Because my parents cannot afford a new, bigger piano, I've commissioned the help of a tech with about 30 years of experience. I would like some opinions about this.

He said that voicing a piano usually deals with the mids and upper ranges of the piano. Is this true? I ask because the bass is brassy and unsatisfying, and, the length of the piano excluded, I've run across small uprights with better bass response. The bass needs to be fuller. I was wondering if this has something to do with the hammers, or the strings? How could one pull the most possible bass out of this instrument? I'm looking for a deep, growling tone. The mids and highs, however, sound fine, if not great.

Next are the wobbly keys. They move from side to side, not too much of a problem but noticeable to the observant pianist (e.g. me). The keys also squeak, and this is extremely annoying.

The piano is about a year and a half old and I play it regularly.

I've been told I deserve a better grand many times, but low and behold the world doesn't work that way and my parents have little money to spend.

Thoughts would be appreciated.

-Colin

Colin :

What gives piano bass notes depth and character is what is called the "speaking length" of the string, the portion of the string that's allowed to vibrate freely when struck. In a 4'7" grand the longest bass string may be shorter than it is on some uprights, and this is why you've heard some uprights with better bass response. Unfortunately, it's pretty well a given that in a 4'7" grand piano you're not going to get a satisfying bass. "Brassy and unsatisfying" is almost always true of the bass of grands as small as the one you're talking about.

Regards,

But wouldn't the action of a fine upright be inferior to that of this grand? Or am I just kidding myself? The action is the most important for me.

I agree with Bruce. I am looking at baby grands of at least 5'6" or longer, otherwise I will settle for an upright or a spinet.

Mark

Interesting. You're telling me my poor parents spent all this money on a grand and I could've gotten a great upright with better sound?

The "brassy" tone of the bass may not be due to the fundamentals, but the harmonics. I'm not a piano tech, but I'd think voicing hammers that hit bass strings could change what higher-frequency harmonics get created, and that could change the tone. Still, there is only so much that can be done to get bass out of a small piano.

What did the tech say that he could do to improve the tonal qualities of the piano? The action problems definitely should be fixable. I'm not sure much can be done to improve the bass, as that is primarily a function of string length and soundboard area.

Most Asian pianos are said to have a "bright" tone. Perhaps having the piano voiced down to a mellower tone may improve the perceived bass tone? Comments???

Thing is, I've actually played a grand of very similar size and thought the bass response was quite a bit better. This leads me to question if my grand could have better bass; not superb, but at least a deeper and fuller tone.

I was thinking the same thing. I'm thinking the hammers may be too hard, but I wouldn't want to ruin what I think is a great mid and upper range in this piano.

How tall do uprights get, btw?

The tallest uprights I've read about being in current manufacture are about 52-54" high (4'4" to 4'6").

I too have heard decent bass out of small grand pianos. The bass shouldn't be "brassy." It will lack some depth/fullness that is impossible to develop on a small piano ... but it shouldn't have an objectionable tone.

That's why I'm curious what the piano tech has to say when he evaluates the piano...

He suggested that rather than working on the piano's parts that I get a new piano. The prices, however, are far out of our league. I'm a bit leery, though, because of what has been said here. Perhaps it's some sort of sales pitch. He said a regulation of the action would be 850 bucks, and he then recommended that this money should be put towards a finer instrument. I can't help but agree.

It's his opinion that I get a better instrument. For a second opinion, I need to spend 50 bucks just to have the guy come in the door.

I have since put up an ad on craigslist seeing if anyone is willing to give away their grand pianos in the area, or if I can trade sweat-equity and perhaps a payment of 500 dollars in order to receive a finer instrument. I hope with all my power that someone is kind enough to get me what I need to help me move along in my piano study.

A decent looking grand is up for sale on Craigslist for 2500. I'm hoping that we can do some negotiations if the piano is to my liking.

-Colin

You should not need to pay $850 for regulating what is essentially a new piano. Find someone else.

...and read "The Piano Book".

--Cy--

http://www.pin.ca/ari/qanda.htm

Go to this site. Find a tech. willing to listen to you and show him this page. Simple regulating and this voicing technique should satisfy you without replacing the piano or spending alot. Remember, it is limited by its' size.

I think this highly experienced technician may think that it is a waste of his time to regulate an entry-level piano like the Pearl River. Most likely, he does good work and charges a premium price ... but mainly owners of high-end pianos will pay him $850 to keep their instruments in tip-top shape.

Another tech may quote a more reasonable price for the work. Also, I am generally turned off by techs who are too much of 'piano snobs' and think that only high-end pianos are worthy of their time. I encountered a tech like this once, and he will never again work on my piano.

That may be to his liking ... but there must be a good tech out there who realizes not all musicians are on a high budget, and will help you get that Pearl River playing better - at a reasonable price, and without telling you to replace your piano before your finances allow.

Most piano makers don't spend much time making their 4'7" pianos. The shorter pianos can lack proper regulation, voicing, bearing, and case parts and pedals might not fit well. In other words, because of the low price point, the makers rush these pianos out the door. They assume (wrongly) that a good piano player will never buy one. It's possible that a good tech can improve the action and tone, but he/she will be fighting the inherent lower build quality, given the low price point. The larger piano sizes have a better build quality. Yes, you should have bought a good used upright such as a Yamaha, or Kawai, or a Baldwin 243 studio.

Your tuner is doing you a favor. He should have told you a thousand or two to regulate if that would lead you away from trying to make that piano into what you are looking for. Take his honest and caring advice, spend the money and get a decent piano. You will be far happier in the long run.

I agree with the other techs. Imho, it probably isn't a bad piano. It's just that you have to limit your expectations of it. The big limitation is the tone of the bass.

I'm sure it can be improved somewhat, but keep in mind it can't be made into something that it isn't.

No matter what the bass is like, the action should be fine. If you have been playing on it a lot, chances are it needs some adjustment. It should not take more than a day's work to do it at your home, and $850 is too much for that. Find someone who will do it for an affordable price.

Many people have become fine pianists on equivalently small pianos. You can adjust to that fairly easily, once the action is working properly. Besides, some small Chinese grand pianos sound pretty good for small pianos, and the chances are yours is one of them.

Hi Colin,

I wanted to add a couple of more things about the mechanical problems you mentioned above.

If you play the piano alot, key bushings are probably wearing (side to side movement). The pins that the keys slide up and down on can be turned a little bit to get rid of some of that annoyance. Eventually, the bushings will have to be replaced (2-300 bucks, most places).

The squeaking is probably caused by a plastic or wood piece rubbing on felt or buckskin. The action needs lubrication with dry lubricants. Possible noisemakers include:

jack > knuckle
jack toe > letoff button
drop screw > drop leather
wippen heel > key capstan
center pin > flange bushing (not as common, but it happens)
key bushings > key pins
misalignment of parts can also cause squeaks by rubbing on neighboring parts.

All of these squeakers are easily remedied with a couple of different types of lubricants and/or a small amount of time.

As BDB suggested, the action should be fine. A day's work should take care of all of these possible problems.

I have links to a couple of virtual action models on my website if you want to check it out.

Keep us posted,

Also read the Reblitz book on piano repair. I have played a PR 4'7" that was very satisfying. You're not going to get the volumne or power of a large piano, but the action was very acceptable (truly a grand action and better than a vertical action), and the tone was nice and clean. The place where I work has a 5'6" PR which has some bugs that the dealer should have dealt with. We still plan to do some voicing and 'turn' the bass strings to tighten the coils (and hopefully improve the bass). If the bass doesn't improve, I may replace the bass strings. Other than a couple of other very minor issues (sluggish key, and leaking damper) the piano has been doing very well. We've been using it since it first arrived in Dec of '05. I'll let you know how our piano ends up, but I believe that if set up carefully (as req'd by any piano), PR's can be very nice pianos and (in my opinion) perfect for your needs. I own a good quality Yamaha upright and the action and tone of the PR grand at work is far superior. I think your idea of tweaking your 4'7" for maximum performance is a good one, but if you can't find a tech that shares your approach (and is affordable), you may have to study up and prepare to do your own work. As a young man, you'd be well served by developing the skills to maintain and repair your own pianos. Good luck, walt

I am from the camp that believes even a lesser quality grand is better than a higher profile upright. I believe in the benifits of the grand piano's repetition and expression.
Often frequent and hard players wear out too small grands trying to drive sound that isn't there. We see this a lot in gospel churches that buy baby grands for large sanctuaries.
Piannaman is right on in his observations and recommendations regarding your action. I have played and worked on many Pearl 4'7" grands. IMO they have better bass than other sub 5' grands I have played.

I'm the guy you referred to when you said you would have to spend fifty bucks "just to have the guy come in the door." You forgot to mention that I would have to spend an hour and a half driving time. Sounds like a deal to me. I thought I was doing a fellow forum guy a favor, but I guess my good intentions were misplaced.

Oh no! I wasn't referring to you. No, no, you've been most helpful, I really appreciate all that you've done. Believe it or not someone else quoted me 50 dollars to come out and inspect the piano, this was awhile before I contacted you.

You've been extremely kind! It's been a pleasure talking to you, please don't take my words the wrong way.

I am of the camp which believes a tall great-quality upright can be a better performance choice than a small baby grand. The bass on these really small parlor "grands" is so bad, the player will refuse to play below C3, in order to avoid embarassment. If you close your eyes, you would swear they were playing on a drop action spinet.

Yeah, repetition is very nice, but good or decent bass has to be at least as important, if not more.

I tried Petrof's magnetic repetition vertical action model at our last state PTG conference in Milbrae, CA- indeed it repeated like an Uzi 9mm ! Can't wait to try it in a piano!