Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Piano Forum SOCK PUPPET ALERT: Essex, Yamaha, Charles Walter

I would ask you to reread my post and point out to me where I accuse you of trashing the competition. I know that emotions are running high and you may have, understandably, said something you really do not have clear evidence for.

Shilling outrageously for Steinway, indeed! I think that is obvious to anyone with the meanest intelligence.

Oh, and your first sock-post to start this thread is a dig at CW. Subtle, not gross, but a clear dig designed to turn the discussion, and done as a sock to promote your brand. That's not an honest opinion.

Those of us who think you should be banned are rather forthright in explaining why. You may choose to call it a witch hunt if it makes you feel better.

Lastly, I challenge YOU to show that I trash Steinway. I have posted many complimentary things about Steinway products. I even started my own thread to describe my visit to Steinway Hall with my son (complete with paeans of praise to a wonderful D under the dome.

What I react to is boilerplate promo-sheet hype of the sort you have repeatedly foisted upon this forum. You have brought great discredit to a fine piano.

Now with this sock episode, you need to depart.

Exactly. You're anonymous anyway. Why is it so important that you continue to post as Pianomadam? Given recent developments, it's rather bizarre. You're just a bunch of dishonest electrons to the rest of us, so if you really want to continue participating in this disconnected form of social interaction, change your name and pretend nothing happened. Pianomadam is dead.

She may not be anonymous to her immediate environment and may have bad karma there too

I hope this is not what happens. If a person is banned, that person is gone, not not just their current avatar.

an internet address can be blocked. ironically the one other person who was permanently blocked was the BEST at doing the laundry.

I think this is restating the obvious, but most people here—the ones with our "dopey" noms de guerre—don't feel it's wise (or even safe) to use our real names. I'm sure the only thing most of us want to hide is our full names, for the very practical reason that there are a lot of nuts out there. Most of us say things from time to time that someone, somewhere for some reason will find controversial, and it's as easy to make enemies as friends on these here Internets.

Are you aware of how much can be found out about you by revealing your name and location to anyone with a casual motivation to do so? It's certainly your choice to do so, but smugness toward those of us who don't isn't appropriate. (FWIW, Monica hasn't used her surname here for quite a while.)

Steven

I agree with Steven / Sotto Voice here.

There are people who trawl internet forums looking for ID theft material, or just to use the contacts gleaned for nuisance purposes.

I have been on this forum for years now. I have corresponded with many members here and many know my full real name - the forename of which is, remarkably enough, Adrian. My avatar is my initials.

That said I think it is different for a dealer. Dealers - who let's be honest seek commercial gain from being here - should publish their name or their business name. Those dealers who use their genuine id may well get business from it if they post here in a sensible way.

I personally think that dealers who hide behind anonymous avatars should be at least temporarily banned promptly if they engage in blatant brand promotion or blatant brand knocking.

And PianoMadam, having a dig at Piano Dad (who publishes his real name for all to see) is just laughable. He does not need me to defend him, but in several years here I have NEVER seen him engage in brand bashing. We have corresponded from time to time and to my mind he is one of the people here who displays considerable integrity - whether of not you agree with his opinions.

Kind regards

Adrian

Pianomadam, here is a thread started by jman37 where he praises Boston at the expense of trashing Kawai. You join in on page 3 to cast subtle aspersions on Kawai actions. A little later on Turandot accuses you of tag teaming with jman37.

http://www.pianoworld.com/ubb/ubb/ultimatebb.php?/topic/1/24913.html

Rod already linked this thread where you tag teamed with L1037, but here it is again

http://www.pianoworld.com/ubb/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?/topic/1/21749.html

Here's an interesting thread that doesn't trash the competition. You start the thread by asking which line the reader would rather represent, Yamaha or Kawai. The first response is by jman37 hijacking the thread (planned perhaps?) to suggest Boston.

http://www.pianoworld.com/ubb/ubb/ultimatebb.php?/topic/1/24927.html#000001

Dan

Do these professional piano people who play these silly games actually think they are effecting piano sales in any way, shape or form? LOL

Well, if my memory serves me, several people have posted that they felt deceived by some of what they read here concerning a recently defunct internet seller. I have no desire to turn this thread in that direction (please!), but I have no problems accepting that some people can be persuaded to shift their purchase based on the skillful manipulations of a sock here at PW.


P.S. Thanks Adrian.

I don't mind the defense!

Mark...thay are not "professional" people. They are just people who call themselves that but without any of the integrity that actually being a true professional requires.

One advantage they gain is a lots of google hits for their brands. This may pull shoppers in their direction. Possibly.

The other potential advantage they seek may be to damage competing brands.

Thank you Stephen for making this sane observation. One could flip John's sweeping slur and say that anyone who posts with a clear identity here is simply interested in calling attention to herself/himself, whether for piano biz related rea$ons or simply from a 'here I am, look at me' perspective. To generalize in that direction would not be right either.

Just a general comment on the festivities here.

The forum has rules. Pianomadam has admitted to breaking the rules. She has also expressed a desire to remain here and to be given a second chance. Ken Knapp is the moderator of this forum. He works with other moderators and the owner. It is their call as to how to deal with those who break the rules.

I can't exactly figure out what the reason is that this morality play keeps piling up the pages. At this point is seems like some people are queueing up just for another chance to stomp on a dead insect lying on the pavement. I mean what's with the continual stream of Pinocchio images?

Or maybe this is a wake that is being well-attended beyond all expectations because enemies of the deceased have traveled great distances to pay their disrespects.

I really don't think anyone here should want the mods to make a decision based on how many hooded or unhooded faces and lit torches can be seen at the castle gate. We are all better-served if they use their best judgment based on rules and precedent in punishment whether we agree with any individual decision or not. They operate from a frame of reference that is far wider than anything we have.

Mark, how can we know that Pianomadam is even a piano professional since she keeps hiding behind anonymity?

And I don't begrudge any sales falling to our dealers who do disclose their personal and professional identities. Many of those dealers give a lot of very useful information.

Dan

I guess I should of said anyone playing these silly games having much effect on piano sales to any great extent. And when I say this I am referring to piano branding, not the Internet sales mess from PSS. Even though I could never buy a piano I didn't actually play...

It seems to me there are a lot of people on the forum that are put off/annoyed with S&S marketing tactics. Whether it's the assertion that Concert D's are better than (Bosie/Blunther/Fazioli/M&H etc...) and that's why 99% of concert artist perform exclusively on them, or that essex/boston are superior to because they are "made by Steinway" unlike yammie, kawai etc...Some question whether this aggressive marketing slides into deception.

PianoMadam seems to embody the all the worst adjectives attributed to S&S's marketing program, and now its been caught red-footed (err, red handed).

To the extent S&S cares what is said about it on this forum, it would seem to me that they would want to publicly distance themselves from this type of behavior

this is CLEARLY against the rules and antithetical to what PW is here for.

your kind of help is not what people need.

yes, let's be honest. YOU are the one with the agenda. i sincerely hope you and all of your incarnations are banned. for good.

Come on, I never want to oust Pianomadam from this forum but she or he broke rules by her/himself.

I have repeated my point, whoever tries to promote Essex, Boston over other brands like Yamaha and Kawai with biased info. will eventually damage not only Essex, Boston but also the name of Steinway.

I don't think pianomadam should be banned. She adds a little bourgeois je ne sais pas to the Steinway brand -- kind of cuts through the fancy-pants lingo that Steinway uses to make the brand sound more accesible to people who live in trailers or who buy cars off of "instant credit" car lots.

I've said before that I don't think she is actually a woman and that she probably DOES NOT represent Steinway. If she's anything in person like she is on line, she's probably a terrible representative of the brand and her/his sales are probably in the toilet.

I still would like her take on Cristofori too. . .

Speaking of witch-hunts, did you know that PianoMadam turned my M&H A into a Betsy Ross Spinet?

[incredulous looks]

It got better...