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Topic Options
#430792 - 01/19/08 01:21 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
guest1013 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/13/07
Posts: 1239
Sean, Did you see saerra's thread in adult beginner forum about "wanting a piano" ? Lots of lessons about limits and patience.

On other shopping threads, have you noticed how the best retailers do not compare their customers to stubborn donkeys? Try to find positive outcomes and benefits that would accrue to your parents, not just yourself, by obtaining an acoustic piano. How would you become a better family member? How can you prove it to them in the meantime? Otherwise, why not have plan b or plan c ready, a better digital piano, or continuing to use the school piano or other pianos in your area.

Good luck.

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#430793 - 01/19/08 03:31 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
Poor Dave Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/07/08
Posts: 28
... where did sean go? LOL

Wonder how he went... it's been a couple of months...
_________________________
I have a Kawai RX-5G... it sounds like a coffee maker.

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#430794 - 01/19/08 04:34 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
cruiser Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/19/07
Posts: 1172
Loc: Cornwall, England
We've been here before, haven't we Sean?

Quit bleating, be thankful for what you've got.. and, above all, STOP BEING SO PUBLICLY DISRESPECTFUL OF YOUR PARENTS. Instinctively, my sympathies are firmly with them... goodness knows what they're having to tolerate from you. I don't know your parent's financial circumstances and it's no business of mine anyway, or of this forum in general, but I for one will have more time for you when you've done some growing up. My advice, for what it's worth, is - first learn some respect for your parents and then maybe you'll get the piano your apparent talent deserves.

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#430795 - 01/19/08 04:47 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11810
Loc: Canada
Disrespect, maybe. Frustration, maybe. Your link brings us back to a link to Sean's playing: demo Clackety clackety clack. Just how hard is this piano to play? Sean, if you can play that piano, you can play anything. In another forum a student had a top of the line piano, and as a result she could not adjust to lesser pianos and that is not good.

Sean, it's your choice of language that is turning people of: do not write about your parents with such adjectives - rather stay with problem solving. Have you thanked them for letting you have piano lessons? Not all parents do. Acknowledgement and appreciation may be something they need to hear and it may open the door a crack.

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#430796 - 01/20/08 04:42 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
slerk Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/08/07
Posts: 320
Loc: Massachusetts, USA
 Quote:
Originally posted by cruiser:
We've been here before, haven't we Sean?

Quit bleating, be thankful for what you've got.. and, above all, STOP BEING SO PUBLICLY DISRESPECTFUL OF YOUR PARENTS. Instinctively, my sympathies are firmly with them... goodness knows what they're having to tolerate from you. I don't know your parent's financial circumstances and it's no business of mine anyway, or of this forum in general, but I for one will have more time for you when you've done some growing up. My advice, for what it's worth, is - first learn some respect for your parents and then maybe you'll get the piano your apparent talent deserves. [/b]
As long as it's a free world and I have a right of free speech, don't tell me what to do.
IF you want to attack me, expect an attack back.

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#430797 - 01/20/08 09:45 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
classik51 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/24/07
Posts: 77
Loc: Canada
 Quote:
Originally posted by Nikolas:
Buying a piano would mean shoveling 200 or so (!) (then again if you have THAT much snow, you might as well start exporting some towards Greece! \:D )
[/b]
Not quite THAT hard to do here in Winnipeg! \:\)

A piano is pretty expensive. I have a battered upright that is beyond repair, but unfortunately cannot afford to get even a used piano. Still, I guess that's better than a battered digital.

If your parents feel that buying an acoustic piano is too much, then there's nothing you can do. But hey, cheer up! In a couple of years, you can legally get a part-time job to get the money yourself. And it really doesn't take that long to make a couple grands if you don't have living expenses to worry about.

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#430798 - 01/22/08 04:47 AM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
Nikolas Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 5369
Loc: Europe
 Quote:
Originally posted by cruiser:
Quit bleating, be thankful for what you've got.. and, above all, STOP BEING SO PUBLICLY DISRESPECTFUL OF YOUR PARENTS. Instinctively, my sympathies are firmly with them... goodness knows what they're having to tolerate from you. I don't know your parent's financial circumstances and it's no business of mine anyway, or of this forum in general, but I for one will have more time for you when you've done some growing up. My advice, for what it's worth, is - first learn some respect for your parents and then maybe you'll get the piano your apparent talent deserves. [/b]
Sorry but:

WHAT?!?!?!?!

Who are you to talk to anybody like that? Sean talks about his parents and he has the age factor which plays a part, unless you just were born and old (wo)man.

I just hope that Sean won't wait for your time. I'm sure that he does understand everything, but maybe that this forum does not work like many others. This is something that maybe never crossed you mind, but this is by far the most civilised forum I've seen in quite a while. Posts like the above are considered (in the general population of the Internet) quite ok actually. At least to my knowledge.

 Quote:
Instinctively, my sympathies are firmly with them... goodness knows what they're having to tolerate from you.[/b]
WOW! I mean WOW!

I would suggest you learn how to talk to anyone[/b] no matter their age or a public forum post before trying to offer any kind of advice, huh?


____________________________________

The demo linked, had a piano which felt really bad for me (seeing it that is and hearing it). The clicks and clacks in every single key, the velocity issues, and judging from his hands the touché of the piano as well.

No doubt the first post in this thread was not nice, no doubt at all, but we've been through this as well. 2 pages (and another 1 page in the previous thread) about the same thing. 13 year olds get frustrated and express themselves. End of story. Heck I'm 30 and just did so as well above to cruiser. I'm sure that he realises that his original post was at least of poor taste.

Now let's hope that his situation (about the piano) can be resolved one way or another. There have been plenty of suggestions around. Just some things are not meant to be sometimes. Lack of space, lack of money (and priorities are different in different people), lack of attitude or willingless are enough to make people... more patient.
_________________________
http://www.musica-ferrum.com

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#430799 - 01/22/08 10:08 AM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
Frank III Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/10/03
Posts: 310
Loc: Spring Lake, MI
Getting back to the topic: You mentioned that your Mom complained about tuning a piano. It really only needs two tunings a year.[/b]

Not necessarily - depends on the piano and the ears of the family. I actually think once a year is sufficient for most people. We had an old upright that rarely needed to be tuned.
_________________________
Frank III

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#430800 - 01/22/08 11:45 AM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12151
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
 Quote:
Originally posted by Frank III:
Getting back to the topic: You mentioned that your Mom complained about tuning a piano. It really only needs two tunings a year.[/b]

Not necessarily - depends on the piano and the ears of the family. I actually think once a year is sufficient for most people. We had an old upright that rarely needed to be tuned. [/b]
And, really, how much do tunings of an upright cost? $50? Maybe $75 if some extra stuff needs to be done? Once a year, that's not so bad. Offer to pay for tunings yourself. Renting a good digital piano sounds like your best option, which would eliminate all of your parent's concerns. A decent digital will be fine to practice on for the time being, supplementing that with practice every once in a while on one of the nicer pianos at the school or church. It's not ideal, but the goal here is to improve your situation, and the best way to do that is to deal with all of your parent's objections until they have none \:\) .
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#430801 - 01/22/08 12:13 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
kissyana Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/12/07
Posts: 199
Loc: Northeast Illinois
Sean-
In case you don't end up getting a good instrument soon... one of the most talented pianists I have ever met (including seasoned performers with PhDs) was a young man who had only a digital and a TON of chores to do before being allowed to practice (he lived on a farm). He was 16 when I heard him perform and it was absolutely amazing. His technique, expression, and interpretive skills were way beyond his years. That was 4+ years ago so I can't even imagine what he plays like today!

P.S. Piano tuning costs are way cheaper than digital cable costs. \:\) And TV rots your brain while piano study strengthens it.

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#430802 - 01/22/08 01:04 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
slerk Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/08/07
Posts: 320
Loc: Massachusetts, USA
 Quote:
Originally posted by Frank III:
Getting back to the topic: You mentioned that your Mom complained about tuning a piano. It really only needs two tunings a year.[/b]

Not necessarily - depends on the piano and the ears of the family. I actually think once a year is sufficient for most people. We had an old upright that rarely needed to be tuned. [/b]
My general advice is four times a year for the first year, (Change in seasons), then two times every year... I heard it "Seasons the pinblock."

There has been an old piano at my school which never had been tuned, and it still sounds good now. On the contrary, my piano teacher's piano needs to be tuned, or else I hear a dissonant buzzing noise.

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#430803 - 01/22/08 04:48 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
Akira Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/27/07
Posts: 1645
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Has any of the advice on this thread helped you? Any progress? An update would be nice.

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#430804 - 01/22/08 09:05 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
slerk Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/08/07
Posts: 320
Loc: Massachusetts, USA
 Quote:
Originally posted by Akira:
Has any of the advice on this thread helped you? Any progress? An update would be nice. [/b]
Well, I now use the piano at my school, although the problem is a very light action and it's way out of tune.

I talked to my parents, who refuse to talk about this matter anymore.

My teacher has finally given up on persuasion and doesn't really care anymore.

At this rate, I will be quitting piano soon!


I did find a very nice professional upright, Steinway, 1980 for sale.

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#430805 - 01/22/08 09:42 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12151
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Sean, don't give up! You will find that not playing anything at all is many, many more times worse than playing on a bad piano. Make the best of your situation, and try not to dwell on the negatives, because right now, you cannot change them. However, make plans for the future. Save up your money so that someday, you will buy yourself an instrument. Make some small sacrifices now for that future instrument, and you will get it. The best things are worth the wait.

And in the meantime, having an out of tune, lighter action piano at school to practice on isn't really that bad. Lighter action is actually desirable, and well, the tune thing you can't help, but you will get accustomed to it. Don't let this little setback defeat you, because to be honest, life as a musician is full of setbacks like this. Many times what keeps us going is the fact that music chose us, not the other way around, and so we have no choice but to press on.
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#430806 - 01/23/08 02:27 AM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
Nikolas Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 5369
Loc: Europe
Sean.

1. Don't give up piano. Why on earth would you want to do that?
2. Maybe hire a tuner yourself for the piano at school? I mean even 100$ is rather small amount, which I'm sure you can find. Thus the tunning problem might dissappear. About the action I don't think that much can be done, but let's face it you put the limit high with an upright Steinway. ;\)
_________________________
http://www.musica-ferrum.com

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#430807 - 01/23/08 06:08 AM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
cruiser Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/19/07
Posts: 1172
Loc: Cornwall, England
 Quote:
Originally posted by Morodiene:
Sean, don't give up! You will find that not playing anything at all is many, many more times worse than playing on a bad piano. Make the best of your situation, and try not to dwell on the negatives, because right now, you cannot change them. However, make plans for the future. Save up your money so that someday, you will buy yourself an instrument. Make some small sacrifices now for that future instrument, and you will get it. The best things are worth the wait.[/b]
Good advice.

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#430808 - 01/23/08 01:00 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
computerpro3 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/12/04
Posts: 367
Loc: Connecticut/Cincinnati
I don't know the situation in detail but I must say it seems quite unfair.

When I was 16 I wanted a piano and my parents were reulctant to buy one, but I had explained to them the differences between it and a digital, and they bought me a $5000 chinese grand. They had to sacrifice to do it (a new car they were planning on) but I was sincere and signed a contract stating practice time and how I was to do work and such.

Two and a half years later I'm a piano performance major at the Cincinnati College-Conservatory of Music.

I think it's a shame if the OP isn't allowed to explore his potential. Who knows what can happen?

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#430809 - 01/23/08 01:24 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
guest1013 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/13/07
Posts: 1239
Yes, the OP has talent and it would be wonderful for him to develop it on an acoustic. It would be ideal if he could find someone whom his parents respect or with whom they share cultural ties or values that might put in a good word for him. I don't think his parents will care at all about anything said by us here at PW.

Also, look back in the fall, Sean, at posts by BradKY. I think people at PW rallied to get him a piano because of how polite and enthusiastic and persistent he was despite his hardships. Your parents might respond to you in a similar way if you follow his example.

Good luck.

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#430810 - 01/23/08 01:28 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
bitWrangler Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/14/07
Posts: 1789
Loc: Central TX
 Quote:
Originally posted by computerpro3:

I think it's a shame if the OP isn't allowed to explore his potential. Who knows what can happen? [/b]
Yup, I'm pretty sure I'd be a professional Formula 1 driver if it wasn't for my parents lack of support in my youth ;\)

Sean, a couple of other things to try:

- Hook up with your local piano dealer. Show'em that you're sincere and serious. They may be able to at least get you going down the path of getting a cheap piano (payments, rent to own). You'd be amazed at what some fact time and earnestness can do. If nothing else, having some decent piano's to play once or twice a week could help keep your fire burning.

- Find a person who has a piano who needs odd jobs done in exchange for piano time. Heck, if some teenager came to me and said that they'd do all my yard work in exchange for consistent time on our piano, I'd have my leaf vacuum in the hands of that kid so fast they wouldn't know what hit them!

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#430811 - 01/23/08 10:29 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
slerk Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/08/07
Posts: 320
Loc: Massachusetts, USA
Oh yes, did I mention the efforts I have taken to right this?


-I first disassembled my piano, spraying compressed air everywhere inbetween the keys and on the motherboard. I skipped a Boy Scout camping trip for this.

-To no avail, I then look for free pianos on craigslist. I still do every day.

-I then do all the house chores. Although I don't have a real piano yet, I still have to do all of them.

- After, I disassembled, cleaned again.

-Finally, I asked my piano teacher to practice at her house on weekends. No avail.

- I asked 3 libraries, 2 churches, 2 temples, and my school if I could practice. Only my school, which has a broken piano, it's also light touch.

- I go to local piano dealers, and ask for cheap pianos.

- I make phamplets.

-I write on the mirrors and glass (With dry erase marker)

- I petition.

- I boycott the piano.

- I stopped taking lessons.


NOTHING yet. This is very frustrating!

Here is a youtube video of the broken piano:
http://www.youtube.com/v/YS0dpHNmBXg

Please wait a while for it to appear.

Here's a picture of what I did to our bathrooms:


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#430812 - 01/24/08 09:44 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
classik51 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/24/07
Posts: 77
Loc: Canada
You quit taking piano lessons? How is that supposed to persuade your parents into buying you a piano?

It's not my place to judge, when I don't know the exact situation. However, I'll just say that if I was your parent, I would sell the damn TV if need be to get you the piano.

But really, at least your parents are willing to pay for your piano lessons. Practicing on a bad digital is better than not playing at all.

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#430813 - 01/24/08 09:58 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
Theowne Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 1099
Loc: Toronto, Canada
I have no piano at home. I have a digital that's ten times worse than whatever you have - it's practically a keyboard - the keys are mushy, not weighted. It feels nothing like a piano except it has 88 keys. I wouldn't even call it a digital since digitals imply weighted keys and some semblance of similarity. But in fact, with this shoddy piano I've already one a (student) competition and relieved a first-class honour pass on my recent senior piano exam. There's no doubt that having a great piano would be helpful and I certainly wouldn't deny it - but I think this "life and death" situation is an exaggeration. So call me a skeptic about the whole "exploring potential" side of things.
_________________________
http://www.youtube.com/user/Theowne- Piano Videos (Ravel, Debussy, etc) & Original Compositions
音楽は楽しいですね。。。

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#430814 - 01/25/08 02:52 AM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
Nikolas Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 5369
Loc: Europe
Sean,

1. WOW! resize those pics! You just destroyed the 2nd page of your thread! (even paint can resize pics, I think)

2. I think you have plenty of serious advice and backing up from here. Start taking some actions:
i. If it is a problem of space there's absolutely nothing you can do.
ii. If it is a matter of money, start saving I'm afraid.
iii. If it is a matter of the neighboors, TALK TO THEM. Get them to talk to your parents!
iv. If it is a matter of your parents simply refusing for no apparent[/b] reason (although I'm sure there should be a reason) then... again you need to listen I'm afraid.
_________________________
http://www.musica-ferrum.com

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#430815 - 01/25/08 03:12 AM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
cruiser Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/19/07
Posts: 1172
Loc: Cornwall, England
 Quote:
Originally posted by Nikolas:
Sean,

1. WOW! resize those pics! You just destroyed the 2nd page of your thread! (even paint can resize pics, I think)

2. I think you have plenty of serious advice and backing up from here. Start taking some actions:
i. If it is a problem of space there's absolutely nothing you can do.
ii. If it is a matter of money, start saving I'm afraid.
iii. If it is a matter of the neighboors, TALK TO THEM. Get them to talk to your parents!
iv. If it is a matter of your parents simply refusing for no apparent[/b] reason (although I'm sure there should be a reason) then... again you need to listen I'm afraid. [/b]
...more good advice

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#430816 - 01/25/08 09:59 AM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
guest1013 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/13/07
Posts: 1239
How ironic is this thread? The OP is looking for advice about his parents who don't do what he wants. The OP receives lots of advice, some he may not like, so he doesn't comment or appear to listen to it. Some advice might be the hard truth, that he either will have to work harder and change how he acts or wait until he is grown and on his own, to get what he wants... which is the true life experience of most PW posters.

I got exasperated at the OP in the last thread and yelled at him. Of course now he won't listen to me.

But look at that photo. I don't think that is an effective or persuasive communication strategy. That is like the OP yelling at his parents. So the parents ignore the OP. In frustration, the OP asks for PW advice but doesn't seem ready to follow it. The OP doesn't appear to want to change his ineffective ways of communicating or doing more than what he has already done. So another poster like me yells at the OP. And of course, yelling at the OP is ineffective in persuading HIM to either change his ways or accept life without an acoustic piano in his home.

Let's break this ironic cycle. I apologize to Sean for yelling at him and lecturing him when I was rudely and bluntly sharing my opinion.

Peace be with you Sean. I hope you count your blessings. Life is full of waiting, compromises, and more work.

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#430817 - 01/25/08 10:01 AM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
guest1013 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/13/07
Posts: 1239
oops double post. sorry

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#430818 - 01/25/08 11:57 AM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
SSB Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/18/08
Posts: 184
Loc: Cumbria, UK
Spell persuade correctly. Take up the lessons again (they were paying for those weren't they?). Spend more time at school practising - practise anywhere you can. Stop writing on windows and mirrors. Resize enormous picture on page two of this thread. Job done.
_________________________
User ratings are the work of the devil

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#430819 - 01/25/08 03:18 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
miaeih Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/06/08
Posts: 267
Loc: SF Bay Area, CA
 Quote:
Originally posted by Nikolas:
iv. If it is a matter of your parents simply refusing for no apparent[/b] reason (although I'm sure there should be a reason) then... again you need to listen I'm afraid. [/b]
I wouldn't buy the OP anything for those pictures alone, much less a piano. That's more than enough reason. On top of that, there should be punishment for destroying property!

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#430820 - 01/25/08 03:22 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
Nikolas Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 5369
Loc: Europe
lol

Guys/gals.

Stop judging the guy completely. He sure doesn't seem to listen, so let's leave this thread to die. But mirrors can be cleaned extremely easily... \:D
_________________________
http://www.musica-ferrum.com

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#430821 - 01/25/08 05:26 PM Re: Need ways to pursuade parents to buy a new piano.
Tenuto Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/09/07
Posts: 550
Loc: U.S.A.
Sean,

First, it's wondeful how much you love the piano and want to play it.

Second, even the greatest composers of the world had to put up with second-rate, broken-down pianos

Third, your relationship with your parents is more important than the piano, at the moment. If they don't share your enthusiasm it's too bad, but not all is lost. You are young, energetic, soon you will be an adult and make your own decisions. However, you only have one Mom and one Dad and you've got to work on getting along with them. See what artistic kinds of interests you share with them. Start communicating with them in a positive way. You'd be surprised what can develop if you have a strong foundation with your family.

Good luck to you.
Don't give up music.

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