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Boing, Bow-wow-wow, P22 Piano tone
I just bought a Yamaha P22 piano about 20 years old. The piano appears to be in good condition and not used too much. I am a beginner piano
tuner and I tuned the piano myself. The piano seems to be in fairly good tune.

I am not satisfied with the piano tone, however. I want the piano to make a bimp sound but instead it makes a boing, bow-wow-wow sound especially in the middle base. At the local used piano stores, a number of the Yamaha pianos had the undesirable boing sound and not the bimp sound. Apparently the piano technician there did not feel it
was an undesirable sound or did not fix it for some reason. Sometimes pianos in classical radio performances boing a little bit.

Does anyone have any suggestion on how I can improve the tone of this piano? If anyone knows a more technical name for the sounds I am describing please let me know.

"Bimp" instead of "boing?" That's what I love about this business.

Wow, you have a pretty amazing piano there. It actually barks! Unless, it's really the neighbor or his dog and one or the other is really a ventriloquist?

HAHAHAHAHA

Ajahns:

Can you mention some brands and sizes of pianos that you have heard that have the bimp sound that you want in the middle bass?

'Sounds like you still have some wobbly unisons (the bow wow wow), or a temperament problem.

After action regulation and tuning, this 20 year old piano will need hammer voicing. No offense but as a begining tuner, you're probably not the guy for the job.

http://www.pianoworld.com/ubb/ubb/ultimatebb.php?/topic/1/22150.html

In the above thread you told us you used this $19.95 Korg CA-30 Chromatic guitar tuner to tune your piano.



After tuning it you said it makes a “Boing, Bow wow wow” sound.
People tried to tell you to hire a real piano tuner.

Now I see in your other thread here that you are thinking of voicing your hammers?
Please don’t.

Voicing hammers is the last thing a tech will do after a good regulation and tuning.
If you think tuning is complicated wait till you learn how hard voicing is.

I’m not a tech but am just trying to save your poor piano from being ruined.

Please hire a real piano technician.

Kenny, that was a very good explanation of tuning to inharmonicity in the other forum.

I've heard of wolf tones, sounds like Ajahns has found a woof tone.

Ajahns,

You are in way over your head. I admire your courage , ... sort of, but what you are attempting is quite a bit beyond you at this point.

Hire a good technician and watch what he does. 'No need to tell him you tried tuning it yourself. He'll know! In the 60s and 70s I ran across a lot of self-tuned pianos that had to be resurrected. On most of them it was all I could do to keep a straight face.

To learn tuning, get an old junker and plan on spending a LOT of time training your ears and hand.

The Korg tuner an the lack of tuning experience is the reason for the Bow Wow. That's a pretty good description of how a badly tuned bass unison sounds. The reason the pianos in the store are barking too is that stores often don't tune their pianos as often as they should, it cuts into the profit margin.

Yamaha has been making pianos for over a hundred years and you have been tuning for a couple of days. My money is on Yamaha in this case. It is more likely that your lack of knowledge is the problem.


That being said, everyone in the piano service trade had to start somewhere. It's your piano, but my advice would be not to try voicing until you are absolutely sure that the problem isn't tuning before you dig into the hammers.

Regardless of who does the tone regulation, it would help the piano owner know exactly what needs to be done. All I am getting is an argument on who does what and no info on what needs to be done. Therefore I do not find these responses of much use. 11 posts in this thread and not a single clue.

Ajahn,

How can you expect one can understand and talk about voicing and the numerous possible causes of a tone problem on an Internet forum ?

We are yet happy we can understand each other when talking between tuners because we know yet by experience what may be hidden beside words, but it may be impossible for anyone, experienced or not without seeing the piano. particularly with your descriptions that makes me think you are very young and enthusiast (and a tad agressive I may say !) but have not yet the ear necessary to talk about piano tone.
Only the Mickey piano make Bimp bimp, to me !

Why do you wish to be a tuner, by the way ?

Your approach will not provide you much help.

And people are loosing their time trying to give you advices

Beside, I told 3 times that aging bass strings produce high pitched "harmonics" , and that Yamaha bass are not that long lasting in that regard (even 20 yeard after it may be something else than new). But it can be some many other things, principally the unisons, that I can't comment more.

May be also all the gentlemen on this forum are selling grey market yamahas with old less than musical strings tehy don't even notice, probably. It may be so !!! this idea my please you .

Quote
"All I am getting is an argument on who does what and no info on what needs to be done. Therefore I do not find these responses of much use. 11 posts in this thread and not a single clue."


Clue #1/
It's the tuning.

Quote
"All I am getting is an argument on who does what and no info on what needs to be done. Therefore I do not find these responses of much use. 11 posts in this thread and not a single clue."


Clue #1/
It's the tuning.

Comment of no value #13.

Ajahns,

You can do two things here.

#1. Waste a lot of time judging peoples comments as of no value or

#2. Actually read some of the comments and act on the advice.

Seems to me you have already had the advice you are looking for but have not read it correctly.

Isaac asked you earlier how piano technicians are supposed to evaluate your piano from a forum. Do you not understand what this means?

First of all none of us can hear or see this instrument. Secondly, it would be a very good idea if you would hire a professional technician to look at this piano. Thirdly, did you not receive some sort of service from the place that you purchased it from?

It does not seem like you are getting the answers that you are looking for. The one that you object to most is the fact that you don’t exactly know fully what you are doing, and further, you cannot describe it in terms that most of us can understand.

Making statements like my piano goes boing boing and I want it to go bimp bimp are not exactly helpful either to you, or others.

You have purchased a 20 yr. old Yamaha. Must have cost at least 2 grand maybe more. Now no service calls included or free tuning? So you have funding for the instrument but no funding to take care of it properly? I would start to re-think you position here just a bit ok?

I agree with the fact that the owner should know what is involved with the repair. Now are you willing to let a professional person have a look or what?? No-one can tell you what is up without looking…………

That's better than one that goes "BRAAA-AAAAA-AAAAA-AAANNNGGGGG!!!!!"

Now and then this forum just becomes a comedy. Here we have an amateur who tune his piano with a guitar tuner; screws it up, and when professional techs give him good advice, he says it comments are of no value!!!!

Please let me echo what has already been said. Ajahns, call a technician. You come in here expecting people to give you advice on tuning and voicing, so you can further screw up your piano with your amateurish adventurism. Just pray the tech doesnt charge you double for his efforts. I can tell you...I would!!!!

I agree. It is clear that after 13 posts, you still haven't got a clue.

Ajahns,

It's BuyersRemorse here. The guy with the 'twang'. Read my most recent post from this evening. I had my technician here for over an hour tonight. He was able to adjust and fix 12 of 13 bad keys. The last one is still an open issue. He was able to fix all but one by adjusting the string position on the bridges. If you are suffering from the same issue as I, it's not something you can do yourself. As I watched quietly and from a discreet distance, it was apparent to me that fixing spurious tones is not for the first timer.