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#476562 - 11/15/07 01:49 PM Porter's Beguine
btb Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 4263
Loc: Pretoria South Africa
Here’s Cole Porter’s "Begin the Beguine" (first 4 measures).



The notation does not convey the inherent beat of the Beguine ... which is contained in the rhythmic note pattern of C.G (rh).G.G .

The note durations to capture the Beguine beat should be
C (1/8-note), G (dotted 1/4-note), G (1/4-note), lower G (1/4-note)

Any thoughts?

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#476563 - 11/15/07 01:54 PM Re: Porter's Beguine
BDB Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 21923
Loc: Oakland
The only problem I see is that the last two quarter notes are Gs, not Cs, which is your mistake. Perhaps you should take this up with Señorita Nina, from Argentina.
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#476564 - 11/15/07 02:03 PM Re: Porter's Beguine
btb Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 4263
Loc: Pretoria South Africa
Thanks BDB ... the last two are indeed Gs (corrected original).

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#476565 - 11/15/07 03:16 PM Re: Porter's Beguine
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 18292
Loc: Victoria, BC
 Quote:
Originally posted by btb:
Here’s Cole Porter’s "Begin the Beguine" (first 4 measures).
The notation does not convey the inherent beat of the Beguine ... which is contained in the rhythmic note pattern of C.G (rh).G.G .

The note durations to capture the Beguine beat should be
C (1/8-note), G (dotted 1/4-note), G (1/4-note), lower G (1/4-note)

Any thoughts? [/b]
I think from the viewpoint of strict theory rules, you could not have, in common (4/4)time, an eighth note on the first beat followed by a dotted quarter; I believe it would have to be an eighth note on the first beat followed by an eighth note that is tied to a quarter. It produces precisely the same rhythmic effect, it just follows the rules of music notation - I think.

Is your quibble with Porter's notation the fact that the first note (C) is held, rather than being simply an eighth note? Otherwise, I've always felt that this notation captures the haunting rhythm of the beguine quite well - for those of us who don't have Latin blood flowing in our veins.

Regards,
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#476566 - 11/15/07 05:00 PM Re: Porter's Beguine
Kreisler Offline



Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 13818
Loc: Iowa City, IA
Notation always approximates a style. It can never fully encapsulate it.

Given that, I think a person who knows a bit about the beguine would be able to decipher the style from the notation above.

The same is true of any genre or composer.
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"If we continually try to force a child to do what he is afraid to do, he will become more timid, and will use his brains and energy, not to explore the unknown, but to find ways to avoid the pressures we put on him." (John Holt)

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#476567 - 11/15/07 07:44 PM Re: Porter's Beguine
bryan s Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/11/06
Posts: 180
Loc: new york
Cole Porter wasn't exactly from south of the border either.
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#476568 - 11/15/07 07:55 PM Re: Porter's Beguine
BDB Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 21923
Loc: Oakland
What do you mean? He was from Peru! \:\)
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#476569 - 11/15/07 11:21 PM Re: Porter's Beguine
btb Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 4263
Loc: Pretoria South Africa
Delightfully vague Kreisler.

"Notation always approximates a style.
It can never fully encapsulate it."

It is stretching the bounds of reason to suggest
"Given that, I think a person who knows a bit about the Beguine would be able to decipher the style from the notation above."

In the Beguine example ... why can’t the note durations be accurately shown to fully capture the French West Indies beat?

The same is not true of any genre or composer ... Beethoven is spot on with his notation ... but then, of course ... he never wrote a Beguine.

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#476570 - 11/15/07 11:47 PM Re: Porter's Beguine
bryan s Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/11/06
Posts: 180
Loc: new york
 Quote:
Originally posted by BDB:
What do you mean? He was from Peru! \:\) [/b]
:D That was a good one. It took a little outside research for me to get it though!
_________________________
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#476571 - 11/16/07 01:25 AM Re: Porter's Beguine
BDB Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 21923
Loc: Oakland
Did you figure out who Señorita Nina from Argentina is?
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#476572 - 11/16/07 01:42 AM Re: Porter's Beguine
argerichfan Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 8935
Loc: Pacific Northwest, US.
 Quote:
Originally posted by bryan s:
 Quote:
Originally posted by BDB:
What do you mean? He was from Peru! \:\)
:D That was a good one. It took a little outside research for me to get it though!
LOL, I "got it", but not after a moment of huh? Being very fond of Cole Porter, I have read several of his bios -one of them totally glossed over a rather major aspect of his private life- so the "Peru" thing fell into place fairly quickly.

As for Señorita Nina, well there's stuff in Google about that. Not the first time BDB has kept us on our collective toes.
_________________________
Jason

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#476573 - 11/16/07 02:46 AM Re: Porter's Beguine
btb Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 4263
Loc: Pretoria South Africa
You chaps are obviously not Beguiners (sorry about that) ... but I can't sit around here idly chatting ... must get to my deck-chair for the Pretoria-venue cricket test match ... NZ took a pasting in the first test ... we're hoping for a ding-dong 2nd test starting in less than an hour ... it's a bit early for a beer... but with the sunny temperature already on 27 degrees C it won't be long.

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