About 6 weeks ago, I found a used Steinway B, 15 years old (1989), in
apparently very good condition. I liked its sound better than new
Steinways, even if it was a bit out of tune in the shop. So I didn't
hesitate and bought it, thinking that such a relatively new Steinway
must be top quality. It wasn't cheap, by the way.

The first days after delivery I was quite happy with it, a new
experience having a Steinway compared to my former Yamaha.

About 2 weeks later, the technician came, tuned the piano, did a
little extra voicing and left me happier than before.

Just for a few days. I noticed that the tuning stability
degraded. Only a little first, but day by day more and more. After one
week I found it a little annoying, after 2 weeks quite annoying and
after 3 weeks I'm wondering if this is really normal? Did I buy trash?
Are there some hidden faults?

I have to add that the temperature in the room is around 20-22 °C and
the humidity, which I check daily, was between 42% and 58% during that
period after the tuner left. Not that special, I think. I'm also not
banging the piano, playing around 1-2 hours daily, mostly pieces by
Bach, Chopin etc.

I plan to order a new tuning by a S&S specialist in the next weeks.

But what do you think: Is this quick degradation of tuning stability a
bad sign? Will it be better after the second tuning? I really don't
want to pay a tuner every month.

Is it possible that this 15 years old Steinway, which plays and looks
very good, seems to be well taken care of, is unstable and therefore a
bad buy?


Thanks for your comments!

It takes a while for a piano to acclimate itself to a new situation. Steinways can be more sensitive than other makes. Also, if it hadn't been tuned for a while, the first tuning can be a bit less stable. I would wait a while, tune it again, and then see how well it stays tuned.

I see you are using celcius degrees.. Where are you???

I agree with BDB. It is very common for used pianos to have suffered years of tuning neglect before the owner finally decides to get rid of it. The well-cared for used piano is by far the exception, in my experience. Coming from a badly out-of-tune state, it can take several tunings over a relatively short time period sometimes before the piano settles in at a "tuned" tension. Much like a new piano.

Also, a change of 42% to 58% humidity is pretty significant. I would guess maybe 5 cents of drift from the humidity change alone, maybe more. This can sound pretty sour to someone with good ears as the middle registers go out of tune disproportionately to the end registers.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if your tuning instability is caused by both the humidity changes and a previous lack of regular tunings. However, either factor by itself is enough to cause instability.

Regards,

Rick Clark

My advice is not to invest in more tunings until you have a dampp-chaser installed. I just did on a brand new super pitch stable Grotrian here in NYC that I tuned one day (60% RH) and two days later at 80% RH the tenor was all over the place.

The $350 investment (or what ever it will cost with installation) will be WAY worth it.

Where are you located by the way?

Thanks for all your comments.

I'm located in Germany, by the way.

So it seems that there is nothing to worry about. Anyway, I was
surprised that this Steinway was out of tune that fast.

So it seems to me that keeping the Steinway in perfect condition, I
have to invest further.

Anyway, this Steinway is a fantastic instrument. But it is only
fantastic, if it is in tune and in perfect working condition. I think
it is not worth to invest so much money into a Steinway and then keep it
in mediocre condition.

A Dampp-Chaser will be of significant use? Here the humidity is mostly
between 40-60%, a little less in winter.

If I buy a Dampp-Chaser and have a tuner come every 2-3 months, do you
think the piano will be pleasant almost throughout the year? Any other
"tricks" I have to consider?

All very good advice so far. A quick question - the 40% to 60% swing - is this a seasonal thing or a daily thing?

If it is seasonal, that is not terrible. You will still benefit from a climate control system (they are now distributed in Europe) but I have seen much worse conditions.

Enjoy!

The 40-60% humidity I mentioned before is throughout the year, not during a day.

Only rarely it is outside this range. Our climate is not that extreme. Is a Dampp-Chaser still of major use?

The local humidity around the piano is what matters. If you have dry heat in the winter you could get down to 30%. If you do not air condition and the temperature inside is elevated you could get to 70% around the piano. You should invest in a 30 Euro humidistat and put it near your piano to understand the local humidity. (Do you use a fire place?)

Your tuner should be able to tell you if the pins feel loose (this would be another other source of instability). Otherwise, with a Dampp-Chaser I am told that pianos hold pitch up to 4 times longer than without.

For the 300 or so euro that it costs, you certainly won't make anything worse...

Thomas F,

A 40-60% range of humidity is unlikely to ever cause permanent damage to a piano. However, the changes will cause a certain degree of tuning stability, I guarantee it. Whether the change is enough to bother you depends on your ear.

However, I hope you are not judging your humidity range by the weather report because what is happening outdoors is not the same as what is happening indoors. A heating system, for instance, can make the inside air much drier than outside air. What you need is a decent humidity gauge placed near the piano, so you can observe the true numbers.

If in the end you find that indeed the humidity doesn't get below 40%, then you are lucky because you can invest in a simple Dampp-Chaser dehumidifier rod and humidistat, and this will stabilize the tuning very nicely at a low price. However if your humidity goes much below 40% you will need a humidifier component also and it will be more expensive.

Once the humidity is stabilized and the piano is otherwise settled I think most people would be happy with fewer tunings than 4 a year. I have many customers on 1 tuning a year or even 1 every 18 months, and their pianos are more in tune than they previously were when tuning 4 times a year.

However, constant or heavy playing of the instrument will make the tuning less stable, and there is no way to prevent that. Some people who are heavy users may still want to tune 4 times a year. But still, with humidity control it will be in better tune than it would otherwise be.

Regards,

Rick Clark

Thanks, Rick, for your comment.

Of course I measure the humidity by a gauge besides of the piano, it is not from weather report. I don't have a/c, but central heating in winter. The heater is well away from the piano. In winter, humidity can be sometimes be around 35%, but not less. Even if it is raining (quite common here over the year), the humidity will not be much above 60% in the room. During the last week, it is around 50-55%, while it is dryer outside.

So I guess, a DamppChaser dehumidifier may be sufficient for the climate here.

Having also lived in Germany for 3 years (Schwarzwald), I would say that A Dampchaser is not truly what your piano needs. Your annual humidity changes are not that great, and not at any extreems where thy might damage the piano.

Get a good Technician and get 2-3 tunings the first year and after this you can probably taper-off the tunngs to 2 per year. Of course, if you play 2-4 hours every day, then your piano will require more tunings. Finding great Technicians may well be more important that trying to temper your climate.