Well, this is my first question on the forums! I wanted to make my first question here, a question I've had unanswered for a long time now. Yes, thats it, all the hatred for Rachmaninoff's 3rd concerto, and not only that, but some hatred for Rachmaninoff.

Now, I am speaking as a Rachmaninoff fan, and if I could listen to only one of the great composers for the rest of my life (which I pray wont happen), It would be him. But I view the 3rd concerto as a MASTERPIECE. I dont prefer it to his wonderful 4th and 1st(despite the questionable orchestration in the 1st) but I think it is genius. I understand the "Shine" situation. I am somewhat against the movie too, but that has nothing to do with Rachmaninoff, or his concerto! I think that some people dislike it because of its fame through this movie and maybe Horowitz and Cliburn(dont shoot ) , but how can that change it as a piece. should fame and not music determine the way you view a piece?

I will end this post with a question

If shine was never made, if David Helfgott was viewed as an amateur, if the post "The Mach 3" didn't exist, would you still dislike it? This piece is very true to my heart, and I am most fond of it. I cant let hollywood interrupt what is dear to me!

Aus,

Nothing is going to stop me from enjoying it. I think it's a great piece. Truly moving.

Actually, as I type this I'm listening to a recording of Rach playing the Rach3 with Ormandy that I purchased today.

This piece found me at a young age, reached inside, and grabbed tight. I find it one of the most profound and sublime statements in all of music for me. And I believe I need to expose myself to more interpretations as I've really only honed in a few, and havent heard the field.

The movie phenomenon did bother me greatly. I didnt even see the movie, but every time you turned around, you heard the Rach3, whether it was a movie promo, piped in music at the bookstore, or a commercial soundtrack. It was everywhere, and in a 'soundbite' environment. I feel it really cheapened it by over exposure in a shallow context (and some poor recordings). Nothing will take this piece away from me but I definitely need a break from it so make it fresh again.

Rach 3 is my favorite, Horowitz is my favorite recording, and I've never seen Shine

I like the piece, but I hate the terms "Rach 3" and god forbid: "Rocky 3"

then you can use the newly adquired term: MACH3

Faster than the speed of sound!!!

wtf

Horrible thread.

hey, you are doing lot of image editing lately, don't u?

(Brendan, your avatar fits great for your comment)

My experience with the 3rd concerto is like Siddartha's. I got well acquainted with it as a boy (wore out my first vinyl recording of Cliburn's Carnegie Hall performance) and have bought more than 40 CD recordings of it in the last 20 years. I think it contains two of the most sublime moments in all of music (the "sunburst" major key climax in the 2nd movement and the end of the finale, especially in great live performances), and the whole thing is filled with melody, mystery and invention from start to end.

A word of advice for AusRotten: don't concern yourself with how "Shine" affected other people's opinions of this music. Just ignore 'em and buy more recordings. (My current favorites are Andsnes, Gilels, Cliburn, Volodos and Janis.) This wonderful piece is a friend you can stay close to for life. Trust your taste and have fun with it.

It's not so much that people dislike Rachmaninoff, third concerto or otherwise. It's that 99.999% of the internet forum discussions on the work are of extremely low quality. They tend to fall into the following categories:

1) Is Rach 3 the hardest piece ever?
2) What's your fave recording of Rach 3?
3) I love Rach 3, don't you?
4) I saw the movie Shine, did you?

To which the answers have always been, and always will be:

1) No
2) Why do you care?
3) yes/no, and goody goody gumdrops for you
4) yes/no, Geoffrey Rush is a good actor, it was a good movie, and it's a highly fictionalized hollywood version of a true story

I used to love this concerto. But then everyone started to overrate it and call it the best piece in the world. I must admit, it is good and pleasing to hear, but after constantly hearing people call it the best piece and trying to convince me that it is THE BEST - the concerto has just lost it's meaning. I rarely listen to this recording anymore. In fact, I listen to his 1st PC more than his 3rd and 4th (but I listen to the 2nd the most).
Also, people consider it so technically difficulty and constantly remind me of this. After listening to the concerto as a result of these comments, I guess I just perceived the concerto as a showoff-piece with no musical attributes.

That's too bad that the whims of the world had such a negative influence on your attitude toward this peice. I love it, and it's musical integrity and quality still stands undesecrated despite it's everatedness. I don't get the idealogy that if something is very popular and praised in public is necessarily BAD. Isn't it logical to conclude that something has to indeed be GOOD to be praised and loved so widely? Of course there are always excpetions, but Rachmaninoff 3 is not.

Same here. Who does your favorite recording?

Gee, I forget the performer. However I remember obtaining the file from PW, and I believe you were the one who posted it on streamload NAK

You know, all those recordings of Rach 1 - 4, AND two sets of concertos by Alkan

Man, I was going to make a crack about the Mach 3... but you guys had to go and do it already. =( Spoiling all the fun...

i'm still intrigated with your SNK style avatar, Aznxk3vi17 (is that your pass or what?). Who is on your avatar?

Googlism, I think you got the wrong guy. I have recordings of the Rachmaninoff 2nd by Rachmaninoff, Zimerman, and a live recording by Hough.

Ah, the glorious Mach 3 thread. I still remember almost wetting myself at Brendan\'s comment .

Danor, I already answered about who it was, but I suppose the thread is long gone now.

The character is Makoto from Street Fighter III: 3rd Strike.

i love that game, but i haven't played the "3rd strike". Is there any ROM of it? for any emulator?

Oh my bad - but the guy I'm talking about is Hough . Sounds so perfect

How is the one by Rachmaninoff?

I prefer the 2nd piano concerto over the 3rd as well. I have an Orozco recording with the Royal Philharmonic, where he plays the chord cadenza in the 3rd. I think it sounds perfect, but anyone has any other suggestions, I'd be happy to take a listen.

I don't think Rachmaninoff or this concerto are hated here. In fact they are well loved pieces of the repertoire. It's just considered a piece that has been talked about to death and overplayed. The piece deserves much of the praise, but there are so many other works to talk about.

No. Orozco's is simply the best cadenza I've ever heard.

i have loved this concerto for a long time but i'm pretty sure there are a lot that i like more. also, i am starting to agree with some critic that i think i heard about saying something about a lack of contrast. even if that is true, it's a great concerto. I just watched a video of Olga Kern playing it live(I downloaded it and it's excellent quality). She plays it wonderfully and thank goodness she plays the big cadenza. it really meant a lot to me those first few notes of the cadenza I was like YES! I really don't care for that obnoxious fast cadenza but that's just my opinion. Has anyone else heard Olga play this? what are your thoughts? I thought she was fantastic. My other favorite is ashkenazy and i think volodos has a pretty good version too. I agree that the 2nd is overall a better concerto. Van Cliburn owns that one.
what was this topic about again? oh well, that video i think was from some dvd and it took me more than a day to download it. now that i've seen it i doubt i'll watch it again anytime soon. i've heard that concerto way too many times. oh well, enough rambling.

I think it's like fast food.

Ahhh, what an intro!

But seriously, fast food is great to eat here and there, but if you have it all the time, it'll lose it's attraction. Similarly, if Rach3 is always talked about, perhaps some people will just be turned off.

I think it is the best and hardest piece in the world. For one to play it perfectly takes a lifetime to master (well, maybe), and it is my favorite piece of music in the world, hands down. I hope to learn it someday...check back in the year 2024.

BTW, is it rachmaninOFF or rachmaninOV???

"The Rachmaninoff 3rd concerto is no where near the artistic heights of the Beethoven 4th"
-Horacio Guttierez

Beethoven 3rd > Beethoven 4th

I'll agree with that!


I respectfully disagree. In my opinion, the Beethoven 4th concerto is the most perfect concerto ever written.

they are NO MATCH FOR MOZART's

I think the 5th is more "perfect" than the 4th, but I don't necessarily prefer it. Musically, they are miles apart, yet both at the summit of concerto repetoire IMO.

"Best" is of course subjective, so I'll let you get away with that.

Why do you say Rach3 - which lots of students play at conservatories - is the most difficult? Why specifically do you say it's more difficult than Prokofiev 2, Barber 2, Rachmaninov 1st sonata, Brahms 2, Boulez second sonata, Ives "Concord Sonata," or for that matter Xenakis' "Herma," or Sorjabi's Opus Clavicembalisticum?

BTW, is it rachmaninOFF or rachmaninOV???

Itis both, it's just the crazy russian language. From my knowledge (which is very sparse) one is formal and one is not, im not sure whihch though.

The Henselt is more challenging....

K

wow,
someone knows henselt

If you want to hear a GREAT recording of the Henselt concerto, then check this one out:

Link

It is a shame that Raymond Lewenthal didn't record more.

It's just a different translation of cyrillic characters.

I use Rachmaninoff.


Also, Rachmaninoff is written on his tombstone.

Rachmaninov is closer to the correct pronunciation in modern day English. However, the man himself used Rachmaninoff, and personally I think it looks better with a double "f".

Sorry... somebody had to...

I hereby apologise to the honourable members of this forum for the travesty above, but I couldn't resist...

Nice photoshoping