that really helps when you're learning fugues is playing each voice separately a few times. Really get the voices in your ear, because that makes the fugue make more sense. Also if you're memorizing, it helps to make little marks on the score to denote which voice is carrying the theme. Sometimes the theme is silent, so if you can't find it don't worry. That's what my teacher had me do on my first fugue and it made things a lot easier and really broke it down into manageable pieces. best of luck!
_________________________
Raspberry liqueur, apparently. :p

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#429205 - 12/13/04 02:28 PM Re: Question about Bach Fugues
Matthew Collett Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/15/04
Posts: 536
Loc: Auckland, New Zealand
 Quote:
Generally the assignment of parts to hands is fairly straightforward in this fugue, but if it's giving you trouble try looking at another edition that does it for you. [/b]
Following up my own suggestion, it looks like the version at the Sheet Music Archive has sufficiently detailed fingering (RH above, LH below) that you can see the distribution of the voices between the hands (even if you don't agree with the fingering in detail ;\) ).

 Quote:
Originally posted by signa:
thank you so much, Matthew! [/b]
You're welcome. This particular Prelude and Fugue is one of my own favourite pieces; in fact, I think I probably know it better than anything else I've ever learnt.

Best wishes,
Matthew
_________________________
"Passions, violent or not, may never be expressed to the point of revulsion; even in the most frightening situation music must never offend the ear but must even then offer enjoyment, i.e. must always remain music." -- W.A.Mozart

212cm Fazioli: some photos and recordings .
Auckland Catholic Music Schola .

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#429206 - 12/13/04 05:14 PM Re: Question about Bach Fugues
signa Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8452
Loc: Ohio, USA
thanks for all of those good suggestions! i will check out the fugue at sheetmusicarchive.net to get the fingering reference. i have done most of fingering for the prelude already, so that i will probably just stick to mine.

yes, i love this pair too. i remember when i heard the prelude for first time (even only in midi) a few years back, i felt excited about it. there is something about this prelude which gave me an immediate impact. i tried to learn it then, but it was too hard for me and had to give it up. the fugue is a fantastic piece as well. there are a few fugues in WTC i love most, and this one is one of them.

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