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#485801 - 02/07/08 12:37 AM Grieg : Notturno, Op 54, No 4
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17836
Loc: Victoria, BC
(recording deleted)

I started this a week ago, and hope to have it sort-of-ready for my lesson this Saturday.

It's still in the learning stages, but if you hear anything that needs serious re-working, I'd appreciate your input.

I'll post a better recording of it in a few days, I hope, when it begins to feel more comfortable under my fingers, and perhaps will add it to Members Recordings forum.

So, why post a recording of it now, you ask? Sometimes it helps to get input when a work is still in its early, formative stages, even if it's not yet performance-ready.

Fire away!

Regards,
_________________________
BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190

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#485802 - 02/07/08 12:46 AM Re: Grieg : Notturno, Op 54, No 4
pianojerome Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 9868
Pretty good for one week. \:\)

Careful not to rush, especially with the 2-against-3 in the first section. Something that helped me with this was to ignore the ties in that first section left hand, and just play straight triplets against the right hand straight duplets.

The middle section -- marked "piu mosso". I know it's the hardest part, so when you're more comfortable with the notes, you'll be able to play it more lightly and quickly.

Also, maybe a little more time between sections. For example, after the first section, before the bird trills (pause after mm. 14). Take a deep breath.

On the same note, good job with the rests at the end. I'm looking forward to hearing your next recording.
_________________________
Sam

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#485803 - 02/07/08 01:19 PM Re: Grieg : Notturno, Op 54, No 4
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17836
Loc: Victoria, BC
Sam :

That's a good suggestion for mastering the two against three with the tied third to first note of the triplet. I was trying it the way you suggested, but I need to work on it still more diligently because I still have trouble really "feeling" the two against three in this section!

I'm always advocating breathing at ends of phrases and between sections; I just have to learn to listen more closely to what I'm playing and to practice what I'm "preaching."

Thanks for your input, Sam; it helps!

Regards,
_________________________
BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190

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#485804 - 02/07/08 01:38 PM Re: Grieg : Notturno, Op 54, No 4
Tacoma David Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/06/08
Posts: 25
Loc: Tacoma, Washington
Dear Bruce,
Am a new member to Piano Forum I noticed that you are playing the Grieg Notturno. This is one of my favorite pieces, and I just performed it in Tacoma on Jan 20 at the dedication/celebration recital for our newly acquired 1928 Hamburg Steinway O. It permits a wide dynamic range as well as great finesse.
Good luck with the piece...it is certainly appealing to audiences (and being of Norwegian descent, it certainly "speaks to me." David (Dahl), Tacoma, WA.

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#485805 - 02/07/08 02:03 PM Re: Grieg : Notturno, Op 54, No 4
Jack3491 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/14/08
Posts: 22
Loc: UK
hey there, i also started this piece a few weeks ago here are some tips for you

- maybe more expressive on that right hand motif
- in the first section bring out the chromatioc lower line a little more.

- I also found a book at my local library called 'The pianists repertoire, Grieg' whic goes into detail about all of Grieg's piano pieces, and how to play them
- Download sibelius scorch and use this resource, slow down the tempo (on the scorch music) and it could help you to understand the thirds against the duplets a little clearer,

http://www.mfiles.co.uk/scores/grieg-lyric-piece-op54-no4-notturno.htm

Hope this was of some help,

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#485806 - 02/07/08 03:15 PM Re: Grieg : Notturno, Op 54, No 4
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17836
Loc: Victoria, BC
 Quote:
Originally posted by Jack3491:
- Download sibelius scorch and use this resource, slow down the tempo (on the scorch music) and it could help you to understand the thirds against the duplets a little clearer,

http://www.mfiles.co.uk/scores/grieg-lyric-piece-op54-no4-notturno.htm

Hope this was of some help, [/b]
Thank you, Jack.

It's not that I don't "understand" two against three; my comment was that, in this particular piece, I don't yet "feel" them, naturally.

Regards,
_________________________
BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190

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#485807 - 02/08/08 12:06 PM Re: Grieg : Notturno, Op 54, No 4
ted.stanion Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/15/06
Posts: 278
Loc: Portland, OR
Well done for a week of work. I've been playing this piece for a bit over two months and hope I can play it this well. I'm not sure that I'm qualified to give advice, but I agree with Sam about the pause before the trill section. Similarly, my teacher wants me to take a smaller breath in the piĆ¹ mosso section just before the ppp[/b]. You can take it or leave it, but I find it to be effective.

Ted

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#485808 - 02/08/08 04:09 PM Re: Grieg : Notturno, Op 54, No 4
wdot Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/07
Posts: 726
Loc: South Carolina, USA
Very nice, Bruce, particularly as you've been playing it for such a short time. The middle section is fun once you get it under your fingers.

The 2 vs. 3 is undoubtedly the hardest thing to do in this piece. I play it at slightly quicker clip, and frankly the 2 vs. 3 flows better.

One question/suggestion. Have you thought about playing the right hand grace notes in the main subject on the first beat of the measure, and then bringing the interior voice in just slightly after the beat? Getting the third triplet of the last beat in and then trying to fit the the grace note in makes for a very busy end to each measure. Plus, the grace note is also a melody note, and I think it's better to keep the melodic flow on the beat. That's just my opinion, and reasonable minds could certainly differ.

You're a very musical player. Keep up the good work. I wish I were as dedicated as you obviously are.

Regards,

Walt

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#485809 - 03/10/08 10:57 AM Re: Grieg : Notturno, Op 54, No 4
randini Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 04/10/06
Posts: 2
Hello fellow Noctturno players,

I've been playing this piece for some time now as well and I'm having a hard time working out the right hand in the 'piu mosso' section. Specifically the 2nd phrase (starting with f# and a in the RH).

I just can't seem to build up speed or consistency in those couple measures. I'm noticing some poor coordination among the fingers in the ascending portion of the phrase. Any advice?

(I hope I'm not hijacking the thread, just thought Bruce might had some fresh input.)

-Randy

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#485810 - 03/10/08 01:38 PM Re: Grieg : Notturno, Op 54, No 4
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17836
Loc: Victoria, BC
randini :

A few things that helped me work up this lovely Nocturne :

1) Think of the bridge of the hand as being fairly firm, but without any stiffness in the fingers

2) Executing those right hand passages, the weight of the arm should be on the outer fingers (3, 4, and 5)

3) Excecute those short phrases with a down-up motion of the wrist and arm.

4) For practice purposes, try playing the top note legato and the bottom note staccato, and then reverse, playing the top note staccato and the bottom note legato. This should eventually help getting them to sound absolutely together.

Regards,
_________________________
BruceD
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Estonia 190

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#485811 - 03/10/08 01:38 PM Re: Grieg : Notturno, Op 54, No 4
pianojerome Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 9868
Hi Randy,

That's the hardest part of the piece... the same part that I struggled with the most! Since the difficulty is in playing 2 notes at the same time in the right hand, I tried playing it through first with only the top notes, and then I played all the way through with only the bottom notes. When that was comfortable, then I tried again with both top and bottom notes together. It's sort of like a "hands separate" kind of idea, except, of course, you're splitting up the 2 parts that are both played by the same hand. I hope that helps.

Bruce, how's it going?
_________________________
Sam

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#485812 - 03/10/08 01:41 PM Re: Grieg : Notturno, Op 54, No 4
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17836
Loc: Victoria, BC
 Quote:
Originally posted by pianojerome:
Bruce, how's it going? [/b]
Sam :

It's much more comfortable now; thanks for asking.

I like to think that I have refined my playing of this piece, therefore I removed the recording from this thread. That recording was the result of one week of work on the piece, and I feel it deserves a better recording than that one. I will try sometime soon to post a new recording of it in the Members Recordings section.

Regards,
_________________________
BruceD
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Estonia 190

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