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#569547 - 01/07/06 06:30 PM Un Sospiro Fingering
Linkxero Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/07/06
Posts: 3
Loc: Regina Saskatchewan Canada
Hi, ok, just started un sospiro and im wondering what you do for the fingering in measure 9, im sure people do it differently, so that would be awsome if you could post how you do it.

Oh and just to verify that I wont run into any proplems, for the first part I play the first three notes going up with the left hand and the next four with the right and the top not with the left, is that good?

Thanks for your help, and it's good to be a part of this forum.

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#569548 - 01/07/06 07:24 PM Re: Un Sospiro Fingering
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17666
Loc: Victoria, BC
Linkxero :

Welcome to the forum!

I don't agree with your fingering for the opening bars, although you may have small hands, which might justify your fingering.

I take the first four notes (Db Ab Db F) with the LH, and the remaining notes with the RH. I see no need to do cross-hand fingering in the opening accompaniment figure, and I think there's less of a chance of the top Ab standing out from the arpeggiated figure if it's played with the RH.

Similarly, in bar 9 :

LH = 5,3,2,1; RH = 1, 2, 3, 5, with the melody notes : Gb with LH, F with RH and C with LH.
_________________________
BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190 in satin ebony

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#569549 - 01/07/06 08:24 PM Re: Un Sospiro Fingering
8ude Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 2050
I agree with Bruce - for the beginning try to hit 4 notes with the LH and then the other 4 notes in the upward arpeggio with the RH. Though the way you have it is not too bad, just make sure not to emphasize the top Ab until the real melody starts.

Re/ bar 9, Bruce's suggestion is the fingering I use and it works fine.
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#569550 - 01/08/06 07:31 PM Re: Un Sospiro Fingering
Linkxero Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/07/06
Posts: 3
Loc: Regina Saskatchewan Canada
Ok, thanks, so for the first part do you have to sort of 'roll' your left hand to reach the first 4 notes? because I can't reach the first 4 notes(at the same time), oh and does anyone here play it like I do and what do you do for measure 9?

Thanks again

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#569551 - 01/08/06 07:37 PM Re: Un Sospiro Fingering
8ude Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 2050
Unless you've got really big hands, you'll need to move your hand to be able to hit those notes in the LH. Use 5-3-2-1.
_________________________
What you are is an accident of birth. What I am, I am through my own efforts. There have been a thousand princes and there will be a thousand more. There is one Beethoven.

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#569552 - 01/09/06 09:24 AM Re: Un Sospiro Fingering
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17666
Loc: Victoria, BC
 Quote:
Originally posted by Linkxero:
Ok, thanks, so for the first part do you have to sort of 'roll' your left hand to reach the first 4 notes? because I can't reach the first 4 notes(at the same time), oh and does anyone here play it like I do and what do you do for measure 9?

Thanks again [/b]
Your question makes me wonder if you are trying to hold down the notes in the LH. Since the arpeggio is composed of 16th notes, it is not necessary to hold them down. Furthermore, the sustain of the arpeggio's individual notes is done by the damper pedal.

Regards,
_________________________
BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190 in satin ebony

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#569553 - 01/09/06 09:55 AM Re: Un Sospiro Fingering
sevenfootgrand Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/07/05
Posts: 35
I've done LH: 5,3,2,1 as well but ended up (somewhat unconsciously) playing it 5,2,1,2. It's kind of a rolling/rotational motion - combination arm/wrist/fingers. Anyway, I have large hands but ended up finding this technique to more inherently more relaxed. Just another idea to try.

The section I had to think about comes a few pages later - don't have the score in front of me, but it's the fast series of repeated arpeggios w/ both hands - tried several techniques to get the right sort of light/transparent sound at a high speed. Spent most of my practice time on that piece sorting out that one page!

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#569554 - 01/09/06 02:48 PM Re: Un Sospiro Fingering
Contrapunctus Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/08/05
Posts: 808
Loc: Whittier, California
Oh no, I'm afraid that neither of you are correct. Have you gone over this piece with your teachers?
You play the first four notes in the LH, the next three notes in the RH and that very last note that forms the melody in the LH. You will need to cross over for that. the notes of the nelody that come in between the arpeggios you play with your RH, though. On the second page when the melody notes are eighth -note octaves, you play them all with RH and the arpeggios entirely with LH.
Also, you do not keep your fingers down on the arpeggios. Use the pedal and let your hand follow the contour of notes for the smoothest possible performance.
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#569555 - 01/10/06 12:46 AM Re: Un Sospiro Fingering
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17666
Loc: Victoria, BC
Contrapunctus :

I don't know who the "both" of us are who are wrong in your opinion, but if you will go back and read my first post on this thread, I was talking about the opening two measures before the melody begins when I said : "I take the first four notes (Db Ab Db F) with the LH, and the remaining notes with the RH. I see no need to do cross-hand fingering in the opening accompaniment figure , and I think there's less of a chance of the top Ab standing out from the arpeggiated figure if it's played with the RH.

It's an entirely different matter beginning at bar three where, starting on beat 2, the melody alternates between LH and RH for each note. It's even so clearly marked in the scores that I have(upper stave = LH, RH, LH, RH, etc.) that I thought it was clear we weren't talking about bars 3 and onward.

Regards,
_________________________
BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190 in satin ebony

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#569556 - 01/10/06 10:06 AM Re: Un Sospiro Fingering
sevenfootgrand Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/07/05
Posts: 35
Since I might be the other incorrect person, let me clarify my earlier post. I was just throwing out an alternative LH fingering for measure 9 (Linkxero's original question).

For the sake of Linkxero - who is by now probably totally confused by all this: I wouldn't call it incorrect but Contrapunctus' description of playing the octave eighth notes with the right hand (only) on page two is not conventional. I have one score (Hinson) with specific notation to continue alternating hands through the octaves passage.

On the other hand, whatever works, works.

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#569557 - 01/10/06 11:45 AM Re: Un Sospiro Fingering
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17666
Loc: Victoria, BC
I have to agree with sevenfootgrand's last comment, too. I would agree that it's quite unconventional to play the broken octave melody with RH only. In my scores it's clearly marked to alternate LH / RH for this section, which is totally consistent with the first manifestation of the melody. I have also seen this played several times by pianists of various levels of competence, and they have all - to my recollection - alternated hands when playing the broken octaves.

My only question at that point in the score, when the LH plays the broken octaves is: do you use 3,2 as the LH fingering consistently throughout this section?

This is one of those times when it would be so satisfying to be all grouped around the same piano discussing and demonstrating, wouldn't it?

Regards,
_________________________
BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190 in satin ebony

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#569558 - 01/10/06 12:28 PM Re: Un Sospiro Fingering
Hakki Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 2100
My edition (Universal-Edition Nr.5849.5981.5940, Herausgegeben von Ignaz Friedman, my German is not good so someone might translate this) also shows the eighth octaves as alternating between hands and suggests two different fingerings for the left hand broken octaves as 3-2 or 5-2 respectively. Though it is not stated here if I remember correctly, 3-2 was actually Liszt's fingering.
So, I concur with what BrudeD and sevenfootgrand has said and I have to disagree with Contrapunctus.

Regards,
Hakki.
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#569559 - 01/10/06 04:12 PM Re: Un Sospiro Fingering
Contrapunctus Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/08/05
Posts: 808
Loc: Whittier, California
Yes, I know the fingering in the book states to continue altering RH and LH in the octave section. However, I have found it easier to play it the other way. Yes, I continue to use 2,3 fingering throughout.
Sorry, I did not know that you were speaking about the first line only and not the entir first page.
_________________________
I don't know what the meaning of life is- I'm too busy to figure it out.

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#569560 - 01/10/06 04:38 PM Re: Un Sospiro Fingering
Linkxero Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/07/06
Posts: 3
Loc: Regina Saskatchewan Canada
Haha,im not entirely confused :p But thanks for all your input I'v started playing the base notes 5321 and its working fine so thanks.

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