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#556665 - 02/15/07 07:48 PM Joyce Hatto hoax
pianojerome Offline
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#556666 - 02/15/07 07:57 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Palindrome Offline
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Registered: 12/22/01
Posts: 3914
Loc: Chicago, IL USA
Absolutely astonishing.

It was amazing, though, that anyone could record all of that music. I've got her Hammerklavier, which I haven't listened to as yet. I wonder who recorded it?
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#556667 - 02/15/07 08:34 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Bassio Offline
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Registered: 08/24/03
Posts: 2480
Loc: Alexandria, Egypt
Amazing!! \:D

But I have one question:
Who the f*** is Joyce Hatto?

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#556668 - 02/15/07 09:27 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Bassio Offline
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Registered: 08/24/03
Posts: 2480
Loc: Alexandria, Egypt
PianoGate

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#556669 - 02/15/07 09:36 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
signa Offline
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Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8483
Loc: Ohio, USA
it's shocking things like this could ever happen...

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#556670 - 02/15/07 09:51 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Brendan Offline



Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 5310
Loc: McAllen, TX
Oh. My. God.

This is unbelievable, I have a friend who will be very[/b] interested to read this.
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http://www.BrendanKinsella.com

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#556671 - 02/15/07 10:15 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
argerichfan Offline
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Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 8886
Loc: Pacific Northwest, US.
Yes indeed, this is very[/b] interesting. For several years I've read glowing reviews of Hatto in Gramophone, but something about the whole thing just seemed a bit dodgy. I wondered how a woman in such poor health could have made such landmark recordings of some of the most piano difficult literature.

I had planned on purchasing some of her CDs, but the music would always have duplicated existing -and satisfactory- recordings in my library. After Hamelin, I didn't feel a necessity to duplicate the Godowsky Studies or add yet another Rachmaninov 3 from any pianist.
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#556672 - 02/15/07 10:22 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Palindrome Offline
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Registered: 12/22/01
Posts: 3914
Loc: Chicago, IL USA
 Quote:
Originally posted by argerichfan:
...I wondered how a woman in such poor health could have made such landmark recordings of some of the most piano difficult literature.... [/b]
Her disease did give an excuse for her never playing in public, however (she claimed never to be able to predict when the pain from her disease was going to hit her).

I've got to listen to that Op. 106 soon.

I remember that her Barcarolle (or the one attributed to her) was pretty good but not great. I could post it. Who would sue me?

She claimed two recordings of the Chopin Études, one made on her 70th or 75th birthday. I'd love to compare the two now, to see if (with hindsight, of course) one could conclude that the set would have to have been made by two different pianists (they were purported to have been recorded only a few years apart).

(Sigh) One fantasy dashed, though - the idea that one could devote oneself assiduously to Cortot's Rational Principles..., which she claimed to have done and really achieve broad mastery of the piano literature.
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#556673 - 02/15/07 10:28 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
argerichfan Offline
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Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 8886
Loc: Pacific Northwest, US.
 Quote:
Originally posted by Palindrome:
Her disease did give an excuse for her never playing in public, however (she claimed never to be able to predict when the pain from her disease was going to hit her).
Yes, I had read something to that effect, yet how much of this in hindsight can I believe? Gramophone (according to the link posted above) will have an article in the April issue. I wouldn't post the Chopin right now.
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Jason

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#556674 - 02/15/07 10:34 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Palindrome Offline
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Registered: 12/22/01
Posts: 3914
Loc: Chicago, IL USA
 Quote:
Originally posted by argerichfan:
...I wouldn't post the Chopin right now. [/b]
Why not? It'll be a great "Guess the Pianist!" ;\)

I'll bet a lot of those guys proven not to be the father of Anna Nicole Smith\'s Baby start claiming to be the true pianists in the Hatto recordings. \:D

And Jason, what are you doing up at 4:30 in the morning over there in London?
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#556675 - 02/16/07 12:18 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Lee_Gato Offline
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Registered: 02/18/06
Posts: 60
Someone also posted a thread regarding this on gff. This is rather intersting stuff. I have both her Chopets and Chopgods that were recorded in her 70's. I remember comparing her Chopgod No 2 Op.10 No.1 D Flat Major-Left Hand and to Hamelin's, and being were impressed. I've also been contemplating buying her recently released complete Ravel which was favorably reviewed: http://classicstoday.com/review.asp?ReviewNum=10667

While the evidence posted at pristineclassical is pretty damning on the face of it, I would like to see further substantiation. I would also like to hear a formal response from Joyce's husband, who owns and runs her label, Concert Artists.

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#556676 - 02/16/07 03:27 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
argerichfan Offline
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Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 8886
Loc: Pacific Northwest, US.
 Quote:
Originally posted by Lee_Gato:
While the evidence posted at pristineclassical is pretty damning on the face of it, I would like to see further substantiation.
So would we all and I expect Gramophone will have much to say about this in the April issue, not to mention more brash publications like Fanfare getting into the act.

Once again, I will simply go on record as saying that, whilst I never had any inside information, the various reviews I read of Hatto's CDs caused a suspicion that something was amiss.
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#556677 - 02/16/07 07:19 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
AndrewG Offline
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Registered: 05/26/01
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Loc: Denver, Colorado
I'd be very interested to see how the story or 'mystery' unfolds.

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#556678 - 02/16/07 07:45 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
PoStTeNeBrAsLuX Offline
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Loc: Geneva, Switzerland
Aha! The "Piltdown Pianist!" :rolleyes:

-Michael B.
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There are two rules to success in life: Rule #1. Don't tell people everything you know.

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#556679 - 02/16/07 12:40 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
dannylux Offline
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Registered: 02/15/06
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Loc: Connecticut
Interesting discussions here:


http://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php/topic,23524.0.html


And here:


http://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php/topic,19312.0.html


Apparently Baghdad Bob is a member of pianostreet.

Mel
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#556680 - 02/16/07 01:13 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
argerichfan Offline
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Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 8886
Loc: Pacific Northwest, US.
 Quote:
Originally posted by dannylux:
Interesting discussions here:
Bollocks, another forum! I spend enough time here (plus an organ and an Anglican church music forum)... perish the thought of getting involved in another. :rolleyes:
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#556681 - 02/16/07 03:20 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Tavner Offline
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Amazing! Talk about chutzpah to use another's recording and pawn it off as one's own. Should be interesting if and when more details emerge about the true culprit (husband? Hatto herself? or group of conspirators?)
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#556682 - 02/16/07 03:58 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
kluurs Offline
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Well, I'm out a bunch. I recently acquired a lot of her recordings - Beethoven Sonatas, Ravel, Debussy, Schubert, Mozart. One wonders what her husband was thinking if this proves to be the case.

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#556683 - 02/16/07 04:47 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
pianojerome Offline
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Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 9868
 Quote:
Originally posted by kluurs:
Well, I'm out a bunch. [/b]
No you're not, if they're as good as they're made out to be. So maybe it wasn't really her playing, but in the end you still have CDs.
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#556684 - 02/16/07 05:54 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Lemon Pledge Offline
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Registered: 12/21/04
Posts: 350
 Quote:
Originally posted by pianojerome:
 Quote:
Originally posted by kluurs:
Well, I'm out a bunch. [/b]
No you're not, if they're as good as they're made out to be.[/b]
Well, there's the rub, right? Are the recordings as good as they have been made out to be? I won't go so far as saying that we all hear what we expect to hear, but certainly our reactions and evaluations are affected by more than just the sound. We take into account all the information we have, whether we like it or not, I think. And the critics who fawned over these discs were apparently provided with some very inaccurate information. You can almost the hear the gears turning--slowly--in the critic brain: this pianist has mastered a ridiculous amount of rep, therefore she must be some sort of genius, and therefore her interpretations must be running over with all manner of revelatory insights. And she must have a truly unique, personal voice. \:\)

I haven't heard any Hatto recordings. I did catch some of the buzz, but I was never suspicious. Ashkenazy has recorded everything, so why not Hatto? I suppose that I just wasn't intrigued enough to buy any of the discs. I confess that I won't be disappointed if they are proven to be frauds, primarily because I find the star-cult mentality (the idea that there are a few godlike artists who alone are worthy of attention and support, because they always play better than the lesser mortals) to be absurd. Also, it would be nice to see this turn out well for all the Nojimas and Simons out there.

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#556685 - 02/16/07 09:40 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Palindrome Offline
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Registered: 12/22/01
Posts: 3914
Loc: Chicago, IL USA
 Quote:
Originally posted by pianojerome:
 Quote:
Originally posted by kluurs:
Well, I'm out a bunch. [/b]
No you're not, if they're as good as they're made out to be. So maybe it wasn't really her playing, but in the end you still have CDs. [/b]
Yes, he is. I've seen Ken's CD collection. He's already got everything else, which would mean the original recordings from which the Hatto discs may have been pirated (time and more checking by eagle-eared* and technologically savvy persons will tell).

*If eagles have good eyes, I suppose the metaphor will not be misunderstood, whether or not the birds hear well, also.
_________________________
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#556686 - 02/17/07 10:24 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
calpiano Offline
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Registered: 01/08/07
Posts: 146
Loc: California
I'm speechless... is this woman real? From reading the story I would've thought it was a much, much more well-elaborated variation of one of those "cancer patients" who coincidentally die off the minute that skepticism arises. But if she was in fact a real person I of course intend no disrespect toward her, at least not in this way.

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#556687 - 02/17/07 10:56 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
dannylux Offline
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Registered: 02/15/06
Posts: 1819
Loc: Connecticut
From:

The New York Times

More interesting reading:

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.music.classical.recordings/topics

More evidence from an independent source:

http://www.charm.rhul.ac.uk/content/contact/hatto_article.html


There are currently 104 Joyce Hatto CDs in print and 50 more awaiting production!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

WT !

Mel
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#556688 - 02/17/07 11:39 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Piano*Dad Offline
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The statistical evidence seems overwhelming.
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#556689 - 02/17/07 12:15 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
argerichfan Offline
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Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 8886
Loc: Pacific Northwest, US.
 Quote:
Originally posted by dannylux:
There are currently 104 Joyce Hatto CDs in print and 50 more awaiting production!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
50?[/b] This is truly getting more bizarre all the time.
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Jason

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#556690 - 02/17/07 01:21 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
sophial Offline
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Registered: 04/11/05
Posts: 3465
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I just read the article in the NY Times this morning. wow. The evidence is pretty convincing so far. The question is going to be-- are any of these recordings legitimate? Did anyone here ever hear her play in person?


Sophia

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#556691 - 02/19/07 12:48 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
dannylux Offline
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Registered: 02/15/06
Posts: 1819
Loc: Connecticut
 Quote:
Originally posted by sophial:
Did anyone here ever hear her play in person?
Sophia [/b]
Not since her last concert in London in 1976. Some websites report 1979 as the year of her last concert.

The severe pain she experienced from cancer would overtake her anytime during a performance, so she gave up performing in public.

She fought that horrible disease for 36 years.

This is getting stranger and stranger.

She was apparently a phenomenally gifted pianist.

From a review of her Wigmore Hall debut in 1954:

The Guardian's Neville Cardus wrote of her Brahms Paganini Variations that they were "despatched in a seamless riot of ecstatic bravura laced with underlying deep musical feeling rarely countenanced in this work".

She was the first person in modern times to play all of the Beethoven-Liszt Symphonies in concert.

At another concert, she played the 12 Transendental Etudes, preceeded by Liszt's first version of the TEs.

She was told by the London Conservatory (correction: this should be the Royal Acadamy of Music) that, being a woman, she would do better to learn to cook a good roast than to study piano.

She studied with Marian Holbrooke, Serge Krish ( Busoni's pupil), Benno Moiseiwitsch, Nicolai Medtner, Alfred Cortot, Matyas Seiber, Clara Haskil, Nadia Boulanger, and others.

I've got[/b] to hear some authentic Hatto.

I have "her" Chopin-Godowsky Studies and the ChopEts.

The ChopGods are reported to be Carlo Grante's recording speeded up.

"Her" ChopGods were rated 10/10. The review is here:

http://classicstoday.com/review.asp?ReviewNum=10551

My God, that woman was amazing!

She managed to make Carlo Grante sound like a great pianist.

Mel
_________________________
My Recordings

"Love has nothing to do with what you are expecting to get — only what you are expecting to give — which is everything. What you will receive in return varies. But it really has no connection with what you give. You give because you love and cannot help giving." Katharine Hepburn

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#556692 - 02/19/07 01:20 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
argerichfan Offline
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Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 8886
Loc: Pacific Northwest, US.
 Quote:
Originally posted by dannylux:
She was the first person in modern times to play all of the Beethoven-Liszt Symphonies in concert.

At another concert, she played the 12 Transendental Etudes, preceeded by Liszt's first version of the TEs.
Any reviews of these concerts? I remain unconvinced.

I have the scores to both the Beethoven-Liszt and the earlier version of Liszt's TE. Throw in the Godowsky nonsense -I have those scores too- and I smell a rat. Pure and simple. The pianist that no one has ever heard of that just happens to negotiate this impossibly difficult repertoire with the ease that would make Hamelin blush? Bullshit.
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#556693 - 02/19/07 04:31 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
AJB Offline
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Registered: 10/01/05
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This link posted by Dannylux was very revealing. Fascinating analysis method for comparing recordings.

More evidence from an independent source:

http://www.charm.rhul.ac.uk/content/contact/hatto_article.html

I agree with pianodad, it seems to me to be conclusive that at least some of the Hatto recordings have been misrepresented.
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#556694 - 02/19/07 05:45 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
drumour Online   content
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Registered: 10/08/05
Posts: 859
Loc: Scotland
"She was told by the London Conservatory that, being a woman, she would do better to learn to cook a good roast than to study piano."

Except there's no such thing as the London Conservatory and to my knowledge there never has been.


John
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Vasa inania multum strepunt.

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#556695 - 02/19/07 06:13 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
dannylux Offline
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Registered: 02/15/06
Posts: 1819
Loc: Connecticut
It was the Royal Academy of Music.

My mistake.

Roast

Mel
_________________________
My Recordings

"Love has nothing to do with what you are expecting to get — only what you are expecting to give — which is everything. What you will receive in return varies. But it really has no connection with what you give. You give because you love and cannot help giving." Katharine Hepburn

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#556696 - 02/19/07 07:15 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
drumour Online   content
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Registered: 10/08/05
Posts: 859
Loc: Scotland
Odd, really. Plenty of women came through the London music colleges and there were well-known woman musicians. I could imagine, though, the patronising "being a woman, she would do better to learn to cook a good roast" response to an inadequate audition or subsequent assessment at that time.


John
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#556697 - 02/19/07 08:01 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
andrewp Offline
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Registered: 09/30/04
Posts: 494
Loc: united kingdom
There will be a lot of egg on a lot of faces among the critics who have praised here so highly. It will be interesting to see how many of the recordings turn out to be fakes once they are all examined.

The mind boggles when it comes to trying to guess at the motivation for perpetrating such a hoax. Perhaps it was done to show up the gullibility of a lot of the critics... I wonder how Laszlo's Liszt went down at the time it was released.

I wonder to whom the mantle of 'greatest pianist no one has ever heard of' might now pass to? Perhaps that kind of thinking was just too goood to be true!

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#556698 - 02/19/07 08:04 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
ftp Offline
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Registered: 09/10/05
Posts: 2365
Loc: Philadelphia
Very interesting whodunit and I tend to believe it.

What I don't undertstand is that with this mountain of potential evidence there must be lots of people involved--so why is there not more in the news on the modus operandi?

Whats the motive and how was it done? We need it for a good story.

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#556699 - 02/19/07 08:34 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
dannylux Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/15/06
Posts: 1819
Loc: Connecticut
By David Hurwitz in www.classicstoday.com "Will The Real Joyce Hatto Please Stand Up":

Part 1

Part 2


I think this is going to get even stranger.

Mel
_________________________
My Recordings

"Love has nothing to do with what you are expecting to get — only what you are expecting to give — which is everything. What you will receive in return varies. But it really has no connection with what you give. You give because you love and cannot help giving." Katharine Hepburn

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#556700 - 02/19/07 09:41 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Piano*Dad Offline
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Registered: 04/12/05
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Loc: Williamsburg, VA
The link that Mel and Adrian provided is a statistical analysis. The acoustical signature analaysis is of a different sort entirely. The combination seems quite convincing. I suspect over the next month or two every recording ascribed to her will be thoroughly analyzed.

Reporters smell a good story, after all, and this one has all the elements of high drama. How can you beat it; the tragedy in her life, the feminist/discrimination angle, the technical wizardry involved and subsequent use of technology to expose things, the self-important critics wearing egg. Oh, it's all so potentially delicious to a writer. I smell a book soon, and potentially a movie. It could easily be on par with "A Beautiful Mind." If you can make a mathematician-economist seem interesting........

Cheers,

D

P.S. I wonder when Ivan Davis will say something. I studied with one of his colleagues (Rosalina Sackstein) at Miami back in the 70s, and I heard him play on occasion.
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#556701 - 02/19/07 10:14 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
dannylux Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/15/06
Posts: 1819
Loc: Connecticut
 Quote:
Originally posted by Piano*Dad:
I wonder when Ivan Davis will say something. [/b]
Posted by cmg last night on pianostreet:

"Well, for what this is worth to those already convinced of fraud in the Hatto affair, I spoke last night with Ivan Davis, expecting that he might be horrified and mortified at the lastest developments. He just laughed. His faith in the veracity of the Hatto recordings remains unshaken."

More from cmg here:

pianostreet


Mel
_________________________
My Recordings

"Love has nothing to do with what you are expecting to get — only what you are expecting to give — which is everything. What you will receive in return varies. But it really has no connection with what you give. You give because you love and cannot help giving." Katharine Hepburn

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#556702 - 02/19/07 10:38 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
sophial Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/05
Posts: 3465
Loc: US
 Quote:
Originally posted by Piano*Dad:
The link that Mel and Adrian provided is a statistical analysis. The acoustical signature analaysis is of a different sort entirely. The combination seems quite convincing. I suspect over the next month or two every recording ascribed to her will be thoroughly analyzed.

Reporters smell a good story, after all, and this one has all the elements of high drama. How can you beat it; the tragedy in her life, the feminist/discrimination angle, the technical wizardry involved and subsequent use of technology to expose things, the self-important critics wearing egg. Oh, it's all so potentially delicious to a writer. I smell a book soon, and potentially a movie. It could easily be on par with "A Beautiful Mind." If you can make a mathematician-economist seem interesting........

Cheers,

D

P.S. I wonder when Ivan Davis will say something. I studied with one of his colleagues (Rosalina Sackstein) at Miami back in the 70s, and I heard him play on occasion. [/b]
After reading the Hurwitz articles this morning, the evidence seems overwhelming. The questions of course will be who did it and why. The back story to this should be fascinating. David, this might be more like "Shine" in reverse... "Tarnished" perhaps?

Sophia

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#556703 - 02/19/07 11:09 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Piano*Dad Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 10362
Loc: Williamsburg, VA
 Quote:
He just laughed. His faith in the veracity of the Hatto recordings remains unshaken.
It's certainly worth keeping an open mind, but for those of us who are not invested in this issue at all, "faith" isn't a word to apply. Ultimately, Davis and everyone else who believes deeply that these recordings are authentic, has to contend with the acoustical and statistical evidence.

If, for instance, one could show that two performances played by different people (and this fact is verified independently) could have an exactly matching acoustical signature, then that would be some counter-evidence. On the other hand, even if such a match is possible, it may be such a rarity that multiple cases of match (and with different pianists) would have to be regarded as solid evidence of fraud.

For now, we should all keep an open mind. There will be a continuing process of analysis, I'm sure, and more and more evidence will accumulate. Eventually, the weight of that evidence will allow reasonable people to draw some conclusions.
_________________________
Grotrian 192 #156455

https://www.youtube.com/user/dhfeld/videos

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#556704 - 02/19/07 12:01 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
w_scott_iv@yahoo Offline
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Registered: 12/29/05
Posts: 1120
Loc: West Virginia
Don't be too quick to assume that the Hatto recordings are worthless - they could become prized by collectors as keepsakes of one of the greatest musical scandals of our time.

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#556705 - 02/19/07 12:07 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
argerichfan Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 8886
Loc: Pacific Northwest, US.
 Quote:
Originally posted by w_scott@verizon.net:
Don't be too quick to assume that the Hatto recordings are worthless - they could become prized by collectors as keepsakes of one of the greatest musical scandals of our time.
Shades of Milli Vanilli, albeit on a more grandiose scale... so to speak.
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#556706 - 02/19/07 01:06 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Octavia Offline
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This article provides some more detail. Apparently the name of a conductor and an entire orchestra were faked for concerto recordings!

Stereophile
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#556707 - 02/19/07 01:34 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
John Citron Offline
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I have to laugh...

This goes to show how simple it is to fake a recording today using off-the-shelf software. I'm glad I don't go out and purchase a lot of music CDs.

So from now on, we can no longer post just recordings of us playing. We will have to use You-Tube, or some other means to show a full video of the performance! :p

John
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#556708 - 02/19/07 01:57 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
sophial Offline
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 Quote:
Originally posted by Octavia:
This article provides some more detail. Apparently the name of a conductor and an entire orchestra were faked for concerto recordings!

[/b]
Interesting article but the statistics are wrong. A correlation of .999 between sets of 54 independent observations would occur by chance less than one in 10,000 times, not 1 in a thousand. It is probably even less than that, the result came out at p<.0001. One question of course is how highly correlated two performances of the same pieces of music by different performers are in general and how different this correlation would be from that, since we would expect some relationship. I would bet this .999 correlation is substantially and significantly higher.

Sophia

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#556709 - 02/19/07 08:53 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Hank Drake Offline
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The statement at the website seems to be a bit dodgy:

http://concertartistrecordings.com/
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#556710 - 02/19/07 09:21 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Piano*Dad Offline
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Maybe my Safari browser doesn't like that website, but nothing much is coming up.
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#556711 - 02/19/07 09:58 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
LiszThalberg Offline
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It's working for me P*D.... then again, I'm using Explorer.

Matt

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#556712 - 02/19/07 10:22 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
argerichfan Offline
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 Quote:
Originally posted by Piano*Dad:
Maybe my Safari browser doesn't like that website, but nothing much is coming up.
Ah, another Mac user! There are several websites I visit that don't like Safari so would suggest Firefox.
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#556713 - 02/19/07 10:58 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Hank Drake Offline
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 Quote:
Originally posted by dannylux:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by sophial:
[The Guardian's Neville Cardus wrote of her Brahms Paganini Variations that they were "despatched in a seamless riot of ecstatic bravura laced with underlying deep musical feeling rarely countenanced in this work".


Mel [/b]
Neville Cardus is a critic I respect. It's a pity that Hatto's husband apparently felt the need to defraud the public with false representations of his wife's playing.
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#556714 - 02/20/07 04:07 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
dannylux Offline
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William Barrington-Coupe:

" My wife's virtuoso recordings are genuine".

Speaking at his home in Royston, Herts, Mr Barrington-Coupe, 76, said: "She was the sole pianist on those recordings. I was there at all the important sessions, I was the engineer on the jobs and I take full responsibility for everything released on my label Concert Artist".


from telegraph.co.uk


Mel
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#556715 - 02/20/07 04:58 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
argerichfan Offline
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 Quote:
Originally posted by dannylux:
Speaking at his home in Royston, Herts, Mr Barrington-Coupe, 76, said: "She was the sole pianist on those recordings. I was there at all the important sessions, I was the engineer on the jobs and I take full responsibility for everything released on my label Concert Artist".
As well you should take responsibility...

The British press have been caught with their collective pants down and the Americans are going to make a meal of it.
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#556716 - 02/20/07 06:59 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
mazeppa Offline
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Last September, I well remember a BBC "Building a Library" review of the Chopin Etudes and Joyce Hatto's "recording" came a very close second to Pollini's overall, with several Etudes actually being preferred to Pollini's.

Now I am very fascinated to find out who Pollini's main rival really was. Could it have been himself?

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#556717 - 02/20/07 08:21 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
dannylux Offline
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 Quote:
Originally posted by Octavia:
This article provides some more detail. Apparently the name of a conductor and an entire orchestra were faked for concerto recordings!
[/b]
Question: Is it possible for an 80 piece orchestra to fit into a modest home recording studio?

Answer: Yes, if it arrives in a jewel case.


Mel
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#556718 - 02/20/07 08:32 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Hank Drake Offline
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 Quote:
Originally posted by dannylux:
William Barrington-Coupe:

" My wife's virtuoso recordings are genuine".

Speaking at his home in Royston, Herts, Mr Barrington-Coupe, 76, said: "She was the sole pianist on those recordings. I was there at all the important sessions, I was the engineer on the jobs and I take full responsibility for everything released on my label Concert Artist".


from telegraph.co.uk


Mel [/b]
It's interesting that Barrington-Coupe never disloses, nor indicated he will disclose, any proof of those sessions. He's seems unwilling to produce, in the flesh, one orchestra player or one recording engineer that was involved in the alleged recordings.

Curious.
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#556719 - 02/20/07 11:55 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
argerichfan Offline
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 Quote:
Originally posted by dannylux:
Question: Is it possible for an 80 piece orchestra to fit into a modest home recording studio?

Answer: Yes, if it arrives in a jewel case.
So that's how he did it... \:D
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#556720 - 02/20/07 02:49 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
sophial Offline
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This is an excerpt from the following article by Ates Orga on the musicweb site listed below, written apparently before recent events blew this whole thing open. I hope it's ok to post a short excerpt if credited. It is almost eerie in its description of the difficulty involved in finding information that can be corroborated about her. I thought this was fascinating.

http://www.musicweb.uk.net/classrev/2006/Jan06/Hatto_Orga_1.htm

"Finding out anything about Joyce, anything corroborative, is a challenge. Her lack of vanity, self-effacement, and desire to be behind the composer, the music, the CD, to be the medium rather than the personality, has over the years created an effective information block. Odd programmes and advertisements surface from time to time. And there’s the standard management biography. But otherwise one hunts vainly for information. No dictionary or handbook entries. Virtually no third-party references. Few readily accessible reviews from her concert days (she’s never kept press cuttings). Her Concert Artist CDs however, offering an in-depth picture of her (present day) strengths and breadth, have helped redress the balance somewhat, attracting notice in Europe and America."

Indeed they have attracted notice.

Sophia

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#556721 - 02/20/07 04:12 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
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I wonder if the other recordings on that label are the artists they purport to be.
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#556722 - 02/20/07 05:22 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
serge1paris Offline
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The pianist playing the Chopin Etudes has been identified. He is a Japanese pianist: Matsugawa or something close to that name. Anyone has the Mozart Sonatas and the Chopin Etudes ??? I would like to have a hint....

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#556723 - 02/20/07 05:24 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
signa Offline
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they updated wiki on this and it has a list of recordings in question:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joyce_Hatto

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#556724 - 02/20/07 10:19 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Opus_Maximus Offline
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This whole thing is truly incredible - how come I haven't heard of her before??

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#556725 - 02/20/07 10:33 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
argerichfan Offline
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 Quote:
Originally posted by Opus_Maximus:
This whole thing is truly incredible - how come I haven't heard of her before?
A lot of people on the American side of the pond are asking that. Gramophone, however, reviewed the Hatto CDs on a regular basis this side of the pond.
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#556726 - 02/21/07 06:22 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
andrewp Offline
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An amazing thing was that he seems to have got away with inventing orchestras and conductors that do not exist.

Rene Koehler?

Someone said that 'Koehler' (German: charcoal burner) is related to the verb 'verkohlen' (to burn to charcoal, but also to play a trick on someone, to have them on...)

A knowing wink or unintentional?

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#556727 - 02/21/07 04:15 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Octavia Offline
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Interesting link in the Wikipedia entry explaining how iTunes figures out a CD's disc ID. Wonder how this relates to attempts to expand and contract the lengths of some of the tracks.

iTunes
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#556728 - 02/22/07 07:28 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
dannylux Offline
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You can download a one hour interview with Joyce Hatto from about a year ago here:

http://www.veledan.com/hatto/Joyce_Hatto_interview.mp3

Absolutely fascinating.

And you can hear her play a clip of the Bax, which is apparently really her playing.

Whether the interview is a hoax as well, who knows?

Discussion here:

google groups


Mel
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#556729 - 02/22/07 02:05 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
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To my ears, the interview is as fake as the recordings !!!! No serious journalist would commit such an unashamed thing... It is just a very clumsy self-promotion !

On what radio is it supposed to have been broadcasted???

I am nevertheless interested by the Mozart extracts. Who is PLAYING ????

I hear here a different piano and a different pianist. Could they be the only authentic Joyce Hatto ?

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#556730 - 02/23/07 06:07 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
dannylux Offline
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 Quote:
Originally posted by serge1paris:
On what radio is it supposed to have been broadcasted???[/b]
This is from Murray Khouri's "Pressing On" program that was broadcast on Radio New Zealand on Saturday, Dec.30, 2006:


Hatto


Mel
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#556731 - 02/23/07 12:09 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
dannylux Offline
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 Quote:
Originally posted by serge1paris:
I am nevertheless interested by the Mozart extracts. Who is PLAYING ????
[/b]
From what I've read, the pianist appears to be Ingrid Haebler, but this has not been proven, yet.

I'll let you know when it's announced.

Mel
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#556732 - 02/23/07 02:28 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
serge1paris Offline
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Thank you very much Mel ! I would'nt be surprised.

Most reviewers are usually very cold with Haebler's Mozart. But apparently it makes a good mix with Hatto melodramatic story...

The Mozart extracts from the interview are all very much to my taste.

Did you hear anything about the Chopin Ballades ???

Serge

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#556733 - 02/23/07 03:44 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
NancyM333 Offline
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National Public Radio did a story on this topic yesterday. Here is the link:

Hatto hoax on NPR

You can listen to their analysis, and then there is also a link to Pristine Classical's Hatto Hoax proof website.

Nancy
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#556734 - 02/23/07 08:03 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
sophial Offline
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I just read an article by Len Mullenger on the MusicWeb-International web site in which he says that it has now emerged that Hatto's husband had previously served time for fraud. Anyone else read anything about this?

Isn't it interesting that their label Concert Artists can be abbreviated Con Artists?

Sophia

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#556735 - 02/24/07 01:29 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Octavia Offline
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 Quote:
Originally posted by sophial:
I just read an article by Len Mullenger on the MusicWeb-International web site in which he says that it has now emerged that Hatto's husband had previously served time for fraud. Anyone else read anything about this?

Isn't it interesting that their label Concert Artists can be abbreviated Con Artists?

Sophia [/b]
Here's something about it: UK Telegraph
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#556736 - 02/24/07 04:03 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
PoStTeNeBrAsLuX Offline
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Hatto's husband had previously served time for fraud.[/b]

With a name like Barrington-Coupe, he does sound like one of those rotters from a P.G. Wodehouse tale. What a bounder! Such a cad!

-Michael B.
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#556737 - 02/24/07 02:33 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
yok Offline
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 Quote:
To my ears, the interview is as fake as the recordings !!!! No serious journalist would commit such an unashamed thing... It is just a very clumsy self-promotion !

On what radio is it supposed to have been broadcasted???

The interviewer, Murray Khouri, is a real person (jury is still out on the interviewee, of course). I don't know whether he is a professional journalist or braodcaster, but he is heard occasionally on Concert FM, our classical music public radio station here in NZ. I think he was a clarinettist in orchestras in the UK before he settled in this country. Despite his OTT praise of Hatto, I would be surprised if he was knowingly involved in the hoax.

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#556738 - 02/24/07 03:09 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
serge1paris Offline
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Murray Khouri !!!

Very naive guy, don't you think ???

Could he explain again why it is so important to have all the time this very special piano, now we know we listen to different pianos and different pianists...

Hatto's voice is to be treasured too !!!

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#556739 - 02/24/07 09:59 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
signa Offline
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#556740 - 02/25/07 01:05 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
dannylux Offline
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Listen to this cut of "Hatto" playing the Mephisto Waltz:


Mephisto-Hatto


Scroll down towards the bottom of the page.

What a wonderful performance!

Does anyone recognize this pianist?

What kind of fantasy world does one have to live in to believe that's a very ill 71 year old lady playing?


Mel
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#556741 - 02/25/07 01:21 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
argerichfan Offline
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 Quote:
Originally posted by dannylux:
What kind of fantasy world does one have to live in to believe that's a very ill 71 year old lady playing?
I don't know, Mel, you tell me! \:D I won't hazzard a guess who's playing this; it doesn't match any recordings I have in my collection. Still, I'll go on record -so to speak- as one who smelled something dodgy about Hatto from the beginning.
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#556742 - 02/25/07 04:51 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Octavia Offline
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This article speculates about a possible motive:

UK Daily Mail
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#556743 - 02/26/07 12:27 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Lee_Gato Offline
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NEW: 'I did it for my wife' – Joyce Hatto exclusive, William Barrington-Coupe confesses[/b]

In an amazing turn of events, Gramophone has learned of a letter sent from William Barrington-Coupe to the head of BIS records in which he makes a full confession of his wrongdoing in the Joyce Hatto affair. Gramophone subsequently contacted Barrington-Coupe, who confirmed that he stands by the letter’s contents.

http://www.gramophone.co.uk/newsMainTemplate.asp?storyID=2765&newssectionID=1

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#556744 - 02/26/07 12:52 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
sophial Offline
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There was also an article in the editorial section of the NY Times today (I don't have the link) that strongly implied Hatto herself must have been involved. I just read the Gramophone article above, and Barrington-Coupe's latest story just doesnt hold much water either. If all he was doing was inserting portions to cover her "grunts", the wave forms would not match up identically as they do. It looks like he is playing the sympathy card to avoid legal action at this point. The fascinating question still is: was Hatto herself part of this scam knowingly? if not, was it a kind of "willing disbelief" brought about by her desire to have some recognition (or revenge for a frustrated career) late in life or was she duped completely by her husband? the movie can't be too far off....

Sophia

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#556745 - 02/26/07 01:17 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
signa Offline
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from what i have read (not today's though), i already thought Hatto was the part of conspiracy herself. it's much unlikely only her husband was involved without ever her knowing.

i once asked my teacher if he could recognize his own playing from recordings, and he told me that he could. thus, Hatto might as well recoginize anything from recordings if they're her own playing or if they're not.

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#556746 - 02/26/07 01:29 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Octavia Offline
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 Quote:
Originally posted by Lee_Gato:
NEW: 'I did it for my wife' – Joyce Hatto exclusive, William Barrington-Coupe confesses[/b]
[/b]
He kept selling the CDs and issuing new ones after her death. This "confession" is as self-serving as they come, and not plausible in the least (i.e, patching in sections of commercial recordings to cover up the grunts).
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#556747 - 02/26/07 01:41 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
AndrewG Offline
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From the confessing husband we have finally this article from the UK Gramophone site:

=======================================================================================

NEW: 'I did it for my wife'[/b] – Joyce Hatto exclusive, William Barrington-Coupe confesses February 26 2007

In an amazing turn of events, Gramophone has learned of a letter sent from William Barrington-Coupe to the head of BIS records in which he makes a full confession of his wrongdoing in the Joyce Hatto affair. Gramophone subsequently contacted Barrington-Coupe, who confirmed that he stands by the letter’s contents.



It was Gramophone that first revealed how several of the recordings released by Barrington-Coupe under his late wife’s name were identical to other recordings by a range of pianists on different labels. A media storm ensued, with most of the world’s major media outlets reporting the scandal. Amidst it all, Barrington-Coupe denied all allegations of wrongdoing and insisted that he was present at all major sessions, and that the discs were all his wife’s work.

The truth, we now know from his own pen, is different. Robert von Bahr’s BIS records had one of the first identified cases of duplication – the “Hatto” recording of Liszt’s Transcendental Studies exactly matched the soundwaves on Laszlo Simon’s BIS recording. And it was to von Bahr whom Barrington-Coupe wrote his letter of confession.

Although he has made clear that he is not “seeking revenge”, von Bahr kindly agreed to make the substance of the letter known to us, especially as the writer does not bind him to confidentiality. In the letter, Barrington-Coupe explains that he did indeed pass off other people’s recordings as his wife’s, but that he did it to give her the illusion of a great end to an unfairly (as he terms it) overlooked career.

This is the story, as Barrington-Coupe tells it.

The advent of compact disc in 1983 meant that the cassettes he was producing of his wife playing were quickly ignored by critics, as magazines such as Gramophone gradually made the transition to the new format. It was not until many years later, Barrington-Coupe writes, that he had the capacity to produce CDs, by which time Hatto was already in the advanced stages of the ovarian cancer which would kill her. He tried to transfer the cassette recordings to disc, but without great success. So the decision was made to re-record her repertoire.

Although she kept up a rigorous practice regime, Barrington-Coupe says that Hatto was suffering more than she admitted, even to herself. Recording session after recording session was marred by her many grunts of pain as she played, and her husband was at a loss to know how to cover the problem passages.

Until, that is, he remembered the story of Elisabeth Schwarzkopf covering the high notes for Kirsten Flagstad in the famous EMI recording of Wagner’s Tristan und Isolde. Surely something similar could apply here, he reasoned. He began searching for pianists whose sound and style were similar to that of his wife, and once he had found them he would insert small patches of their recordings to cover his wife’s grunts.

As he grew more adept at the practice, he began to take longer sections to ease the editing process, and discovered, he says, by accident how to digitally stretch the time of the source recordings to disguise the sound. He would, he says, use Hatto’s performances as a blueprint and source recordings which were along the same lines (Laszlo, for instance, shared a teacher with his wife and so, Barington-Coupe says, had the same kind of style and technique).

The performances were hailed as superb in Gramophone and elsewhere, and finally his wife – fading fast – had the appreciation that her husband felt was rightfully hers. According to his letter, though, she did not hunger for fame and when told of the admiring article Jeremy Nicholas wrote for Gramophone early in 2006 (which had a great effect in concentrating critical eyes and ears upon her), she said: “It’s all too late.”

Barrington-Coupe, however, says he did not know about the process whereby a computer’s media player seeks to identify a recording, until it was too late. That led to his downfall. Now, he tells von Bahr, he deeply regrets what has happened. He feels that he has acted stupidly, dishonestly and unlawfully. However, he maintains that his wife knew nothing of the deception. He also claims that he has not made vast amounts of money from what he has done – and that the number of recordings sold by his company (including non-Hatto discs) between April 2006 and the time of writing only number 5595. The number of recordings sold in the previous year was only 3051 (he confirmed these figures to Gramophone).

The question remains as to how much of this confession we should actually believe. It is in some ways a humane, romantic story. However, newspaper investigations following the first Hatto revelations have uncovered shady dealing from Barrington-Coupe’s past. He received a prison sentence in 1966 for failure to pay purchase tax. Whether this throws doubt on his confession now, made only after our revelations and in the light of the fact that he continued to release “Hatto” recordings after his wife’s death, is open to debate.

What music lovers will want, and what he must surely now provide (together, where possible, with witnesses who can verify), is a full and accurate list of which Joyce Hatto recordings actually feature Joyce Hatto, and which other artists were involved where appropriate. Only then will we know how good she actually was, and only then can at least some of her reputation be salvaged. When asked to do this, Barrington-Coupe replied that he didn’t want to go down that road, adding, “I’m tired, I’m not very well. I’ve closed the operation down, I’ve had the stock completely destroyed, and I’m not producing any more. Now I just want a little bit of peace.”

As for that, much depends on how the industry reacts. Von Bahr tells Gramophone that he is unlikely to take action himself, as proving financial loss for his Simon recordings would be tricky. He has no idea, he adds, whether Barrington-Coupe is wealthy or not, and in any case, extracting damages from him might be very difficult. “I’m not moved to seek revenge,” he says, “but I’m very glad that the truth is at last known.”

Check this page for regular updates as they occur.

James Inverne, Gramophone

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#556748 - 02/26/07 03:07 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
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Registered: 05/31/01
Posts: 1659
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
He's only sorry he was caught.
_________________________
Hank Drake

The composers want performers be imaginative, in the direction of their thinking--not just robots, who execute orders.
George Szell

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#556749 - 02/26/07 03:30 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
argerichfan Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 8886
Loc: Pacific Northwest, US.
 Quote:
Originally posted by Hank Drake:
He's only sorry he was caught.
I thought we'd had enough of this last year with Kate Moss.
_________________________
Jason

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#556750 - 02/26/07 04:29 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Lee_Gato Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/18/06
Posts: 60
I listened to parts of this one-hour show from Murray Khouri's "Pressing On" program for Radio New Zealand yesterday while reading the Sunday paper:
http://www.veledan.com/hatto/Joyce_Hatto_interview.mp3

She sounded like such a nice charming lady I have to admit. But based on the "confession" published today in my mind there is no way she wasn't involved in the scam.

Here is a follow-up interview with Murray Khouri http://www.radionz.co.nz/cfm/programmes/upbeat/20070219

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#556751 - 02/27/07 09:48 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
ftp Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/10/05
Posts: 2365
Loc: Philadelphia
Sophia,

Here is the link from the NY Times. I saw the article in the paper and found it on-line by googling "Shoot the piano player" New York Times.

www.nytimes.com/2007/02/26/opinion/26dutton.html

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#556752 - 02/28/07 10:33 PM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
sophial Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/05
Posts: 3465
Loc: US
FTP,
Thanks very much! (and thanks for your nice comments re: 1000!!)

This story is strangely compelling. can the movie be far behind? To play Hatto, how about Judi Dench? or Helen Mirren? and for her husband, Michael Gambon?

Sophia

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#556753 - 03/01/07 08:06 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
AndrewG Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 2506
Loc: Denver, Colorado
Here is the article of shooting the piano player:
======================================================================================

February 26, 2007
OP-ED CONTRIBUTOR

Shoot the Piano Player[/b]
By DENIS DUTTON[/b]

Correction Appended
Christchurch, New Zealand

IT seemed almost too good to be true, and in the end it was. A conscientious pianist who had enjoyed an active if undistinguished career in London falls ill and retreats to a small town. Here she undertakes a project to record virtually the entire standard classical repertoire. Her recordings, CDs made when she was in her late 60s and 70s, are staggering, showing a masterful technique, a preternatural ability to adapt to different styles and a depth of musical insight hardly seen elsewhere.
Born in 1928, the pianist, Joyce Hatto, was the daughter of a music-loving London antiques dealer. As a teenager, she said, she kept practicing during the Blitz, hiding under the piano when the bombs were falling. She claimed later to have known the composers Ralph Vaughn Williams, Benjamin Britten and Carl Orff, to have studied Chopin with the French virtuoso Alfred Cortot and taken advice from the pianist Clara Haskil. She was Arnold Bax’s favored interpreter for his “Symphonic Variations.”
Ms. Hatto made recordings from the 1950s until 1970 — some Mozart and Rachmaninoff — but tending toward light-music potboilers: Hubert Bath’s “Cornish Rhapsody” and Richard Addinsell’s “Warsaw Concerto.” Her career was already in decline when she was given a cancer diagnosis in the early 1970s. She retired to a village near Cambridge with her husband, a recording engineer named William Barrington-Coupe, and a fine old Steinway that Rachmaninoff himself had used for prewar recitals in Britain.
Then came one of the strangest turns in the history of classical music. Starting in 1989, Joyce Hatto began recording CDs for a small record label run by her husband. She began with Liszt, went back to cover Bach and all of the Mozart sonatas and continued with a complete Beethoven sonata set. Then on to Schubert and Schumann, Chopin and more Liszt. She played Messiaen. Her Prokofiev sonatas (all nine) were tossed off with incredible virtuosity. In total she recorded more than 120 CDs — including many of the most difficult piano pieces ever written, played with breathtaking speed and accuracy.
Intriguingly, she gave to the music a developed although oddly malleable personality. She could do Schubert in one style, and then Prokofiev almost as though she was a new person playing a different piano — an astonishing, chameleon-like artistic ability.
We normally think of prodigies as children who exhibit some kind of miraculous ability in music. Joyce Hatto became something unheard of in the annals of classical music: a prodigy of old age — the very latest of late bloomers, “the greatest living pianist that almost no one has heard of,” as the critic Richard Dyer put it for himself and many other piano aficionados in The Boston Globe.
Little wonder that when she at last succumbed to her cancer last year at age 77 — recording Beethoven’s Sonata No. 26, “Les Adieux,” from a wheelchair in her last days — The Guardian called her “one of the greatest pianists Britain has ever produced.” Nice touch, that, playing Beethoven’s farewell sonata from a wheelchair. It went along with her image in the press as an indomitable spirit with a charming personality — always ready with a quote from Shakespeare, Arthur Rubinstein or Muhammad Ali. She also had a clear vision of the mission of musical interpreters, telling The Boston Globe: “Our job is to communicate the spiritual content of life as it is presented in the music. Nothing belongs to us; all you can do is pass it along.”
Now it has become brutally clear that “passing along” is exactly what she was up to. Earlier this month, a reader of the British music magazine Gramophone told one of its critics, Jed Distler, that something odd happened when he slid Ms. Hatto’s CD of Liszt’s “Transcendental Études” into his computer. His iTunes library, linked to a catalogue of about four million CDs, immediately identified it as a recording by the Hungarian pianist Laszlo Simon. Mr. Distler then listened to both recordings, and found them identical.
Since then, analysis by professional sound engineers and piano enthusiasts across the globe has pushed toward the same conclusion: the entire Joyce Hatto oeuvre recorded after 1989 appears to be stolen from the CDs of other pianists. It is a scandal unparalleled in the annals of classical music.
Ms. Hatto usually stole from younger artists who were not household names, although on the basis of the reviews she received, they richly deserved to be. Her recording of Chopin mazurkas seems to be by Eugen Indjic; the fiendishly difficult transcription of Chopin studies by Leopold Godowsky are actually recordings by Carlo Grante and Marc-André Hamelin; her Messiaen recordings were by Paul S. Kim; her version of the “Goldberg” Variations of Bach at least in part by Pi-Hsien Chen; the complete Ravel piano music by Roger Muraro. As reports come in, the rip-off list grows daily.
Her concerto recordings are even more brazen. The CD labels say they were made with the National Philharmonic Symphony Orchestra, always conducted by one René Köhler. Mr. Barrington-Coupe told a reporter that this was his name for a pick-up orchestra of Polish émigrés whom, he said, came out from London to record at a venue he now refuses to reveal. He declined to further discuss the orchestra on the grounds that they were employed “below union rates.” No one has yet been able to find a single reference to this René Köhler outside of the Joyce Hatto recordings, nor have any members of the orchestra come forward to confirm Mr. Barrington-Coupe’s story.
In a rapturous review of Ms. Hatto’s playing of Rachmaninoff’s Third Concerto, one critic said of the orchestra musicians: “It doesn’t matter who they are, their playing is tight and hot.” Actually, it did matter, since they have turned out to be the Philharmonia Orchestra of London, conducted by Esa-Pekka Salonen, performing with the formidable Yefim Bronfman. Her version of the Brahms Second Concerto is Vladimir Ashkenazy’s, with the Vienna Philharmonic under Bernard Haitink laboring in the name of René Köhler and his non-union Poles.
Since the news broke, some have likened the exploits of Joyce Hatto to the notorious 20th-century Vermeer forger Han van Meegeren. But the differences are significant. Van Meegeren’s success was based as much on presentation — stories of old Italian families impoverished before World War II and needing quick cash — as on artistic plausibility. After he confessed, it was not hard for anyone to see that his dreadful fakes had more in common with each other than with any original Vermeers.
Joyce Hatto, however, was not a pianistic forger. In order to forge a piano performance, she would have had to record Beethoven’s “Hammerklavier” herself and sell it to the world as a lost recording by, say, William Kapell. She was instead a plagiarist: she stole other pianists’ work and, with only a few electronic alterations, sold it as her own.
Although the critics who praised Van Meegerens’s “Vermeers” as masterpieces were in the end rightly humiliated, the same should not be true of those who praised Ms. Hatto’s recordings. They may have been fooled, but their opinions were not foolish, because the artists she ripped off played beautifully.
Yet the Joyce Hatto episode is a stern reminder of the importance of framing and background in criticism. Music isn’t just about sound; it is about achievement in a larger human sense. If you think an interpretation is by a 74-year-old pianist at the end of her life, it won’t sound quite the same to you as if you think it’s by a 24-year-old piano-competition winner who is just starting out. Beyond all the pretty notes, we want creative engagement and communication from music, we want music to be a bridge to another personality. Otherwise, we might as well feed Chopin scores into a computer.
This makes instrumental criticism a tricky business. I’m personally convinced that there is an authentic, objective maturity that I can hear in the later recordings of Rubinstein. This special quality of his is actually in the music, and is not just subjectively derived from seeing the wrinkles in the old man’s face. But the Joyce Hatto episode shows that our expectations, our knowledge of a back story, can subtly, or perhaps even crudely, affect our aesthetic response.
The greatest lesson for us all ought to be, however, that there are more fine young pianists out there than most of us realize. If it wasn’t Joyce Hatto, then who did perform those dazzlingly powerful Prokofiev sonatas? Having been so moved by hearing “her” Schubert on the radio, I’ve vowed to honor the real pianist by ordering the proper CD, as soon as I find out who it is. Backhanded credit to Joyce Hatto for having introduced us to some fine new talent.
Denis Dutton, who teaches aesthetics at the University of Canterbury, is the author of the forthcoming book “The Art Instinct.”
Correction: Feb. 27, 2006
An Op-Ed article yesterday, about the disputed works of the pianist Joyce Hatto, misidentified a music critic for Gramophone magazine. He is Jed Distler, not Jeremy Distler.

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#556754 - 03/01/07 08:15 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
AndrewG Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 2506
Loc: Denver, Colorado
Online free encyclopaedia is one source you can see and read almost everything related to this recent scandal for those interested:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joyce_Hatto

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#556755 - 03/06/07 04:49 AM Re: Joyce Hatto hoax
Andrys Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/25/07
Posts: 43
Loc: Berkeley, California
 Quote:
Originally posted by AndrewG:
Online free encyclopaedia is one source you can see and read almost everything related to this recent scandal for those interested:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joyce_Hatto [/b]
An adjunct to that (linked to by The Times interview with him at his home the other day and by Alex Ross) is my Hatto news log at http://www.andrys.com/hatto.html

It also holds the first 2 small mp3 files that generated interest on the Net in her recordings late 2002 (during blind-listening in a piano forum).
_________________________
- Andrys, hobbyist, intermediate level
Hobbyist mp3 site

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