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#658827 - 04/28/07 11:07 PM Clavinova CLP 280
kawai07 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 04/28/07
Posts: 13
Loc: Detroit
Hello everybody!

I am new on this forum. Initially, I wanted to buy a Kawai CA5, because of the nice key action and wood touch, but yesterday I played on Clavinova CLP 280. I really liked it.I was mentioned a price $4400. What do you guys think? Should I take it or wait til the prices go down a little bit more...

Thanks a lot for your input!

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#658828 - 04/29/07 06:51 AM Re: Clavinova CLP 280
bachmaniac Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/01/06
Posts: 410
Loc: Montreal, CAN
Welcome to the forum!

I prefer the Kawai (CA71 or 91 are models in the CLP280's price range) but what is even more preferable is to make sure you choose the piano that suits you best and that you[/b] like best. No amount of persuasion can replace personal preference as a guarantee of long-term satisfaction, this is just toooo subjective business. The CLP280 is certainly an excellent instrument also, but I don't believe the prices are heading down that much at Yamaha, as the present CLP models are not due for short-term replacement, if I'm not mistaken...

Best,
Claude
_________________________
K. Kawai KG-2D grand, Kawai MP8 digital, Kawai CA7

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#658829 - 04/29/07 07:17 AM Re: Clavinova CLP 280
Suryaman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/19/05
Posts: 131
Loc: Italy&Orange County, CA
If I had to choose between CLP280 or CA91/71 (same price range) I would go for Kawai if I was looking for the best digital action and I would go for Yamaha if I was looking for the best sound.
But if you like the Kawai sound (I don't) you can't go wrong with Kawai.

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#658830 - 04/29/07 10:58 AM Re: Clavinova CLP 280
bachmaniac Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/01/06
Posts: 410
Loc: Montreal, CAN
...but if in the end I preferred the 280, I would then buy the 270 and save a grand getting the same piano, LOL!

Claude
_________________________
K. Kawai KG-2D grand, Kawai MP8 digital, Kawai CA7

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#658831 - 04/29/07 11:38 AM Re: Clavinova CLP 280
franzooey Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/26/03
Posts: 95
Aren't the Clavinovas negotiable in terms of price? I think many here have had to bargain a certain price, just as they would with an acoustic piano.

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#658832 - 04/29/07 11:39 AM Re: Clavinova CLP 280
J. Mark Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/13/06
Posts: 1323
IIRC, 270 has plastic keys, 280 has wood, right? I think I was told there were other differences, as well. Not the same piano. Different. No?

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#658833 - 04/29/07 02:20 PM Re: Clavinova CLP 280
VE1PL Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/03/06
Posts: 22
Loc: Nova Scotia, Canada
The CLP-280 has wooden white keys (the sharps are plastic). However, the geometry of the action is quite different between 270 and 280; the material is not the only difference. I believe that the electronics, firmware and analog electronics are identical. I am very pleased with my 280 for silent practice; I rarely turn on the speakers.
_________________________
Willis (1910) and Yamaha CLP-280

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#658834 - 04/30/07 09:07 AM Re: Clavinova CLP 280
bachmaniac Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/01/06
Posts: 410
Loc: Montreal, CAN
VE1PL,

With all due respect, I beg to differ, and though I don't want to spoil your love affair with your CLP280, it seriously does NOT have a wooden keyboard, nothing at all like Yamaha used to offer in its CLP990 or what Kawai offers: it merely has cosmetic wooden inserts into the outward, visible part of its white (still plastic) keys. I don't know who (the dealer?) led you to believe that the geometry of the action was "quite" different, in verifiable fact it is negligibly different. Same plastic, folded pretzel action on the 280, whose keyboard Yamaha has the nerve to call a "wooden keyboard". It's all semantics and marketing dynamics, but it sure works!!!

Regards,
Claude
_________________________
K. Kawai KG-2D grand, Kawai MP8 digital, Kawai CA7

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#658835 - 04/30/07 09:38 AM Re: Clavinova CLP 280
AJB Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/01/05
Posts: 3655
Loc: Surrey, England
Claude

You have often put forward this view. As a matter of interest, how thick are the wooden inserts? Just a thin veneer - say 1 mm or less - or thicker than that?

May I point out that there may be another reason for people to buy a 280 instead of a 270. At least in some markets, the 270 is not available in gloss black ebony, but the 280 is. I did buy a 280 in preference to the 270 and this aesthetic reason (we wanted gloss black to match other stuff) was a significant factor.

I would equally happily have bought a Roland (but the finish available to me at the time was horrible plastic veneer that was already peeling off in places) or a 270 (that just had awful fake wood finishes or a premium priced real wood veneer).

I did once check key down and return weights between 280 and 279, using a measuring tool for the purpose (accidentally left behind once when my tech was working on my acoustic grand). I did not test all keys, just a few, but the 280 had quite a significantly heavier action (about 5 grammes around centre keyboard extra as I recall). This was not measured using my 280 for comparison, but two shop floor instruments locally.

Obviously I would not draw any major conclusions from this, though subjectively I felt that the slightly heavier 280 felt more like a lightish acoustic action.

I am inclined to agree with you that it is unlikely that the action geometry differs otherwise between the 270 and 280.

Both are pretty acceptable, as is the Kawai MP8.

Kind regards

Adrian
_________________________
S&S Hamburg D, Yamaha CLP 280


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#658836 - 04/30/07 01:37 PM Re: Clavinova CLP 280
bachmaniac Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/01/06
Posts: 410
Loc: Montreal, CAN
Hey Adrian,

I appreciate your post a lot, and I really am only after true facts, not on a crusade to discredit Yamaha at all. I know I've blown that same trumpet several times, but it seems annoying to me that people will not see the difference between an "aesthetically wooden" and a "real wooden" keyboard and fall for the subterfuge, here.

No, in all honesty it is NOT just a wood veneer. The front part of the white keys on the CLP280/CVP309 is hollowed out and wood-filled, probably the kind of white spruce you normally find in acoustic piano keyboards. That is enough to change both the static and the dynamic weight of the keys a bit, and I presume they have to adjust the black keys somewhat to match, hence the feeling of a slight difference in touch between 270/280. However, those users who insist there is a great difference are, IMHO, but blatant victims of the placebo effect.

The first pianos I tried out extensively when I decided to get one were the CLPs, and I almost bought a 280 at the time, I found the Polished Ebony so striking. Do you realize that Yamaha is offering that PE finish on the 230, 240 and 280, but not on the 270? Why do you think they would do a thing like that? The answer seems so obvious...

Best,
Claude
_________________________
K. Kawai KG-2D grand, Kawai MP8 digital, Kawai CA7

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#658837 - 04/30/07 10:43 PM Re: Clavinova CLP 280
kawai07 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 04/28/07
Posts: 13
Loc: Detroit
Thank you guys for your input, and suggestions!!!
I really appreciated it.

To Bachmaniac: Unfortunately, I did not have the chance to test CA-71, and CA 91 here in Michigan. I heard they sound pretty good. I initially tried CA 51 and fell in love with the touch and sound. However, a day later, I tried the CLP 280. The sound was marvelous, although the touch not as special as Kawai. I then played a faster song on Kawai, and the sound did not impress me as much as in the beginning, probably because of the 64 polyphony ( I think) vs 128 (CLP 280). I hope I will get to try the other two from Kawai, and then decide.

Thanks again!

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#658838 - 05/01/07 12:04 AM Re: Clavinova CLP 280
bachmaniac Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/01/06
Posts: 410
Loc: Montreal, CAN
the CA51 has 96 polyphony, 71 and 91 got 192 just like the MP8...

Claude
_________________________
K. Kawai KG-2D grand, Kawai MP8 digital, Kawai CA7

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