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#609511 - 10/28/08 03:12 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Patrick Draine RPT Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/29/08
Posts: 21
Loc: Billerica, MA
Hey, I've been holding my breath waiting for Jerry Groot to post his own set of audio files! Seriously though, I'm glad Kent took the time to explain what the files were about (which he had explained on the CAUT list; Keith started this thread by posting the link without a full explanation). Tuning with 3:1 intervals in the high treble can result in more contracted octaves than those tuned by 4:1 double octaves. So that is probably part of what Jerry was commenting on.
BTW, Kent is running the OnlyPure program on a Windows Mobile PDA , which has been available for about a year. I await the iPhone version, although I'll need to have a hands on session with the program before I part with my $$.
_________________________
Patrick Draine RPT
www.drainepianoservice.com

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#609512 - 10/28/08 03:44 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Silverwood Pianos Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 4187
Loc: Vancouver B. C. Canada
“Ah well. If people wish to trash the recording, that’s fine.”

I don’t agree with this statement. People have offered their opinion, and their preferences. This is what I am reading…………… as you have stated previously Kent, some folks will like this and others will not. Some folks are Dodge people. Others drive a Chevy.

“You are welcome to come try to tune them yourself if you think you can do better!”

Would tuners be “doing it better” with the Stopper temperament or with what they use at the present time?

Perhaps you are over-reaching with these comments?
_________________________
Dan Silverwood
www.silverwoodpianos.com
http://silverwoodpianos.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/SilverwoodPianosDotCom
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur."

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#609513 - 10/28/08 03:48 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Ron Alexander Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/17/03
Posts: 1292
Loc: North Carolina
quote:
Hey, I've been holding my breath waiting for Jerry Groot to post his own set of audio files!

Now that's kind of s smirky statement there, Patrick. I'm sure if Mr. Groot wants to post some audio files of his tuning, he will do so.
But it sounds kind of sarscastic in light that he was simply giving an opinion, just like we all are doing.

This thread began with several people giving opinions about how great this temperament is. Maybe it is. I'm not questioning that. But anytime someone posts their work there, they open themselves up to both positive and negative feedback.

I for one did not hear what the others were raving about when I listened to the mp3's. But note I qualified my opinion by stating that recordings to me bring out the inherent falicies
of pianos unless they are recorded under the most ideal circumstances.
_________________________
-----------------
Ron Alexander
Piano Tuner-Technician

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#609514 - 10/28/08 08:03 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Keith Roberts Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/04/04
Posts: 1984
Loc: Murphys, Ca
Don't be snippy, you guys. Kent is a respected member of the guild. His tunings, while maybe not immpecable, certainly were good enough to show the Stopper program to you. Maybe our estimation of our tunings is better when it can't be scrutinized so minutely as it can when it is recorded....
_________________________
Keith Roberts
Associate, PTG
Keith's Piano Service
Hathaway Pines,Ca

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#609515 - 10/28/08 08:57 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Thomson Lawrie Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/12/04
Posts: 283
Loc: Grimsby ON Canada
Kent,

I like the tuning on these recordings. I think I would be pretty happy to walk away from these pianos if I had done the tuning. I felt that the high treble sounded a bit flat in the first recordings that Keith posted but I don't hear that in this recording. I would really like to have the chance to sit down to a piano that has been tuned with the stopper program.

I can't pretend to understand the principles that this program employs but all that really matters is does it work, is it a useful tool? If this is the result then the answer is yes.

I still hate the sound of spinets, even when they are well tuned.
_________________________
Piano Technician
www.pianotech.ca
Piano tuners make the world a better place, one string at a time.

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#609516 - 10/28/08 09:59 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Kent Swafford Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/06/07
Posts: 80
Loc: Kansas City
quote:
Perhaps you are over-reaching with these comments?

Woah. When I said it's fine to trash the recordings, I meant it, literally. One doesn't put recordings like this out there unless one is prepared to accept criticism.

It would be good if those criticizing the recordings knew exactly what they were hearing. That's all.

I originally posted this to PTG CAUT list, because I thought those who were familiar with tuning a Steinway to a Bosendorfer would be impressed with the tunings. That appears to have been true.

Thanks for the material on the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle. Very helpful.

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#609517 - 10/29/08 12:02 AM Re: Stoppers temperament
Jerry Groot RPT Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/07/07
Posts: 6828
Loc: Grand Rapids Michigan
It would be interesting as Thompson says, to hear the tuning in person rather than via an internet recording played back through mere computer speakers. Perhaps it does sound better in person than it did being recorded and then played back in this manner.

It is interesting regardless that this thing can tune all of the notes on a Bose for one and do so without doing a check as some other programs are required to do. In further thinking on the matter, fine tuning with no mutes or strips isn't an easy task either.

Perhaps, at the next PTG Convention here in Grand Rapids Michigan next summer, we will get an opportunity to listen "up close and personal" to this program. That would prove interesting.

I would wonder what a concert artist might think of this tuning? Would you be satisfied with this type of tuning and the sound of it? But then again, they would probably have to set down and play the piano itself to form a good opinion one way or the other.

Any concert artists out there that might wish to contribute or pose their opinion on the subject?

Keith, I know who Kent is. I'm not trying to be snippy or offensive. Just stating my own opinion on what I heard is all. Perhaps I should have tried writing it differently. :-)

Patrick, I thought you were kinda snippy though. :p I presume that you're joking of course but, either way, I don't have the time or desire to post that stuff and have no clue how to anyway... ;\)

I'm just tossing out my opinion as I said about what I heard, like some others here, that's all. No offense intended to anyone out there.

But, if you really want to know what kind of work I do or, what my tunings sound like? Just call our chapter president and ask him what he thinks of me and my work... I'll be glad to give you his number if you want it. \:D
_________________________
Jerry Groot RPT
Piano Technicians Guild
Grand Rapids, Michigan
www.grootpiano.com

We love to play BF2.

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#609518 - 10/29/08 06:58 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Jeff A. Smith, RPT Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/01/03
Posts: 476
Loc: Angola, Indiana USA
 Quote:
A rapid search in Wikipedia: "In quantum physics, the Heisenberg uncertainty principle states that the position and momentum of a particle cannot both be known simultaneously. "
I'm not a physicist, but one specific thing I seem to remember about this principle has to do with the quantum experimentation context it arose out of: On the quantum level it's impossible to do measurements without the possibility that the method of measurement itself will affect a quantity being measured. Measuring one quantity is done with the cost of actively changing the other quantity. I don't see how Stopper's device changes the actual pitch of a string but, even if it did, it seems a little goofy to me -- and a stretch -- to take a principle derived from a totally different context and apply it to piano tuning.

I'd be interested to hear Robert Scott's concerns addressed, if anyone's able to do that.

Kent S., thanks for making an appearance here. I hope you'll hang around and contribute more in the future.

Jeff
_________________________
Jeff A. Smith
Registered Piano Technician
Indiana, USA

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#609519 - 10/29/08 07:34 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Coolkid70 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/27/08
Posts: 378
Loc: Irvine, CA
Jeff,

I posted a link above explaining this phenomenon in respect to measuring the frequency of vibrations on a string. Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle does apply on this level, even though it might not necessarily be obvious.

Check it out and see what you think.
_________________________
Kawai K-3 (2008)

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#609520 - 11/21/08 01:37 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Jerry Groot RPT Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/07/07
Posts: 6828
Loc: Grand Rapids Michigan
You know, for the heck of it, I recorded my own tuning onto my cell phone after I did a concert tuning on a Steinway D. Holy MOLY what a difference!

I had no clue how rotten a recorded tuning could sound. Especially on a cell phone!!

While the tuning itself was fine, I double checked afterward to make sure nothing had changed. My octaves, unison's etc., were all where they were supposed to be in perfect tune. So, I recorded it again THREE TIMES with the exact same results.

After listening to the recording a few minutes later I thought, WOW, these cell phones sure do a rotten job of reproducing good tunings big time!!!

That made me realize that I no doubt, jumped to conclusions on Kent's Stopper tuning and learned a valuable lesson. The tuning we do will not come out the same recorded onto something as chintzy as a cell phone. Even on a better quality recorder, unless you maybe spend thousands on the recording device, it will not sound the same as being there in person. So, Kent's tuning was probably just fine. I'm sure that the fact that it was recorded and then sent through the internet, is what seemed to have changed things possibly even more so.

I thought this was important to point out for future reference.
_________________________
Jerry Groot RPT
Piano Technicians Guild
Grand Rapids, Michigan
www.grootpiano.com

We love to play BF2.

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#609521 - 11/21/08 03:17 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
John Dutton Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/06/06
Posts: 251
Loc: Billings, MT
The piano is one of the hardest instruments to record well even if you have a pair of DPA 4006's or a pair of Earthworks PM40's.
_________________________
Piano Technician
Pro horn player
Recording Engineer

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#609522 - 11/21/08 06:19 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Ron Alexander Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/17/03
Posts: 1292
Loc: North Carolina
I agree, the piano is extremely hard to get a good recording of. It takes extremely good, ie. expensive mics to get their true sound.

I too feel I was too hard on Kent's Stopper temperament. I extend to him my apology.

Good point Jerry,....good for future reference.
_________________________
-----------------
Ron Alexander
Piano Tuner-Technician

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#609523 - 11/21/08 07:34 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
David Jenson Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/22/06
Posts: 2084
Loc: Maine
"The tuning we do will not come out the same recorded onto something as chintzy as a cell phone. Even on a better quality recorder, unless you maybe spend thousands on the recording device, it will not sound the same as being there in person." Jerry Groot

--------
And how!!! 'Takes really good (expensive) mics and a recording engineers knowledge of placement and processing to record a piano well. I never even bother to try to evaluate the tuning on a recorded piano. Not enough information comes through the mics.
_________________________
David L. Jenson
Tuning - Repairs - Refurbishing
Jenson's Piano Service
-----

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#609524 - 11/22/08 01:18 AM Re: Stoppers temperament
KawaiDon Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/05/02
Posts: 1225
Loc: Orange County, CA
I listened to the pianos at the PTG convention in Anaheim, and I also listened some to Mr. Stopper's explanations. I was not at all favorably impressed with either the tunings or his discussions. Based only on his explanations, I feel that the software is flawed because, as Robert Scott mentioned, it does not seem to have the ability to adjust to the individual piano's inharmonicity. This is a fundamental requirement of any piano tuning software or device, in order to begin to approximate what an aural piano tuner does naturally.

I have to give a disclaimer to my opinion of his tunings. I had a very hard time really listening to the piano tunings at the convention. Mr. Stopper remained very close to me all the time, and seemed to be trying very hard to elicit positive comments from me while I was testing the pianos. It was not a pleasant experience, and I would have really enjoyed just sitting and listening for 10 minutes or so, in order to get a better understanding of why I didn't like what I was hearing.

Don Mannino
_________________________
Don Mannino, MPA
Kawai America

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#609525 - 11/22/08 02:17 AM Re: Stoppers temperament
Bernhard Stopper Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/22/08
Posts: 211
Loc: Germany
Dear Mr. Mannino,
I apologize for having stolen 5 minutes of your valuable time.
Probably the beating of octaves and double octave caused the dislike of what you heard. Unfortunately i had no luck to come into deeper discussions with you why i am doing so.

My tuning software does indeed taking consideration of inharmonicity.

Best regards,
Bernhard Stopper
_________________________
Bernhard Stopper
www.piano-stopper.de

Salieri: "Mediocrities everywhere, now and to come: I absolve you all! Amen! Amen! Amen!"
(Amadeus, the movie)

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#609526 - 11/22/08 03:44 AM Re: Stoppers temperament
Bernhard Stopper Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/22/08
Posts: 211
Loc: Germany
I want add that the tuning Mr. Mannino listened to and he is referring here was later commented by David Andersen "Angels flying out of the piano"
(A Steingraeber concert grand i prepared for David Anderesen)

Bernhard Stopper
_________________________
Bernhard Stopper
www.piano-stopper.de

Salieri: "Mediocrities everywhere, now and to come: I absolve you all! Amen! Amen! Amen!"
(Amadeus, the movie)

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#609527 - 11/22/08 04:49 AM Re: Stoppers temperament
charleslang Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/13/08
Posts: 2079
The spinet sounds great to me. I'm not a tuner but I've played plenty of spinets that have lots of inharmonicity and the recording sounds like you could actually make music with that one anyway. Of course the best thing would be to have two recordings of the same piano, one with a traditional tuning and one with this special tuning. One MP3 of each, please!
_________________________
Charles Lang
Working on: A Night in Tunisia; Memories of Tomorrow (Keith Jarrett).
Just started: Brazilian Like (Michel Petrucciani)

Baldwin Model R (1974), Hardman 5'9" grand (1915), Rieger-Kloss 42.5" vertical

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#609528 - 01/11/09 01:03 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Jerry Viviano Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 263
Loc: Cary, NC
I'm an aural tuner who just did my first ETD tuning with Tunelab Pro. So am not that familiar with all of the ETDs, especially Stopper's. I don't understand the discussion of poorly tuned unisons. I would think that the ETD is only used to tune one string of a key. That string becomes the reference for that key. The unisons for that key then should be tuned aurally against the reference string, not by use of the ETD. The quality of the unison tunings then are a reflection of the quality of the human tuner, not the ETD.

I did find that Tunelab's spectral display was useful in roughing in the unisons in the high treble, but then fine-tuned them all by ear to get them beatless. Does the Stopper system have some system for fine tuning unisons better, or quicker, than could be accomplished aurally?
_________________________
Jerry Viviano
V. I. Piano
PTG Associate Member

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#609529 - 01/11/09 05:58 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Roy123 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/20/04
Posts: 1708
Loc: Massachusetts
I think Stopper's tuning is more straightforward than the impression this discussion may leave. Traditionally, tunings, if there were no inharmonicity, would produce perfect octaves. The Stopper tuning, with no inharamonicity, would produce perfect twelths. The theory behind this is at Stopper's website, and no doubt he does a better job explaining it than I would.

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#609530 - 01/12/09 04:51 AM Re: Stoppers temperament
Gadzar Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/15/06
Posts: 1719
Loc: Mexico City
I've looked at Stopper's website and there is no explanation at all of his temperament.

Is there a book or any other source to consult on the Stopper's temperament?
_________________________
Rafael Melo
Piano Technician
rafaelmelo@afinacionpianos.com.mx

Serving Mexico City and suburbs.

http://www.afinacionpianos.com.mx

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#609531 - 01/12/09 07:30 AM Re: Stoppers temperament
Jerry Viviano Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 263
Loc: Cary, NC
I had the same problem. There are real problems with his web site. Play with google enough you can find some info on it. Here is a page on some information on the theory, although I haven't had time to read it yet.

http://www.piano-stopper.de/html/stopper_tuning1.html

The basic idea is that a it is based on making 12ths beatless instead of octaves. A 12th is an octave and a fifth. An example would be C4 to G5. The frequency of G5 is 1.5 times that of C5, which is 2 times the frequency of C4. That means G5's frequency is 3 times that of C4's. Their are 19 semi-tones between C4 and G5. As always, the frequencies of the semi-tones progress exponentially. So the frequency between a note and the note a semi-tone below it is the 19th root of 3. Using that relationship, the frequency of G5, which is 19 semi-tones above C4, ends up being 3 times that of C4, the expected results. Using this relationship you'll see that you get similar, but slightly different ratios for the approximations to just intervals than you do if you use the twelfth root of two semi-tone steps.

I understand that much about it. Why that should result in better tunings, I don't know yet. I just found out about this yesterday, so haven't had time to thoroughly research it.

Hope this helps.
_________________________
Jerry Viviano
V. I. Piano
PTG Associate Member

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#609532 - 01/12/09 07:43 AM Re: Stoppers temperament
Roy123 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/20/04
Posts: 1708
Loc: Massachusetts
 Quote:
Originally posted by Coolkid70:

I looked into it a little more, and it does indeed seem that the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle does have an effect on reading the vibrations of a string. The main result is that the longer you attempt to read the frequency, the easier it will be to determine.

An informal discussion can be found here: http://www.geocities.jp/imyfujita/wtcuncertain.html [/b]
Please, anyone, correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the mathematical derivation that purports to show that the uncertainty principle applies to musical waves is utter hogwash.

The derivation starts with the formulas for the uncertainty principal and for energy, but on the 6th line of the math, the author introduces the energy of a photon, and uses that to derive the result. What does the energy of a photon have to do with measuring the vibration of a sting? Right--nothing. Plus, one can disprove his theory practically--one can measure the frequency of an electronic signal with extreme accuracy--accuracy that is far better than his supposed proof indicates.

Bah, humbug!

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#609533 - 01/12/09 08:14 AM Re: Stoppers temperament
UnrightTooner Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/13/08
Posts: 4924
Loc: Bradford County, PA
I have not read all the different posts on the Stopper Tuning. I don’t need to because the theory is very simple. Beatless 3:1 twelfths are the goal, which will also produce narrow 6:2 twelfths. Just as any octave type (2:1, 4:2, etc) cannot be truly beatless and will also cause different pianos to sound, well, different, so will tuning beatless 3:1 twelfths. It should also be noted that this is not a frequency ratio, but a coincident partial match. Because of iH, the frequency ratio will be more than 1:3, the same as when tuning a beatless 2:1 octave the frequency ratio will be more than 1:2. I don’t believe that there can be a “one size fits all” stretch scheme that will be best for every piano. How could there be when every piano scale is different, every piano is voiced differently, is in a different environment, and has different ears listening to it?
_________________________
Jeff Deutschle
Part-Time Tuner
Who taught the first chicken how to peck?

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#609534 - 01/12/09 12:02 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Erus Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/26/07
Posts: 386
Loc: Mexico
 Quote:
Originally posted by Roy123:
Please, anyone, correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the mathematical derivation that purports to show that the uncertainty principle applies to musical waves is utter hogwash.
[/b]
I think it's not hogwash, however, this is more on the realm of information theory than on applied physics. It's about attempting to make EXACT measurements, instead of accurate ones.

Engineering is about "good enough", you need things to work, but don't have eternity or all the energy in the universe to accomplish that. Good enough sometimes mean VERY precise measurements, but that's not exact.

 Quote:
Originally posted by Roy123:
Plus, one can disprove his theory practically--one can measure the frequency of an electronic signal with extreme accuracy--accuracy that is far better than his supposed proof indicates.[/b]
No you can't, it's not about practical matters. Extreme accuracy won't equal exactness, that's the point. Measurements are made UP TO some level of precision, and there is an error associated with them.

Check this link:

http://www.phys.unsw.edu.au/jw/uncertainty.html

They have some very nice pages on the acoustics of musical instruments.

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#609535 - 01/12/09 12:49 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Roy123 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/20/04
Posts: 1708
Loc: Massachusetts
 Quote:
Originally posted by Erus:
[I think it's not hogwash, however, this is more on the realm of information theory than on applied physics. It's about attempting to make EXACT measurements, instead of accurate ones.

Engineering is about "good enough", you need things to work, but don't have eternity or all the energy in the universe to accomplish that. Good enough sometimes mean VERY precise measurements, but that's not exact.

 Quote:
Originally posted by Roy123:
Plus, one can disprove his theory practically--one can measure the frequency of an electronic signal with extreme accuracy--accuracy that is far better than his supposed proof indicates.[/b]
No you can't, it's not about practical matters. Extreme accuracy won't equal exactness, that's the point. Measurements are made UP TO some level of precision, and there is an error associated with them.

Check this link:

http://www.phys.unsw.edu.au/jw/uncertainty.html

They have some very nice pages on the acoustics of musical instruments. [/b]
I have to disagree--the Heisenberg uncertainty principle is very much about practical matters. It describes how precise measurements can be. This is by no means a philosophical topic. What's at stake in tuning a piano is being able to measure the difference between two or mores tones. What is needed is therefore precision, not exactness.

In the referenced article, the author states, "If you want to determine [middle] C with this precision 0.0001Hz, you need Δt of 800 sec, or 13 min 20 sec." I believe by precision, he means resolution, and that's the only thing of consequence when dealing with musical tones. The requirement for absolute accuracy is relatively non-critical.

The difference in period between middle C and another note that differs by .0001 Hz is about 1.5 nanoseconds. The length of time required to measure that difference is only limited by the noise and precision of the electronics used to measure it. Ten seconds of such a note will bring the difference up to about 4 microseconds, which is EASY to measure--no tricks required. His theory says it will take 800 seconds. Once again, I say, "Hogwash!" If the measurement can be made in far less time than his theory predicts, then, by definition, the theory is flawed.

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#609536 - 01/12/09 02:00 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
UnrightTooner Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/13/08
Posts: 4924
Loc: Bradford County, PA
Giving the benefit of the doubt to the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle being applicable to piano tuning, does the Stopper Tuning deal with it differently than other tuning methods?
_________________________
Jeff Deutschle
Part-Time Tuner
Who taught the first chicken how to peck?

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#609537 - 01/12/09 04:24 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Erus Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/26/07
Posts: 386
Loc: Mexico
 Quote:
Originally posted by Roy123:
the Heisenberg uncertainty principle is very much about practical matters[/b]
The uncertainty principle prohibits exact knowledge of initial conditions, and repeated performances of such processes will diverge. The consequences of the uncertainty principle are usually only important for extremely small magnitudes.

According to that middle C example requiring requiring 800 seconds, he's aiming for a precision of thousandths of a cent, Is that precision reasonable for piano tuning/music theory, or is it more on the crazy side of things?

 Quote:
Originally posted by Roy123:
If the[/b] measurement can be made in far less time than his theory predicts, then, by definition, the theory is flawed.
*A* measurement or *THE* measurement? It's not the same. Having *A* measurement that is good enough doesn't mean the theory is wrong.

We can make measurements (using very affordable technology) in far less time than those, and they work just great for our applications. You are completely right about that, and I agree, we are not aiming for crazy precision and things work.

 Quote:
Originally posted by Roy123:
I believe by precision, he means resolution...[/b]
Higher resolution is no substitute for longer measurements, however it is very important.

The Nyquist-Shannon sampling theorem would be more relevant to resolution.

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#609538 - 01/12/09 04:34 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Gadzar Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/15/06
Posts: 1719
Loc: Mexico City
I've read some of the theory on the Stopper's web site, thanks for the link Jerry.

Does anyone knows how to aurally tune the Onlypure method?

 Quote:
Originally posted by Supply:
I heard Stopper's tuning at the National in June. I must say I was blown away.


He played an octave - it sounded fine, nice and clean. Then he played the tonic- fifth interval and the fifth - octave interval. They sounded good - a nice, slow roll. Then he played the tonic - fifth - octave. It was absolutely pure and clean! The beats canceled each other out. It was amazing.

[/b]
Is it for example: A3-E4-A4? A3= tonic, E4 = fifth, A4 = octave?

Then you have a slow roll on each of the intervals: A3-A4 octave, A3-E4 fifth and E4-A4 fourth. And then if you play the three notes together the beats cancel each other out. Is that so?
_________________________
Rafael Melo
Piano Technician
rafaelmelo@afinacionpianos.com.mx

Serving Mexico City and suburbs.

http://www.afinacionpianos.com.mx

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#609539 - 01/12/09 11:09 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Supply Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/11/06
Posts: 3919
Loc: Vancouver Island, BC, Canada
Yes, that was undoubtedly what everyone heard. I would not say the octave had a slow roll, it sounded quite pure. Apart from that your underanding is correct. In addition, when large chords were played, the tone was so well blended that the sustained sound was like that of a pipe organ. As I said, I have never heard anything like it.
_________________________
Jurgen Goering
Piano Forte Supply
www.pianofortesupply.com

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#609540 - 01/12/09 11:57 PM Re: Stoppers temperament
Gadzar Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/15/06
Posts: 1719
Loc: Mexico City
So does anyone know how to aurally tune the Onlypure tuning? (excuse my poor english, I couldn't find a better way to ask this, I hope you can understand it).
_________________________
Rafael Melo
Piano Technician
rafaelmelo@afinacionpianos.com.mx

Serving Mexico City and suburbs.

http://www.afinacionpianos.com.mx

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