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#56304 - 03/31/06 03:33 PM Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
chic_losa Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/29/06
Posts: 2
Loc: SW California
Hello everyone!
1* I'm interested in buying a Petrof piano. Weinbach is made by Petrof and is cheaper. Larry Fine says in his original Piano book "Weinbach - see Petrof". I wonder if there are differences inside of the pianos, in materials used, overall quality. I do not care much about the "outside look". One dealer said, Petrof and Weinbach are identical instruments and it is just a marketing issue to have two brands.
Anyone has an idea?
2* Would new Weinbach 6'4'' for around $17000 considered a good deal?
Thank you.

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#56305 - 03/31/06 04:02 PM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
NmbrNine Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/21/05
Posts: 288
Loc: West
Hi chic_losa:

I played them both within the last year...though the Petrof IV and it's Weinbach equivalent we're voiced a bit differently, they were (as this reputable dealer pointed out) basically identical. I believe the Petrof has a more ornate plate, and different colored felt if I recall correctly, someone else may be able to give you more specifics on the cosmetic differences.

I recall the Petrof III would have been offered in the low 20s, so by comparison, your price on a 6'4" Weinbach would seem in the right ballpark to me.

I should point out that I'm not a dealer, nor an expert, those were just my findings during my shopping experience.

Good luck.

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#56306 - 04/01/06 02:06 PM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
Utrumpet Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/12/05
Posts: 154
Loc: Utah
Petrof and Weinbach are currently the same piano internally, not sure if Weinbachs contain Renner action like the Petrofs. Mainly the difference is cosmetic. As far as the future of Weinbach, their assembly is being shipped to China in the near future. The parts will still be built in the Czech Republic, but assembled in China.
_________________________
Piano consultant.
Riverton Music
Salt Lake City, UT
(801)255-8300

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#56307 - 04/01/06 07:31 PM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
Rich Galassini Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/28/01
Posts: 8975
Loc: Philadelphia/South Jersey
Utrumpet is correct.

If you are considering a Czech built Weinbach against a Petrof... but what you love an start playing. It is that simple.
_________________________
Rich Galassini
Cunningham Piano Co.
Phila, Pa.
Dir. Line (215) 991-0834
rich@cunninghampiano.com
Get Cunningham Piano Email Updates

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#56308 - 04/01/06 10:54 PM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
jt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/13/05
Posts: 13
Loc: Silvis, IL
I just chose between a 6' 4" Petrof and Weinbach. The dealer stated that the pianos are identical except that the Petrof has glossy paint on the plate and has green felt rather than red. I also noticed that the Weinbach has a so-so decal on the fallboard whereas the Petrof has the name engraved (really cool). The materials are supposed to be identical, and the pianos are until now manufactured in the same plant. Weinbach has a smaller selection of sizes and models, and the magnetic accelerated action is available only in the Petrof. My Weinbach has Renner parts mounted on a Petrof frame. The price you quote was similar to the deal I got in Chicago last month. I compared a Petrof with MAA with three Weinbachs the same size, and as each instrument is, of course different, I found the sound of two of the three Weinbachs preferable to that of the Petrof. Of course, the Petrof's action, being magnetic, was lighter and more responsive than the Weinbachs'. I am delighted with my new Weinbach. An advantage of both Weinbachs and Petrofs is that they do not charge more for finishes other than ebony. My Weinbach is black walnut, and the cabinetry is absolutely gorgeous and cost no more than ebony.

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#56309 - 04/02/06 12:56 AM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
chic_losa Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/29/06
Posts: 2
Loc: SW California
Thank you all for your responses !!!

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#56310 - 04/02/06 05:13 AM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
Rockitman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/30/04
Posts: 284
Loc: Central Calif
Petrof has the red felt.

Anybody that knows anything about pianos knows that a red felt piano sounds much nicer than a green one.

Also, engraved fallboards also add to the tonal
quality of the instrument.


The name Petrof sounds much nicer than WineBach.

If you like to play Bach, you'll regret getting the WineBach, cuz you'll always be whinning about how shitty your Bach sounds.

Get the Petrof.

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#56311 - 04/02/06 10:03 AM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
jt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/13/05
Posts: 13
Loc: Silvis, IL
Yes, Rockitman is right--I misspoke about the felt. Petrof is red, Weinbach is green. Sorry!

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#56312 - 04/02/06 11:14 AM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17666
Loc: Victoria, BC
jt :

Your apology is well "felt".
_________________________
BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190 in satin ebony

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#56313 - 04/02/06 04:00 PM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
AdagioM Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/25/04
Posts: 723
Loc: Oregon
JT: I believed you about the felt colors, even though I have a Weinbach and play it every day! So you can see how important felt color can be.

Rockitman: Thanks for setting me straight! I just went over and looked at my piano, and you are correct.

\:o
_________________________


http://pdxknitterati.com

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#56314 - 04/07/06 12:37 PM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
lucy_amanda Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/07/06
Posts: 84
 Quote:
Originally posted by chic_losa:
Hello everyone!
1* I'm interested in buying a Petrof piano. Weinbach is made by Petrof and is cheaper. Larry Fine says in his original Piano book "Weinbach - see Petrof". I wonder if there are differences inside of the pianos, in materials used, overall quality. I do not care much about the "outside look". One dealer said, Petrof and Weinbach are identical instruments and it is just a marketing issue to have two brands.
Anyone has an idea?
2* Would new Weinbach 6'4'' for around $17000 considered a good deal?
Thank you. [/b]

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#56315 - 04/07/06 12:41 PM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
lucy_amanda Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/07/06
Posts: 84
There are design differences. Check out the Geneva International's website (US distributer for Petrof, Weinbach, and Nordiska pianos) http://www.geneva-intl.com for the specifications of the different Petrof and Weinbach models. Petrof is a superior product line: the keyboard is made of solid spruce while in the Weinbach it is made of veneers. The string material is also different and so too is the rim. I am surprised that you found a 6'4" Weinbach, it looks like the Weinbach grand pianos are issued at different sizes from the Petrof - 5'0", 5'5" and 6'0". Petrof's grand piano sizes are 5'3", 5'8", 6'4" and all the way up to 9'. You will also note that Weinbach is presented in secondary order to the Petrof and is described as being an international collaboration of design and manufacturing from Czech, US, Germany, and China while the Petrof is not described in this manner. I have had a Petrof vertical for the past 10 years and have been most pleased with it. The tuning holds up remarkably well and the tone is quite beautiful. We are thinking of upgrading to a Petrof grand piano. For the price difference, I would stick with the Petrof over the Weinbach.

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#56316 - 04/07/06 10:09 PM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
AdagioM Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/25/04
Posts: 723
Loc: Oregon
These differences are new. It sounds like the new Weinbach line was introduced at NAMM 2006. The old line of Weinbachs were made by Petrof in the Czech Republic. I have a 5'8" Weinbach.
_________________________


http://pdxknitterati.com

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#56317 - 04/08/06 12:25 AM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
FogVilleLad Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 4680
Loc: San Francisco
Also sounds like Weinbach is being relegated to the "stencil" category.

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#56318 - 04/08/06 06:28 PM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
apple* Offline


Registered: 01/01/03
Posts: 19862
Loc: Kansas
I just played a Weinbach for and hour at a church.. (purchased last spring) and did not care for the tone or action - it was very difficult to control the volume of the notes... especially in comparison w/ the lovely Petrofs i played in my own piano search.

-for what that's worth
_________________________
accompanist/organist.. a non-MTNA teacher to a few

love and peace, Õun (apple in Estonian)

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#56319 - 04/08/06 10:47 PM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
George K Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/20/04
Posts: 999
Loc: The Midwest
 Quote:
Originally posted by apple*:
especially in comparison w/ the lovely Petrofs i played in my own piano search.
[/b]
Yah, but that's not what you bought, is it?
_________________________

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#56320 - 04/08/06 11:09 PM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
Norbert Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/03/01
Posts: 13969
Loc: Surrey, B.C.
 Quote:
Petrof and Weinbach are currently the same piano internally, not sure if Weinbachs contain Renner action like the Petrofs.
Not according to Geneva's own website.

Petrof actions are now described as "Petrof original" there.

web page

In the past, I know for a fact that, outside their largest grands, the full Renner was an option only[/b] on selected models.

Norbert
_________________________
www.heritagepianos.com
Greater Vancouver B.C. piano dealers for : C.Sauter, Estonia, Brodmann, Ritmuller
604-951-8642

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#56321 - 04/09/06 11:51 AM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
apple* Offline


Registered: 01/01/03
Posts: 19862
Loc: Kansas
 Quote:
Originally posted by George K:
Yah, but that's not what you bought, is it? [/b]
no.. it's not.. i seriously considered the Petrof.. just couldn't get the price right.

I get the chance to regularly play about 6 pianos and i soooooo appreciate the finesse and solidity of mine..

and actually the Young Chang i play weekly is better than the Weinbach i played yesterday.

JMHO
_________________________
accompanist/organist.. a non-MTNA teacher to a few

love and peace, Õun (apple in Estonian)

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#56322 - 04/09/06 06:01 PM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
Rockitman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/30/04
Posts: 284
Loc: Central Calif
Apple, could you give your impressions on the sound of the Petrofs you've played vs. your Estonia?
I assume you got the Estonia for it's solid design and probably nicer action, but did the tone also win out over the Petrof's you sampled?

As I've never seen an Estonia, I'm just curious.

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#56323 - 04/09/06 08:47 PM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
apple* Offline


Registered: 01/01/03
Posts: 19862
Loc: Kansas
absolutely..

A Petrof IV was available in KC... actually 3.

This is hard for me to answer because i ordered my Estonia 168 and i had only played a 190 at an Estate sale for just a few minutes and i was instantly enamored with the 190. I was ecstatic when the piano was set up.. It rang like a huge bell.

The Estonia sustains longer, sounds more complex -with more overtones and a wave effect that sounds with a ringing tone.. the sound comes in waves.. and you can control in a way, the pulse of the waves. The bass was louder and deeper...I've had my piano for gosh will it be 2 years in June?


Would i have been just as happy with a Petrof? probably, maybe. The Petrof's octave above middle c seemed to be more prominent than the octave below middle c .. I can't say that about my piano.. (but, i bought it 'out of the box and except for tunings and expert routine care by my able tech it's not been in any way voiced or regulated.) To me the Petrof seemed thinner and maybe a bit clearer - with the clarity of a Yamaha for instance that has a bit of a quicker decay..

There is so much resonance going on in the Estonia.. the decay.. decays veeeerrry slowly.. you have to be careful not to play sloppily or overpedal because it will project the 'mistakes'..

I do think the way to judge the quality of a piano is to see if it can play what you want it to play.. exactly what you want it to play..

i can't really judge the action.. the Petrof's seemed lighter with a bit more play a bit less control.. less upweight.. but i haven't played one for a year.
_________________________
accompanist/organist.. a non-MTNA teacher to a few

love and peace, Õun (apple in Estonian)

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#56324 - 04/10/06 09:54 AM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
Rockitman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/30/04
Posts: 284
Loc: Central Calif
"I do think the way to judge the quality of a piano is to see if it can play what you want it to play.. exactly what you want it to play.. "

Well I want my piano to play Rach 3 flawlessly.

I haven't found that piano yet. \:\)

These piano builders still have a lot of work ahead of them to make my quality piano.

All kidding aside, thanks for your observations.

Did you also sample Petrof III's in your search?

How does the sound differ from the 190 and 168?

I didn't get to sample a Petrof IV (5'8") but did get to try a V (5'3"), and the III (6'4") was a totally different "grander" piano.


It's interesting, I've heard from others here that if there was any knock on Estonia, it was in a lack of a full resounding bass.

Also, the Petrof actions seem to differ from one piano to another, some plodding and stiff while others very acceptable. Obviously, dealer prep is the issue here.

Mine was the first case, but some good regulation has taken care of that. Whereas Estonias, appear to come well regulated out of the box.

Now that my piano is almost a year old, I can vouch for the breaking in of the tone. It sounds better and better everyday. The "ringing" sound I fell in love with has grown and the decay is very slow.

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#56325 - 04/10/06 10:21 AM Re: Petrof vs. Weinbach - difference in quality? Price?
apple* Offline


Registered: 01/01/03
Posts: 19862
Loc: Kansas
the only problem i have with my piano is that it is not as long as i would like it. I definitely have a space restraint. Shoot I'd love a concert grand.

If i had no money or space restrictions i would have bought a 7 foot Steinway..

not that i don't love my little estoniette

Right now Petrof's are few and far betw/ in KC. Weinbach's are around.. My little friend (he's 12) bought (parents) a 5'8" Weinbach about 2 years ago.. it's fine piano.. does just what it is supposed to.

I did play some IIIs and liked them very much...too long and too much money at the time.
_________________________
accompanist/organist.. a non-MTNA teacher to a few

love and peace, Õun (apple in Estonian)

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